Harmony Gold Mining Company Limited

Good morning, everybody, and thank you for joining us. I'm Bayer Schnell, the CEO of Harmony. Today, we are presenting our financial year 25 results that unpack not only our operational and financial performance, but it also details how we are creating value for our shareholders and all our stakeholders. You'll also hear today from our financial director, Boipelo Lekubu, who will take you through the financial detail later on in the deck. Before we begin, please take note of our safe harbour statement. We encourage you to read the cautionary language in full. And with that, let's move to the heart of the equity story. FY25 marks our 10th consecutive year of meeting production guidance. This level of consistency is rare in our sector and is underpinned by responsible stewardship, operational excellence, effective capital allocation, and cash certainty. Harmony has delivered a steady performance over the past decade, contributing to investor confidence and long-term trust. Our growth story is built on consistent delivery, higher quality ore bodies, disciplined cost management, record cash flows, and a robust balance sheet. It also sets the stage for a future powered by quality gold and meaningful copper. Our success has been built by keeping safety, sustainability, and operational excellence as non-negotiables. Copper, of course, provides a catalyst to our investment case through Mac Copper, Eva Copper, and Wafi Golpu. This will further enhance the portfolio and improve our quality across commodity cycles. Our success is built on trust and collaboration, and we remain focused on the needs and interests of all our stakeholders. This commitment positions Harmony as a partner of choice where we operate. Harmony has once again delivered a stellar operating and financial set of results. Safety is our priority, and despite the devastating losses in the second half of the financial year, our LTIFR is trending lower. In fact, we have managed to achieve the lowest ever LTIFR in our history, evidence that the strategy is correct and that our safety culture is improving. We have generated record high cash flows with adjusted free cash flow reaching just over 11 billion rand at a 16% margin. Headline earnings per share rose by 25% to 2,337 South African cents per share and we will pay a record final dividend of 2.4 billion South African rand. We hit the upper end of production guidance at 46 tons of gold, or about 1.48 million ounces, and kept all in sustaining costs in line with guidance at 1.05 million rand a kilogram, or about 1,800 US dollars per ounce. Our underground recovered grade guidance continues to increase, and at 6.27 grams per ton, we exceeded the upward revised grade guidance as well. This performance is not a once-off. It reflects, rather, the structurally improved quality of our portfolio and the consistency and resilience in our operating model. Harmony has, for the second consecutive year, delivered record-breaking cash flows. While we have certainly been assisted by a record gold price, the main driver of our performance has been a combination of adding high-grade assets and investing in life of mine extension projects. We have delivered an unmatched performance with a 54% growth in adjusted free cash flow. This alongside funding our approved major capital projects as well. Cash is certainty, but also provides us with strategic optionality. ED risks our capital program, supports a consistent dividend, and positions us to fund our various projects and value accretive acquisitions. At Harmony, everything begins with safety. We ensure that at all times, we take safety personally. While the first half of the financial year saw us deliver our best safety performance ever, the second half was simply unacceptable in the modern era of mining, and the lessons learned have been taken on board and incorporated. Encouragingly, our LTI of R is trending in the right direction, and FY25 reached a company all-time low of 5.39 per million hours worked. One of our biggest risks is fall of ground, where LTIFR has decreased by 25% over five years, even as we mine some of the world's deepest, most technically demanding ore bodies. Our journey to zero harm continues, and it continues with urgency, with unity and harmony, and with unwavering resolve. In order to ensure we achieve our goal of zero harm, we have moved from lagging to leading indicators. We are seeing faster A hazard closure times, hard evidence that our system is working. High risk work verification means that the all clear is earned, not assumed. And this is how we turn intent into outcomes and outcomes into culture. The message throughout Harmony is clear. A safe mine is a productive mine and we will never trade safety for tons. Quality mining is imperative across all our operations. I believe we are consistently getting this right, which is evident in excellent grade control and stable, predictable production. Underground recovered grades increased to 6.27 grams per tonne, driven by a phenomenal performance at Mpuneng and a solid performance at Mob Kutsong as well. Despite the impact of safety stoppages and inclement weather in the second half, we still met the upper end of our guidance. In line with plan, group production decreased by 5% to 46 tons, or 1.48 million ounces. Quality over volume is yielding results, and we mine smarter ounces and boost our resilience. All in sustaining cost increases remain controlled and in line with guidance, rising 17% to 1.05 million rand a kilogram, or about 1,800 US dollars per ounce. This reflects lower planned production, mine inflation, higher