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spk10: Good afternoon. My name is Nora, and I'll be your conference operator today. I would like to welcome everyone to the Las Vegas Sense Third Quarter 2020 Earnings Conference Call. All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. I will now turn the call over to Mr. Daniel Briggs. Please go ahead.
spk02: Thank you, Operator. Joining me on the call today are Sheldon Adelson, our Chairman and Chief Executive Officer, Rob Goldstein, our President and Chief Operating Officer, and Dr. Dumont, our Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer. Also joining us on the call are Dr. Wilford Wong, President of SanchChina, and Grant Shum, Chief Operating Officer of SanchChina. Before I turn the call over to Mr. Adelson, please let me remind you that today's conference call will contain forward-looking statements that we are making under the safe harbor provision of federal securities law. The company's actual results could differ materially from the anticipated results in these forward-looking statements. In addition, we may discuss non-GAAP measures. The definition of each of these measures to the most comparable GAAP financial measures is included in the press release. Please note that we have posted supplementary earnings slides on our investor relations website. We may refer to those slides during the Q&A portion of the call. Finally, for those who would like to participate in the Q&A session, we ask that you please respect our request to limit yourself to one question and one follow-up question so we might allow everyone with interest the opportunity to participate. Please note that this presentation is being recorded. With that, let me please turn the call over to Mr. Adelson.
spk07: Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us today. I hope that all of you and your families are staying safe and healthy. While the business volumes continue to be impacted by the pandemic, we're pleased to see improving operating results, especially in Asia. In Singapore, Marina Bay stands at a profitable quarter as operations progressively resumed across the resort during the summer. In Macau, operating losses reduced sequentially over the second quarter. The third quarter results, however, are not representative of our current business trajectory, as the resumption of visa issuance across all provinces in China only commenced toward the end of September. The initial stages of recovery since then have been very encouraging. Through the October golden week, we saw meaningful recovery across the different segments of our Macau operations. Importantly, business volumes in the premium mass segment enjoyed the most significant researches. This vital segment is central to our ongoing investment program in Macau and has been leading our revenue generation at this stage of the recovery. We expect the base mass market to recover as visitation to the market increases. Consistent with the recovery of premium mass and overall domestic China consumption returns. We also experienced strong recovery in our retail malls with the luxury retail segment enjoying the strongest performance. We continue to make excellent progress in our $2.2 billion U.S. dollar capital investment for the London and Macau and Four Seasons projects. The Grand Suites at Four Seasons, the largest all-suites Four Seasons hotel in the world, is non-complete, licensed, and hosting customers in the premium mass segment. These gorgeous new suites have been receiving great customer feedback since the golden week. We will be introducing a variety of additional world-class integrated resort products and amenities as we complete the London and Macau and other capital projects. The Londoner will include two new all-suite hotels, more than a dozen new restaurants, additional retail and new mice and entertainment facilities. Our unwavering commitment to our significant ongoing investments in Macau enables us to play a part in supporting local employment and the local economy. It also ensures Macau will be even better positioned to recapture and, over time, increase. the chair of leisure and business tourism from China and the rest of Asia. I remain steadfast in my belief that Macau has the potential to become one of the greatest business and leisure tourism destinations in the world and the most capital of Asia. As I've said on many occasions, we would welcome the opportunity to invest billions of additional investment dollars. and extend our contributions to Macau's diversification and evolution into Asia's leading leisure and business tourism destination. Now turning to Marina Bay Sands in Singapore. We encourage that MBS was profitable in the third quarter, despite the absence of overseas tourists. We hope to see the initiation of reciprocal travel arrangements in the coming months as health concerns. We remain committed to pursuing long-term investment in Singapore and our expansion of Marina Bay Sands, although there would be likely delays in the timing of the expansion given the challenges created by the pandemic. In addition to the expansion, we will continue to reinvest in Marina Bay Sands to enhance the customer experience and the tourism appeal of the resort. In Las Vegas, we are pleased to report that the recovery is well underway. Weekend occupancies have been as high as 70%. Together with our state and local government leadership and the entire Las Vegas community, Our team members are working diligently to prepare to safely host convention and group meeting customers from throughout the world, throughout the country, and around the world. We look forward to once again welcoming these customers back to Las Vegas, which will always be the most important convention and group meeting market in the United States. as we have said in the past increased analyst and the resumption of the convention of good media business are both critical components to achieving a full recovery in las vegas now moving to our balance sheet maintaining a strong balance sheet makes great business sense while we weather the storm caused by this pandemic Our balance sheet strength enabled us to continue to execute our capital investment programs in both Macau and Singapore, which we believe will position the company to deliver industry-leading growth and profitability in the years ahead. We're as confident as ever in the strength of our business model and the eventual recovery in travel and tourism spending in our markets. So thanks again for joining us on the call today. Now we'll take questions.
