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spk04: Thank you for standing by, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the C-Energy Maritime Holdings Corp conference call on the 4th quarter and year ended 31 December 2022, financial results. We are with us Mr. Stamatis Stanis, Chairman and CEO of Mr. Sparrow Gift Gas, CFO and Officer of C-Energy Maritime Holdings Corp. At this time, all participants are in listen-only mode. There will be a presentation, followed by a question and answer session. At which time, I wish you like to ask a question, please press star 11 on your telephone. If you would like to cancel your request, please press star 11 again. Please be advised that today's conference is being recorded. Today, Tuesday, March 14, 2023. The archived webcast of the conference call and accompanying slides will be soon made available on the Senergy website, www.senergymanagement.com. Please now turn to slide 2 of the presentation. Many of the remarks today contain forward-looking statements based on current expectations. Actual results may differ materially from the results projected from those forward-looking statements. Additional information concerning factors that can cause the actual results to differ in material from those in the forward looking statement is contained in the full Quartan and here handled December 31, 2022 earnings release, which is available on the Synergy website again. If you'd like to turn the conference over to one of our speakers today, the chairman and CEO of the company, Mrs. Tamati Stanis.
spk05: Please go ahead, sir. Thank you, Operator.
spk02: Hello, I would like to welcome everyone to our conference call. Today we are presenting the financial results for the fourth quarter and the full year period of 2022. We are also pleased to announce the distribution of another cash dividend, which is basically equal to our net profit for the fourth quarter. The fourth quarter was another profitable period for Synergy and concluded our second consecutive profitable year. First and foremost, in 2022, we clearly prioritized shareholder rewards, as I will discuss in detail in today's call. We made generous distributions to our shareholders, despite a series of microeconomic and political challenges that occurred during the year. First, there was the invasion of Ukraine by Russia and the ongoing military conflict. Second, the heightened uncertainty about the probability of a significant slowdown in the global economy due to the spike in inflation. Last but not least, 2022 marked the third consecutive year of severe lockdowns in China, which negatively affected industrial production and economic growth. However, the recent lifting of COVID-related lockdowns in China has already had a positive effect on general economic activity and still production, and we expect to see accelerated raw material imports. We are bullish for the dry bulk market outlook, and we believe that Synergy is very well positioned to benefit over the next years. Turning to our highlights with regards to our financial performance, for the full year period, net revenue reached $125 million, adjusted EBITDA was $65.6 million, while net income amounted to $17.2 million. As regards to fourth quarter, We recorded net revenues of $28.5 million and adjusted EBITDA of $12.5 million, while net income was equal to half a million. Since the fourth quarter of 2021, we delivered approximately $58.4 million of value to our shareholders in the form of dividends, share buybacks and the repurchase of convertible securities. board of directors approved the cash dividend of 2.5 cents per share for the fourth quarter of 2022 which is effectively all of our net income i'm confident that our financial performance will be able to support good shareholder returns throughout the shipping cycle regarding our vessel transactions during 2022 we sold or spun out our three oldest vessels built in 2004 2005 and 2006 while in the same period we acquired two modern japanese vessels the ownership built in 2010 and the scrubber fitted parachute built in 2012. these transactions have a positive impact both on our fleet's average age as well as our profitability based on lower fuel consumption better rating on the baltic hs index and scrubber premium earnings During the second quarter of 2022, we concluded the spin-off of United Maritime Corporation, which commenced trading on the NASDAQ capital market on July 6, 2022, under the symbol UC. All shares of United were distributed to our shareholders. United, in its first year of operations, generated a significant profit and distributed massive dividends to its shareholders and, hopefully, to Synergy's original shareholders that retained their United shares. In January 2023, we completed