sustaining capital, and royalties on stronger revenue. Because we are a RAND cost producer, the stronger RAND resulted in higher US dollar reported cost. Even so, our investment case in quality has moved us down the global cost curve. We have expanded group-adjusted free cash flow margins eightfold over the past four years, whilst investing to sustain and grow high-quality ounces. Harmony has maintained its predictable cash operating cost base. Over 90% of our operating costs are RAND-denominated. Total labor and electricity costs make up 72% of group costs. Wage inflation is predictable under our five-year agreement, and power tariffs are regulated. Royalties contribute about 41,000 rand a kilogram to cash operating costs on the back of improved revenues and profitability. As a result, total cash operating costs increased by 9%, and that is as planned. On a per unit basis, costs rose by 15% given lower production as discussed. Our planning cycle and disciplined procurement keep cost outcomes within parameters, supporting margin resilience. This slide is very familiar, but it perfectly illustrates how we have transformed Harmony into a company with sustained higher margins. Through our various acquisitions and capital projects, the portfolio is now doing exactly what we designed it to do. High-grade SA underground and surface operations generate significant free cash, with margins of 44% and 36% respectively. Hidden Valley continues to deliver with margins at an exceptional 48%. Our optimized SA underground assets mine for cash at lower but positive margin, helping fund our growth and enabling us to extend mine lives responsibly. This portfolio balance is the engine behind record cash flow generation. Our FY25 results reflect more than just numbers. They show our purpose in action. Sustainability is not an add-on. It's embedded in our planning, how we mine, and how we grow. Independent ratings confirm this progress with our inclusion in the FTSE for Good Index for the eighth consecutive year. The MSCI upgrading us to double B, ahead of industry average. CDP scored us an A- for water stewardship, and we conform with the SBTI for our global climate goals. These achievements reinforce our commitment to responsible mining and long-term value creation. Operational excellence is how we turn plans into results. The goal remains simple, safe, profitable production. We have built a quality portfolio that is resilient by design. We have divided our operations into four distinct quadrants, each with its own plan, risk profile, and strategy. This ensures we deliver as guided and extract the absolute best from our assets. Together, these quadrants give us stability and the capacity to reinvest into even higher quality ounces. Let's look at the high-grade operations first. Penang, once again, delivered a phenomenal performance with an underground recovery grade of 11.27 grams per ton. FY25 production from our high-grade mines increased by 8% to 16.5 tons, while grade improved by 10% to 9.89 grams per ton. All in sustaining costs increased by 9% to close to 860,000 rand a kilogram. These assets generated 8.8 billion rand in adjusted free cash flow at an excellent 35% margin. We are extending the life of these mines to around 20 years each with disciplined high return projects. Once these projects are complete, Moab Kutsong and Mpuneng, both with recovered grades of around nine grams per ton, will each produce 200,000 to 250,000 ounces annually at steady state. Important to note is that we expect a dip in production at Moab Kutsong from six tons to four tons between 2027 and 2031. This gap arose largely as the Zyplast feasibility study was only completed after Harmony acquired the asset. At both Moab and Mpuneng, we experienced challenges in securing contractors to assist with our projects. At Moab, we successfully mobilized our internal teams to keep the project moving and maintain momentum. At Mpuneng, after the liquidation of the contractor, it took some time to renegotiate the commercial terms to ensure long-term value and execution certainty. We have adjusted project sequencing to maintain progress and to minimize disruption. These actions are already yielding positive momentum. Further, we are progressing the very exciting 100 megawatt renewable solar plant at Mob Kutsong, which will reduce our reliability on ESCOM and mitigate higher tariffs and energy inflation. Hidden Valley delivered another strong performance. In line with the plan, production remained steady at 5.1 tons at a recovered grade of 1.35 grams per ton. All in sustaining costs increased by 7% to R868,000 a kilogram. Free cash flow margins remained exceptional at 48%, with R3.8 billion generated in adjusted free cash flow. CAPEX remains focused on capitalized stripping, necessary fleet replacement, and tailing storage facility development to sustain production. FY26 priorities include life of mine extension studies beyond 2030 and the dewatering cyclone project to optimize TFS deposition. Our South African surface operations remain a quiet powerhouse of low risk and high margin cash. Despite the heavy rainfall, which reduced production by 13% to 7.9 tons, margins stayed solid at 36%. As a result, oil and sustaining costs increased higher than planned to 853,000 rand a kilogram. We invested 1.4 billion rand on the projects at Mineway Solutions, which include the Carrerran TSF extension and the Misbah pump station to sustain and grow output. The Mineway Solutions extension project is largely complete and is delivering 100,000 ounces annually. We are improving flexibility and the mining mix at Mineway Solutions as well. As a