spk10: Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you'll need to press star 1 on your telephone. And to regard a question, press the pound key. Your first question comes from the line of Joe Graff with JP Morgan. Your line is open.
spk02: Good morning, everybody. Sheldon, your comments about recent trends in Macau on the premium mass and the luxury retail side, certainly encouraging. I was hoping maybe you can give us a little bit more detail on what you've seen since Golden Week. Would you say at this point, if your run rating at these levels and these levels continue, that you would be at EBITDA break-even levels in Macau?
spk07: That's what we're shooting for.
spk02: but not currently there as of yet.
spk07: The trajectory is heading in the right direction.
spk06: Joe, I'd like to make some comments. Joe, it's Rob. How are you doing? Hey, Rob. How are you? Let's begin with a question. To answer your question, let's just begin with the obvious, and our confidence in Macau being the world's greatest gaming market, and its principal source of customers come from China. We know exactly in China, from a growing economy perspective, a fatal position due to COVID, The renminbi is as strong as it's been in many years. And of course, the Chinese consumer is not traveling to foreign countries. We think this fact pattern, the macro perspective, is very favorable for Macau. And as you know, Macau's been a $40 to $50 billion revenue market for the past number of years, year in, year out performance. The COVID IBS obstacles are real. And we believe as they start to lessen, we'll go back to marching towards our goal of $4 billion annually. Our new Four Seasons is now open. It's quite a product. The London we complete from the interior perspective by December. So we've never been stronger from an asset perspective. But there's no question, while demand for Macau is there, and it's there, we have great confidence, the visa and the testing issues have proven to be challenging and have limited the access. We are hoping the government will loosen restrictions and access to Macau will continue to improve. The truth is the way Macau and China has handled the virus is in a very capable manner. And Macau will be the beneficiary of reduced travel to other markets. The Chinese consumer is not traveling outside China, so it's a domestic travel bubble. We hope to include it shortly. I'd like Grant to opine and talk about – I asked Grant to join Nicole Wilford-Wong to give you color from the ground since he hasn't been there. in many, many months. I think they can give you, Grant maybe could begin by talking about your questions about October, about profitability, trends, et cetera. So Grant, are you awake there, Grant?
spk08: We're well awake, yeah. Thank you, Rob. Yes, good morning, good afternoon, everyone. Yeah, I mean, October was the first time since January that we've seen, you know, significant real business volumes and patronage. And as Mr. A mentioned in his opening remarks, premium mass has been the strongest segment by far. And that is really across all of the different tiers of premium mass. The patrons returning first to Macau are the high-quality, high-frequency customers. I think that reflects the pent-up demand that these guests have, and these are the ones who are used to staying overnight in Macau. They are used to having multiple night stays in Macau, enjoying the destination, and these are the first customers to come back, and that's natural. In terms of the question about where we are on the volumes and profitability, I mean, principally based on the premium mass recovery, our October month-to-date non-rolling drop per day is just over $20 million. That's about 30% of last year's level. And at this level of non-rolling drop, we are able to achieve and we are achieving a slight positive EBITDA month-to-date based on current cost structure and the business mix. I think what's particularly encouraging to Joe's question about what's happening after Golden Week, we had the expected lull in the second week of October, but then we saw a very notable rebound in the third week. In fact, in the third week, we are actually still averaging around or just under 20 million drop per day as well. So we are, as Ms. Day said, we are well onto that trajectory, and we hope we can maintain that. I think in tandem with the premium mass recovery, we've seen a resurgence in the retail more sales. And that's especially true in the four seasons in the luxury retail segment. The retail recovery actually began in September and has continued into October. In fact, some of our A number of our top first-line brands within the Four Seasons more is actually up year on year in terms of their retail tenant sales in the first two weeks of October. And obviously, in conjunction with that, at the Four Seasons, we've just opened the Grand Suites for Four Seasons. And these suites have received exceptional feedback. I think this is exactly the right product for this premium mass segment structurally, but also at this point in time, I think these Chinese consumers are looking for higher quality, looking for the premium experiences, and also obviously in this time, an increased amount of personal space. So we're very happy of how that product has come through and, in fact, is really one of our best performing hotels, if not the best performing hotels in October. The question on the other segments, I think base mass certainly is relatively low in terms of traffic right now. As you know, the overall visitation in Macau remains relatively low. And as Rob referenced, there are obviously impediments. Some are real, some are perceived, some are more to do with awareness in terms of the policies. real logistical challenges relating to the testing, the COVID testing as well as the visa application. But as the awareness builds, as the word of mouth spreads, as some of these visa application processes are shortened and become more abbreviated, Some of these logistical challenges will be overcome or mitigated, and we're confident that the base mass will follow as visitation recovers. As for the VIP segment, obviously that's been slower in terms of the recovery. That's expected. A lot of those issues are well documented. But we are also seeing a reasonable amount of play coming through in that segment in October as well. So I hope that gives you some color on the October.
