ECARX Holdings Inc.

Good day and thank you for joining us. Welcome to eCarX's fourth quarter and full year 2024 earnings conference call. At this time, all participants are in listen-only mode. After management gives their prepared remarks, there will be a question and answer session. As a reminder, today's conference call is being recorded. I would now like to turn the call over to your host for today's call, Renee Du, Head of Investor Relations at ECARx. Please proceed, Renee.

Thank you, Operator. Good morning and welcome to ECARx fourth quarter and fourth year 2024 earnings conference call. With me today from ECARx are our Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Liu Shen, Chief Operating Officer, Peter Serino, and Chief Financial Officer, Phil Zhou. Following their prepared remarks, they will all be available to answer your questions. Before we start, I would like to refer you to our forward-looking statements at the bottom of our earnings press release, which also applies to... Specifically, we will discuss certain forecasts and projections, which represent the current and preliminary view of our management team and is therefore subject to change and uncertainties, as well as these forward-looking statements. Further information of specific risk factors that could cause actual results to differ materially can be found in our filings with the SEC. In addition, this call will include the discussions of certain non-GAAP financial measures. A reconciliation of the non-GAAP financial measures to the GAAP financial measures can also be found at the bottom of our earnings release. With that, I'd like to hand the call over to Ziyu. Please go ahead.

Thank you, Renee. Hello, everyone, and thank you for joining our fourth quarter and four-year earnings call today. 2024 was a remarkable year for eCARX, marked by significant milestones and progress across our business. We continued to execute on our strategic vision, further strengthening our position as a leading provider of intelligent solutions for automakers on a global scale. With market momentum continuing to build towards software-defined vehicles, we remain at the forefront with a clear focus on strengthening and expanding our portfolio of cutting-edge, cost-effective solutions. The global automotive market continues to grow, although at a slow pace in an increasingly challenging environment. Global vehicle sales grew by approximately 2% in 2004 to 91 million, including 64 million passenger vehicles. China continued to outpass the rest of the world in 2004 with passenger vehicle sales increasing 6% to 28 million. This was primarily driven by EVs, where sales surged to an impressive 13 million, up 36% and accounting for over 40% of sales. Chinese investment into advanced high-quality and high-tech production is pouring a new economic future. As growth slows and remains uneven globally, it becomes ever more important for companies to stand out from competition and define themselves. We are capitalizing on this growing demand and helping all makers distinguish themselves with our innovative product portfolio. Diverse customer base and strategic global partnerships is already having an impact, which is clear with fact in our performance last quarter and throughout the year. Revenue during the quarter and the year was up 4% and 18%, respectively. with growth margin of 21.2% and 20.8%. Respectively, not barely, our opening loss consistently narrowed throughout the year, while our business kept growing with the partial sale of an equity investment. This allowed us to hit breakeven at EBITDA level during the quarter, strengthening our confidence in reaching four-year breakeven in 2025. Total shipments reached a record high of 3 million last year, up 33% year-over-year, with over 700,000 ships during the fourth quarter alone, up 10% from last quarter by the end of 2024. There were over 8.1 million vehicles on the road incorporating eCAR-X technology. This strong performance was driven by the vast demand for GD models deploying eCAR-X technology, such as GLAS E5, StarWish, and Starship 7. The success of these models helped GD exceed its annual sales target last year with momentum carrying into January 2005 where GD's sales volume for the month hit a record high. We secured a new project with Volkswagen Group during the quarter, expanding our global customer base to 18 outmakers across 28 brands. This project wing is a milestone for us and our solutions, which will be deployed in vehicles across EMEA and Americas, expanding our global reach and demonstrating to a broader audience how our four-stack solutions can be seamlessly customized for deployment. Regardless of market, we also won a number of new projects from existing customers as our solutions are expanded to cover even more of their vehicles. We released our AutoGPG in vehicle AI large language modeling application last quarter and quickly integrated multi-LLMS large modeling, including OpenAI and most recent DPCs. This underscores the unique value proposition we offer to global automakers with cutting-edge technology supported by our growing ecosystem of strategic partnerships. Before I hand the call over to Peter, I would like to reiterate the optimism and confidence we have in our future growth prospects. Having achieved a break-even during the quarter, we are targeting positive EBITDA for four years, 2025. $20 million share repurchase program we announced in December further underscores this optimism. The growing prominence of software-defined vehicles continues to create tremendous opportunities for us as we replicate and scale our solutions globally, enabling us to drive sustainable growth and value for our shareholders. I will now pass the call over to Peter. who will go through the operating results of the quarter in more detail.