reminder, we have a further over 5.7 million ounces and resources in Old Tailings Dam in the Free State alone. Our optimized underground portfolio produced 16 and a half tons at 4.58 grams per ton. All in sustaining costs increased by 26% to 1.4 million rand a kilogram due to lower volumes following necessary safety stoppages, while still delivering 2.3 billion rand in adjusted free cash flow. The role of these assets is clear, mine for cash safely and predictably with improved discipline and flexibility. The priority in FY26 is the target one turnaround. which is now showing green shoots in terms of higher volumes and grades coming through. Our FY26 guidance reflects consistency and confidence in our planning. Our planning is of course aimed at ensuring that we have safe, sustainable operations, where safety and long-term viability are non-negotiable. Production guidance remains steady at 1.4 to 1.5 million ounces, a level at which we have shown that our ore bodies can deliver safely. Underground recovered grade stays strong at above 5.8 grams per tonne, and oil and sustaining costs are planned to rise to between 1.15 and 1.22 million rand per kilogram, driven mainly by mining inflation and higher sustaining capital. Total capital rises to 12.95 billion rand, driven by fleet replacement at Hidden Valley Mine, and advancing the project's mob, kutsung, umpening, and mine waste solutions, as discussed. We expect to close the MAC Copper transaction in October, pending tomorrow's MAC Copper shareholder vote. Later this calendar year, a final investment decision on EVA Copper project is expected as well. These catalysts could positively affect our outlook, and we'll share any updates with our half-year results in late February. A detailed breakdown of our capital, production, grade, and life of mine for each of our operations is included in the annexures. We have a visible sequence growth pathway to ensure a more sustainable, profitable business which delivers long-term value. While copper is a near-term catalyst and a structural hedge that enhances portfolio durability, gold remains at our core. Our growth plans remain balanced and affordable and designed not to strain the balance sheet or execution capacity. It is focused on value and transforming harmony into a higher quality global gold and copper producer. Our portfolio is changing, not just in size, but importantly in quality. We remain a gold-first company, and gold continues to anchor our strategy. As optimized ounces taper, high-grade gold and copper equivalents step in. Copper serves as a strategic lever. It's worth noting that, based on our current planning assumptions, every 100,000 tons of copper equates to around 400,000 ounces in gold equivalents. We are not aiming for a fixed copper-gold ratio in Harmony. Rather, capital goes where there is value. We base our decisions on solid fundamentals, economic value, and the strength of our reserves. As per our current plans, by FY35, we estimate that around 40% of production will be copper from EVA, MAC Copper, and Wafi Gold Pool. These are high-quality assets that complement our South African gold base. Our high-grade, high-margin assets are globally competitive. The excellent margins are as a result of higher quality ounces and lower unit costs. The SA optimized portfolio sits on the high end of the cost curve, mainly due to target one. The other three quadrants in our portfolio all operate at an all-in sustaining cost below $1,500 per ounce and generate meaningful cash flow at strong margins. As high-cost ounces are mined out and copper comes in, we naturally become more profitable. In May this year, we announced the acquisition of 100% of MAC Copper, a high-grade, long-life copper asset in Australia. We have received all the regulatory approvals and are now awaiting the MAC Copper Shell to vote, which will take place tomorrow. The court-sanctioned hearing is scheduled for the 9th of October, Provided all the support and approvals are received, we will assume operational control towards the end of October this year. This transaction will be funded with a bridge facility and supported by our strong balance sheet. The asset offers over 12 years of reserve life, with a pathway to more than 40,000 tonnes of copper per annum, with a low C1 cost after by-product credits. Importantly, it adds around 2.8 million ounces of gold equivalents in reserves and is immediately EBITDA accretive. The Eva Copper project continues to advance steadily with a feasibility update targeted for the release before the end of 2025. We continue to de-risk the project to protect value and progress execution readiness. Eva is strategically aligned with our long-term objectives and checks all the right boxes. These include, a solid production mix of 55 to 60,000 tons of copper and around 14,000 ounces of gold as a byproduct per annum, a 15-year life of mine offering sustained value, competitive cost positioning on the global copper curve, and a competitive capital intensity enhancing project attractiveness. Eva consolidates six deposits and 10 open pits into a single integrated operation, feeding an 18 million ton per annum concentrator. This is supported by a strip ratio of 1.6 times. The flow sheet is based on conventional crush, grind, and flotation, and mineral resources continue to increase as we de-resist this project further. In FY25, EVA copper resources grew by 31%, while gold resources increased by 12%. This means EVA now holds approximately 8.6 million ounces of gold and gold equivalents. Allow me now to hand over to Boipelo Lukubu, our financial director, to walk you through the numbers. Boipelo.

