Selvaag Bolig ASA

Good morning, and welcome to the first quarter's results presentation for Selvåg Bolig. My name is Sverre Malvik, and I am the managing director. Together with Kristoffer Brunvold, we will go through today's agenda. We will start by looking at the highlights, then we will look at the operational aspects, then Kristoffer will take us through the financial aspects, and then we will look at the market, and some future prospects and the Q&A at the end. We had a very strong sale in the first quarter, the best Q1 or start of the year since 2022, which is very positive. We have sold both on new projects, but also sold out a lot of goods, so we are down to 500 million less than we were at the same time last year in unsold finished goods. We start building 183 units and finish at 0 in the quarter, so we increase our order reserve quite a lot. Up to over 1000 units in production, or to a value of 7.2 billion. So good speed in the company. While the results after IFRS are very much influenced by the fact that we have zero failures and very few deliveries in the quarter. If we look at the key numbers, these are pro forma numbers, that is to say, including our share of cooperating companies, or TSs. That is, we include our share in the result, and not on the TS line. If we look at NGAP, or starting with IFRS, we have 194 million in turnover, very few over-delivered units, as I mentioned, and get a negative margin of 4.2% in the quarter, in isolation, due to fixed costs at the bottom with a few failures, it becomes thin. After NGAP, which is the ongoing calculation method, where you take out the proportion of sales and turnover in the projects, which much better reflects the company's value creation, we have a turnover of 729 million, with a margin of just under 10%. It is very good, it corresponds to a margin in the projects on an average of 15%, which we are pleased with in relation to the circumstances around especially building costs. So good speed, you could say. If we look at the sales, we have sold 169 units to a value of 1,38 million. In the quarter, there is good speed, almost two a day in Q1. In Q2 now, it is a little calmer, but not so dramatic. We are at about one a day in Q1, so year to date. we are on the same level as Year to Date last year, which was a good start to the year. So we are very pleased with that. It is a bit calmer, due to the lack of interest rate cuts, and probably due to other circumstances in the world as well. So it is a bit calmer, but we sell well and surprisingly well in relation to the market in general. In 12 months, we are at about 4 billion, which is a very good increase from Q1 2024. We are now almost doubled, so we have a good sales pace, we have to say. A total of 707 in the last 12 months, 598 net. This is also the third quarter where we are starting to build more than we are finishing. We have increased production by 1.3 million. Now we have 183 start-ups and 0 finishes in the quarter. The order reserve has grown at least in the last five quarters. We had 661 units in production at the lowest, and now we are up in over 1,012, to a value of almost 7.2 billion. This gives us a very good solidity and good speed to stand against possibly new heavy periods 64% of this was sold at the beginning of the quarter and more now. And as I said, there is a pretty good margin for this, which is under production, around 15% project margin. In terms of finishes, there are 393 this year. That's a bit higher. We have 19 units, or half of the NTE collaboration project, up at Svinsen. In addition, it was in Q1, but now it is in Q4 instead. So 393 units. 85% of it was sold at the beginning of the quarter and more now. So good control over the year in terms of sales, but there will be a couple We call it the TASN-quartal-result-like EFRS in Q1 and Q2, of course, because of very few errors, and that is through supervision. Kristoffer will tell us more about this.