Thank you, Ziyu, and good day to everyone. I'll start with our growing customer base, where Ziyu mentioned we secured a milestone project win with the Volkswagen Group during the quarter. This project will deploy our Antora 1000 computing platform and eCarX Cloud Peak integrated with Google Automotive Services in multiple vehicles through Volkswagen's Global Entry Infotainment Initiative, which is set to launch across EMEA and the Americas towards the end of this decade. We also won three new design wins from our existing customers, with two deploying our Galena computing platforms and one deploying Makalu. On the product front, we had several exciting new vehicles launched this quarter. Following the strong launch in China, of the Geely Galaxy E5 last August. An overseas version known as the Geely Galaxy EX5 entered startup production during the quarter and began deliveries in early 2025. The EX5 will be the first vehicle overseas to deploy the Antora 1000 computing platform, demonstrating our technological strengths and ability to deliver this solution for both the PRC and international markets. We cumulatively shipped approximately 500,000 Antora series units by the end of last year, with shipments expected to surpass 1 million in 2025. This provides automakers with a cost-effective way to integrate digital cockpit and driving capabilities into a single board using the Antora 1000, which will be deployed as Geely's mainstream entry-level solution on future models. The Hongqi Tiangong-5 started production late last year and was launched in January 2025, deploying the first intelligent cockpit jointly developed under our strategic partnership with FAW. Powered by the Antora 1000 Pro and integrated with a customized Hongqi FAW OS built on top of the eClarX CloudPeak and AutoGBT, The Tiangong-5 will set new industry benchmarks with an immersive and AI-driven intelligent cockpit experience. A similar solution will be deployed on another Hongqi model, which is expected to launch in the first quarter of 2025. We are also working on an ADAS solution for five Hongqi vehicles with startup production scheduled for the third quarter, further deepening our relationship. We continue to drive innovation in other areas as well, ensuring that our automaker partners have access to cutting-edge solutions. Our Cloud Peak hypervisor, a core component of the Cloud Peak software stack, received ISO 26262 ASIL-D certification in January, the highest level of certification, and a reflection of our focus on functional safety throughout the product lifecycle. CloudPeak was integrated into the Macaloo computing platform and deployed on the Lincoln Co. Z10 StarBuff, which was launched in November of last year. This customized eSports version of the Z10 allows users to play AAA games on the go with an immersive gaming experience. Momentum for the Skyline Pro ADAS solution is building as automakers are increasingly seeking cost-effective solutions that they can rapidly bring to market. Skyland Pro has been integrated into Geely's G-PILOT unified intelligent driving system, powering the recently launched Galaxy E8 all-electric sedan. The solution can be easily replicated and scaled across various brands and models, offering users a unique driving experience with advanced features such as automatic parking, assistance, and highway NOA. The Skyland Pro already powers vehicles including the Lincoln Co. 08 and Lincoln Co. 07 launched in 2023. The 08 model received a high CN cap rating and remains in strong demand. With the bottom ground for automakers to differentiate themselves, now expanding to ADAS and vehicle intelligence, intelligent driving solutions will be crucial to drive the long-term sustainable development of our business and the global automotive industry. With a clear roadmap for future ADAS solutions, we are already capitalizing this opportunity and will continue to drive innovation going forward. Our robust intellectual property portfolio keeps growing with 692 registered patents and 723 patent pending applications globally as of December 31st, 2024. To demonstrate our robust portfolio of technologies, we attended numerous industry events during the quarter. In November, we showcased the Skyland Pro ADAS solution at AutoSense China, demonstrating how it can empower automakers with high-performance, cost-effective, intelligent driving solutions. That same month, we also represented the automotive sector at the Saudi Arabia National Quality Conference, where we received the SASO Award, for contributions to generative AI quality assurance, reflecting the impact that AutoGPT is having on the industry. We carried this momentum into 2025 at CES in January, where one of the dominant themes was AI. Interest in automotive applications of AI was extremely high this year, making AutoGPT a real point of interest. Over four days at CES, our management team packed in more than 50 meetings including 17 with automakers from across the world. We also showcase the power and versatility of our solutions at our booth, including the Galena, Antora, and Makalu platforms, solutions that all have been validated and deployed in vehicles currently in production, along with our ADAS technologies. A key point of our message and conversations was the power of AutoGPT, specifically its core auto agent, AutoFlow, AutoScene, and AutoEco capabilities built on top of several of the world's leading LLMs to enhance the in-vehicle experience. Automakers and ecosystem partners were captivated by the AutoAgent's adaptability to unique driver preferences, AutoScene's monitoring of in-vehicle behavior, AutoFlow's interaction with mobile apps, and AutoEco's seamless connectivity with in-vehicle applications across devices, creating a comprehensive range of AI-enhanced solutions. Our presentation at CES helped us set the agenda for the year to come, with a focus on expanding our global business by empowering automakers with cost and power-efficient, high-quality solutions. I'd like to end with a quick update on our Fuyang Smart Facility, and our strategy to integrate manufacturing and supply chain processes. Production continues to ramp up with more than 60,000 Antora units produced in December alone and further capacity expansions planned throughout this year. In conclusion, 2024 was a remarkable year for us and I remain highly optimistic that this will continue into 2025, especially as we lean into technological innovation and continue to diversify our customer base globally. I will now turn the call over to Phil, who will go through our financial results.