spk02: That's great, Grant. I hope you're on the next bunch of earnings conference calls. Just a quick follow-up. How much of your volume do you think are coming from outside of Guangdong since Golden Week, or is it primarily this month all Guangdong?
spk08: Actually, the vast majority of the volumes and the room bookings are from non-Guandong, but that ratio is actually consistent with what we saw in the past. So this is not out of the ordinary. Majority of the volume comes from outside of Guangdong. And that was the case in October already. But your question is still well made in the sense that in the first week of October, I mean, a lot of these customers from outside of Guangdong either didn't have time to get the visa or they didn't want to leave their planning to such a last minute deadline. time frame. So they already made alternative plans. So the nationwide visa resumption only occurred or started on 23rd of September. So that really was not sufficient time or window for a lot of the customers to feel that they could confidently get the visa before Golden Week, before all the offices shut down again for the holidays. So In that sense, we should hopefully be seeing the non-Guangdong visitation improve as the awareness and the logistics challenges are met and some of these people have time to get the visa to come to Macau. Great.
spk02: Thank you very much, everybody.
spk14: Thank you.
spk10: Your next question comes from Felicia Hendricks with Barclays. Your line is open.
spk09: Hi, thanks so much. And if we could keep you on the hot seat here. I think we're all excited to hear from you. So just, you know, getting back to some of the items that you just mentioned, you know, on the visitation side, are you seeing any changes per se in the rate of visa application approvals or even the methodology? I mean, have the kiosks been coming back or is it still an in-person kind of more manual process? And, you know, on the testing, is there any sense that it will be extended to 14 days? I know that there's been some talk about that.
spk08: Sure. I think when the Guangdong visas resumed, I think most of the offices were operating on the physical application process. and not using the kiosks. As the rest of the country has reopened for visa application, we see a variety. It's not uniform because it's, you know, different provinces have different procedures and they always have had. So there are some significant provinces and cities where you can get a same day application But most of the others, I would say, range from the manual process takes anywhere between three working days to seven working days. But there are a number of them that have a shorter application period. And then I think for going forward, hopefully, obviously, this gets smoothed out. And I think this is just part of the initial, I think quite rightly, the authorities are cautious. And I think that's the right thing to do in the face of the pandemic, that we don't necessarily want a huge surge of people into Macau in a short space of time at the beginning.
spk09: And then just on the texting, do you think they'll extend that to 14 days versus seven? I know that's a bit of a gating factor.
spk08: That has been discussed in Macau, and we are waiting for further development on that front.
spk09: Okay. And then, just as my follow-up, and this could be for anybody, but on the VIP side, I'm just wondering what you guys are seeing in terms of junket liquidity. I know it's not a big part of your business, but junket liquidity is important for the market as a whole. So, I just wanted to know what your thoughts were there.
spk08: I think some of the challenges in that segment are well documented. The segment has been slower to recover in this initial stage of the recovery, but at the same time, as you quite rightly referenced, It's not a significant part of our business, only 4% of our contribution in 2019. And in the meantime, we have obviously very strong performance in the premium end of premium mass, both across gaming and retail. I'm sorry, please, go ahead.
spk09: I was just wondering if you thought that maybe some of your premium masks might be benefiting from, you know, folks moving segments as it was before COVID, but maybe seeing that, you know, more accelerated now.
spk08: I think it's too short a time period to ascertain that. Okay.
spk09: Sorry, Rob.
spk06: Well, I think one thing to point out what Grant is saying was I think the nice thing, it may not be important to our overall business, but in terms of percentages, but clearly it is important to liquidity in the marketplace. And I think what's nice to see is that the first segment out of box recovery has been pretty massive, speculation that it may be hurt badly by liquidity issues. And what we're seeing in retail, I think Grant mentioned the strength of the retail premium, it's i was talking to our retail team this morning it's hard to imagine that in this environment our top six lovely retailers i won't name the names and you can imagine the french the italian luxury brands are up year on year in total sales which is kind of astounding it shows the strength and equity of that premium segment and reflects both the gaming and the retail appetite i think it's very exciting to realize that segment's back and that speaks to our four seasons in our london rooms but also When the day comes when they do lessen the restrictions and make it more accessible based mass, you've got the two most important segments delivering. I think it's nice to see the current situation being massed and perhaps the base masses are not too far down the road.
