Axis Capital Holdings Limited

Q3 2021 Earnings Conference Call

10/28/2021

spk05: Good morning and welcome to Axis Capital Third Quarter Earnings Call. All participants will be in listen-only mode. If you need assistance, please signal a conference specialist by pressing the star key followed by zero. After today's presentation, there will be opportunity to ask questions. Please note that this event is being recorded. I'd like to turn the conference over to Mr. Matt Wurman, Investor Relations. Please go ahead.
spk01: Thank you, Nick. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I'm happy to welcome you to our conference call to discuss the financial results for Axis Capital for the third quarter and its September 30th, 2021. Our next press release and financial supplement were issued yesterday evening after the market closed. If you'd like copies, please visit the investor information section of our website at axiscapital.com. We set aside an hour for today's call, which is also available as an audio webcast, found in the investor information section of our website. With me today are Albert Benchimol, our president and CEO, and Pete Vogt, our CFO. Before I turn the call over to Albert, I'll remind everyone that the statements made during this call, including the question and answer session, which are not historical facts, may be forward-looking statements. Forward-looking statements involve risks, uncertainties, and assumptions. Actual events or results may differ materially from those projected in the forward-looking statements due to a variety of factors, including the risk factors set forth in the company's most recent report on Form 10-K and other reports the company files for the SEC. This includes the additional risks identified in the cautionary note regarding forward-looking statements in our earnings press release issued yesterday evening. We undertake no obligation to publicly update or revise any forward-looking statements. In addition, this presentation may contain non-GAAP financial measures. Reconciliations are included in our earnings press release and financial supplement. With that, I'll turn the call over to Albert.
spk07: Thank you, Matt. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining today's call. Our company's performance in recent quarters has been defined by consistency and accelerated momentum in our results, a trend that continued in the third quarter, even in the face of heavy CAT and weather activity. We expect industry CAT losses in the third quarter will exceed $50 billion. And with year-to-date industry natural catastrophe losses already ahead of full year 2020, this year should rank among the top five CAT loss years for the industry. Despite this, AXA has generated net operating income for the quarter. Our operating income is up $66 million in the quarter and $412 million year-to-date as compared to the prior year periods. And our core underwriting profitability is on a strong positive trajectory. Our all-in XCAT underwriting income was up 82% in the quarter to $191 million and year-to-date it's up 56 percent to $518 million. Over the last few years, we've both improved our core XCAT results and reduced our exposure to CAT events, and the results are now evident. This quarter marks the eighth consecutive quarter of year-over-year improvement in our XCAT combined ratio. Over that period, we've reduced our reported XCAT combined ratio by more than seven points, and it now stands below 88 percent year-to-date. In that same period, we've reduced our PMLs by 25 to 40 percent at various points along the curve to ensure that less of our core XCAD profits are eroded by CAD events. Our modest year-over-year change in CAD losses and lower market share of global CAD events this year reflects our progress in reducing earnings volatility. allowing us to deliver a consolidated underwriting profit in the year-to-date period. I want to highlight the strong performance of our insurance business to illustrate just how far we've come. During the quarter, our insurance business produced 26 percent growth in premiums, reflecting our strong positioning in the attractive ENS and specialty markets. And we're on pace to report record premium production for the second year in a row. We continue to extend our footprint in highly attractive markets that are seeing the most favorable conditions, and we feel good about the pricing and terms that our underwriters are securing. Importantly, this growth came with improvements in profitability, as insurance delivered an underwriting profit in the quarter, and our all-in year-to-date insurance combined ratio is below 93%, even with all the caps incurred this year. This is on the strength of an insurance ex-CAT combined ratio below 85% and a CAT loss ratio of less than 8% in a heavy CAT year. We're confident that we're building one of the better specialty commercial insurance franchises in the industry. Our reinsurance business similarly delivered a strong year-to-date ex-CAT combined ratio of 86%. And with an all-in year-to-date combined ratio of 101.6%, Our reinsurance operations are within reach of generating and underwriting profit for this year. Within our reinsurance business, year-to-date volume has been essentially flat as our team remains focused on increasing profitability and reducing earnings volatility related to catastrophes. Stepping back, our teams remain disciplined, and we are allocating more of our capital to attractive insurance opportunities. Across this company, we have a strong team, and a consistent record of developing and recruiting great talent. And our performance over the last few years tells us that our plan is generating tangible results. And we know exactly what we need to do to sustain this momentum. We will continue to intelligently develop our portfolio while reducing our exposures to catastrophe events. We will further manage expenses, and we will continue to invest in our culture and in our people. These are the actions that have delivered consistent progress over the past three years, and we're confident that they will continue to drive improvements to our performance, our value creation, and delivering attractive returns to our shareholders. I'll now pass the floor to Pete, who will walk us through the third quarter financials. Then I'll come back and discuss market trends, and we'll have our Q&A. Pete?