successfully the tender offer for Class E warrants, repurchasing approximately half of the outstanding securities, thus reducing dilution risk. On February 16, 2023, very recently, we affected a 10 to 1 reverse split of our common stock and on the 3rd of March, we regained compliance with the Nasdaq's minimum bid requirements. We expect the increase of the nominal price of our shares to have a positive effect on the marketability and trading liquidity, mainly by eliminating certain price-related trading restrictions. As regards to our financing updates, Synergy has completed new financings and refinancings of almost $125 million in 2022. We are also working closely on other deals that will improve further our financing costs and release liquidity. We are constantly working towards optimizing our capital structure and preserving our liquidity while evaluating our options to refinance our indebtedness at lower interest rates. Following up on our environmental, social and governance initiatives, in 2022 we released our first ESG report which provides an overview of our policies and commitments on ESG matters. Our board of directors has also established a sustainability committee with the aim of advising the board on relevant issues. We are guided by ESG principles in our operational and strategic objectives and we recognize the growing importance of these efforts in achieving the best outcomes for all companies, stakeholders and society. Lastly, given the large discount of our share price as compared to its intrinsic value, I have decided to personally purchase another up to $1 million in additional common shares. I intend to commence my purchases following the release of our earnings, which is now, in line with our internal trading policy and restrictions. Turning to slide 2 for a more detailed breakdown of shareholder returns, approximately 18.5 million in regular dividends and 4.5 million in extraordinary dividends have been declared since the fourth quarter of 2021. This represents approximately 20% of our current market cap. Additionally, during the same period, significant capital was deployed in repurchases of shares and other potentially diluted securities. More specifically, 3.5 million has been allocated to share and warrant repurchases, and 32 million was utilized to buy back convertible notes. On a final note, during 2022, our shareholders also received shares of our spin-off, United Maritime, which in turn, as I mentioned before, after a very profitable series of transactions, has made significant distributions to its shareholders. Since the initiation of our capital returns in the beginning of 2022, Synergy has paid approximately $22.9 million in cash dividends, translating to $1.75 per share. When including the value of the United Maritime Shares received as part of the spin-off, total distributions amount to approximately $1.61, per Synergy Share or a 26% dividend yield based on this Friday's closing price. Please turn over to slide 3 to discuss our fleet's commercial developments. Our fleet currently consists of 16 cape-sized vessels with an average age of 12 years, of which 9 have scrubbers installed. Our latest acquisition, the Paroship, was placed into an index-linked time charter with a major European operator for a period of about 10 months. Additionally, following our last quarterly update, we completed the sales of two of our oldest vessels, the Trader Ship and Good Ship, built 2005 and 2006. Both vessels were delivered to their new owners in February of 2023. As regards to our commercial performance, the daily time charter equivalent in the fourth quarter was approximately $17,300, representing a 16% premium to the average Baltic Cape Size Index. In the full year period, we recorded a daily TCE of about $20,000 per ship per day, or a 24% premium over the BCI. Our decision to focus on high-quality vessels and the scrubber premiums and by our fleet in combination with some proactive hedging through FFA conversions, have alleviated the effects of a falling spot market, and we view this as an important validation of our commercial strategy. For the first quarter of 2023, we expect to earn daily time charter equivalent rate of 10,200, which may sound very low, but it's a premium of more than 40% over the average BCI year to date. In addition, we recently decided to convert the floating index linked rates on two of our vessels to fixed rates at approximately $20,000 from the second quarter of 2023 until the end of the year. We are actively monitoring the FFA curve and considering further conversions as the market conditions and outlook improve. I will now pass the call to our CFO who is going to discuss our financial results before I return to discuss our market update. Stavros, please go ahead.