Thank you, Bez, and good morning to you all. Please note, all U.S. dollar figures are in their lectures. So FY25 was another standout year. Net cash on the balance sheet surged by 285% to 11.1 billion rand, a clear sign of robust cash generation and operational excellence. As a result, headline earnings per share rose by 26% to 2,337 South African cents. The main items which impacted earnings included the 3.5 billion rand increase in taxation and a swing of 500 million rand on forex and silver derivatives. Revenue grew by 20% to 74 billion rand from 61 billion rand on the back of operational consistency and the higher gold price received. Included in this figure is a 4.5 billion rand hedge loss relating to the realized effective portion of the hedge-accounted gold derivatives. We continue to hedge up to 30% of our gold production over a rolling 36 month period to protect and lock in margins. This prudent strategy provides financial stability and flexibility during a phase of elevated capital investment. Our hedging table is available in the lectures. Net profit jumped 67% to R14.6 billion from R8.7 billion, while EBITDA increased by 37% to R26 billion from R19 billion. Adjusted free cash flow increased by 54% to R11 billion from R7.3 billion in FY24. and a headroom has grown from 12.7 billion rand last year to 20.9 billion this past financial year. That is over 1.1 billion US dollars in available liquidity. This strength comes from our strong cash generation and efficient capital deployment. We are in an excellent position to fund our growth pipeline. It also positions us to act decisively on other potential strategic acquisitions while maintaining a conservative risk profile. We have the capacity, the flexibility, and the discipline to continue delivering on our strategy. Harmony is well-placed to fund the MAC Copper acquisition and EVA Copper build through a combination of existing cash and available facilities. Even after the MAC Copper acquisition, our leverage ratio peaks at just 0.4 times net debt to EBITDA, well below our one times internal threshold. At this stage, an equity raise is unlikely. Instead, we are pursuing a balanced mix of debt instruments to maintain balance sheet strength, optimize our capital structure, and further lower our costs of capital. Harmony continues to strike a balance between delivering shareholder returns while investing in disciplined growth. Our balance sheet remains strong with low gearing and ample headroom. This gives us the agility to fund our capex cycle and take advantage of any opportunities. At the same time, we are rewarding shareholders. The dividend yield of 1.6% is supported by a 50% share price increase. We now have a market cap of approximately 180 billion rand or 10 billion US dollars. This is capital discipline in action, funding growth, maintaining flexibility and delivering returns. Our record total dividend payout of 2.4 billion rand demonstrates confidence in our cash generation and our balance sheet. We have declared a final dividend of 155 South African cents per share or nine US cents per share. This takes the total dividend per share in FY25 to 382 South African cents or 21 US cents per share. Returning cash today while building tomorrow is at the heart of our capital allocation strategy. Thank you. Over to you, Bez.

