Charter Communications, Inc.

Hello, and welcome to Charter Communications' fourth quarter 2025 investor conference call. We ask that you please hold all questions until the completion of the formal remarks, at which time you will be given instructions for the question and answer session. Also, as a reminder, this conference is being recorded today. If you have any objections, please disconnect at this time. I will now turn the call over to Stefan Anninger.

Thanks, Operator, and welcome, everyone. The presentation that accompanies this call can be found on our website, ir.charter.com. I would like to remind you that there are a number of risk factors and other cautionary statements contained in our SEC filings, and we encourage you to read them carefully. Various remarks that we make on this call concerning expectations, predictions, plans, and prospects constitute forward-looking statements, which are subject to risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ from historical or anticipated results. Any forward-looking statements reflect management's current view only, and Charter undertakes no obligation to revise or update such statements. As a reminder, all growth rates noted on this call and in the presentation are calculated on a year-over-year basis unless otherwise specified. On today's call, we have Chris Winfrey, our president and CEO, and Jessica Fisher, our CFO. With that, let's turn the call over to Chris.

Thanks, Stephan. In 2025, we continue to compete for customers by delivering great products at great prices with continuously improving service. We added nearly 2 million mobile lines for growth of 19%, and we remained the fastest-growing mobile provider in the United States. In video, we dramatically reduced our video losses, and in the fourth quarter, we grew our video customers despite well-known headwinds. The video product improvements we've made over the past two years, which improve connectivity relationships, are having an impact. In internet, competition for new customers remains high, but customer losses improved year over year. Our revenue was down about a half a percent in 2025, driven by customer losses and a challenging political advertising comparison, while EBITDA grew by about half a percent. The operating environment for new sales, in particular internet, continues to reflect low move rates and higher mobile substitution, along with both expanded cell phone internet competition and fiber overlap growth, similar to earlier in the year. Collectively, that drove fourth quarter internet sales slightly lower year over year. Churn improved year over year, as expected, given last year's ACP-related impacts. And internet churn, including non-pay churn, remains at low levels. With 2026 in full swing, our shareholders should know that we are a highly competitive group, and we intend to win in the residential and business connectivity marketplace. In this environment, getting back to positive net additions is a game of inches. We're incredibly focused on, one, more clearly messaging our superior value and utility, and two, providing the best quality service in the market in a way that is recognized by our customers and our service is a competitive advantage. Let me go through how I believe we'll win. Assuming regulatory approval of Cox, Spectrum will cover over 70 million households, which gives us additional scale to develop new products and services, serve more business customers, and save customers significant money. In 2026, we'll nearly complete our rural build-out, providing us with over 1.7 million new subsidized rural passings with growth for years to come, as well as upside from the densification of higher growth areas in places like Texas, Florida, and the Carolinas. We're gig capable everywhere. And by the end of this year, 50% of the current Spectrum network will be upgraded to symmetrical and multi-gig service with significant work on the remaining 50% in flight and moving to completion in 2027. Those capabilities matter long-term as customer data usage continues to increase. And we're working with content owners in Silicon Valley to create applications and next generation products like Spectrum Front Row That's immersive content with Apple and the NBA that makes full use of our ubiquitously deployed, largely fallow fiber-based network. Bandwidth-rich products have always followed our network capabilities. And think of the last few hundred feet of our fiber-powered network as 1.8 gigahertz of continuous spectrum, delivered at full capacity to each individual home and business, with the ability to place cellular radios nearly everywhere along the way, fiber deep, power right away. We already have a fully converged connectivity service in 100% of our footprint. Now with expanding hybrid MNO capabilities through CVRS and Wi-Fi to drive our seamless connectivity advantage at gigabit speeds wherever you go. So data usage will continue to increase for both wired and wireless networks. And customers don't know or care which network they're on as they move about, it just has to work. That is the service we uniquely provide. In mobile, we have a structural and strategic mobile reselling agreement with Verizon for current and future services. And we'll launch an additional MVNO for business with T-Mobile in the next six months. Nearly 90% of Spectrum mobile traffic goes over our network already at higher speeds, making us the fastest mobile operator with the best prices. Mobile's profitable, it'll continue to grow and improves broadband churn meaningfully with the opportunity to drive more internet sales. Our network carries more mobile traffic than any operator in our footprint. So we are a facilities-based provider of mobile services with 5G macro cell towers as backup. Our owner's economics of a differentiated network create long-term advantage, which means we can save customers over $1,000 in a single year with internet and mobile. And now we can do the same with video. Our video product and platform is now a killer app. When our video customers activate their included apps, video and broadband churn improvement is meaningful. Our video product can become another unique selling tool. Seamless entertainment with all the key programmer apps included as part of our service, over $125 of value per month. And finally, customers have a platform in Zumo that brings unified search and discovery for all your live TV and apps, utility and value. At Spectrum, we've made huge investments in our 100% U.S.-based sales and service over the past five years with our own employees whose tenure and skill improve each month, supported by market-leading pay and benefits. That investment is already made, and it is a competitive advantage. And we continue to invest in technology, including AI, to increase customer satisfaction through self-service where customers want, and enhancing our employees' service capabilities. That's across sales, call center services, field operations, and the network itself. In 2026, for the first time, cranial incentives will include net promoter scores. We have competitive advantage with our service capabilities, and we're going to make sure we earn credit, the reputation that reflects that significant investment from our customers one by one. And we're going to guarantee all of it. We'll guarantee internet service through a new Invincible Wi-Fi product we'll launch in February. Symmetrical and multi-gigabit service with a Wi-Fi 7 router and battery backup and backup 5G service. Seamlessly switched on the same SSID for storms or outage, as well as Wi-Fi 7 extenders for larger homes. Invincible Wi-Fi is a market-first product combining Wi-Fi 7 with 5G and battery backups. Over a year ago, we deployed the nation's first wireline and wireless service commitment, guaranteeing transparency, reliability, and same-day installation and service. Internally, we're now moving that service window target to two hours and one hour for business, at your doorstep from the time you call. None of our competitors match our service here. In addition to backing our customer service guarantee with credits, beginning in February, we'll now guarantee you $1,000 of savings per year when you take internet and two lines of mobile from Spectrum. If we can't save you $1,000 or more when compared to the big three telco carriers, we'll credit the difference on your bill during the first year. Guaranteed connectivity, guaranteed service, and guaranteed savings. With the best products in the U.S., uniquely serviced by U.S. employees 24 by 7. We want to be America's connectivity company with hyperlocal service delivered by your neighbors who are our local employees and with community investment, including unbiased hyperlocal spectrum news. All of this will expand to Cox following closing, assuming regulatory approvals. Our plan there is to introduce spectrum pricing and packaging, rapidly grow mobile, similarly return to internet growth, and given Cox's low video penetration and our capabilities, we expect to grow video in the Cox footprint for a period of time as well. I also believe the combination of our very complimentary B2B capabilities will create growth synergies we didn't anticipate when we did the deal. Winning connectivity relationships in a cyclical and newly competitive environment is a game of inches. I'm not projecting broadband relationship growth this year, but we expect to see an improved trajectory from the investments we've made over the past three years. The recipe for winning here is simple. Best connectivity, best overall value with the best service. And we aren't perfect, and we own our mistakes with customers, but we are improving the way we communicate our value, utility, and quality service across our footprint. But I do believe we're the best positioned company in the connectivity industry and we will get better. From a financial perspective, we expect our operating plan to deliver even that growth this year. And the investments we've made to lower service transactions and our efficiency programs, including early benefits from customer and employee focused AI tools, will continue to provide a tailwind for many years to come. 2025 was our peak year of capital expenditure, and capital expenditures after this year will decline significantly. Free cash flow will take off from an already significant amount. We expect our capital intensity to return to 13% to 14% of revenue by 2028 at charter standalone, and we can probably do the same even with the Cox integrations. One of the bigger debates around charter has been about the best way to deploy our significant free cash flow. And that cash flow is meaningful. It's about to become much larger. Debating how to allocate that cash flow is a first class problem to have in my mind. And just go provide an update on their balance sheet strategy and capital return priorities in a moment. But the key focus for me and RealDriver, the team, and for value creation of our company is to make sure we deliver long-term customer, EBITDA, and cash flow growth and demonstrate that long-term growth rate for investors along the way. If we do that, the rest will take care of itself. Now I'll pass it over to Jessica.