spk01: Thank you so much. Welcome everyone to our earnings call. Let us start by reviewing the main highlights of our financial statements for the fourth quarter and 12 months period that ended on December 31st, 2022. In the fourth quarter, we achieved net revenue of 28.5 million, reflecting a decrease from the net revenue of 56.7 million in the same period of 2021. The reduction in our revenue came as a result of the decline in the average daily time charter equivalent of the fleet, which was mainly due to the increased volatility in spot earnings and the softer overall market conditions. Our adjusted EBITDA and net income stood at $12.5 million and $0.5 million respectively. However, we remained profitable amid these unfavorable market conditions and in fact we were able to outpace the market as this is reflected in the Baltic Capsule Index. For the 12-month period, net revenue was $125 million, with our average daily time charter equivalent rate standing at $20,040, compared to net revenue of $153 million and an average daily time charter equivalent rate of $27,400 last year. Net income for the 12-month period was $17.2 million, while adjusted EBITDA reached $65.6 million. Earnings per share for the quarter and 12-month period were $3.97 respectively. Concerning our balance sheet, our cash at the end of the fourth quarter remained robust and stood at $32.5 million in a year with approximately $28 million in dividend distributions and buybacks. At the same time, our assets soared to $514 million, while our debt also increased but remained at modest levels, as it is reflected in our debt ratio of approximately 51%. Our net debt at the end of the year was $227.4 million. Finally, total shareholder's equity was $222 million as of December 31, 2022, from $245 million at the end of 2021. Overall, and given the softer keepshift market we witnessed in the second half of the year, Our performance was satisfactory, with our TCE and adjusted EBITDA outpacing our average performance of the last 5 years. The effective deployment of our corporate and commercial strategies allowed us to retain an adjusted EBITDA margin of 51.6%, just 5% below the record margin achieved in 2021. As regards our operating expenses, we noted a rise in 2022 due to the high inflationary environment. Our average daily operating expenses, excluding pre-delivery expenses, was $6,819, reflecting a 10% increase compared to the previous year. However, with most of our fleet now being managed in-house and with increased efficiency that we have seen as of late, we expect these expenses to be trimmed in the coming year. Moving on to our debt profile and some details on our financing updates. The senior debt outstanding at the end of 2022 was 249 million, which translates to 13.8 million per vessel, secured against an average market value per vessel of about 25.4 million. In a year that we accomplished a partial renewal of our fleet, We managed to retain our corporate leverage at modest levels, at around 53%, despite the market values correcting by approximately 25% during the second half of the year. Additionally, during 2022, we completed a $10 million buyback of convertible notes, while another $8 million were repaid in the beginning of this year. Meanwhile, a decrease was noted in our cash interest and finance expenses in 2022, which reached $10.8 million versus $11 million in the previous year. This becomes even more remarkable considering the sharp tightening of Fed's interest rates a sheer 400 basis points increase during the period. Our efforts to improve the overall terms of our facilities continued this year, with total refinancings and financings of 124.8 million, with the average margin of our facilities dropping further to 2.9% as of December 31, 2022, versus 3.2% the year before. I would now move on to discuss the financing transactions that have taken place since our last update in more detail. In December, we entered a 16.5 million loan facility with our existing lender, Alfa Bank, to finance part of the acquisition cost of our latest Cape size, the Paroship. The facility has a term of four years. while the interest rate is 2.9% plus SOFR and will amortize through four quarterly installments of half a million, followed by 12 quarterly installments of 400,000 and a 9.6 million balloon payment at maturity. Meanwhile, in connection with the recent sale of goodship and tradership, the company prepaid in February the 12.9 million outstanding on the AB bank facility, which was secured by these two vessels. In addition to these transactions, the company has recently obtained one commitment letter from one of our existing lenders, Danish Finance, for a loan facility of up to $15.8 million. The support of our banks is apparent even in today's volatile market conditions. This facility will be used to partly finance the repurchase of the championship, currently under a sale and lease back with Cargill. With this transaction, we will not have any debt maturities until the second quarter of 2025. The loan will bear interest at a rate of 2.65% plus SOFR adjusted annually subject to the achievement of certain carbon emissions targets and the term of the agreement will be 5 years. Moreover, we are in progress discussions for a sale and leaseback transaction of up to 19 million in order to refinance at improved terms an existing sale and leaseback agreement for one of our 2010 build caves. Moving on, and before returning the call back to Stamatis, I would like to discuss our operating leverage and some guidance for our company's performance once charter rates have been stabilized at healthcare levels. The potential for high EBITDA in 2023 is clear, as it is illustrated in the graph you see. Even if rates settled this year at the same numbers as in 2022, we expect our EBITDA to overcome the 50 million, while if the great year of 2021 is repeated, our projections show an EBITDA of 148 million. At this early point in the year, these projections are obviously subject to significant uncertainty, but the increase in potential profitability is clear. This concludes my review. I will now turn the call back to Stamatis, who will discuss the market and industry fundamentals. Stamatis?