Good morning. Let's take a look at the main financial points. We start as usual with the results of IFRS, where the revenues and costs of the projects meet the results by delivery to our customers. We focus here on the pro forma result, which gives a more correct picture of the total business and more comparable over time. Here we include, as Sverre was saying, our 50% share of revenues and costs in the projects, and not on its own line as presented in the official results. This resulted in 34 units in the quarter, down from last year in the period of last year, to 179 units. This is due to the fact that we do not have any finished units. These are 34 units, divided into all our projects, which are previously finished, which we have sold and delivered now. Only 9 of these 34 were from collaboration projects, compared to 52 last year. This gives us revenue of 194 million kroner, including 18 million kroner in other revenues, which is the DRIFTA plus service center this year, and the factored project management for collaboration projects. The project cost is 155 million kroner, of which 17 million are financial costs, which are related to rent for construction loans, rent for sales credit and option premiums. So that is the basic element of the rent that is also part of the project cost. Other costs are 67 million kroner, At the same level as last year, we have a relatively stable cost base with a fixed number of employees and managed to cut some operating costs. Given that we have been through a pay rise, we expected it to increase, but we have a slight decline from last year, which we are pleased with. An adjusted EBITDA of minus 8 million, corresponding to a margin of minus 4 percent, compared to a margin of 15 percent in the corresponding period last year. This is of course due to the fact that we are overseeing many different units to cover fixed costs at the bottom. At the bottom, we have a negative result of minus 22 euros per share. compared to 60 euros plus last year, where we had 179 units. Now we will look at segment reporting, which follows Norwegian rules. This NGAP Norwegian rule, where we run the current calculation, which is the sales degree times the return degree, which is more of an excise degree, as Sverre was referring to, which means that we continuously take out revenues and results in the project's execution time. Here we also focus on performance. It is the same with NGAP, that the results from the co-operative projects are taken in net under EBITDA after tax. Here we have brutificated it, so we get our share of revenues and costs. In this regime, we deliver a turnover of 729 million and a margin of 10%. This is after overhead costs. As Sverre mentioned, we still have good project margins, up to about 15% on average. If we look at the 12-month rolling turnover, we see it at 3.3 billion, and a rolling margin of 10%. Here we also see an increase in the last five quarters, which shows higher activity in the company, and now over 1,000 homes in production. This will of course give good results for IFRS in the future. Let's look at the cash flow. We entered the quarter with 384 million in the bank. Then we have a big negative cash flow from drift at about 1 billion, and this is due to the start of construction and the purchase of atom from UP, combined with few finished units. This means that we are building the warehouse quite heavily in the quarter. Negative cash flow from investments at 30 million, which is due to the fact that we have made an investment in joint projects in the quarter. And then we have a large positive cash loan from net income from construction loans. And these income from construction loans, as you can see, we draw on the construction loans to pay, buy back cash from the U.P. and build warehouses. So that explains how the cash loan from DRIFT is financed. Net income is down to 65 million, which at the beginning of the quarter we have 319 million in the bank. Look at the balance. The total balance has now increased by over 6 billion. We were in a period here below 5 billion. Booked income on 25 kroner and 20 euros per share. Then we have an income increase of 39.2%. This has now fallen due to a higher total balance, which of course has increased activity in the company. The exchange rate of 1.25 kroner has not been included in this balance. It first hit the balance at the end of May. Then we would have had some lower equities if we had taken into account that. If we look at the changes from last quarter, the stock exchange went up with 971 million. We'll get back to that. Other requirements are on the same level. And then we have the cash, which is down by 65 million, which we went through on the cash flow process. The revenue from the customers has increased compared to the previous quarter. We have sold well, so the revenue from the customers is now at 51 million and is included in other short-term yields in this balance. Looking at the warehouse, It has increased a lot since last quarter. Booked air conditioning is down due to the start of construction. The big thing here is an increase in goods and labor of 1.1 billion. Again, this is due to a lot of start-ups and buying back property from Urban Property, financed by construction law. This means that we get a strong increase in our sales, which is positive and shows that we have higher activity in the company, which will give results in the future. Then we are pleased with the finished goods warehouse, which is down by 132 million. We now have 50 unsold at the beginning of the quarter and fewer now. A year ago, this was up to 126 units, so that's a good decline from a year ago. In addition, we have sold 23 finished units, which are delivered in most of Q2 and now in Q3. We are comfortable with where these units are located and expect to sell out these 50 in the following quarters, given the low supply side we see in our areas. Let's look at the bottom. Here we have a strong increase from last quarter on the interest rate, up to almost 2.7 billion, where the building loan is the big one with 1.9 billion. We have also yielded to Urban Properly at 774 million. This has also increased a good amount, because we have bought back property and started building a lot in the quarter. This has increased sales. And then we have some loans again on what we have from Tomt i egenbalanse. It is now at 34 million and is stable there for a few quarters now. There is no change in the conditions of these loans, and we have not yet pulled up any of our top facilities. We report a net interest rate of 2.3 billion, which is essentially up from last quarter to 1.2 billion. This is due to increased construction loans. In the end, we will look at the discount on the single capital. This is calculated as the result of the last 12 months, and divided by the entry of the single capital in the 12-month period. We have received 100 million in the last 12 months after the tax, and a discount of 4%. It is worth noting that this is due to the weak periods in 2022 and 2023 with a low start-up. This means that you will receive annual payments in 2025. which contributes to the last 12 months being weak, and then the cost of real capital also falls, so you find that it turns afterwards. Then we went through the financial, and then Sære will go through an update on the market.