Thanks, Chris. Before covering our results, I want to mention that we made several reporting changes to our customer and financial data this quarter, which are detailed in the footnotes to the trending schedule we issued today. To better reflect the converged and integrated nature of our business and operations, we now present our customer relationship statistics inclusive of all mobile customers, including mobile-only customers. We've also added a total connectivity customers section to the trending schedule, which represents all customers receiving our internet or mobile connectivity services. We've also revised our mobile lines reporting methodology to better align with how we report our other services. Please also note that any forward-looking financial or customer information that we provide in today's discussion or presentation does not include Cox or any transition costs related to Cox integration planning consistent with how we reported during the TWC-BHN transactions. Now let's please turn to our customer results on slide nine. Including residential and small business, we lost 119,000 internet customers in the fourth quarter. better than last year's fourth quarter with lower connects year over year, more than offset by lower disconnects driven by last year's ACP-related disconnects. In mobile, we added 428,000 lines with higher gross additions year over year and higher disconnects on a larger base. Net ads in the quarter were lower due to heavy device subsidy activity by the big telco competitors, including the new iPhone 17 through the holiday sales cycle. Video customers grew by 44,000 versus a loss of 123,000 in 4Q24, with the improvement primarily driven by lower churn year over year, resulting from the new pricing and packaging we launched last fall, Zumo, and seamless entertainment product improvements, including our programmer app inclusion packaging. New connects and upgrades to our fully featured video package with apps were up year over year. Our video customer results also include a small benefit related to the YouTube TV Disney dispute. Wireline voice customers declined by 140,000, with year-over-year improvement primarily driven by lower churn. In rural, we continue to see strong customer relationship growth. We generated 46,000 net customer additions in our subsidized rural footprint in the quarter. And in the fourth quarter, we grew our subsidized rural passings by 147,000 and by over 483,000 over the last 12 months, above our 450,000 target. We expect subsidized rural passings growth of approximately 450,000 in 2026, our last large build year. in addition to continued non-rural construction and fill-in activity. Moving to fourth quarter revenue on slide 10. Over the last year, residential customers declined by 1.2% and residential revenue per customer relationship also declined by 1.2% year over year. Given the growth of lower priced video packages within our base, a decline in video customers during the last year, $165 million of costs allocated to programmer streaming apps and netted within video revenue versus $37 million in the prior year period. And our three months promotion for new residential customers that we mentioned on our last call and which is no longer in the market. Those factors were partly offset by promotional rate step-ups, rate adjustments, the growth of Spectrum mobile lines, and $34 million of hurricane-related residential customer credits in the prior year period. By the way, the streaming app gap allocation headwinds to residential revenue that I mentioned a moment ago should continue to grow over time as more customers authenticate into our streaming app offers. It could be as much as $1 billion for the full year 2026. And as a reminder, the gap adjustment is ultimately neutral to EBITDA as an equal and offsetting benefit is applied to our programming expense line every quarter. As slide 10 shows, in total, residential revenue declined by 2.4% and was down by 1.2% when excluding costs allocated to streaming apps and netted within video revenue in both periods. Turning to commercial, total commercial revenue grew by 0.3% year-over-year, with mid-market and large business revenue growth of 2.6%. And when excluding all wholesale revenue, mid-market and large business revenue grew by 3%. Small business revenue declined by 1.3%, reflecting modest year-over-year declines in small business customers and in revenue per small business customer. Fourth quarter advertising revenue declined by 26%, including the impact of less political revenue. Excluding political, advertising revenue was essentially flat year over year. Other revenue grew by 7.3%, driven by higher mobile device sales. And in total, consolidated fourth quarter revenue was down 2.3% year over year and down 0.4% when excluding advertising revenue and programmer app allocations. Moving to operating expenses and adjusted EBITDA on slide 11. In the fourth quarter, total operating expenses decreased by 3.1% year over year. Programming costs declined by 8.4% due to a higher mix of lighter video packages, a 2.2% decline in video customers year over year, and $165 million of costs allocated to programmer streaming apps and netted within video revenue versus $37 million in the prior period. partly offset by higher programming rates. Other costs of revenue increased by 2.4%, primarily driven by higher mobile service direct costs and mobile devices, partly offset by lower advertising sales costs given lower political revenue and lower franchise and regulatory fees. Cost to service customers, which combines field and technology operations and customer operations, decreased 3.9% year over year, primarily due to lower labor costs and lower bad debt expense. Excluding bad debt, cost to service customers declined 3.2%. Marketing and residential sales expense was essentially flat