spk02: Thank you, Stavros. Let's now elaborate on the KPI's demand and supply fundamentals. In 2022, the KPI's market started off with a strong first half and ended on a weaker Q3 and Q4, diverging from the usual historical pattern. As discussed in the beginning of this call, the global picture was negatively affected by the invasion of Ukraine by Russia and the ongoing military conflict. In addition, rising inflation had a negative impact on the global economy by increasing uncertainty and industrial input costs. Lastly, 2022 was the third consecutive year of lockdowns in China which resulted in a negative economic backdrop punctuated by falling industrial production and economic growth. The average level of the Baltic Cape size index for the year 2022 was approximately 16,200 with the first half average of 18,200 and the second half average of 14,300. We are pleased to see the market achieve these levels amidst slower industrial activity and we are confident of further improvements as conditions normalize. Let's discuss now the high-level demand and supply picture for 2023 and onwards. In terms of vessel demand during 2022, China's industrial production fell due to squeezed profit margins and weak real estate activity. The Manufacturing Purchasing Managers Index fell to its lowest level since the COVID lockdowns and to the second lowest level since 2010. So far in 2023, we have seen a reversal of these negative trends as the latest two months manufacturing PMI in China registered the highest increases of the past 10 years. Other forward-looking indicators, such as excavator sales, which have historically been good predictors of future construction activity, have also turned upwards, while profit margins and utilization for steel mills are rebounding strongly and Brazilian iron ore exports are finally back on track for better performance. This is supported both from incremental improvements in real estate construction and car production, among others. Aside from China, we expect the massive infrastructure projects in the Middle East area, which are in excess of 1.5 trillion US dollars until 2030, as well as India's accelerated economic growth rate to be key factors for raw material demand. Moving on to vessel supply, figures are very encouraging for the KPI sector. First, the current new vessel order book is at the lowest point in decades. the combination of high steel prices and high interest rates greatly reduces the incentive for new vessel orders, while limited CPR capacity would make it almost impossible to get a new vessel delivered before the end of 2025 at best. As regards to demolition, high scrap prices are likely to incentivise the continued demolition of ineffective tonnage over the next years, especially as stricter environmental regulations set in. Along with the potential for fleet speed reduction due to EXI and CII in the new regulations, the effective cape-sized fleet capacity will be firmly under control or even reduced in the coming years. Concluding, as a closing remark, I'm pleased with our financial performance during a very volatile year for the CAPE size market. We are consistent to our pledge to deliver strong shareholder returns by executing significant distributions and creating significant accretion. Synergy remains in an excellent position to capitalize on the expected strong markets in the next years. On that note, I would like to turn the call over to the operator and answer any questions you may have. Operator, please take the call. Thank you.
spk04: As a reminder, to ask a question, you will need to press star 11 on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced.
spk05: We are now taking the first question.
spk04: Please stand by. And the first question from Paige Sullivan from Maxim Group. Let's go ahead.
spk03: Hello. Thank you. Good day. You commented on supporting good shareholder returns through cycles. And I think, correct me if I'm wrong, I think you'll have a gain on a sale of about $8 million in this current quarter from selling two vessels. I mean, how do you consider that gain when you evaluate your quarterly dividends since it is a one-time gain? And Justin, in light of the dividend amount that you announced today as well, please.
