This conference call transcript was computer generated and almost certianly contains errors. This transcript is provided for information purposes only.EarningsCall, LLC makes no representation about the accuracy of the aforementioned transcript, and you are cautioned not to place undue reliance on the information provided by the transcript.
spk01: Hello, everyone. Thank you for attending today's Lending Club Third Quarter 2023 Earnings Conference Call. My name is Sierra, and I will be your moderator today. All lines will be muted during the presentation portion of the call, with an opportunity for questions and answers at the end. If you would like to ask a question, press star 1 on your telephone keypad. I would now like to pass the conference over to our host, Autumn Neloveco, Vice President of Finance.
spk07: Thank you and good afternoon. Welcome to LendingClub's third quarter earnings conference call. Joining me today to talk about our results are Scott Sanborn, CEO, and Drew Levin, CFO. You can find the presentation accompanying our earnings release on the investor relations section of our website. On the call, in addition to questions from analysts, we will also be answering some of the questions that were submitted for consideration via email. Our remarks today will include forward-looking statements, including with respect to our competitive advantages and strategy, macroeconomic conditions and outlook, platform volume, future products and services, and future business and financial performance. Our actual results may differ materially from those contemplated by these forward-looking statements. Factors that could cause these results to differ materially are described in today's press release and presentation. Any forward-looking statements that we make on this call are based on current expectations and assumptions and we undertake no obligation to update these statements as a result of new information or future events. Our remarks also include non-GAAP measures relating to our performance, including tangible book value for common share and pre-provisioned net revenue. You can find more information on our use of non-GAAP measures and a reconciliation to the most directly comparable GAAP measures in today's earnings release and presentation. And now, I'd like to turn the call over to Scott.
spk04: All right. Thanks, Artem. Welcome, everyone. We delivered another profitable quarter thanks to disciplined execution and proactive efforts to appropriately position the company in what remains a dynamic environment. Our $1.5 billion in originations was in line with our expectations. Total revenue for the quarter was $201 million, and pre-provision net revenue, which is revenue less non-provision expenses, was $73 million. which was well above the high end of our guidance and aided by a couple of non-recurring items, which Drew will explain. The quarter's results were further supported by our ongoing expense management efforts and our difficult recent decision to align staffing to current market conditions should position us to stay resilient going forward. I want to begin by providing context on the current operating environment, which remains challenging, particularly on the investor side of our marketplace. Following the banking turmoil that emerged earlier this year, bank investors, which historically comprised 50% of our marketplace, have temporarily moved to the sidelines as they focus on fortifying capital and liquidity levels. While we continue to have productive discussions and the appeal of our high-yield, short-duration assets is clearer now more than ever, banks are currently focused on right-sizing their balance sheets, and their capacity to invest is likely to remain restricted in the near term. In anticipation of this shift in marketplace dynamics, we have been leaning into our bank capability to build unique new structures to better serve asset managers and Lending Club in today's environment. In Q2, we launched our structured certificates program, which is essentially a two-tier private securitization in which Lending Club retains the senior note and sells the residual certificate on a pool of loans to a marketplace buyer at a predetermined price. This effectively provides low-friction, low-cost financing for the buyer. And in exchange, Lending Club earns an attractive yield with remote credit risk and without upfront CECL provisioning. As a bank, this is something we are uniquely positioned to deliver for marketplace investors. Interest in the program is strong and growing, which is a testament to the strength of our credit, given we're selling residuals in a market where residual sales are few and far between. We more than doubled the program in Q3 from Q2 and expect to roughly double it again to as much as a billion dollars in Q4. In total, we now have close to $2 billion of signed orders for over the next six months. Not only are structured certificates helping us to attract new investors, they're also helping us make efficient use of capital and reposition the balance sheet to capture low-risk interest income off of the senior note. Another advantage of our bank, is our ability to hold in-season loans for investors, earning interest income for Lending Club while increasing the certainty around future credit performance for the buyer, which is especially important in this environment. We're receiving interest from investors in the program and originated $250 million in Q3 to replenish the $200 million in loans sold earlier in the quarter. Now let's turn to credit. We remain focused on prime originations with near prime representing an immaterial portion of our total Q3 issuance and of our retained portfolio. We've adapted our underwriting standards to the inflationary environment, which has resulted in consistent credit performance on newer vintages. Inflationary pressures are visible in vintages originated before we began tightening, and we therefore increased our provision based on observed trends and our outlook. I note that return on equity on all vintages remains