Thank you, Peter, and hello, everyone. We closed out the year with a strong growth momentum despite intense market competition, hitting break-even at the EBITDA level during the fourth quarter. Total revenue for the quarter was 1.9 billion RMB, an increase of 4% year-over-year, and 36% sequentially. Sales of goods revenue was 1.5 billion RMB, up 16% year-over-year, driven by robust demand for our computing platforms, especially the Antola series and Macalu, which accounted for approximately 29% of sales of goods revenue. Software license revenue came in at 90 million RMB, a decrease of 3% year-over-year, and an increase of 7% sequentially. The year-over-year decrease was due to a decrease in the volume of legacy project software sales, while the sequential increase was driven by the ramp-up of eCLARCS operating system in line with the increase in shipments of the Antola platform. Service revenue was 326 million RMB, a decrease of 31% year-over-year, and a substantial increase of 102% sequentially, primarily impacted by engineering planning schedules and the timing of booking design and development contracts revenue. Gross profit for the quarter was 411 million RMB, down 4% year-over-year. resulting in a gross margin of 21.2%. Total cost of round increases 6% year-over-year during the quarter, mainly driven by an increase in sales volumes for digital carpets. The decrease in the gross margin was primarily the result of our pricing strategy to deepen penetration and drive computing hardware growth, as well as a shift in the overall round mix compared to private quarters. As the industry-wide pricing pressure for automakers has deepened, we expect margins on hardware products to remain challenging over the medium term. To address this challenge, we will focus on optimizing product costs through economics of scale, our supply chain and manufacturing strategy, and improving overall operational efficiency. Furthermore, we will continue to strike a careful balance between top-line growth, profitability, and capital investment. Operating expenses during the quarter decreases 32% year-over-year, primarily driven by the continuous expansion of our global operations and R&D efficiency improvements, as well as synergies created by reallocation and integration of R&D resources. Adjusted EBITDA gains were 74 million RMB during the quarter, a significant improvement compared to a loss of 236 million RMB during the same period last year, primarily attributable to the decrease in total operating expenses as well as gains from the partial sales of an equity investment. Last year was RMB 0.11 compared to the same period last year, RMB 0.89. We closed out the year with a robust performance, with a full year total revenue of 5.6 billion RMB, up 18% year-over-year, gross profit of 1.2 billion RMB, down 9% year-over-year, and a gross margins of 20.8%. During the year, we further improved operating and R&D efficiency by consolidating and reallocating resources and prioritizing investments in our international business and R&D expansion. Fully operating expenses decreased 7% year-over-year, with an adjusted EBITDA loss of $592 million and improvement of $119 million from last year. Moving on to our balance sheets. As of the end of the year, we had 367 million RMB of cash and the restricted cash. As we continue to optimize working capital and enhance profitability, we are proactively exploring options for a capital raise, including equity or debt financing to support our strategic objectives. As part of this effort, we recently filed an F3 registration statement allowing us to rapidly capitalize on favorable market conditions as they arise. Looking forward, we will further improve operating expenses and the product costs with a particular focus on procurement, supply chain, and manufacturing strategy and efficiency. We will continue to drive growth and expand the addressable market for our solutions by penetrating deeper into the Geely and the Geely ecosystem and growing our global automaker customer base further. For product offerings, we will continue to invest in R&D to capitalize on mid- to long-term growth opportunities. Additionally, we will accelerate the build-out of two closed-loop systems, one for China and the other for global markets. each spanning the entire process from R&D to delivery. In summary, we will focus on the unique value proposition we offer to automakers, further diversify our global customer base, proactively mitigate the impact of an increasingly challenging geopolitical environment, and improve our cost structure to ensure the long-term sustainability of our business model and the financial performance. That concludes our prepared remarks today.