spk02: Thank you, Albert, and good morning, everyone. During the quarter, we generated net income available to common shareholders of $47 million and an annualized ROE of 3.9 percent. Operating income was $1 million. Diluted book value per share decreased by 64 cents to $54.86. This was principally driven by a decrease in net unrealized gains, as reported in other comprehensive income, due to increasing interest rates. as well as common share dividends declared. This was partially offset by net income generated. As previously announced, pre-tax CAT and weather-related losses, net of reinsurance and reinstatement premiums were $250 million, or 20.7 points on the combined ratio. This was primarily attributable to Hurricane Ida, the July European floods, and other weather-related events. As Albert noted, core underwriting results continued to show improvement as the company produced a consolidated current accident year combined ratio ex-cat and weather of 87.6 percent, or almost five points better than the prior year quarter. The improvement was across both segments. This is the strongest our consolidated current accident year combined ratio ex-cat and weather has been since the fourth quarter of 2012. The consolidated current accident year loss ratio ex-cat and weather was 55.4%, a decrease of more than three points over the prior year quarter, also driven by improvements in both segments. There was no change to the net loss estimate of $360 million established for the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020. We reported net favorable prior year reserve development of $11 million, compared to under a million in the third quarter of 2020. The consolidated acquisition cost ratio was 19.1%, a decrease of two points compared to the third quarter of 2020, again attributable to both segments. The consolidated G&A expense ratio was 13.1%, slightly higher than the prior year quarter. This was mainly driven by an increase in personnel costs and technology investments, as well as lower expenses during the prior year period due to the impacts of the pandemic. Overall, operating efficiency and expense control remain important goals for us, and we expect the G&A ratio to come in below 14 for full year 2021. And lastly, on a consolidated basis, fee income from strategic capital partners was $18 million, a modest increase year over year. Now we'll discuss the segments. I'll start in insurance, where once again, we have continued solid improvement across all underwriting metrics. Gross premiums written increased by 26% to $1.2 billion, making it our highest third quarter ever. The increase came primarily from new business in professional lines, liability, and property, as well as favorable rate changes across virtually all lines of business. The current accident year loss ratio XCAT weather decreased by almost four points, resulting from not only the impact of favorable rate over trend, but also driven by improved performance due to the underwriting actions taken, most notably in property, liability, and aviation lines. The acquisition cost ratio decreased by two points in the third quarter compared to 2020. This was primarily due to changes in business mix as we wrote less high-cost property MGA business and more low-cost pro-lines and liability business, together with an increase in seating commissions. Now let's move on to the reinsurance segment. The reinsurance segment's gross premiums written of $470 million was $75 million, or 19% higher than the prior year. Approximately 15% of our reinsurance business is written during the third quarter. As such, during the third quarter, a few treaties can move growth figures dramatically either way. In this instance, the increase was driven by the timing of renewals in motor and accident and health, as well as new business production that was primarily attributable to liability and accident and health. The increases in our CAT book were driven by reinstatement premiums due to the CAT activity that occurred during the quarter. These increases were offset by a significant $20 million decrease in property lines as we continue to reshape that book. The current accident year loss ratio XCAT and weather decreased by 1.3 points due to improved loss experience in credit and surety and accident and health lines, as well as the impact of favorable pricing over loss trends. This was partially offset by an impact of changes in some retrocessional agreements and changes in business mix as we've earned less cap premium in the quarter. The acquisition cost ratio decreased by 1.9 points compared to the prior year quarter, and this was primarily due to changes in the retro programs. Net investment income was $107 million in the quarter compared to net investment income of $102 million in the third quarter of 2020. The increase in net investment income was primarily attributable to positive returns from our alternative assets, principally the private equity funds. This was partially offset by a decrease in income from fixed maturities attributable to lower yields on the portfolio. At quarter end, the fixed income portfolio had a book yield of 1.9% and a duration of 3.1 years, and our market yield was 1.4%. Lastly, I'll note that when you review our PML disclosures, you will see that the PMLs have come down significantly as compared to July 1. The decrease is driven by a CAT aggregate cover on our insurance property book, where the deductible has been nearly exhausted due to the CATs in the third quarter. With this cover in place on a go-forward basis, we feel well protected on the insurance property book from now through May 2022. excluding the impact of the CAAT aggregate cover, the PMLA levels would be generally consistent with what you saw in July 1, 2021. Overall, with continued improvement in most operating metrics and positive momentum in our core underwriting book, this was a solid quarter for Axis. And with that summary of our third quarter results, I'll turn the call back over to Albert.