north of 20%. Our expected lifetime losses remain within the range we previously communicated, and better than our competitive set based on available industry data. Looking forward, a historic refinance opportunity awaits us. Credit card balances have grown to 1.3 trillion, and average credit card interest rates are now above 21%. Thanks to foundational investments we've made over the past several years, along with our proven ability to scale quickly, we are well positioned to meet massive consumer demand as conditions normalize. We've been making steady progress on key initiatives that will provide powerful, differentiated solutions and enhance our value proposition to both new and existing members. Before the end of this year, we will have accomplished the following, included loan servicing into our banking mobile app, to provide a seamless member experience across lending, spending, and savings. That's harder than it sounds. In fact, many banks have instead opted to create multiple apps serving specific product verticals. With our mobile-first multi-product platform in place, we will have a single powerful engagement vehicle for offering new solutions to our members. We'll also be testing the first generation of a line of credit products that allows approved members to easily sweep accumulated credit card balances into fully amortizing payment plans. This paves the way for a revolving line of credit product in future years and builds on the proven performance we've seen from repeat members. And we will launch the first phase of a comprehensive debt monitoring and management experience. While in early development, this will ultimately give members a way to track, prioritize, and optimize debt payments, especially credit card payments, which will be of significant value to Lending Club members. Taken together, these innovations will further drive member engagement and satisfaction, which in turn should translate to better credit outcomes and a higher lifetime value. Our business is evolving and we're changing our focus from building a strong mobile banking foundation to focusing on multi-product member engagement. To lead that effort, I'm happy to announce that we've hired Mark Elliott as Chief Customer Officer with experience at JPMorgan Chase and CapOne, where he led digital banking efforts Mark brings a unique background in strategy, marketing, and customer focus, especially in retail banking, as well as a proven ability to coordinate these areas to fuel growth. I'm looking forward to his leadership as we march forward. I want to close by thanking Lending Club's employees for their continued dedication through what has been a trying few quarters. Lending Clubbers are demonstrating their resilience, And I have no doubt they'll be ready, willing, and able to accelerate when the opportunity presents itself. With that, I'll turn it over to Drew.
spk03: Thanks, Scott. And hello, everyone. Let me walk you through the details of our results in the third quarter, starting with originations. Originations were $1.5 billion compared to $2 billion in the prior quarter, and $3.5 billion in the third quarter of 2022. Of the $1.5 billion in originations, approximately $500 million were whole loans for the marketplace, which were primarily sold to asset managers. $450 million were originated for the structured certificates program, which is showing strong demand, as Scott mentioned. We also accumulated approximately $250 million in the help for sale for our extended season program to meet future investor demand for season loans. and we retained over $300 million in our held for investment portfolio. Now let's move on to pre-provision net revenue or PPNR. PPNR was $73 million for the quarter compared to $81 million in the prior quarter and $119 million in the third quarter of 2022. PPNR in the third quarter included severance charges and the benefit of two non-recurring items. First, a $10 million revenue benefit related to customer forfeitures of purchase incentives from the bank investor channel. Importantly, this was a one-time benefit, which will not recur in the fourth quarter. And second, approximately $9 million from lower accrued variable compensation. This was also a one-time expense benefit, which is not expected to repeat in the fourth quarter. PPNR also included severance charges of $5.4 million partially offset by a $4 million reversal of previously accrued compensation for those individuals. Now let's turn to the first component of PPNR, which is revenue. You can find revenue detail on page 9 of our earnings presentation. Total revenue for the quarter was $201 million compared to $232 million in the prior quarter and $305 million in the same quarter of the prior year. Let's dig into the two components of our revenue. First, non-interest income was $64 million in the quarter compared to $86 million in the prior quarter and $181 million in the same quarter of the prior year. As we indicated last quarter, the sequential change in non-interest income was primarily due to two items. First, lower fee and gain on sale revenue driven by the change in marketplace volume. And second, lower price on loan sales due to a lower percentage of purchases coming from banks. You can see this impact in the fair value adjustments line. These items were partially offset by a non-recurring $10 million revenue benefit from the forfeiture of purchase incentives that I mentioned earlier. On to net interest income, which was $137 million in the quarter compared to $147 million in the prior quarter and $124 million in the same quarter of the prior year. The change in net interest income was primarily driven by lower average loans held for investment. This was partially offset by an increase in loans held for sale and securities from the structured certificates. These securities generate a high risk adjusted return, and we expect the balances to further increase in the fourth quarter. Net interest income also benefited from $1.3 million in revenue as a result of a hedging program implemented early in the third quarter