year over year due to lower labor expense, offset by a change in sales mix to higher cost sales channels. Transition expenses related to the pending Cox transaction totaled $15 million in the quarter. Finally, other expense declined by 3.1%, primarily due to lower labor expense. Adjusted EBITDA declined by 1.2% year-over-year in the quarter. For the full year 2025, EBITDA grew by 0.6%. For the full year 2026, we are planning for slight EBITDA growth, excluding the impact of transition costs. Note that first half 2026 EBITDA will be more challenged than second half EBITDA, given the one-time benefits we saw in one queue last year, and the benefit of political advertising that we expect in the second half of 2026. Turning to net income, we generated $1.3 billion of net income attributable to charter shareholders in the fourth quarter, compared to $1.5 billion in the prior year period, given lower adjusted EBITDA and higher income tax expense. Turning to slide 12, fourth quarter capital expenditures totaled $3.3 billion, $273 million higher than last year's fourth quarter, primarily due to two multi-year software agreements that were accrued in the quarter, and higher network evolution spend, which lands in upgrade rebuild spend. 2025 capital expenditures totaled $11.66 billion, slightly above our recent expectation for $11.5 billion, given the new software agreements I just mentioned, which will drive other benefits across the business. We expect total 2026 capital expenditures to reach $11.4 billion. On slide 13, we have provided our current expectations for capital of spending through the year 2029, and now including line extension spending associated with the BEAD program, which totals about $230 million and is mostly in 2027 to 2029. For the years 2025 through 2028, the outlook you see on slide 13 is in line with what we have provided in January 2025, with the inclusion of feed, some modified timing across years, and slight changes across categories. As I mentioned, we have added 2029 to our outlook and expect it to exhibit about the same amount of spend as we expected for 2028. Looking beyond 2026, we expect total capital spending in dollar terms to be on a meaningful downward trajectory. And after our evolution and expansion capital initiatives conclude, our run rate capital expenditures should be below $8 billion per year. Just to highlight, that reduction in capital expenditures on its own from approximately $11.7 billion in 2025 to less than $8 billion in 2028 is equivalent to $28 of free cash flow per share based on today's share count. Turning to free cash flow on slide 14, fourth quarter free cash flow totaled $773 million, about $200 million lower than last year, given a less favorable change in working capital and higher capex, partly offset by lower cash taxes due to the One Big Beautiful Bill Act and cash paid for interest. Turning to cash taxes, fourth quarter cash taxes totaled $139 million. And while full year 2025 cash tax payments totaled just under $900 million. We currently expect that our calendar year 2026 cash tax payments will total between $500 million and $800 million. We finished the fourth quarter with $95 billion in debt principal. Our weighted average cost of debt remains at an attractive 5.2%, and our current run rate annualized cash interest is $4.9 billion. During the quarter, we repurchased 2.9 million charter shares, totaling $760 million at an average price of $259 per share. As of the end of the fourth quarter, our ratio of net debt to last 12-month adjusted EBITDA remains at 4.15 times and stood at 4.21 times pro forma for the pending Liberty Broadband transaction. During the pendency of the Cox deal, we plan to be at or slightly under 4.25 times leverage pro forma for the Liberty transaction. As you may recall, when we announced the Cox transaction, we committed to move our target leverage to the midpoint of a 3.5 to 4 times range. We're very comfortable with our balance sheet and our ability to pivot rapidly given our significant free cash flow generation, which provides flexibility to reduce leverage by up to a half turn annually over the next several years. but we have also heard our shareholders preference for less leverage during a lower growth period. So today we are moving our post transaction target leverage to the low end of a new 3.5 to 3.75 times range, which we expect to achieve within three years following close. Even with this de-levering, we continue to expect significant ongoing capital returns to shareholders. Lower leverage will drive some impact to our weighted average cost of capital, which should in turn positively affect valuation. It should attract a broader constituency of holders to the stock and open the potential for improved debt ratings, including an investment-grade corporate family rating, although that is not an explicit goal. We will continue to generate very meaningful and growing levels of free cash flow. And while we always reinvest in the business as our top capital allocation priority, there are no large-scale projects like Ardoff or Network Evolution on the horizon. We expect to revert to normalized capex in the range of $7.5 to $8 billion per year by 2028. we will have significant additional capital available to return to shareholders. And following our normal course review of accretive uses of cash flow with our board and consistent feedback from shareholders, we plan to continue to return that capital through our share repurchase program. We have significant free cash flow growth in front of us. But ultimately, to overcome the perception of negative perpetuity growth implied in our valuation today, we need to win in the marketplace. And as Chris outlined, that's where we are focused and where we believe we can drive value going forward. With that, I'll turn it over to the operator for Q&A.