Yes, I'll start by looking at the Oslo market, called the imbalance in the supply side in relation to the need there, as usual. In Oslo, you have under-produced for many years, very few, or very few failures, mostly in all years, perhaps apart from the 18th and 19th, in relation to what is called the need. It will not be any better in the future, and I repeat myself a lot here, because I have talked about this for many years. But at least there is an estimated error rate in 2025. 1267 units, and the annual demand is 3800 units. It will be better in 2026, and it is estimated to be much better in 2027, but I do not think so. But at least there is a very low supply side here when it comes to requirements in relation to the needs that everyone has brought with them as readers of newspapers. It is problematic. What is also a little unusual is that Akershus has in recent years taken and produced more than necessary to compensate for the lack of supply in Oslo. It is also now in the process of turning around because municipalities such as Lønnskog for example are not able to to build infrastructure in order to meet this so-called strong population growth. So now there is also less supply and fewer failures. This is of course also due to the fact that you have not been able to start building so much due to high building costs and high interest rates in the years from 1922, 1923 and 1924. will also be affected. But the demand will be lower here than the need, which means that in total there will be a record large gap in the Storoslo area between supply and demand in the coming two to three years. Hopefully only the two to three years, it may be long. If we look at the political situation today, there is no reason to think that it will be easier to start building something with additional requirements that will increase costs in terms of flow of water, more infrastructure, etc., which makes it even more difficult. In Bergen, the situation is pretty much the same as in Oslo. There is a very large gap between what is planned and what is at stake. This has been the case last year, and will continue to be the case in the future. Bergen is also characterized by the fact that they have also been slow to regulate enough property on the same level as Oslo. Stavanger is something better, but there is a delay after 10 years of underproduction. So the demand is probably higher than estimated, I think. That is the real question, because there are so many years without production, new production. On a sustainable level. But 1500 units here are also under in Stavanger. So, let's see what's actually out there, and how it has developed this year, and what's actually for sale. There was 964 in Oslo, which was on the supply side, if you went to Finn in the beginning of January. 530 units have been put out so far this year, or until May 1st. Sold more than what has been put out, and now it's, I think it's record low, 817 in Oslo. In Akershus, we also see the effect that it is sold more than what has been put out. More than 3,600 units are out at the beginning of the year, and almost twice as much has been sold as what has been put out. So now we are down to 3,000 units on the supply side. This also has something to do with the season. In Bergen, the same is sold, which is around 600 units. In Trondheim, the same is sold, but the supply side is large. In Stavanger, the same is sold. If we look at this in relation to the amount of people, The population in the cities is still extremely low in Oslo, with 1.1 apartments per 1,000 people. It is declining in Akershus at 4.2. It has usually been above 5 over a longer period of time, while the one in Bergen is at 2.1. Stavanger, I would say, is balanced, while the supply side is still large in Trondheim, so the buyer's market, I would say, in Trondheim, more than in the other areas. It will be exciting to see how this develops. I don't think anything more will be put out. In Oslo and Bergen there is room for it, also in Stavanger, but in many other places it is not easy to start so many projects due to the cost of building and the ability to pay. If you look at the annual market, I was here three months ago and said that I predicted that these red seals would fall during the year, and I still think so, but they have now risen in this quarter, and that is due to several things, but it is the effect that I have talked about many times, that people go over to buy before they sell. It hasn't hit its peak yet, because of the lack of income cuts, there are still many who are conservative and wait to buy a new home until they have sold their own. I think the effect will continue over the course of the year, Especially now in Oslo Akershus, where prices are very high and there is uncertainty. And probably the banks also demand that the customers sell before they buy, so they know what they have to deal with. In addition, there are large actors who have owned a townhouse for rent, who can no longer afford to rent it at home because of the form tax, among other things. which now turn these homes into housing properties and sell them in the market in a fairly large amount. Of course, this is also a supply side, which is called a one-off, which will last for a few years, and which will affect the housing market in Oslo again, especially in the rental market, when you strip the supply side of rental properties, which is already down by 10,000 units, about 10%. which means that the prices for housing in Oslo are also rising. Price development so far this year in Oslo 4.6%, Bergen 7.6%, Trondheim 6.1% and Stavanger 11.1%. Quite strong development so far this year given the circumstances. But here we can see some of the effect. If the interest rate had gone down, this picture would not have been true in April. But without it, it has become a bit sad. And negative growth in Oslo in April, isolated. Bergen as well. Positive in Trondheim and a bit positive in Stavanger. A slightly weaker growth compared to earlier this year. This is probably a little disappointing in relation to the interest rate decision, among other things. Of course, there are other things happening in the world, and there has been some speculation, but it is difficult to believe that it is not a little more difficult due to the fact that the interest rate decision affects quite significantly. If we look at the projects that we have in the pipeline that we sell well on, we are on Snøbyen Plus, which we made last year. It's going well. We are putting out a new twin there. I think it's this one. Skårebyen also came up with a new large project before the holidays now, on 178 units. Landås, we started building our project yesterday. In the meantime, we