help partially mitigate the impact of further fed rate increases on the next page you can see that our net interest margin was 6.9 compared to 7.1 in the prior quarter and 8.3 in the prior year this change reflects the combination of our growth in high yielding risk remote securities from the structured certificates program as well as higher funding costs in the period Now please turn to page 11 of our earnings presentation where I'll talk about the second component of PPNR, non-interest expense. Non-interest expense of $128 million in the quarter compared favorably to $151 million in the prior quarter and $186 million in the same quarter last year. The sequential reduction was primarily due to three items. First, lower accrued variable compensation that I mentioned earlier. Second, lower variable marketing expense compared to the prior quarter due to fewer originations. And third, continued cost discipline across the company on non-compensation expenses. As Scott mentioned, we made the difficult decision to reduce headcount to reflect the continued macroeconomic challenges. This was a necessary step to align our expense base to the current market conditions as we head into 2024. will result in approximately 6.7 million dollars of severance related charges 5.4 million of which were incurred in the third quarter with the remainder coming in the fourth quarter we expect to realize an annualized compensation benefit of 30 to 35 million dollars when compared to the second quarter of 2023 given all the moves and expenses we are providing a range for non-interest expense excluding marketing expense in the fourth quarter of $115 to $120 million. Next, let's turn to provision. Provision for credit losses was $64 million for the quarter compared to $67 million in the prior quarter and $83 million in the third quarter of 2022. The sequential decrease was primarily the result of lower day one CECL due to fewer loans retained and to help for investment in the quarter, partially offset by an increase in loss reserves primarily for the 2021 and 2022 vintages. As you will see on page 13 of our earnings presentation, we have incorporated this increase in reserves and updated our estimates for the expected net lifetime loss rate on the 2021 and 2022 vintages. The estimates of 8.1 and 8.8% respectively are within the ranges we provided last quarter and include both quantitative and qualitative reserves. While it's still early to judge the ultimate performance of the 2023 vintage, our initial observations are that it is showing stable performance, benefiting from the tightened underwriting we've implemented over the last several quarters, and we continue to expect ROEs in the 25% to 30% range. As Scott mentioned, our current ROE projections for all annual held for investment vintages are north of 20%. Now let's move to taxes. Taxes in the third quarter were $3.3 million, or 40% of free tax income. As I've mentioned before, we will have some variability in the effective rate from quarter to quarter, primarily due to variation in the stock price between the vesting date and the grant date of restricted stock units. Year-to-date, our effective tax rate is 29%, roughly in line with our long-term expectation of 27%. Now let me touch on the balance sheet. Total assets were up modestly to $8.5 billion compared to $8.3 billion at the end of the previous quarter. This is the first quarter where we've had a meaningful shift to more securities from our structured certificates and a modest decrease in our held for investment loan portfolio, which ultimately should lead to strong risk adjusted returns given the efficient use of capital. More specifically, structured certificates increased by approximately $300 million, reflecting the growth in the program. you'll see on page 15 of our earnings presentation over a third of consumer volume production held on balance sheet in the quarter was via the structured certificate program we expect that to increase to 60 to 70 percent in the fourth quarter loans held for sale at fair value were 363 million dollars at the end of the quarter as we sold approximately 200 million season loans during the quarter and held an additional 250 million of originations as we begin growing a seasoned portfolio for future sales. Our consolidated capital levels remain strong with 13.2% Tier 1 leverage and 16.9% CET1 capital ratios. Our available liquidity remains healthy with $1.3 billion of cash on hand and 86% of our deposits are insured. Additionally, we continue to maintain substantial amounts of unused borrowing capacity at both the Federal Home Loan Bank and the Federal Reserve Bank with a total of approximately $3.8 billion of available capacity at September 30th. Now let's move on to guidance for the fourth quarter. Given the interest in the certificate program, we're anticipating a modest increase in originations with a range of $1.5 to $1.7 billion. This volume increase will largely offset incremental pressure on pricing as Q4 will represent the first full quarter without meaningful bank investor participation. The marginal economics of marketplace loan sales are nearing break even, and therefore our go forward earnings should be less sensitive to changes in marketplace volume. We expect PP&R to range from $35 to $45 million. We plan to have positive net income for the quarter. While we are not providing 2024 guidance at this time, we do expect current conditions to persist into the first half of 2024 with volume and pricing at similar levels to our Q4 outlook. So as we are exiting the year, we have taken steps to position the company to operate in a difficult environment, including leveraging our bank capabilities by growing and remixing the balance sheet to more structured certificate securities, improving resiliency, including the cost actions we have taken throughout the year. As a result, we plan to remain profitable and preserve shareholder capital while investing in new capabilities to maintain our readiness for growth and conditions permit. With that, we'll open it up for Q&A.