Thank you. At this time, if you would like to ask a question, please click on the raise hand button, which can be found on the black bar at the bottom of your screen. When it is your turn, you will receive a message on your screen from the host allowing you to talk, and then you will hear your name called. Please accept, unmute your audio, and ask your question. As a reminder, we are allowing analysts to ask one question today. We will wait one moment to allow the queue to form. Our first question will come from Craig Moffitt with Moffitt Nathanson. Your line is now open. Please go ahead.

Hi, thank you. Good morning. Let me start with wireless. First, you signed a new agreement that both Comcast and Verizon have talked about. I wonder if you could just say anything about what that new agreement looks like and whether it it has any impact on your strand mount and offload strategy. And then on that point, Chris, you said that you're close to 90% offload. I think you had previously said 85 a couple of quarters ago, and then last quarter, I think said 88. That already is a 20% reduction in how much you're sending over the wholesale network that you're leasing from Verizon. Is the 90% just a reference to that similar to 88, or has the offload gotten even better since then?

Sure. Look, for obvious reasons, we'll stay consistent with what Comcast and Verizon have said as well, but that's For the most part, we've amended and modernized our long-term MVNO agreement with Verizon and, you know, continue to support profitable growth for both Charter and Verizon. It is a very good deal for them and a relationship for both. You know, as you know, it's long-term, and, you know, the market – Evolves over time. And so it's just natural that you have, you know, partners inside of a deal, take a look and want clarity on certain things. So I'd look at it more in that context as opposed to anything else. You know, we have a structural and long term agreement that underpins everything that we're doing here and that hasn't changed. On the 90%, I think it's around 89% or something like that. It's bumping in that area. So it's moved up a bit, but it's on a steady climb. And as we've always talked about before, the reality is that we have a very attractive structure and partnership with Verizon. And so we can be opportunistic here, but because of the favorable economics that we've always had with Verizon continue to have. You know, there's a balance there in terms of the pace of CBRS rollout, and we're focusing that on positive ROI areas. I'll mention, you know, we did roll out to the 23 markets last year that we talked about for CBRS, probably do, I think, maybe 20 or so more, but we'll be in all the states where we have, you know, CBRS PAL licenses, you know, within this year. So we continue to roll out there at an opportunistic pace.