have the entire project that we created a year ago, on 141, that we started building. Kalnes, we are struggling with political treatment now, but we have a plus project that could have been regulated now, but there is now political struggle. If we are going to be able to build what we have proposed, or if we have to step back a little. Let's see. Sensely Bergen, we have a lot out there, tickers and sellers, and start-ups, several of those projects this year. We have already started building the Solheimsvane. I don't remember if this is a trend or not, but we have started building a lot, and it goes away with the apartments, the very nice projects that are on Milde. There we will also come up with a new trend afterwards. The same goes for Solbergskogen. There we also have a lot in the market, and it seems to go well away. And then we have Lervik. If we only have some unsold again, we have a new trend that is also under regulation, so we get a decision now in the course of the summer, if we get the utilization that is relevant there, we do not know yet. In Sweden it is three years. Barkaby is out there. We have sold about 20 of the 60-70 that are out there, including bookings, as they are called. We have sold about 20 of them. There is 210 here, but that is 200-ish. It has not been updated. What we see now, which is positive for Sweden, is that it is starting to get better. There are much lower interest rates in Sweden, and it is starting to get a little better. But it is probably the central property in Stockholm that is more in demand. This is a bit more in the outskirts, so it is a bit slow so far. So we see what's coming. Finally, Lønvangen will be regulated before the holidays. I have three alternatives. It has taken us ten years. I have had it up here. I have promised many times that it would come at some point, but it hasn't. We're finally doing it now, hopefully. It will be an alternative that can be implemented. There are three proposals in there. We're going up to the city council before the holidays. Rådhushagen is a nice project we have in Ski. We hope to release it at some point during the year. There is also slow court proceedings. Terrassekvarteret in Stockholm is a very nice project in the north of Djurgården, which we are going to launch in the new year. It is fully regulated, it is very nice for Belidinge, and we already have several thousand interested parties. A project that we got hold of because some did not manage to implement it due to the difficult times. Fornebu is under regulation. It is a large project. We hope that it will be treated for the first time during the holiday season. It is in the process of selling at the end of the year, but most likely early next year. Fredrikstad is regulated, of these 2,000 units, we have regulated 1,300 units, but here it is the expansion agreement, and a little like that, that needs to be in place before we can put it on the market. It will be a great area that will be a big project that will take place in many years. Lilleakre in Oslo will also be regulated now, hopefully, in the course of the holidays. The municipality is currently working on a number of follow-up requirements. They are trying to get us to build some walkways that are not really triggered by our plan. So we assume that they take it for granted and see that there is nothing significant. Then it will come faster, since they are not trying to do that. Bjerke, a large regulation plan, or several regulation plans, will probably be a year before we get it out on the market. Maybe a year and a half. It will be completely different in sales management time. It will be a great project. Holmsberg in Stockholm is a city project. We have not been allowed to do this in Norway yet. It is a plus that we use small and compact apartments, which are very suitable for single-person households who have more shared areas and accommodation. Yes, slaughterhouses and more. This is at least something we have a lot of, the point is that we have many projects to lay out in the market when the market is modern for it. It is still the case in many places, but there are some places where it is very heavy, due to higher building costs and higher rents, they do not go together everywhere. So, The interest rates are good, and we are doing very well in the daily market. But I personally think it will get better. I think the interest rates will go down. And then there is the imbalance in supply in relation to demand, which controls everything here in the world, which means that the price is still quite high. As I said, we manage the 15% margin, despite the fact that the construction cost is now over 10,000 kroner per square meter higher than it was before Putin went into Ukraine. So hopefully, through interest rates, the purchasing power, real interest rates, will increase in the course of the year, the better next year. We also think that Stockholm, We are on the right track, at least with the terrace. I am confident that it will sell very well. And Barkaby will also gradually, although it is a bit tired in Stockholm with high unemployment, or in Sweden in general, a bit high unemployment and a real recession. We have a good empty bank, over 10,000 units in it. We have very good relations with, for example, banks, which is important. The bank is with us. They see that we have the ability to implement. Of course, that is also important. I haven't said that, but of course it is very important to be able to have over 1,000 units under production, then it is important to have good relations with cooperation partners and banks, and then it doesn't work. We are glad to have both DNB and Nordea, which are very important in times like these. We see that we will increase the number of units produced further from the higher level over the course of the year, and we will buy more tomes. That is what we are doing in times like these, buying more tomes through urban property and through collaboration. because of the performance, among other things, that we have. To sum up, we have very good sales in the quarter. We have sold out, got down the stock market, as I said, been calm about it, sold without having to rebuke idiotic on idiotic levels, so we have had a significant decline on a safe level, and we have increased the order reserve considerably, and are up in good speed in the scouts, and that will give us very good results going forward. So we are well able to get through this extremely long crisis. The results of the isolated quarter are also bad, because no one finishes, and only a few unemployed people survive. The year is like that. There won't be any red numbers. That's positive. That was that. If there are any questions,