spk01: If you would like to ask a question, please press star followed by one on your telephone keypad. To remove your question, press star followed by two. And if you are using a speakerphone today, please pick up your handset before asking your question. Our first question today comes from Bill Ryan with CPART Research Partners. Please proceed.
spk06: Good afternoon. Thanks for taking my questions. First one is sort of credit related in the provision. And I was wondering if you could, you know, maybe quantify what the dollar amount of the additional true up was for the health or investment portfolio. And what gives you confidence that you've, you know, based on your analysis that you've got it covered, at least based on what you know now about the macro environment.
spk03: Yeah, hey, Bill, it's Drew. Thanks for the question. Yeah, of the additional provision that we took on the back book, that was about $20 million between the two vintages that we put on. And, you know, obviously under CECL, when we're redoing our provision estimates, we're taking the new expected discounted lifetime losses into the provision all at once. so you know the estimate that we're putting forth here at q3 is our best estimate at this time and you know we'll continue to watch it um but i'd say just in the grand scheme of kind of how the provision is moved on that back book i think we're up seven percent at this point so while taking it all up front creates a little bit of a larger provision this isn't a you know i would call it a massive move in the expected performance of the portfolio yeah and bill hey one other thing to add and just kind of understanding the dynamics is
spk04: when at least when you kind of look at the 21 book, it's really been, you know, the initial outperformance was really strong, right? That post COVID outperformance. So if you look at kind of lifetime losses within that, we kind of, there was a period of outperformance where actually released a provision. And, you know, I know you've probably heard others in the industry talking about, you know, those charge offs didn't go away. They just got deferred. And, you know, that's kind of what you're seeing. So like, basically released it and are now taking it back. It's not actually a meaningful move off of what we thought day one, it was just, we thought it got better. And then it came back to what we had initially thought.
spk06: Okay, and one just follow up on the volume side of the equation. So questions then kind of coming up, I mean, obviously, you dial back in your volume, you talked about the bank investors, which are historically been 50%, buying 50% of the originations, that's kind of gone. But there's also a question about, you know, competition. I mean, is irrational pricing by some competitors, maybe, you know, different channels of marketing. Is there anything else going on in the volume or is it mostly just related or pretty much just mostly related to the bank buyer's withdrawing from the market?
spk04: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, the dominant piece is really, it's not on the borrower side of the house. The dominant piece is really investor supply of capital. You look at the competitive space, a couple nuances maybe worth talking about is competition in the lower FICO bands has definitely lessened, right? There's just not a lot of investor appetite for TAB, Mark McIntyre:" profile at the moment, and so a lot of people have pulled back but competition in the higher fico you know that pretty much most people have shifted there. TAB, Mark McIntyre:" You know, we have always been a very effective competitor with you know the highly optimized processes, we have in the data advantages, we have you can see our marketing remains. TAB, Mark McIntyre:" amongst the most efficient in the space so it's really competition isn't driving it in terms of who were competing with you know. I guess if you looked at three categories, those with bank charters that are either direct banks or new bank charters, they're obviously still competing. I'd say fintechs that raised significant capital within the last two years are still competing. And then fintechs that haven't raised capital in the last two years, I'd say, are less visible in this environment.