Thanks, Craig. We'll take our next question, please.

Your next question from Ben Swinberg with Morgan Stanley.

Thanks, good morning. You know, Chris, you guys have been competing in the market with the Converge strategy for a number of years now. I'm wondering if you could maybe assess the position of, of spectrum mobile in particular in the market with consumers, you guys have been marketing the product for a long time. You've got very attractive price points, but you know, you've been building a new product and new brand for some time. Where do you think that sits with consumers today? Is there more work to do and maybe tie in how the, how the Salesforce is, is executing in your mind on, on, you know, selling that into the base, into new customers. Obviously it's core to the long-term growth of the company.

It is. So, The convergence strategy is working. You can see that in our results. On one hand, you would look and say, well, the net ad rate ticked down a little bit, but it ticked down in an environment with a tremendous amount of flooding the market with subsidies that we didn't match, and yet we continued to grow, which It shows and demonstrates the value of the product that customers perceive that we have. I don't think that customers are ultimately at the end of the day fooled. They can be entertained with an offer at one point in time. But at the end of the day, you look at the total amount that's on your bill. And if you compare that of our competitors to what our bill looks like, you can buy a lot of advanced telephones, cellular devices with that savings that we provide. So we're the all-in best product for both speed as well as savings. Now, your question about market perception, Spectrum Mobile is still a relatively new brand in the marketplace. Yeah. getting that product from your cable providers and, you know, still relatively new concept. So our brand awareness continues to go up every year. The reputation of the product, you know, continues to improve and settle in. The savings recognition and the word of mouth I think is, is improving, but it'll take time for that to continue to develop. And, you know, if you think back to some of the things that we did around video, But there are other products, broadband, video, and even phone, can both be an asset as well as can be a liability to the mobile reputation in a particular moment in time. And so when we have programming-related rate increases that go through on the cable bill and impacts the spectrum customer there, it flows through a little bit to mobile. So that's a piece that we try to... to manage and think through as well. But I think the, do I think there's more that we can do? Of course. And, but we're on a steady path to increasing brand awareness. I think the increasing capabilities, the convergence is recognized. Most customers still today are, haven't picked up on the fact that as you're moving around across the country, both inside our markets as well as other MSO cable operator markets, that you're actually connecting to faster speeds through Wi-Fi. And for those of our investors who are live in, for example, New York City or LA, I just encourage you as a Spectrum Mobile customer to drive around and walk around. And what you'll notice is that you're actually attached not to a 5G network, but you're attached to Spectrum Mobile at a vastly superior speed than you would have gotten with 5G. And we haven't, in my mind, we have work to do to really show and demonstrate that product capability in the way that we go to market. And I think that's upside for us because it is better speeds. It's at a better price. So eventually word of mouth gets around that it is a great product. It's better than anything else out there and it saves you money. So I'm positive. And the fact that we can do that in an environment that had so much, you know, as I said, flooding the market with subsidy, you know, I think gives us a lot of confidence.

Got it. Great. Thanks so much. Yep. Thanks, Ben. Operator, we'll take our next question, please.

Your next question will come from Vikash Harlalka with Newstreet Research.

Hi, thanks so much for taking my question. I want for Chris and for Jessica. Chris, could you just provide us any details on how your market share has trended in markets where you've competed against fiber operators for a few years now? And how do you see that evolve over time? And then One for Jessica. Jessica, you said you expect EBITDA growth to be slightly positive this year. By our estimate, political advertising adds about a percentage point to EBITDA growth. Could you grow EBITDA higher than 1% this year? Thank you.

Sure. So I'll take the first question related to fiber competition. We've competed well against fiber for many years. We expect to continue to do so. The reality is that's been going on for 15 years. So we have a lot of experience and we have a lot of data and trends there. We have greater penetration than our fiber competitors, even in mature fiber markets. And when it happens, overbuilt impact tends to be limited to a few percentage points of internet penetration during the first year of a new overbuilt vintage, as it were, coming online. That's not ideal for us, but the pace of that's tied to the pace of overbuilt, and that's been fairly consistent. And in the meantime, as a result of all that, You know, we really don't see overbuilders reaching their ROI goals within our footprint now or in the future. The piece that I would add to that is, you know, and I know you've done some analysis around this. Obviously, the introduction of fixed wireless access, you know, has impacts on everyone's penetration. I think that needs to be factored in as well. But inside of our footprint where we have a lot of experience, a lot of years of fiber overlap. As I mentioned in the prepared remarks, that's not new. And while it is new competition and that in itself presents some challenges, it's one that we've dealt with over time. The bigger issue over the past three years is the macro environment in terms of housing, low moves, and the introduction of, even though it's an inferior product, is a brand new competitor in the marketplace with expanding footprint through cell phone, internet, or fixed wireless access.