Thank you, Søren. A few questions from Karnege, Simen Mortensen. Q1 was a weak quarter. Q2 is very few deliveries. Just a joint venture project, as I saw. But you have half-year exchanges. How will this situation with two very weak quarters affect the policy around half-year exchanges and the fact that there are also X exchanges on equity ratio in Q2?

It does not affect policy in any way, but every time you pay an exchange rate, you make a reasonable assessment of whether it is reasonable to do it twice a year in such a situation. Now our liquidity is strong and our facilities are strong, so we can pay an exchange rate when we want. But if you look at it from a reasonable perspective, it is of course far from unlikely that we will choose to pay once a year instead of twice, as we did last year. It depends on how the situation is over the holidays and how we look at it. But the total exchange rate for the year will be the same as I said last year. The total exchange rate for the year 2024 was what it was, and it would not have been any different if we had paid it twice. So in terms of liquidity and conservatively, it can well be that we will extend the exchange rate for next year. We'll see. But the total will be the same. It will be a periodization.

It was just me who had to take a bit of a break from that. And now the housing producers in Gård Metal commented, among other things, that April had been very slow after Easter. We have now entered May. You mention a little here in the market that there is more supply, a slightly slower market. How have you experienced the market so far into Q2?

The market for Q2, as I mentioned, has been good. It's worse than in Q1. We sold, for example, nine units last week. We have about one a day. So the speed is worse than in Q1. But year to date, compared to last year, it's the same. So far this year, Q1 and Q2 together, about the same as last year, and we had a huge Q2 last year. So selling so far is good. But of course it's calmer in Q2 than in Q1, that's it. And we've had a little less sales starters as well. So we'll see. Now we're going to have some sales starters and see how it goes. But it's not going to be... It's going to be a lot more that Q2 will be as good as Q1. That's what it's going to be, in total.

You were so far in on these landlords who sell properties via housing loans, but the government has also gone out and said that they want to look at the compensation of the housing loan model and how it impacts. How do you see that such a tax change can affect your industry, which is purely housing development, not necessarily landlords?

Our industry, or the way we run it, we don't build housing units. We haven't had a single housing unit in 15 years or so. But it's not a problem that we can build housing units. We don't use it, and we're competing with the buyers. But it affects a lot... It will be more profitable to buy a rental and rent out, because the rental prices are rising. So we can say that the health of those who buy a rental from us, on the flip side, will be better now. Because of the idiotic policy that makes it less rental housing, as it was before secondary housing was so high. we sold to investors who rent out for a few years and then sell or give it to the children. That was a very nice way to handle the rental market, because then you could also spread the rental net around in the different communities. Those who buy from us now, the larger share of those who buy, want to flip it around and sell it. Unfortunately, it is not the case that the empty prices are in free fall. because of this. I would say that the retail price is very little affected by the retail price of the real estate agent, because you get a higher price per square meter in the market with a real estate agent than what you do with a real estate agent. So you have to have a lot of latent tax to make it worth it. So we, for example, we evaluate it on single projects, but it doesn't do it. You might have to have 4-5,000 NOK per square meter in latent tax, and that's a lot, per unit, to make it worth it to get a real estate agent, in terms of profitability.