spk06: OK, thanks for taking my questions.
spk01: Our next question comes from David Chiaverini with Wedbush Securities. Please proceed.
spk08: Hi, thanks. I wanted to ask about the volume of loans sold through the marketplace, the net fair value adjustments, that negative $41 million in the quarter. I was curious, you know, at what percent of par are loans or were loans sold at in the third quarter?
spk03: So our average sales price was low 96s in terms of where we sold. So just about a four point discount, a little less.
spk08: And I think if I heard you right during the prepared comments, looking out to the fourth quarter, did you allude to that being closer to par? Or how should we think about the fair value adjustments looking forward?
spk03: No, I think it's going to remain pretty consistent, probably. There should be a little bit of a drop as we go into Q4. But, you know, 96 is about where, you know, we view near breakeven on the sales. So going any lower than that, much lower, any going lower than that would not really make sense to us from an issuance standpoint.
spk08: Yep. Got it. Got it. Okay. follow up on the on the credit quality side so the the net charge off rate uh 5.1 percent in in the quarter with the portfolio uh kind of stable here over the past four quarters around you know five billion call it um should we think of this as being kind of around the stable stable kind of going forward in this five percent range on on net charge offs
spk03: No, we'll continue to move upward if we don't grow the HFI portfolio. So the charge-off rate you're looking at is just the health for investment portfolio, which as we're doing more extended seasoning and more sales through the SLIC program, we'll also have less HFI coming on, which means the average age of that book is going to increase. So we'll see a slowdown effect and charge-offs should continue to still move upward. half at 24, I would say. Now, keep in mind, again, this is under CECL. We've taken the reserves on a discounted basis for all these estimated charge-offs that are coming through.
spk08: And if we assume a kind of lifetime loss assumption in the high eights, let's use the 2022 as an example, 8.8%. and we assume a one and a half year average life, that would equate to 5.9% net charge off rate. Is that the way to kind of think about roughly the upper end of where this could trend over the next several quarters?
spk03: Yeah, I mean, the math isn't quite as simple as that. If you took the, because it depends on the speed of payoff of the balances and the weighted average life isn't exactly 1.5. but for example if you look at the 23 vintage and what we're putting on there we're at four to five percent anc lsr estimate right now in terms of where that's coming on the ancl on the 2022 vintage is lower we haven't given the range but it's lower than than what you're citing there and the main difference in the calc um is at the very beginning of the loan you have a six month period so we're taking very few charge offs at high balances So it pulls down the overall ANC, how low is the life?
spk04: Yeah, just a thing to think about is the prepayment speeds over the last couple of years have changed pretty dramatically. So the duration on the 21 vintage is actually fairly short because consumers had enough excess liquidity that they were paying down faster. And that's really normalized up to through till today.
spk08: Got it. Thanks for that. And then last one for me. appreciate the that the guide on expenses x marketing the 115 to 120. um kind of zooming in on the marketing expense most recent quarter you know 20 million is it fair to assume the new origination guidance if we're at the top end of that guidance range then we could be north of um 20 million and then if we're at the low end of that guidance range it could be you know roughly the same of 20 million any any commentary on the marketing expense uh going forward
spk03: Yeah, I think you're thinking about it right. You know, assuming the same marketing efficiency, which is a good assumption, that that math should hold.
spk04: Yeah, that'll hold until, you know, once we really get back in growth mode. We've obviously optimized right now for the lowest cost channels. And, you know, yet we are also maintaining our historical balance of new customers versus repeat members, right? So we're still investing in building the membership base today. So when we get back into growth mode and we go into higher cost channels, there'll be some upward movement on that. But we won't do that. I just want to come back to your question on pricing. I think there's a little maybe tick down in pricing in Q4, but as Drew said in his prepared remarks, we're really pleased with the amount of demand we're seeing for the programs we're offering. Our goal right now from here is to optimize price. We don't see a lot of pressure on price because we're not really going to sell below what we're selling at today. So, you know, where that would show up is, you know, volume or not. And for us to be doing more volume, we're going to, you know, meaningfully more volume, we're going to look for better pricing.
spk08: Great. Thanks very much.
spk01: Our next question comes from John Hecht with Jefferies. Please proceed.