Thank you, Boepelo. In conclusion, as we mark 75 years of harmony, we do so with pride and our legacy and confidence in our future. We have a globally significant resource base of 136 million ounces in resources and 37 million ounces in reserves in gold and gold equivalents. Our strategy of producing safe, profitable ounces is clear. We prioritize value over volume and invest in high-grade gold and copper and diversify geographically. This is aimed at protecting and growing shareholder value through responsible growth to the benefit of all our stakeholders. This is Harmony today, a gold mining specialist with a growing copper footprint, a company built on purpose and positioned for the future. We are not just mining ounces. We are discovering, developing, and delivering metals that sustain the world and secure the next 75 years of success. Thank you for your trust and support as we continue to mine with purpose. Jarrett, over to you for any questions.

Now it's on. Well, thanks, everyone. Good to see so many familiar faces. Welcome. Do you have any questions?

Hi. Morning, Bayers and team. Bruce Williamson, Integral Asset Management. Bayers, after your press release on Monday, I was listening to one of the fund managers on Channel 412 and being a bit critical, saying that he doesn't like to see companies high grading when the gold price is high. And in particular, can you just look at in Penang where you're going through the east and west blocks that are high grade? And I mean, you can, stoping crews can only mine what's in front of them. You can't mine resources. Can you just take us through, I mean, how much longer will that grade stay above 11? And you alluded to coming down to nine on average between the two mines, the big ones. Wow. Will it be a sudden fall, or will you gradually bring that grade down?

Thank you for the question, Bruce. Just harmony is not high grading. Harmony is mining, particularly at Mpuneng, in a mining method which we call the sequential grid mining method. It is actually a very rigid mining front, and it's designed to ensure that mining is done safe and that you don't trigger unnecessary geotechnical events or seismicity. So you're in the V formation. So, you know, mining out a sequence or trying to chase high grades, you know, would be unsafe to do and also irresponsible to do. So what we have at Mpening is we see overperformance on the planned reserve grade. Now, how we need to think about Mpening going forward is that we need to think about Mpening as at the reserve grade. I mean, that is the stated grade. Yes, we've seen positive performance delta or positive outperformance on the reserve grade. But I mean, I can't go and adjust the reserve grade based on proven techniques that we've always used to evaluate these ore bodies just because I'm, for a period, having higher grades. Where we're mining today, we still have good grade, and we'll continue to have good grades, but we need to think about it in line with the reserve grade. That's the important thing at those two assets. What we do do, however, from a grade management point of view, Bruce, is we see grade as a, grade improvement rather, as a little bit of a hedge against cost inflation. So what we don't do is the inverse. We also don't drop our cutoff grades when gold prices are high. Because for those of you that understand the technical aspects, an ounce that you develop today, you only mine in two years from today. So if you have these good gold prices and you drop your cut of grades, you develop into areas that are lower grades. By the time you get there and you have to mine those lower grades, the gold price is maybe different than it is today. So we're trying to keep cut-off grades constant, you know, and trying to maintain our grade. And if we then see these areas of overperformance, like in the case of impending, it just gives us that extra little bit of lift against the pressures of cost inflation. Of course, with, you know, good cost management and cost discipline and cost control.