You also mentioned that it is something you are looking at, but a common parameter is the size of the country bank in relation to your production numbers. Now the market has been a bit low, you have 10,000 homes, a very low turnover. How do you look at that ratio? What do you look at in terms of buying, where and what types of projects?

We don't. I don't think so. I think you are strict if you think we have poor start-ups. I don't think so either. Tomtebank in relation to start-ups? Yes, we buy at least what we finish. Because Tomtebank will be at that level in 10,000 events. There is no point in blowing it up to the sky.

No, that's what I wondered if I should reflect on.

Yes, so we should rather have it at least on the same level. So last year we bought a lot more. Then we bought twice as much as we failed to sell. And of course we will probably buy a little more this year also than we fail to sell. Because it's smart, I think, to buy in the opposite direction. Especially when others have to sell, for example, then you get it more reasonably. And of course the price of the tent, like everything else, is down. Because the building costs have gone up 10,000 per square meter, so to speak. and flat income, the interest rate is the balance sheet. And that's not what we experience in the bid round. The interest rate is reasonable, but you don't get the whole dip. Because that's the expectation. Some see it differently when it's out and about. Especially in Oslo, Oslo Vest, it's very... We don't speculate or gamble with the money of the shareholders. We buy an empty one for what we expect. If we don't win, we go to the next one and buy the one we expect. But we win a lot, and that's why we have a lot of cooperation.

But then it's a bit more of a running purchase, so we couldn't have the comment that you should size up a bit. It's more FIFO here.

I'm not going to go into details, but I have been accused of being a bit greedy in these high-conjuncture times, where we didn't win many tomato competitions, because we don't have the principle that you have to count them. There were many who bought expensive tomatoes, and many of them have now had to write down those expensive tomatoes. We haven't done that.

You mentioned a bit about the interest rate cut and that it should be a driving market. The Swedish market has had an interest rate cut, but there you are really not a leader. Why are the differences so big? How can you lean so much on the interest rate cut situation in the argumentation when you see what has happened in Sweden?

That's a very good question. I've been working with this for many years. In the past, the rent cut had a significant role in Norway. Employability had a significant role. Employability and rent are the biggest enemies of the developer. In Norway, you have employment, but you also have a fall screen, which means that it doesn't mean much to many if you're employed or if you work. So you don't get that effect anymore. And then there is almost no unemployment in Norway, because it is not caught up in the same way in Sweden. In Sweden you have real unemployment. It changes. You get different conditions when you are unemployed. Even if you work at ICA and then become unemployed, you get much less money. And it hits much more. It hits much more like it did in Norway before. But in the last few years, Norway has not been a significant employer, so it does not work in the same way in Norway. Norway is probably a slightly different country. But rents are of course important. It is in Sweden too. But I also think there are a lot more rental properties in Sweden that we look at in a different way. For example, we try to explain pedagogically when we sell properties in Sweden, how much the cost of living is on a rental property, compared to buying a property from us. But in Norway, there are many more people who have this top of mind. They are much more into housing as an investment than the Swedes are. I think that is part of the explanation. It is now more reasonable to buy a new property from us in Barkerby than to rent next door. However, there is no rush. So that's a little special.

Thank you.

We have some questions on the internet. First is from Bengt Jonasen. Project margin on what is in production. You say 15%. Which projects are invading on margin, and which projects are invading on margin?

We don't want any details on project level, so we won't go without it.

Next question, also from Bengt Jonasson. Tomte Kjøp from UP. Which Tomte is this? Does it go on sale at once?

Tomte Kjøp from UP? It's probably in the report.

We have bought back, we have started building a lot, so we have bought back four projects in the quarter. They have gone straight to the construction site.

Another question from Petter Nilsen. Is it right to say that the regulations in Stockholm are easier than in Oslo, but that it is the subsequent question in Sweden that makes it more difficult to start a case there?

Yes. Or, it's not necessarily easier, but remember, it's another decision structure. Decisions are largely linked to when it is regulated. It is definitely easier, a more sensible, intelligent process. Definitely. much more collaboration between builders and both politicians and Plan & Build, and a much better collaboration between Plan & Build in Stockholm and the politicians. They are constantly on. A huge difference, and it should be copied with advantage. A bit of a long answer there.

There are no more questions.

Thank you for today.