spk02: Hey, guys, thanks very much. Just a couple questions on the structured certificate program. I mean, I think you've given us sort of the mix into the near term. I mean, how do we think about the use of that relative to other, call it liquidating outlets over the course of 24 if rates are where they are versus with rates drop? And then what does kind of the NIM trajectory look like thinking about those different scenarios?
spk03: Yeah, so so I think for 24, it's a little early, I think, to call the ball on how much we're going to allocate to this program. You know, our initial goal when we set it up was to get multiple buyers in, get demand up for the program, which I think we have now accomplished, and then start to work on price. As we go into 24 and we think about how we're going to allocate capital and how we're going to allocate balance sheet, it will be a function of obviously demand, but also price that we're getting through the various structures. And we'll seek to optimize based on price and return on capital as we go through there. So it's, I think we need, we need more visibility into 24 before we're making that final allocation, but look to come back on the next call with more details. As far as NIM, I mean, obviously the structured certificates given that they're pretty risk remote in terms of taking a loss they come with a um with a spinner coupon which is going to bring nim down but from a you know they also come with no provision so we're making a trade here where we're going to have a little bit we're going to have some pressure on them but we should have lower provision over time as well okay and just as a reminder i think it's I would say just as a reminder, you know, I think it's probably clear from the presentation, but we have a 20% risk weighting on those securities right now. So as we're going into next year and we're thinking about our capital levels, you know, that potentially gives us some more latitude to think about where our targets should be from a leverage and a risk-based capital ratio.
spk02: Yep. And then on that topic, you guys mentioned 20%. whatever risk-adjusted weighting for the structured certificate program. Is that what we should think about what it would be in terms of the regulatory capital ratios, or is that something that can change over time?
spk03: That is, as we are booking these A notes, these securities, they are coming with the 20% risk weighting as far as, for example, our CET1 capital. You know, there are certainly situations where credit significantly deteriorated. That could go to a 50% risk weighting, or I guess 100% risk weighting. But assuming our credit outlook is, you know, holds, then they're very efficient from that perspective.
spk02: Okay. And then last question, just kind of on the front end of the funnel. I mean, you guys cite, you know, a big kind of pool of unsecured debt at fairly high rates of interest. You know, so a growing TAM for you. I'm just wondering kind of in the application side, in terms of like the characteristics of applications for loans and kind of the funnel approval rates and this and that, is there anything you can point to in terms of trend changes or characteristics that are developing?
spk04: Yeah, I mean, I'd say mostly coming from us, consumer demand remains intact, right? They're continuing to see their credit card balances move up. and they're seeing the size of their bill move up in proportion to that plus their rate. So on the demand side, it remains strong. We are, you know, we have moved even more of our origination to that use case and away from, you know, other alternative use cases that would just result in providing people more cash given that we, you know, we're anticipating the potential for continued strain and or stress due to the inflationary environment we are overall you know we are tighter overall on the front end in terms of who we're allowing in that said you know some of the things i touched on is the experience we're working on and plan to have ready for when we resume growth will be the ability to get approved for a personal loan at the same time as you're approved for uh you know a bank account have the ability to service your loan in a mobile app And within that mobile app, also be able to manage your credit card debt. One of the things that's really different about credit card debt is unlike most of your car, your mortgage, all the rest, those are fixed payments. Your credit card debt varies in amount every month, both based on the balance and the rate, but also based on whether you pay the minimum payment or you pay it off or something in between. So consumers really don't have a very good way to see all of that data. and manage it holistically. So we are working on an experience that will help them do that, as well as a line of credit products that as we're seeing those balances build, we'll be able to allow them to kind of sweep that automatically into an installment payoff plan. So, you know, we're those will all be kind of in the background in development and optimization right now until the time is right. But we we plan to be in a position to leverage all of that to, you know, with a competitive mode when the time is right.
spk02: Great. I appreciate the color, guys. Thanks.
spk01: Our next question comes from Reggie Smith with JPMorgan. Please proceed.