spk02: Hi, Tate. Good morning, and thanks for the question. Well, obviously, yes, we're going to have a gain from the sale of the ships. At the same time, Q1 so far has been trading at around $10,000 a day. So we have to see what's going to be the final impact on that at the end of the quarter, and then we will decide. But it's not going to be a static approach. If obviously the market has turned to where we want it to go and where it appears that it is going, then obviously we will try and reward our shareholders more generously, to put it this way. Right now, the reduction of the dividend has been in order to reflect the very bad market that we experienced in Q1, or we're experiencing so far, and we're trying to preserve cash and liquidity as much as we can. Obviously, as things change in the future and as things improve, we have had an excellent track record in paying out to our shareholders to the best of our capacity.
spk03: Thank you. Yes, you mentioned the repurchases. I mean, the China PMI reading a couple weeks ago was the highest since, what, 2012. But then, I mean, since that PMI reading, have you seen or even before that China booking more? more voyages? Are there any other tangible data points that you can point to in terms of China demand for the dry bulk sector, please?
spk02: Demand is not only China driven. I mean, we keep saying China and China, but I think China contributed more to the negative market of 2022. And we believe it's going to contribute a lot in the upside. But have in mind that China and the PMI was so weak in 2022. because they had the third consecutive year of almost a full year lockdown. As you can understand, this had a severe impact in industrial production. Things started to turn very ugly. At the same time, it's not only the vast infrastructure projects that we expect to happen in the Far East area. We also see that there's going to be $1.5 trillion of new infrastructure investments in the UAE area, together with Saudi Arabia, that have already started. So this is going to absorb a lot of steel and a lot of iron ore and cooking coal demand, in our opinion. So overall, we feel that the market is getting into a very strong infrastructure phase, combined with the Chinese reopening of the economy. I believe that from a demand perspective, we will see much, much better numbers than compared to last year.
spk03: Thank you. And Stavros, further, I'm looking at the numbers, but can you remind me the fees from related parties? Is that related to United Maritime or some gain on bunker fuel, or is the gain on bunker fuel within the lower operating expenses?
spk01: No, this is high pay. As you very correctly pointed out, these are fees and income from United So basically, as you may recall, United is managing the operations of Synergy. So Synergy is getting an administrative fee out of United. And at the same time, the dry bulk vessels of United are being managed by Synergy's in-house dry bulk management company. Lastly, Synergy is also earning fees on the earnings of United Ships and on the sale and purchase activity of United. This should be seen in conjunctions with a small increase that we had in our GNAs. The income from United is there to set off the increase which has incurred as a result of Synergy basically managing United's operations. Thank you very much.
spk05: Thank you, Tate.
spk04: Thank you for your question. We are now taking the next question. Please stand by. The next question from Jay, Ms. Meyer. Please go ahead. Your line is open.
spk06: Hi, good afternoon, gentlemen. Thanks for taking my question.
spk02: Hello, Jay. Nice to hear from you.
spk06: Yeah, the first question I had, you know, I'm looking at your results, and it's been, you know, two and a half months since the end of the year. You had the convertible repurchase. You had two shifts that you sold. I'm wondering if you have a pro forma figure for liquidity, how much cash liquidity you have right now.
spk02: Right now, we are, if I recall well, in the mid-20s, $20 million. But please have in mind that we have certain refinancings lined up now. which are to the benefit, of course, of the overall capital structure. So this figure is going to change depending on, you know, what's going to be the final agreement on that. But that's a good region. I mean, anywhere between, let's say, 25 and 30-plus million dollars, if I remember well. Thank you.
spk06: Yeah, I was wondering on the convertible repurchase. I thought that was very accretive. Good job on that. But she left about 3 million of those outstanding. What was the thought process behind that? And is there a potential to wrap up the rest of those?
spk02: Yes. There was absolutely no reason. It was just we wanted to, you know, get on with the housekeeping effect of whatever it was on the basis of the agreement. And we expect that to close completely hopefully within the first half of the year. So, you know, in the next few months we will most likely, sorry, extinguish the whole thing.