I would now like to hand the call back to the operator to begin the Q&A session.

Thank you. To ask a question, you will need to press star 1 and 1 on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced. To withdraw your question, please press star 1 and 1 again. Please stand by while we compile the Q&A queue. Our first question comes from the line of Danlin Ren from CICC. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Hi. Good evening, everyone. This is Danlin Ren from CICC Auto Team. Congratulations on your strong results last year. And I have three quick questions to check with you. The first one is, could you share the company's global production capacity layout and how you expect to pace the implementation of global orders in the coming years. The second one is what's your current plan for ADES or AD products? Which clients are you working with? And where do you see growth opportunities in your collaboration with Geely? The last one is what's your overall strategic roadmap and development goals for over the next three to five years? That's all my questions.

Hi, Devin. This is Peter. I'll take your first question. We just talked a little bit about our manufacturing strategy. 2024 was a big milestone year for us in terms of manufacturing because we ramped up our capabilities in China quite extensively. If you remember, we took the control of a joint venture we had established quite early in eCarX's life and also opened our new Fuyang facility. We're today very close to that site. We're holding a big supplier day. So the Fuyang facility continues to ramp up very aggressively to serve our needs in China and will continue to be our premier site where we're investing heavily in technology there to have a leading manufacturing facility in the China region. Globally, as we expand, as we mentioned earlier in our remarks, we had a big milestone win with Volkswagen. And as we continue to expand with opportunities in South America, India, and in Europe, I would expect that we would probably use some EMS or contract manufacturing partners that will help us expand our production capacity while we're continuing to expand engineering services or engineering capabilities to serve the global audience. So I think we'll use very similar strategy that we utilized in China as we continue our growth over the last seven years that we have started with some partnership relationships, and then we'll continue to expand as it makes sense as we grow our business.

Okay, so we Yeah, okay, so DJ Su speaking. So I will take the second question about the ADAS. We have already made a Skyline Pro product operating on linking KUKA 08 and 07 last year. Yeah, I think two years ago, yeah. So that's a 10 camera solution with 5 radar and also can support highway NLP function. Also, we are following the urban feature as well. And this product already be a part of the GD-ADA roadmap they just announced. Also, we are keep working on this platform, Skyline Pro and Skyline. Also, we just announced the AD1000 SoC with 5G company together. That is a very high performance AI computing SOC platform from SA engine IC design company we invested. So very similar to SE1000 from Antola platform for digital capitalism. This one we will get ADAS computer unit for very high performance feature on this platform. We are starting investments on development and we have make production next two years. This is ongoing still. Also, I think we are investing the ADA roadmap to stretch our portfolio and to earn more growth next three years. That's a lot of expectation here.

Thank you. It's very clear.

Thank you. Thank you. We'll now move on to our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Daishen from SPDBI. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Dear management, this is Tony from SPDBI International. First of all, congratulations on the EBITDA break even in the first quarter of 2024. This is perfect. And so I've got two questions here. The first question is about the guidance or the outlook of 2025. Can the management share some color or guidance for revenue, growth margin, and also the break-even point of 2025? This is my first question. And the second question may be also related to the ADAS penetration rate increasing significantly, especially powered by BYD in February this year. how do we see the opportunities for e-CarX, for e-CarX, the PAM opportunity and the customer's demand for both the cockpit and the driving solutions? These are my two questions. Thank you.