So on your second question, which I think is, will we grow EBITDA when excluding advertising? I think the answer is maybe. It's certainly our goal. EBITDA growth is challenged in 2026, given the headwind from broadband subscriber declines. But we think we can overcome that with the combination of mobile growth. changing mix of internet driving positive RPU growth, continued operational improvements, and attentive expense management, in addition to what we see from the political advertising space.

Thank you. Operator, next question.

Your next question will come from Jessica Reif-Ehrlich with B of A.

Thank you. I guess two questions, of course, I'm going to ask on video. Chris, what do you think the sustainability of the video sub gains are? And is there any color that you can provide on first quarter trends? And then just to follow up with your comments, just to speak really quickly about Silicon Valley, can you give us some color on what you're doing, what the endeavors are, what's the goal, and what's the timing of maybe some products coming out?

Sure. Look, for video, I want to be really clear. Our North Star here, our goal is not to have net gain of video just for net gain stakes. Our goal is to have a video product that supports broadband technology. acquisition and broadband retention. And I think it's a powerful tool to do that if we can provide value and utility for customers. I do, and I know you spend a lot of time in this space. I do think it's good for the ecosystem, everything that we've done. And of course, we're pleased about that, but that's not what our shareholders ask us to do. And so it's a nice side benefit. But in getting there, I think it does help broadband You know, I think it's important to thank the programmers here and particularly some of the key execs. I'm not going to name them out, but it's a handful and they know who they are. They leaned in and they continue to lean in to help us. I think they believed in what we were doing. It wasn't easy to get there, but, you know, eventually, you know, did believe what we're doing. And the reason is because, you know, again, with the viewpoint of solving for our broadband customers, we're really solving for customers first and providing that value. And we're unique in a relationship with the programmers because we bring a broadband distribution capability that most others don't have. And that means that we can serve all of these customers with the programmer's product, whether that's a skinny bundle, whether that's the full expanded product with apps. We get to put in ad-free upgrades that benefits the customer at a much lower incremental cost as well as the programmer. And then from their perspective, the direct-to-consumer apps that we sell a la carte to our 30 million customers. customers now, and that's going to be an increasing component. And so what we've been able to do with video is create the best economics and choice for the customer, which means that we're actually, I think we're the best channel distribution path to maximize the opportunity for the programmer as well. And so back to your question about video growth, I mean, the ecosystem is still really challenged. Programming costs continue to go up. In particular, retrans is a real challenge. But around that, I think you'll see us continue to innovate. We do have some new product ideas. We'll talk to the programmers about that in the course of this year. But the key for us to go back to connectivity, acquisition insurance. So on your net gain question, it's not the goal. You're on the razor's edge. You know, if you use that parallel, there's and you say, well, what happened in Q4? Q4 was really no different than Q3. You know, there's a slight difference between Q3 and Q4 that went from net loss to net gain. So you can just as easily float back into the net loss category. And it's, you know, the net gain isn't our goal. I think the parallel there is, you know, when you're on the edge. and you have a high amount of gross ads and a high amount of gross or disconnects, it's a dangerous place to be in terms of volatility. I think there's some parallel there to internet and the way that we need to get ourselves out of that space. And when I talk about game of inches, that really applies to all subscription businesses. And if you can get a more commanding lead through the things I talked about, the ways I think we win, I think that helps us in internet, which really is the goal here together with mobile. Silicon Valley, the big overarching thing that we're trying to do there is communicate to the people who develop products and software that they should stop developing to the least common denominator in terms of network capabilities. That because the cable ecosystem covers nearly in the entire country, unlike fiber overbuilders who do a lot of cherry picking, redlining, You know, we upgrade everywhere. We have already, we have a gigabit everywhere we operate. We're upgrading to symmetrical and multi-gig speeds, effectively nationwide. And that's the platform with low latency, by the way. And that's the platform that software developers and product developers should be developing to. They have unfettered access to that network, convergence, multi-gig, and the product capabilities that come about as a result of that. I think are significant and our networks put us in a unique place to go deliver that. And so the product that we supported Apple and the NBA with Spectrum Front Row, do we need to own those rights? Do we need to own that product? No, absolutely not. In fact, what we're just trying to do is show the way that a ubiquitously deployed network in the US exists that can carry that type of 8K or 16K product that provides an immersive experience that can actually have caching, at the local edge in a way that hasn't been thought of before. And given the fact that just at Charter alone, we have a thousand hubs or localized data centers that provide local edge compute. And so we have a lot of assets that aren't being used today. Our experience has been once people understand that these networks exist and their capabilities there, that they'll develop products to go do that. And so our time out in Silicon Valley has really been spent around making sure people understand that this platform has been built for them. There are things that we can do with it. If you take a look at what we've done with Amazon in terms of convergence and offloading, you think about the things that we could do in the electrical vehicle market in terms of offloading in a way that's attractive for them and really make use of the tools that we have. So that's the major goal. The biggest one is, you know, internally we've called it the fill the pipe tour. And to go really explain to people that this network's available there for them and they should develop to it.