Good morning, . Just one quick question for me. Has the opportunity cost with regards to , has the opportunity cost been analyzed with regards to the delay that's there? Has it been taken into account over the years? I presume that there were other opportunities available in the interim over the years. Has that been analyzed, the opportunity cost of the delay? Thanks.

Yeah, thanks for the question. Great question. I think the opportunity cost on that asset, not only for shareholders and harmony and managers and stakeholders, but also the Papua New Guinean people has been enormous. you know, the delay in getting that project over the line. But, you know, if you look at the macroeconomic environment or the macro context and you look at a scramble for large-scale bulk copper mines at the top end of, you know, the all bodies in the world, there's an absolute scramble and people are paying top dollar for big copper mines going forward. And Wafi Goldpoo is one of those. It's a tier one copper gold bulk block cave mine. That is an exceptionally valuable thing. And the way we think about it, albeit frustrating, getting through the mine development contract and the SML with the Papua New Guinean state negotiating team and the government with our JV partners, Newmont, we believe it is worth the wait. I mean, that is a phenomenal ore body. Yes, our management team is working very hard. Great alignment between ourselves and Newmont in terms of trying to get that mine development contract and special mining lease over the line. But we are still not there yet, unfortunately.

Two questions from my side, if I may. So the first one is on Mac Copper. How does that look under Harmony? And what I mean with that is, are there a lot of operational changes and cap exchanges that you see to get this on spec with the rest of your operations? And then the second question, I mean, you've showed us you still get a meaningful contribution from your optimized assets. But the margins remain fairly low. I think year on year it's down, in fact, despite the changes in the gold price. So my question is, how much flexibility do you have there to maintain that margin and keep that positive, should either the operating environment change or the pricing environment? Thanks.

Thanks, Arnold. I'll start with Mac. So we haven't got the keys yet. You know, the vote is tomorrow. You know, the way we think about MAC is, you know, we will, once we, you know, close the transaction or we're optimistic that we will do, that'll be in October. We will spend November and December putting MAC through the detailed technical analysis planning process that, you know, we've been accustomed to at Harmony. We believe... A lot of our operational consistency is as a result of the way we look at the technical aspects at the onset and the planning. So we'll do exactly that if we close in October. And we said that we will, in February, when we do our first half year results, we will update the market on the outlook for MAC Copper for the second half. So at the moment, there's nothing in the guidance for MAC. We'll spend the latter part of the year you know, going through the planning process and guide in February what we think production would look like. As to some of the technical challenges at the mine, Yes, it's right up our alley. The mine is ventilation constrained, and there is some flexibility challenges. There are, from what I've seen, excellent plans in terms of mitigating those challenges that Mac Copper is working on. Those plans would actually have to be seen through, but Harmony would take our own view once we've gotten the keys. When you look at an old mine, you would think that it's a dilapidated mine, it's tired. I've been out to the mine three times already. It's actually quite the contrary. The mine is in good nick. I mean, credit to the current owners. They've spent significant amount of capital on, they did a mill replacement there, ventilation infrastructure, refrigeration plants, winder upgrades and things. The mine is, from a housekeeping point of view and quality infrastructure point of view, in very good nick. So pretty much in Harmony, we always say that old doesn't necessarily have to be dilapidated and tired. So we're excited to close the transaction and to get stuck in and to bring the Harmony philosophy and the Harmony operating model to Mac. On the optimized assets, our optimized assets, albeit they are in the optimized assets quadrant, they are subject to the same flexibility planning tools we use, the iceberg philosophy we've spoken about on many occasions. We manage the flexibility per mine, whether you're an optimized mine or a surface mine, the necessary flexibility is non-negotiable for us. Hence, if you look at our sustaining capex we're spending, there's quite a lot of sustaining capex going into the oil reserve development at these mines. Again, you know, what we don't do is we don't want to go and target areas that were previously closed off that could be unsafe or areas that are lower grade, you know, because of these good gold prices. But, you know, we keep on rolling these mines over. As long as we can find acceptable grade and safe areas to mine, we will continue to do that. I mean, Masimung Mine is the one mine that's had a two-year life of mine for the last 10 years. And that is how we roll these assets over. They do not, at the moment... attract significant amounts of major capital investment, you know, because of the lower margins and the lower grade, but sustaining capex definitely to roll them over. It's still a significant part of our production mix. I mean, it's still big in our life, and like any other mine in the Harmony stable, I mean, important to us.