spk09: Great. Thank you so much.
spk06: Thank you.
spk10: Your next question comes from the line of Stephen Grambling. We have Goldman Sachs. Your line is open.
spk14: Good afternoon. Thanks for taking the question. It seems like there's been just more news and perhaps noise around overseas gambling legislation in China and some of the restrictions potentially there. What is your interpretation of some of these laws or legislation and the implications for both Macau and Marina Bay Sands and how that might change how you position or market LDS properties?
spk06: I'll just take the first point. I was listening to Dr. Wong to speak to McAlbert. The concerns there don't concern us as Western Singapore. We do our job as best we can and we carefully monitor as best we can all the restrictions and all the issues money moves etc to our best of our ability we take that responsibly very seriously all typical rules Singapore continues that you know obviously the outside like all of Asia were negatively impacted by the inability of the Chinese customer to get to Singapore however we do see the opening the initiatives taken by Singapore government to open Hong Kong open that would be a a catalyst for other jurisdictions, other countries, other airlines to open the doors to more travel into Singapore. Dr. Wong, do you speak to the issue of cross-border casino from your perspective as it relates to Macau?
spk11: Sure. We understand the National People's Congress still debating the final form of that legislation. But we must remember that uh the target the main target is really gambling in foreign countries including particularly internet and telephone betting however macau has never been considered foreign in china and all of concessionaires in macau respect the law in china and we never promote gaming in china only our hospitality and mice facilities and services. So we believe that Macau has a unique place under the one country, two systems in China, and that we will continue to operate under the confines of the legislation.
spk14: That's helpful. I'll jump back in the queue. Thanks so much. Thank you. Thanks.
spk10: Your next question comes from the line of Carlos Santorelli of Deutsche Bank. Your line is open.
spk02: Hey, guys. Thank you. I just want to follow up on, I believe it was Felicia's question, and talk a little bit about the VIP segment. When you guys, and maybe Grant, you're probably best positioned to answer this, but when you think about kind of the Issues on the VIP side, and as you mentioned, kind of they've been well advertised. How much of it do you think it is a supply issue in terms of liquidity and supply of capital versus a demand issue? And I guess part of that gets to is some of the demand actually just showing up in your premium ask, which you kind of already addressed. So anything just on the supply and demand dynamics within the VIP segment?
spk08: Rob, you want me to take that?
spk06: I want to finish a comment after you. Do you want to initiate, Grant, please?
spk08: Sure. Yeah, I don't particularly see it as a demand issue. I think there are some issues related, specifically relating to that segment. But I think one contextual point is you have to remember that the system consists of a working capital cycle in that segment. And what we've had in 2020 is a seven, eight-month complete disruption of that business and that ecosystem with all the working capital issues associated with that. So, you know, we've never had that level of essentially the business stopped. you know, everywhere, but obviously for that segment, given the particular dynamics, it's particularly damaging. So I think you're seeing some of the after effect of that disruption. But obviously, as gaming activity resumes and demand resumes, you hope that some of these issues will evolve in a positive way.
spk06: I've got to say this, and I'm saying the obvious, but I'm going to say it anyway. The aging customer, at least in our industry, is the highest offense in the world. It's been that way for decades, and it will be that way for decades to come. I don't think demand, the appetite of the consumer is diminished whatsoever. Obviously, the capital cycle is in jeopardy right now. It will take time to adapt. We've had this issue in the past years, and back in 14. And we know two things are intact. Demand remains intact. And that's a fact. And at some point, capital will become available again. I wouldn't count that segment out. It may be in a very, very tough spot right now. But again, demand will be there. Eventually, we'll figure out the supply on the capital side. We feel highly confident. That's a fact.
spk02: Great. Thank you, guys, both. And if I could just ask one quick follow-up as it pertains to, you know, what you're kind of seeing, obviously, in a reduced demand environment across the board to an extent, but obviously healthier in the premium mass segment. Are you guys seeing anything unique from competitors in the market just in terms of the way they're going about their business and trying to drive demand at their assets or is it pretty much business as usual across the board? Grant, you have a challenge for me. Yeah, I'm sorry.
spk08: Actually, it's a business as usual. We don't see anything out of the ordinary. Yeah, this is not really a business where people are going to go out and do silly things. I think it's pretty rational right now.