spk07: Thank you, Pete. Let's do a brief overview of market conditions and outlook, and we'll then open the call for questions. Market conditions remain strong, with rates ahead of lost cost trends in practically every line across our book. This represents the 16th consecutive quarter of insurance rate increases and the sixth consecutive quarter of double-digit increases. Rate increases in insurance were almost 14 percent this quarter, which is close to flat with the 14 percent reported in the second quarter of this year. Looking at our insurance segment by region, the North American market is up 13 percent and London is up 15 percent. By class of business, professional lines once again saw the strongest pricing actions with average rate increases close to 21 percent. Rapid pricing escalation in cyber continues to be the key factor. For the quarter, cyber is up 52 percent, which follows on a 38 percent increase in the second quarter. excluding cyber, other professional lines are averaging 12%. With London and Canada in the high teens, while in the US, rates are averaging about 9%. Liability, primary casualty, and excess casualty are averaging increases of close to 10%. Property, likewise, is seeing great increases at 10%. A number of our specialty lines continue to do well in the low to mid double digits, for example, renewable energy, where we're a global leader, is up close to 15 percent. Looking broadly from an industry view, insurance rate increases are not as high as they were in the third quarter of last year. But putting things in perspective within AXIS, for the first nine months of this year, we achieved average rate increases of 13 percent that are on par with the 13 percent increase we saw in the first nine months of 2020. so we're getting solid rate on rate. It is understandable that after four years of rate increases that have now aggregated to more than 40 percent, pricing action is slowing modestly in certain lines. But overall, conditions remain very strong, and most importantly, we're staying meaningfully ahead of lost costs. During the quarter, 97 percent of our insurance portfolio renewed flat to up, and almost half the portfolio renewed at double-digit increases. We're also generating record levels of new business, and our new business pricing metrics are at least as strong as, if not stronger, the renewal pricing metrics. Let's move to reinsurance. As Pete noted, the third quarter is a relatively small renewal period for Access Re, impacting less than 15% of our reinsurance business. By comparison, just over half of our insurance business will renew at January 1. The third quarter reinsurance rate change was up 9% in the quarter. While this is below the 11% average year to date, timing and mix issues are a factor. A better comparison may be the prior year third quarter where rate change was 8%. As is typical in the reinsurance market, there was great variation by geography and line of business. The North American market was strongest with average increases of 11% while the rest of the world averaged in the low single digits. By class of business, numerous lines saw increases in the low double digits, with accident and health up 13 percent, liability at 12, and catastrophe and property averaging 11 percent. Motor and credit insurity were close to flat. Heading into the January 1 renewals, we expect to see reinsurance rate increases, but the quantum remains uncertain at the moment. In property and property CAT, we anticipate that this year's CATs will continue to drive market momentum. These most recent events, coupled with five years of poor performance within the sector and concerns about the immediate impact of climate change, have most reinsurance carriers signaling stable to reduced capacity. There's also the question of how much retro and third-party capital will be trapped or withdrawn at year-end and the amount of new capital that may be deployed. In other lines, the rationale for rate increases is also clear, as we've covered before. And the reinsurance industry has not gained relative improvements equal to what it has achieved in prior cycles. So there is a strong case for meaningful increases, at least on par with insurance pricing. However, the absolute amount of reinsurance capital that is presently available continues to be the main offsetting driver to a more meaningful correction. For Access Re, Underwriting discipline and optimizing the portfolio remain the foremost priorities, and we plan to further reduce our catastrophe exposure into the new year, and in other lines, align our appetite to attractive terms and conditions. Taking a broader view of both insurance and reinsurance markets, notwithstanding four years of price increases, not all lines offer adequate pricing. What the industry needs at this point is to get all lines to adequacy, and sustain the discipline to price at or ahead of lost cost trends. I believe that in the near term, there are sufficient drivers to maintain that discipline. This includes continuing low interest rates below book yields, which