Thank you.

Thanks, Jessica. Operator, we'll take our next question.

Your next question will come from Michael Ng with Goldman Sachs.

Hey, good morning. Thank you so much for the question. I wanted to ask about operating expense growth next year and investment opportunities. You know, you guys are obviously seeing really good momentum on the video side, and streaming app inclusions, and obviously also with Convergence and Spectrum Mobile. So, you know, how are you balancing, you know, the commitments to EBITDA growth with, you know, the potential to, you know, invest to drive these opportunities a little bit faster? And, you know, how do you balance that with efficiencies that you could potentially realize? Thank you.

I think Jessica can chime in for a second, but strategically, if you step back, we've made the investments. So if you think about the place we're coming from, we've made the investment by keeping our pricing low. We've made the investment by having a fully US-based in-source sales and service capability across the country. We've made the investment in our technology platforms. And so that gives us the ability to have increasing efficiency through the business and still be able to innovate and develop new products along the way. And to be able to manage both your foot on the gas and foot on the brake at the same time.

Yeah, I think that's right. And if you think about how that translates into... You know, something like cost of service customers, like ultimately, I expect that cost of service customers to be slightly down over the year in the year versus last year. But a big chunk of that is related to improvements and operating efficiency and in the way that we utilize technology to make our services more efficient. I guess on top of that, in marketing and resi sales last year, we had seen some pretty substantial growth in the year over year. I expect that to be meaningfully slower this year than what we saw last year, largely related to sort of investment that we already made, sort of bringing the expense rate up and then changes that we've made that I think Chris talked quite a bit about inside of last quarter. to really try to find the right way to drive our message into the marketplace and to do so efficiently. And so I think with those, we believe in our ability to generate a bit of growth while still doing the right things for the business to drive medium and long-term growth, which ultimately has always been sort of the strategic goal of the management team.

Great. Thank you, Chris. Thank you, Jessica. I appreciate the thoughts. Thanks, Michael.

Operator, we'll take our next question, please.

Your next question will come from Michael Rollins with Citi.

Thanks, and good morning. There's been a bit of discussion lately around pricing strategies for these services and whether companies should move to everyday value pricing versus that um you know lower higher uh promotional stack and just curious charter's latest views on how you're approaching pricing and that strategy um and the sustainability uh for what uh you've been employing now for for quite some time sure um you know you you know this but by way of background for for everybody else in september of 2024 we introduced new pricing and packaging

And really what that pricing and packaging did was lower our promotional price for internet, as well as our retail price for internet across all tiers, and both at standalone and bundled, and to provide a price block for up to two to three years, depending how many products you bundled at those lower prices. And despite that, we've been able to maintain relatively consistent ARPA, or in many cases, growing. And in parallel, use that to first reactively and then proactively migrate good portions of the existing base to lower product pricing. But in the meantime, maintain or actually grow customer relationship through that process, absent some of the video tier mix that is well known. um because people are taking more products for household and so that's been a long-held strategy at charter that you can keep your product pricing low and you can have higher customer relationship offered by getting higher product penetration and that's uh that was the goal of that pricing and packaging at the end of 2025 where about 40 of our footprint had that new pricing and packaging will probably be at 60 at the end of this year um and so we've been able to manage an environment where you are really lowering your broadband pricing at promotion and at retail, both in standalone, but more importantly, in bundled pricing and packaging in a way that creates significant savings for customers. And whether that's mobile, where we can save you over $1,000 a year, or it's in video, where actually now we can also save you over $1,000 a year because of the inclusion of the apps. We're using these tools that we have that are really unique in the marketplace. We can offer mobile everywhere. We can offer video everywhere. And I know you didn't ask it, but I was thinking about mobile everywhere. I know one of our large competitors the other day mentioned that in their wireline footprint, which is limited to where they offer mobile, they thought they could get mobile penetration to I thought that was interesting because if that's true, and it was said by one of our large competitors, I mean, the implications for Charter and Comcast are, I think, dramatic. If you can get 75% to 80% penetration on our broadband footprints, and that's sustainable. You would say, well, maybe to the earlier point, we don't have the brand to go do that. But we have a structural advantage. Without the same macro cell tower and spectrum investments that's required, of our traffic goes on a much faster multi-gig network so we have a product advantage and we have the ability to offer those products ubiquitously we cover all of our DMAs essentially and so that provides a marketing and service advantage and then we can save customers a lot of money questions. So we're pleased with where we're heading. It's, you know, there's, this is a, you know, it's a tough migration path to manage, but we've got a lot of experience doing it. And we've done it many times and we'll actually end up doing the same thing with Cox and look forward to doing that, assuming that we get regulatory approval there.