Any other questions? Do we have any questions on the chorus call?

Yes, sir. The question comes from Rene Hofreiter of NOAA Capital. Please go ahead.

Good morning, Bayers and the team. Thanks very much for taking my question. I see on your production profile that you've got on slide number 22, there's a bit of a gap between 2030 and 2035, a production gap to keep it at 1.5 million ounces. Is that where you're planning to put MAC copper to fill that gap? My second question is, could you give us a quick update on target? I see your guidance for target is nicely up compared to last year. And then thirdly, the sustainable grade that Bruce asked about, 6.27 grams a ton that you're managing underground. It comes from Umpeneng. Umpeneng, I assume you're mining the VCR. The VCR is very channelized. And how long will it take before that 11.72 grams a ton will come down again to sort of the average of the ore body? Is it going to be like a year or two or shorter than that? That's all, thanks.

Thanks, Rene, for those questions. So I'll address the gap first. No, I mean, the gap is not where MAC will come in. MAC's already in the graph, you know, on that slide. CSA copper, the dark gray in the middle there. But what is important to notice when you look at this grade is that's a production profile. It's not necessarily a value, profit, or EBITDA profile. I mean, the quality of the ounces we'll be mining despite lower production in that period is vastly better because you see how the optimized assets basically taper down, and that is what results in that gap there. Of course, implied in that gap area there is this six tons to four tons on Moab Kutsong, with the Zyplus project being a little bit later. But on the slide now, you can see how the red, which is high-cost production, is actually tapering down. So it's production profile, and production is important, but certainly value is more important for us. The target update, yes, the recapitalization is complete. The time for delivery is now. You know, we're starting to see some green shoots there, you know, on the infrastructure starting to work. We did suffer a few delays in the second half of the year, which we reported on in this deck. And it seems like we're over most of those now. But, yes, so target, you know, we look forward to target being better. I mean, that was the standout mine on the negative. You know, because it went through the recapitalization, that mine was not positively contributing. And, you know, we certainly do look forward to get Target to contribute this year. As to the grade, that's a very difficult question. You know, I try to answer, you know, I can't predict for how long Penang will be at 11 grams per ton, unfortunately, Rene. You know, long made last is obviously good, but we need to think about, you know, opening in line with a stated reserve grade. I mean, that is, you know, what our geostatistical models deliver, and that is what we need to think about. Yes, we're mining the VCR, and why the grades are so good is we're mining... two half levels on 123 and 126 in the high-grade pay chutes on the east and the west of the mine. So it was always known that we would be in these high-grade areas, and mining would eventually mine out of the pay chute, and that's when grades would be a little bit lower. But again, the grades are being broken and blasted there today are still very strong and still very, very, very good.

So if I put into my model about nine grams a tonne in two years' time, would that be fair?

The reserve grade, Rene, is how we should think about the grade at Timpani.

Okay. All right, fine. Thanks very much. Thank you. Thanks, Rene.

We have no further questions on the lines. Thank you.

I suppose I think we're done.

Thank you, everyone.