will provide a headwind to future growth of investment income, the catastrophic impacts of climate change, as well as financial and social inflation. On that last point, I believe most insurers recognize that the drivers of social inflation remain, including legislative and regulatory intervention, social inequality, and litigation funding, as well as new causes for actions, including scrutiny surrounding ESG practices. I am increasingly confident that pricing discipline will run through 2022 and likely beyond. And as long as our industry can stay ahead of lost cost trends, we should have attractive opportunities for profitable growth at Axis. As we look to the future, the primary sentiment that we're feeling at Axis is one of optimism. We've made significant progress through decisive action. We're delivering on our commitments, and we're seeing the intended results. We have a strong franchise grounded in a culture of providing superior service to our customers, a great team, and we believe that we're well on our way to building an optimized hybrid underwriter that will deliver attractive returns to our shareholders. Everything that we're seeing tells us that we're on the right path. Each quarter, we're seeing increasing evidence that our plan is working, and with our performance during the third quarter providing yet another positive data point to that trend. We believe that the future looks bright. And with that, let's please open the line for questions.
spk05: Thank you. We'll now begin the question and answer session. To ask a question, you may press star then one on your touchtone phone. If you're using a speakerphone, please pick up your handset before pressing the keys. For all your questions, please press star then two. This time we'll pause momentarily to assemble the roster. First question comes from Brian Meredith, UBS. Please go ahead.
spk06: Yeah, thank you. A couple questions here for you all. The first one, just curious, the underlying loss ratio we have in the insurance segment, is that kind of a good run rate number? Was any current year development or anything on that number?
spk02: Hey, Brian. No, there was nothing unusual. Go ahead, Peter. Go ahead, Albert. Yeah, Brian, this is Pete. There was nothing unusual in that, Brian. So I would say overall it's a good run rate number. Again, there's always a little bit of noise. Just because of where we are in quarters, I'd look at the year-to-date numbers as a really good number right now going forward.
spk06: Gotcha. And then second question, you talked about that aggregate cover and the effect on PMLs. Maybe you can describe it a little bit better for us. You know, what impact will that have on mitigating losses here for you all over the next, I guess, you know, couple quarters?
spk02: Yeah, I'll give you a little bit more color on that, Brian. We purchased a – When we read our property purchasing, first of all, our XOL cover for insurance attaches at $100 million. So, that's to be aware. And then we bought an aggregate that attaches at $100 million. That was almost exhausted with Hurricane Ida. So, we've got about $10 million left to exhaust that. It is a 150 in excess of 100 tower. It's got a $10 million event deductible. and it's about 70% placed. So you can sort of see that should give you all the details you need. What I would tell you is when you do the modeling, that cover really plays well on the lower end of the curve, which is why you sort of more of a benefit on the lower end of the curve than, say, in the 1 and 250 part of the curve.
spk06: And when does a cover expire? At your end, or when is it?
spk02: No, actually, yeah, that's a good point, too. I'm sorry. That goes to May of 2022. So that covers all the the winter and the early spring.
spk06: Great. And then my last question, just curious, your stock still trades at a pretty attractive valuation here. I know you had a, you know, we had the big cat losses in the quarter, but just looking at your capital position, looking at your leverage ratios, where are we with respect to your ability or desire, willingness to repurchase your shares?
spk02: Yes. So, I mean, I think right now, as you noted, the stock does, at definitely trade an attractive valuation. We're coming out of win period now, so we'll take a look at where the capital lands as well as what we want to do for growth next year. As Albert mentioned, still very attractive markets that we are in, especially on the insurance side. And we'll, as I said at the second quarter call, we'll vet that decision with our board in the December timeframe.
spk06: Makes sense. Thanks.
spk05: Thank you. The next question is from Derek Hahn, KBW.
spk04: Please go ahead. Good morning. Thanks for taking my question. I just had a question on the underlying margin improvement. You obviously had good underlying margin improvement in the quarter. Can you provide some color on how much is being driven by the casualty and the specialty lines, whether you've kind of lowered loss stakes in those lines of business or whether you have plans to do so?