And it's maybe helpful there and translate a little bit of that into financials as well, because I know folks are focused on sort of what does that mean for ARPU across the business? And we don't often talk about product ARPUs, but I'm going to go there because I think it's helpful in this context as we're sort of doing the pricing migration. Ultimately, I think we expect Internet ARPU to grow this year, though more slowly than it has in prior years as we drive spectrum pricing and packaging through the footprint. I think mobile ARPU has been declining as more customers take our gig product, which includes unlimited plus at unlimited pricing. And as we see some contra revenue from phone balance dial plan, I think that we're at a low point there. And so there might be additional mobile ARPU declines in the year over year going forward. But sequentially, I think that we've bottomed out on that front. And then, you know, there are multiple headwinds that impact video ARPU that make that one difficult. You've got programmer streaming app allocation, which continues to accelerate. You have some more unfavorable bundled revenue allocation, and you have a higher mix of skinnier video tiers. If you think about that together with programming and programming cost per video sub, I expect that programmer cost per video sub will be up in low single digits when you exclude that programmer streaming app allocation. And we did pass through some programmer costs in our video pricing at the Ultimately, what happens then, you have to think about it in margin instead of individual costs. So you might have video ARPU continuing to decline, but it's really based on those impacts.

Very helpful.

Thanks.

Thanks, Michael. Thanks, Michael. Operator, we'll take our next question, please.

Your next question will come from Stephen Cahill with Wells Fargo.

Thank you. First, Chris, just going back to fiber, you said you don't expect the fiber overbuilders to reach their ROI goals, and we haven't necessarily seen that pressure translate into a slowdown, especially from the telcos. I don't know if that's due to lower cash taxes or something else, but I was wondering if you could just speak to how you expect the competitive environment to play out when we might actually see a slowdown in that activity that could lessen some of the competitive pressure. And then also just on the promotional environment, I thought slide five was interesting with maybe a $40 gig offer in the market. Was just wondering if you see a really attractive opportunity to be more promotional this year or if I'm misreading that slide. But if you are, what you think that could do to subscriber trends as we move through the year? Thank you.

Yeah, so let me start with that one first. The $40 gig is when bundled with either two mobile lines or video. That's been in the market since... since September of 2024. So that's our everyday pricing that's out there that's been in the market. And clearly it's had a big impact on the percentage of gig uptake amongst acquisition. So it's not new and we think it's positive. The ROI question, I mean, I've said this for 25 years that When we take a look at ROI, we think about classic IRR, cash on cash payback, years for that return to take place. And I guess the danger is always that other people's ROI may be based on a going concern as opposed to a real financial ROI. I'm not sure that you should be investing for going concern ROI because I think most shareholders or return way, but that's not new. I mean, that's existed with telcos for at least, I've been in it for almost 30 years and it's always been the case. So that makes it dangerous when your competitor isn't focused on traditional financial returns and shareholders are either confused or willing to look the other way and not insist on understanding what those ROIs are. I think that's... And that's not me complaining. That's just saying, I think that's what the case is. I don't think it's going to change. And we have to be able to compete irrespective of that. And we do. And we've been doing that for a really long time. So given what I just said, I don't know when the competitive slowdown occurs. I do know that as you get deeper into the market that density gets lower and the cost per passing ultimately has to increase when the density gets lower. And so there's a natural throttling mechanism that exists there relative to what they've done in the past. You know, whether it's taxes or interest rates that, you know, put an additional lever on that, I'm not sure, but we're, that's not, that's not our job. And so our job is to go compete against whatever's, you know, being brought to us. And that's what we've been doing since fiber has been doing overlaps for the overbills for the past 15 years or so.

Thank you, operator. We will take our last question, please.

Your last question will come from Frank Luthan with Raymond James.

Great, thank you. Looking forward here, as far as some of the promotional activity that you have, how long do you see the need for price locks and what is sort of your thoughts on that as a long-term solution? And then how quickly do you think you can get the Cox customers up that you experience in your base footprint?

Thanks. Look, we don't have any plans to change our pricing strategy. I think the price locks is both a good competitive reaction on our part, and it's something that gives customers a lot of comfort in the ability to switch. And so I think that's here to stay. Could you see over time that we evolve that further into a next evolution? Yes, but we're not at that stage today. We actually think what we have is working and will work, but we'll always continue to modernize our pricing strategy So I don't see any big change today. On the wireless or the mobile penetration at Cox, I think you should take a look at Maybe not our early days of Spectrum mobile penetration because we were still putting the product together, getting larger brand awareness. But I think you can take a look at the Spectrum mobile penetration at charter curve. I think that's a good indication. I would expect the earlier days to be much faster. And that's simply because we were a better operator in that space than we were, whatever it is, six, seven years ago in terms of our performance. our sales channel, our marketing, our national brand awareness. It's all in a much better place. But I think an improvement to that original curve is probably a good starting point for people to think about how we can get into the market there. All right, great. Thank you.

Thanks, Frank. Operator, I'll pass it back to you to close out. Thank you.

Thank you for joining today's call. You may now disconnect.

Thank you all.