Hello. Hi. So this is Du speaking. OK. So thank you for questions. The first question, I think the answer is very clear. I think in 2025, we are very, very focus on breakeven. That's very main priority for us. So, of course, we still will have the growth for revenue, but that will be the second priority for founder breakeven. So that breakeven is top priority for us because we believe the health of the cash flow and the finance and balance sheet is the most important for the company, the global journey, because we already win the global OEM and we have to go very health, finance, balance sheet to support our global expansion. So that's why brick even is my main priority for the company. Well, also your first question. Okay. And second question about the ADAS opportunity and also digital copies to the opportunity. Yeah, we already know BYD announcement. So we believe the ADAS growth is very significant in China market. And most of OEM following the journey BYD is doing. So that's why I think it's a good opportunity. I just answered the question to CICC before that. We invest in Skyline and Skyline Pro already. Also, we are fast moving with the SunEngine chipset, SOC 81000. Also, we will go NVIDIA platform as well for SOI. So that's why I think ADOT portfolio will be very important, be part of the e-car X next three years growth. So that's why we believe ADAS feature and ADAS software development will be very key for the company. And we will continue to invest in this area.

Okay, perfect. That is very clear. May I have a quick follow-up? Can we have any color on the growth margin, maybe for 2025? Especially, how do you see the price trend related to growth margin? Okay, this is my last question. Thank you.

Hey, I'm happy to address your question. So regarding the margin performance, as I can see that in Q4 last year, we just recovered our gross margin performance back to 20% and above. And that reflects our ability to manage the portfolio selling. So in Q4, we sold our balanced software and services. At the same time, we also drove a very effective cost-down activities. So that's why, in the end, we are able to recover the margin back to 20%. So when moving into 2025, this strategy will continue. For sure, we foresee the headwinds ahead regarding the pricing erosion, pricing pressure. But at the same time, the company is ready to drive the upstream supply chain management. So we will keep optimizing cost and as well as the scale, the economics of scale. So at the same time, back to the first question regarding our breakeven. Our breakeven, the path to breakeven in 2025 is built on the data-driven strategy and with measurable progress. And we focus on multi-financial dimensions as well. First of all, we go, for sure, we will accelerate the top-line growth with the volume scaling. You may have observed that our installation rate and attention rate keep increasing. Last year, we shipped in total nearly 500,000 units in our customers. At the same time, we perceived that such kind of mix will keep climbing, which will definitely contribute to our revenue growth as well as our margin performance. Second, we will drive the operational efficiency improvement as well. So we already systematically reduced our OPEX versus revenue ratio. from 22, 53% to 34% in 2024. And in 2025, we foresee the percentage will further optimize to 20% plus, which is really helpful for our break-even achievement. And yeah, as I mentioned earlier, the effective cost-to-structure optimization definitely will help us to achieve that goal as well. adjust the question and by adding more minutes with answers.

OK, perfect. Perfect. Thank you. Thank you, Phil. Thank you, management.

Thank you. Once again, to ask a question, you will need to press star 1 and 1 on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced. To withdraw your question, please press star 1 and 1 again. We'll now move on to our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Jenny Wang from UBS. Please go ahead, your line is open.

Hi, this is Jenny Wang from UBH Auto Team. Congratulations on the boot event at UBH, and thanks for taking my questions. I have two questions. First, could you please provide a revenue breakdown by clients for 2004, and maybe share your outlook for your current mix for the next five to ten years? And the second question is that, as the largest smart cockpit supplier for Geely brands, Do you expect ECHAX to benefit from Geely's supply chain consolidation and increase the share at Geely Brands further? Where will the ceiling of your share at Geely?

Okay, Jenny, maybe I'll take your questions. I think as we look across our customer base, as Ziyu has highlighted many times, continuing to diversify our revenue from additional customers is very critical for our strategic path forward. And we are very selective as we do that. In 2020, 2024, at the end of the year, we launched the two home team models. That will happen, I think, between December and January. And then as we go through 2025, we'll see additional launches with with Hongxi and with FAW as we continue to expand our relationship and deepening our partnership with them. Additionally, we'll certainly see some expansion of our product set with Hongxi as well beyond the digital copy, which is where we've started that relationship. We're continuing to focus in China on selective expansion as we see customers that align with our winning strategy. We're very excited to engage with them. and develop similar relationships that we have with our existing customers. From a global perspective, as we mentioned, the activity with Volkswagen is certainly a very important milestone for the company. That product will launch, as we mentioned, a few years from now, which is the normal development cycle in the international market. We're already engaged on already a number of mature RFQs that we would expect to be able to continue to gain traction in the global market and capitalize on the capabilities that we've built up. Our largest vehicle in the global market that we launched was the EX30, and we're continuing to expand our relationship with global cars. And then lastly, you talked about Geely. I mean, we've definitely seen growth with the Geely brands. The ANTORA platform is a key element of GE's current architecture and will continue to deploy across additional models as we go through the next few design cycles. Ziyu, I believe, had mentioned earlier around the growth of the ANTORA shipments expected in 2025 and beyond, so we expect that product. continues to gain good share throughout the market and deliver a very fantastic user experience to the consumers of the vehicle. So we're quite excited about the deep partnership that we have built with the Geely brand, and we expect to continue to build off that, both in developing hero products like our Antora series, as well as deepening our relationship with them.