spk09: Hey, good evening. Thanks for taking the question. I guess I wanted to clarify a comment that you just made. Did you suggest that you had kind of pivoted your
spk04: underwriting towards people that were refinancing credit card debt as opposed to using the proceeds or something else well we've you know it's always been our kind of largest use case it's always been our dominant use case because the you know on average we're able to offer people let's say a price that's four to five hundred basis points below their card And it's a big market, right? Half of all US consumers are carrying credit card debt. And so we're able to know who they are, know that we can approve them and reach out and say, we got a better deal for you. But there are other use cases, especially for repeat members. Once they see how easy it is to work with Lending Club and they're in our system, they can come back and use it for a whole variety of other things, home improvement, you name it, weddings, moving, So those latter alternative use cases, they're still in the mix, but they're a smaller percentage of what they would have been two years ago. We're not talking about significant shifts. We're talking about on the margin. But, yeah, that is how we have one of the many ways we've adapted. We've also, you know, tightened up our approval rates for people with federal student loans over a year and a half ago. You know, there's a number of ways we've adapted to this environment. That's just one.
spk09: So can you talk a little bit about your average APR on new originations this period, maybe contextualize and compare it to the last period, maybe a year ago?
spk03: Yeah. So in the prime space where we're originating, I mean, the coupons range anywhere from 10% to 18%, 19%. But on average, we're skewing towards the higher end of that population. So they're going to be in the low teens. in terms of the coupons that we're putting on the books for ourselves.
spk04: And in terms of coupon we've passed on, we're roughly in the near prime space. We've pretty much passed on all of the rate increases to that borrower. As we mentioned, where there's less competition in the prime space, we're probably closer to just under 300 of the call it 500 rough rate increase.
spk09: Got it. And I think you guys talked about a sale price on loans at the 96 cent range during your prepared remarks, or maybe it was a question earlier. I guess, is there a way to kind of contextualize what the required return your buyers are looking for, either gross or net today, maybe versus a year ago, or how it was kind of framed? that difference there.
spk04: Yeah, I mean, I'd say, you know, prior to the rate increase, right on the prime credit, you were looking at an unlevered return of call it, you know, four to 5% for prime and call it seven to eight for near prime. I'd say, you know, those numbers today are more like eight to 10 for prime and north of that for near prime. so you know the way you get there is higher coupons lower losses and a discount and you know and i guess i guess the other thing good note is you know coming into this rate environment we were selling loans at or above par i think uh we were at 101 um you know uh so um you know pretty pretty big pretty big difference in in pricing given the pressure on returns now that and that you know part of that return equation is due to the loss of the banks, right? And, you know, because the banks on prime can absorb a lower return, but without them in the mix with asset managers that are, you know, often warehouse funded, you know, they need that higher return. And, you know, Reggie, that's one of the things you said is that if we look in the space that who we're competing with, I don't, you know, I don't know that the economics that are being offered out there are sustainable for a lot of the businesses, right? The fact that we're able to do this unique structure where we can take the A notes and, you know, capture some yield while also giving efficient financing I think is pretty differentiated. And, you know, if this environment grinds on, I think it's going to be pretty important as a differentiator for our ability to continue to, you know, maintain profitability and marketplace.
spk09: I got one more question, kind of a two-parter. On that structured note, security, just can you remind us, the buyers of that equity tranche or residual tranche, are those new partners or are they existing partners that kind of moved over? It looks like existing asset managers have moved over to this structure. And then the second part of that question is, is there an opportunity to possibly move further down the credit spectrum, maybe enhance the yield there given the support? Or would that breach anything related to it being something that's able to be non-ceasled, non-reserved? Thanks.
spk04: In terms of the partners, it's a combination. We had some investors that were sidelined due to the cost of the warehouse lines that we've brought back. But we've also added several new partners to the platform. The bigger names in private credit, you know, have come on to some of the key names that come on to the platform. And, you know, as we mentioned, what what we like is, you know, these are these are players that have got significant capital to deploy and they are looking for, you know, kind of visibility into longer term flow. So we've got we've got agreements now that extend out through Q1. Obviously, you know, returns have got to keep coming in. And, you know, we won't call that committed capital, but the fact that we've got people who've signed up to make purchases up to $2 billion over the next six to eight months, we think is a real strength. In terms of moving further down the spectrum, we certainly think, you know, that was the area that we, you know, had, you know, really tightened the most and the longest ago. And we're certainly seeing solid returns from that segment uh so we do think over time as more of that data comes in to show uh you know what we're able to deliver there'll be an opportunity for us to potentially grow that marginally but right now investor appetite is lower and it certainly it's not out of the question that it could go into a structure like the the structured certificate program uh drew anything yeah it would clearly though have a different structure right the advance rate would be would be much
spk03: much lower on something that has a higher credit loss content than what we've been doing now. But, yeah, we're definitely able to offer that structure. You know, we could probably even sell some of our season loads through that structure eventually if we wanted to. So we haven't done that yet, but certainly possible.