spk06: Sounds good. Looking forward to that one. I know last time we talked a little bit back in January, the goal was to maintain sort of the fixed dividend level, which of course would have been 25 cents a share. I see you cut the dividend by 90% today. Can you talk a little bit about what changed your mind there in February and March? Is it just the weak rates or is there something else going on?
spk02: Well, we are still fully committed in providing very generous shareholder returns. As I explained to Tate before, we wanted to preserve liquidity. We saw the market going down to $2,000 a day. As you understand, I mean, a couple of weeks ago, the market was literally at $2,000 a day. And we wanted to maintain as much cash as possible, not to have any liquidity concerns, but, you know, if there's a right opportunity or if there's anything in the horizon, we might need to move. The question is that we're fully committed in providing shareholder returns, and we will get back to certain levels that we feel will be more than adequate in the near future. We just wanted the market sentiment to get back to some positive levels. Again, the market is at $2,000 a day. That made us a little bit nervous in paying out a whole dividend amount. So we just wanted to be cautious about it.
spk06: Right. Yeah, those rates were very scary in February. Of course, right now they're looking a lot better. I know you have higher cash break even levels, but you must be pretty close to turning cash flow positive. You mentioned your liquidity is about 25 to 30 million. Is there sort of a reasonable minimum that you would like to maintain? I'm just curious because you have such a great opportunity to repurchase shares. You can buy back those convertibles. I'm just wondering what kind of buffer you have at this moment.
spk02: Well, we're generally very comfortable if we can maintain, let's say, at a minimum of a million and a half per ship. I mean, this is what we have in mind to be absolutely. But again, this is not a static approach. If we see the market and the outlook being very positive and we're able to secure cash flow by converting floating to fixed, as we have already started doing already, then we will be even more in our payouts. We'll be more generous in our payouts. If the market outlook, I mean, if, for example, we come to a point where we see Q1 next year pricing at $3,000 or $5,000 a day, we might be a little bit more cautious. But overall, we feel that the market is now turning into a more sustainable level, and we will be able to, again, start maximizing our shareholder returns to the extent possible. Also, as a final point I want to make is that my strong commitment in the company will be fully fully applied in the near future by me making purchases in the open market so i'm fully committed in what i've said and i will continue doing so as i have done you know all the way up and down and mostly down to be honest yeah looking looking forward to the stronger rates and stronger returns final question thank you so much for your time this morning
spk06: You talked about the related party fees with managing the United Maritime fleet. You mentioned there's some sales and purchase stuff in there as well. United Maritime had a massive gain on sale with some of the tankers there. Is there going to be any proceeds from that going to Synergy or those only on the new vessels?
spk02: Well, no. I mean, United's proceeds are United's proceeds, so there's no profit sharing in whatever we do. However, the company is making 1% on the sales proceeds. And, you know, when you make such a big profit from the sales of United Ships, then that is reflected on the commission that Synergy is making on the sale of the vessels. So that's as far as it goes. But other than that, there's no other profit-sharing agreement. You know, the two companies are separate, and the shareholders in both cases have been very generously rewarded for 2022.
spk06: Excellent. And I'm looking forward to more details in the filings. Thank you both for your time today.
spk02: Of course, Jay. Nice to hear from you. Thank you.
spk04: Thank you for your question. We are now taking the next question. So please stand by. The next question from from Maxine Group. Please go ahead.
spk03: Thank you for taking a follow-up. Circling back on the vessel operating expenses per day, They did drop 7% year-over-year and drop quarter-over-quarter as well. Is some of the 6,651 in 4Q from bunker fuel gains? And what's a reasonable run rate going forward for daily OPEX?