spk07: Actually, every single one of our lines showed improvement year over year. So I think it's a combination of pricing and changes in underwriting. So really, every single line produced an improved underwriting result.
spk04: Okay, that's helpful. And then I have another numbers question. Your premium ratio was about 61%. which is quite a drop, both sequentially and year over year. Is that just being driven by a few treaties, or is low 60s or mid 60s something that's run readable, given that you're going to allocate more capital to the insurance side?
spk01: Derek, could you repeat the first part of that question? You cut out there. Thanks.
spk04: Sorry about that. Can you hear me okay?
spk02: Yeah, now you're coming in better. Yep.
spk04: So your reinsurance net gross written premium ratio is about 61%. And that's a pretty steep drop off from both sequentially and year over year. I was just wondering if that's being driven by a few treaties or if that's something that's more run rateable.
spk02: Yeah, I would say right now that is something that's more run rateable. We increased our sessions on our property CAT as we went into the second half of this year, so that showed more in the third quarter. And as Albert's noted, we are looking to reduce our net on especially the property and the property CAT, and we've done that through more third-party capital partnerships, and that's actually led to higher sessions.
spk04: Okay. Thank you for taking my questions.
spk05: Again, if you have a question, please press star then 1. Next question is from Elise Greenspan of Wells Fargo. Please go ahead.
spk00: Hi, thanks. Good morning. My first question, the G and A ratio was pretty low this quarter relative to how you 13-1, right? And I think you guys were talking about getting into the mid-13s next year. But I know that seasonally that can sometimes be lower in the back half of the year. So is there anything there, or is that 13-1 run rateable, or should we think about seasonality?
spk02: Yeah, the only thing that impacted in the quarter, Elise, was a little bit of noise. I would call it normalized G&A ratio for the quarter at 13-5. Again, I do think that means, as you know, it tends to be a little bit higher in the first half of the year. That will allow us to come in under 14 for the year. I had been indicating kind of low 14s, but we'll come in under 14s. And I believe that means we will be in the 13s for next year also.
spk00: And then what about the acquisition cost ratio? Was that impacted by mix? Like that came in at 19-1, so good level of improvement, a couple points year over year. Is there anything there, or is that just kind of run rate? No.
spk02: No, that actually is a pretty good run rate for the quarter release. If you noted, I noted it came back, especially in insurance, to around that 18 mark because it was 17 in the second quarter due to some one-time good guys. But the third quarter is a pretty good run rate right now for where our book is.
spk00: Okay. And then, Albert, in terms of your commentary on the reinsurance market, it sounds like there's some, you know, realistic – pessimism just given alternative capital and how things might shake out at January 1. So, I just want to make sure I'm understanding that correctly and your thoughts there. And then, second of all, if the market opportunity proves to be stronger at January 1, just given the losses that we've had this year, obviously, Axis has, you know, done really well in terms of taking down its cat exposure. If pricing does improve significantly, would you consider switching course and adding to your exposure, or are you guys, regardless of what happens, you're kind of set on the idea of continuing to just have lower CAT exposure?
spk07: Yes, Elise. So I wasn't trying to put pessimism. What I was trying to say is it's a wide range of possible outcomes. And, you know, certainly in talking to people in conferences and elsewhere, we've heard a number of reinsurers, retro providers, and ILS providers you know, all communicating dissatisfaction with results, kind of indicating flat to down capacity. As I mentioned, you know, if retro and ILS get trapped or capacity gets reduced, I think that could put even more pressure on pricing. So, basically what we're saying is it's something to look for. There are a lot of pressures for increased rates. There's also some capacity in the market, and that's why we're just not, you know, we're saying the quantum of the increase is one that we're not clear on right now. It's a little foggy. As we get closer to 1.1, we'll get more clarity. But I want to be very clear. Our goal is to deliver strong and steady and less volatile earnings going forward. We will not be increasing our CAT exposure, no matter what the price is. We want to bring our book down to a specialty lines book that has an appropriate amount of property and property CAT, but not too much. We've suffered from being overweight property and property cats in the last three, four years. We're working our way down. We like what it does to us. To be fair, I think if I were to tell you a year or two or three ago that access insurance would report an underwriting profit or that we would report an operating gain in a $50 billion cat quarter, you would have been surprised at that. We like the trend we're delivering, and we're going to stay on that trend.