spk09: That was actually another question I had for you guys, but it's good to know that that's an option as well. Okay. Thanks a lot.
spk01: Our next question comes from Tim Switzer with KBW. Please proceed.
spk05: Hey, I'm on for Mike Perreo. Thanks for taking my question. Hi there. I was hoping you guys could expand on the comments you guys made earlier near the beginning of the question session where you mentioned about, you know, there's more competition in the higher side of credit quality, higher FICO space among the personal lending. market and, you know, can you help quantify maybe how many, you know, competitors who have stepped up from lower FICO to higher FICO and kind of crept into your space a little bit and maybe how that's impacted your market share specifically. I don't know if you have any numbers behind that, but just curious.
spk04: No, I mean, I guess the number of offers that are visible to customers has certainly come down. If you look at a key place, like some of the aggregators, like a lending tree or a credit karma, the number of people participating has come down uh it's more pronounced in the lower fico than in the high fico um and you know in terms of share um yeah you know the the best source of data for that will be tu which comes out on a big lag i'll tell you we're not you know long term we've consistently been a leader in the space in this particular market that is not a metric that we're managing to, we're, you know, we're most focused on delivering a predictable return for ourselves and our buyers. Um, but I, you know, what, what I would expect to see is that, you know, certainly some of the, you know, the banks that are playing in prime that are direct banks, right. That are their business model is to be adding the assets to the balance sheet, you know, are going to continue to operate.
spk05: Okay. Um and about your guys comments about the first half of 24 probably looking similar to Q4 um does that mean we should probably assume a similar outlook on expenses or you know is there actions you guys could take that would maybe help lower one way or um you know if there's any investments you would want to make that could have it go up?
spk03: I'd say within I would say think of expenses as being roughly flat there's always a little bit of know friction as time goes on uh you know merit increases things of that nature that come through but i would say roughly flat to slightly up as we go into next year from okay roughly flat from the q4 numbers from the keyboard right from q2 from q2 sorry yeah sorry yeah all right yeah that's understood um and and then uh yeah that's all for me thank you guys
spk01: Thank you for your questions. There are no questions waiting at this time, so I will pass the conference back over to Mario Malaveco for some additional questions.
spk07: Thank you, Ciara. So, Scott and Drew, we've got a couple questions for you here that were submitted by our shareholders. The first question is, have you considered rebranding to another name since LendingClub is more than just a lender now? Great question.
spk04: So, as we talked about, you know, The ways we can serve our members is evolving as we get to a place where we've got an integrated app that will cover spending and savings in addition to lending. That's part of the reason why we brought in Mark, who I talked about on the call, to oversee marketing, brand, communications, and bring also that deposit expertise. So I don't expect any imminent shifts, but I will say that will be one of the key things on his mind is how we integrate these new offerings into the brand and what evolutions we may need to make. Great. Thank you.
spk07: And here's a second question. So with the shares trading at such a steep discount to tangible book value, is there a reason the company is not buying back shares?
spk03: Yeah, well, I think it's probably worth just a reminder to everyone. We're in the third year of our operating agreement that we entered into as part of the radius acquisition. And some of the restrictions around that operating agreement make it difficult for us to execute any type of share buyback at this point.
spk04: But I will add, however, that the discount that we're seeing is certainly not lost on us and, you know, TAB, Mark McIntyre, I don't believe it represents the value that that we will be creating with this business you know i'm one of the largest individual shareholders in the company and. TAB, Mark McIntyre, been selling any shares and at the recent board meeting I indicated I post this earnings that I would be considering to purchase in the open market and wouldn't be surprised if some of the board members did the same.
spk07: TAB, Mark McIntyre, I great.
spk01: That will conclude today's conference call. Thank you all for your participation. You may now disconnect your line.
Disclaimer