Yeah. And regarding the from different customer types. And as Peter mentioned, in 2025, we will massively support FAW Humshi. There are multi-programs to launch. At the same time, starting from 2026, FAW Humshi volume will climb up. And when moving to 2027, 2028 timeframe, Volkswagen business, we will start to do massive supply as well. So let's In the end, by 2027, 2028, the time frame, the random mix, basis mix from the GD and the non-GD will eventually achieve a 50% versus 50%. That is our goal. And we are on the right trajectory to achieve that.

Thank you so much. That's all for me.

OK. Thanks, Jenny.

Thank you. We'll now move on to our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Wei Huang from Deutsche Bank. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Hi. Thanks for taking my question. Congratulations on the very strong set of results. I have three quick questions. The first one is, can you maybe give us the GLE share of your total revenue in 2024? The second is, the Lincoln Co. brand is a significant customer for eCRX. And do we see an impact on our business with them, given their merger into Zeker? And the third is, Jilly recently announced the Galaxy E8 with the Qualcomm A295 chip. Is this using our PyX computing platform? Thank you.

Thank you. I'm sorry, the first question is regarding the Jilly-Ralmy contribution to 2024 performance, right? Yes. Okay, so in 2014, I would say that the majority of revenue still came from Geely, but we significantly shifted our focus to non-Geely expansion. So far, nearly 80% of the revenue still came from Geely and Geely related to the ecosystem business, and 20% is from non-Geely business. So that is the general summary about our revenue performance.

Yeah, that's in 2024. And also, you already got information from the public. We just launched the FAAW vehicle. And also in 2025, we will have the significant revenue from FAAW. We will strengthen the NGD revenue. Also, we just won the Volkswagen Global Fuel in 2027. So that's why we have super confidence in the coming three years. We will strongly strengthen the NGD revenue in the company. Okay, the first question is okay?

Yes, that is very clear.

Thank you. Okay, so the second question about LinkedIn Go and Zeger, right? So I think we don't have too much impact on that because we are still a very strong peer-reviewed supplier for LinkedIn Go, the current main portfolio. Actually, everybody knows, as you know, So, LinkingCode 08 and 07 were successful. We contributed to the Antola platform with Blamey Auto software together in LinkingCode car. Also, we keep working with them very closely. And also, every end user very, very, very enjoyed the user experience from Blamey Auto in the system. So, that's why I think in the near future, in the coming years, we still very important to partner with LinkingCode brand. There's no doubt about that, I think. And also, you mentioned the Glass E8, right? So Glass E8, I think, is still using the primary aural. We are a software partner with Geely for the primary aural adaption. But this hardware, 8295, is not from us. That's from other supplier. But in Glass E8, also, we provide a skyline ADAS system directly to E8, and also we're providing the full feature for including highway NLP feature on the Galaxy E8.

Understood. That is very clear. That's all from me. Thank you. Thank you.

Thank you. There are no further questions at this time, so I'll hand the call back to COO Peter for closing remarks.

Okay. Well, first of all, I just wanted to thank all the members who joined the call. We appreciate the questions. You know, eCAR Act really had a milestone quarter and a great end of the year of 2024. You know, achieving positive EBITDA was a big effort that the organization was extremely focused on. As you mentioned, we're continuing to focus on repeating those results throughout full year 2025. We had a robust launch pipeline that we discussed as we continue to deepen our relationship with new customers such as FIW and our announcement for Volkswagen was a big impact for the organization that we're excited to continue to deepen our global relationships with key customers. So thank you everyone for the call today and appreciate everyone's engagement.

This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect. Speakers please stand by.