spk00: Okay, that's helpful. Thanks for the color.
spk07: Thank you.
spk05: Thank you. Next, we have a follow-up question from Brian Meredith of UBS. Please go ahead.
spk06: Yeah, thanks. I'm just curious, the current inflationary environment we're in, you know, CPI as well as, you know, medical cost inflation and just looking for a tort inflation, how are you thinking about that and how is that factoring into how you're setting loss picks right now?
spk07: The straight line of this is that it's incorporated in our loss trends. So I think our loss trends right now are more elevated in the way we're looking to price and reserve. And I think it's something that we incorporate every year. It's also something that we spend a lot of time on when we settle individual claims. I feel really proud of the fact that when our claims professionals look at something, they take into consideration what's the current and anticipated price of services and supplies, what's happening with demand surge, and I feel really good about the fact that we do a very good job of evaluating those costs. But to your point, Brian, we are, for the moment, estimating higher loss trends in our loss ratios. But I would also say something. which is that it's really important that when we renew policies or we price policies, that we reflect recent inflation in calculating the exposures, the values of assets that are being insured and so on. You know, one of the real risks in our industry is insufficient insured value compared to actual replacement value. And so it's important that as part of the underwriting process, you get a good estimate of what your insured values are.
spk05: Makes sense. Thank you.
spk07: You're welcome.
spk05: Thank you. Next question from Michael Phillips and Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
spk03: Thanks. Good morning. Al, you talk a lot about building a better specialty insurance company and mitigating getting out of the cat risk and volatility there. And you also talked about recruiting. So I'm curious, on the specialty, that requires a lot of deep underwriting expertise at the underwriting level. Do you have the staff you need there? If not, in a recruiting effort, where are you getting them from?
spk07: So the short answer is we've got a great team. We've got a strong staff. And frankly, our strong underwriters have been an important part of who we are for a long time. And I would say that I'm very proud of the culture at Access that is a great culture at recruiting and retaining people and developing them. So we absolutely have a great team. We like to bring them in young and develop them, but when we need to bring somebody in at middle or senior levels, we also recruit outside from other providers, and we've had a very strong track record of recruiting talent. In fact, I believe you've probably seen a number of press releases throughout the year that we're adding talent to property, we're adding talent to liability, we're adding talent to cyber, we're adding talent to renewable energy. You know, if we don't have the sufficient number of people to support the great growth opportunities in front of us, we're very happy to recruit talent. And to date, our track record has been very good.
spk03: Okay, thanks for that. And then maybe one for Pete. Do you think your reserve level today, do you feel a little more comfortable in your reserve level today maybe because of what we went through with COVID? Is there more of a cushion than otherwise would have been there?
spk02: Mike, I guess what I'd say is I'm very comfortable with our reserve levels today, especially since as we've actually increased some reserves in our pro lines and liability area that's been focused on those 16 to 18 years. And so we feel that we've really, you know, gotten good balance there. And then since those years, those are the books of business that have really gotten a lot of rate, a lot of good terms and conditions. And as you can see, as we've gotten a lot of rate, you know, we've been very, I call it, I don't want to say conservative, but we're looking at social inflation and our underwriting, our current accident year loss picks have not come down near as much as you've seen, as we've said, for the rate increases. So I feel really good, especially about the 19, 20, and 21 years. And so far this year, as we've put some reserves up in those pro-lines areas, Those were really focused in the 16 to 18 years. And also what I'd say in the current accident years, some of those reserves we've put up, especially probably 50% of them this quarter, are associated with books of business that we're no longer in. So the underwriting actions we've taken where we've gotten out of some particular sub-lines of business actually make our current book much better, and therefore I think our more younger reserves much stronger than we had in 16 to 18 years.
spk03: Okay, great. Pete, thanks for the call.
spk05: Thank you. This concludes our question and answer session. I'd like to turn the conference back over to Mr. Albert Benjamal for closing remarks. Please go ahead.
spk07: Thank you, everybody, for your time this morning. Appreciate the interaction. Again, really pleased and we feel very optimistic about the future. Before I wrap up the call, I just want to thank all of my colleagues who are listening across access for the fantastic work that you're doing every day, for your deep commitment to the company and our clients and our partners in distribution. We're all working together to make this a stronger, more profitable company, and it's a great team. Thank you all. Operator, that ends our call.
spk05: The call is now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.
Disclaimer

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