spk01: Thanks, Tate. No, bankers are not coming to the OPEX calculation. So OPEX concerns only operating expenses, no mortgage expenses. So that's mainly OPEX. Crew expenses, the majority of around 60% of the operating expenses has to do with crew. Then you've got spares and supplies, and then you have also insurance. The increase in the OPEX can be basically apportioned mainly on the inflationary environment and the fact that stores and supplies have gone up. the same time forwarding cost due to covet has also increased and also crew expenses have generally and especially repatriation and traveling expenses and accommodation have increased a lot and also please bear in mind that we have expanded the fleet a lot we have acquired many new ships and basically in order to crew these vessels and have the quality of the crew that Synergy wants on its ships, we have been paying top dollars for our crews. That's the reason behind the increase in OPEX.
spk03: Thank you. And then on the refinancing seems very active. Is it securing new relationships or establishing new relationships with lenders and also increasing the floating rate? during a rising interest rate environment for those refinances? Can you talk a little bit more about that?
spk01: I mean, the first refinancing, the one that we announced now that concerns the championship, that this will be refinanced through one of our existing lenders, Danish Finance. The reason behind this refinancing were mainly commercial. This vessel was financed through a sale and lease back agreement with Cargill, whereby the charter had the biggest the biggest share of the profit from the scrubber, and there was a small discount versus the index due to the financing background of this agreement. Now we are refinancing the ships through a third-party lender, and the commercial arrangement would be more beneficial for the company. It will include a premium to the index, and the majority of the scrubber profit sharing will be on the account of Synergy. Next, refinancing that we have lined up. are mainly aimed at expanding our relationships with the Japanese lenders we have we which are very competitive both on their overall terms and on their pricing thank you very much have a great rest of the day thanks date thank you for your question we are now taking the next question
spk04: Please stand by. The next question from Kristofferske from Arctic. Please go ahead.
spk00: Hello, gentlemen. Congrats on the call.
spk02: Hello. Good morning. Good afternoon. Nice to hear from you. Good, good.
spk00: Likewise.
spk02: Good afternoon.
spk00: So I understand the rationale behind the dividend reduction protocol. It makes perfect sense given... given how the market has been. But as you pointed out, I mean, the supply side, it looks fantastic going forward and into 2024. So the outlook is definitely strong and in connection with that. I was sort of How are you considering capital allocation going forward in terms of acquiring vessels versus share buybacks or dividends?
spk02: That's a great question. I think we will be fully in line and consistent with what we did in 2022. In 2022, we sold three of our older ships and we bought two more modern ships. So the net cash effect has been minimal for the company. if you think about it. So we will likely do the same, you know, maintain pretty much the same number of ships. If we can renew the fleet by selling an older ship and buying a more modern, we will most likely do it. At the same time, we were super generous in our distributions in 2022. I must remind you that we paid out approximately $1.28 in today's value, which is more than 20 plus percent dividend yield. And if you count in the value of the distributions from United, that's another 30 cents. So it has been a very, very generous distribution we did in 2022. So we will continue to have a balanced approach in our capital allocation in 2023. We're going to keep cash for a potential fleet renewal, but our priority remains in generating and paying good shareholder returns. Another point I must say here, we have provided a sensitivity analysis on EBITDA in today's call. And as you can see, with a very modest $20,000 BCI time charter, the company is going to make $75 million of EBITDA. So, you know, we're talking about a massive potential cash flow generating capacity. And if we move up to, let's say, 2021 figures, then we're talking something in the region of 100 plus, $110 million of EBITDA. Please rest assured that our shareholders will have a very, very generous distribution if we come to these figures. Thanks a lot. Have a great day. Thank you. Have a great afternoon.
spk04: Thank you for your question. As a reminder, if you wish to ask a question, please press star 11 on your telephone.
spk05: There are no further questions.
spk04: I will hand back the conference for closing remarks.
spk02: Thank you very much for attending today's call and please stand by in the next few weeks for providing additional information about the company's capital structure and business development. So thank you very much for hearing into our call today and have a great day, afternoon. Thank you.
spk04: Let's conclude the conference for today. Thank you for participating. You may all disconnect.
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