spk06: I would add one thing, though, that we all agree, and that is that this market is not getting a rational pass, but it has proven to be very, very susceptible to great product. And I do think our new four seasons product, our Londoner product, will prove to be very, very advantageous in the years ahead. As we move back towards our quest for $4 billion annual EBITDA, those products are going to take front and center, and that's what drives this premium mass customer, not silly incentives and poor marketing. Great product wins the day over there. I mean, so highly confident we have built an aesthetic product that would be very appealing to this customer. Thank you both very much. Thank you.
spk10: Your next question comes from the line of Steve Wisinski of Stifel. Your line is open.
spk03: Good afternoon, guys. Rob, can I ask you a Vegas question? Can you maybe help us think about forward bookings for group and convention traffic in Vegas next year and maybe how those bookings at this point are shaking out by quarter?
spk06: Sure, sure. We still see some bright spots in Dougie's market, the convention and group business. There's demand, and there's some recent, you know, despair in the market because some of these are actually still on a common Q1. We have a couple of major impediments that I don't know how we're going to correct them. One is, as you know, the government here, the governor, has imposed group restrictions and size restrictions. So it's very difficult to overcome that. We're hoping to revisit those restrictions and enable the market to talk to some of these large shows. The second issue, of course, is airlift. Airlift is not near pre-COVID levels, so that's a challenge. But I think to the positive side, we're getting calls from the group market. We're getting inquiries from people from all different parts of the group market saying, we want to come back. We're looking at this month, that month. We're not scattered throughout the year. I think it depends on, I guess there's three things. The government will revisit the restrictions, and that's pivotal. The airlift, most of these people require airlift. It's not driving business. So I think that will come back when the market demand is there. And the third thing, I think, to really fully populate the market with group demand, again, is a change, a catalyst to change how the consumer views, you know, being in a place with 30, 40, 50,000 people. It's obvious in Vegas that the weekend leisure market is surging, and we could probably get to 95% right now if we let it happen. We cap hours in the 65, 70 range to keep the elevator safe, et cetera. But the Leisure demand for Las Vegas weekend is very strong, not as much midweek, which has always been relying upon more group. Also, the gaining, as you know, has come back to probably, I don't know, 75%, 80% of pre-COVID. So there's some bright spots, but to your point, That's going to be the pivotal. The bell's really ringing again in Las Vegas. We've got to see group come back. And there's just an impediment despite the demand, which seems to be growing. We get more calls every day to the group market, and people are itching to come back and be here. So I think both in very large conventions as well as small tech groups, there appears to be across the board demand is reoccurring for next year, for 21. And it's probably still actually April, May, June.
spk03: Okay, great. Thanks, Robin. Second question, I'm not really sure how to ask this question. It's going to be a political question, so excuse me. But, you know, yeah, I know. If you take your... personal views out of the equation for a second. How should we think about, you know, the election coming up and maybe how each scenario might play out in terms of your, you know, your China relationships moving forward? And I hope that makes sense.
spk06: I'm really not going to answer that question, I'll do respect. I think it's, first of all, I don't know if there's a good answer I can give you since we don't have insight to your attorney's perspective. But I I'm going to pass that respectfully. I don't know if Sheldon wants to weigh in, but I think that's a question I'll pass on.
spk03: OK.
spk06: Understood. Thanks, guys. Wait one second. Is he on?
spk07: Yes. We don't answer political questions.
spk10: OK. Your next question comes from the line of Robin Farley with UBS. Your line is open.
spk01: Great, thanks. I have a question for Grant. I'm kind of circling back to some of the discussion earlier, and Grant, it's so nice to hear your voice. Just your take on whether, you know, Junket's ability to operate in mainland China, their interactions with customers, would that be impacted potentially by the blacklist regulation in your view? not that players won't come to Macau, but the ability for junkets to, you know, maybe be providing capital for players from the mainland. And kind of looking at your economic crystal ball, how long you think capital controls in mainland China may be kind of front and center. Thanks.
spk08: Rob, should I take that? Yes, please. Yep. Hi, Robin. Yeah. I think we should clarify that there's always been a prohibition on gambling on mainland China and solicitation of gambling in mainland China. And I think those rules and regulations are well understood by market participants. And I think that's the way it should remain. I think the currency issue, these are big, big issues. We're not in a position to opine on that. But obviously, the market has been operating without any issues for so many years, and we don't see any particular issues in that regard as the market starts to come back. But obviously, like everyone else, we'll watch with great interest the evolution of the system. Okay.
spk01: Thank you. Maybe just as a follow-up, and I don't know, Rob, if this would be for you because it's sort of broader. I think in prior calls this year, you talked about potential M&A activity or that would be a little bit of a departure for LVS, having expressed interest in that. Can you sort of update us on your thoughts on that at this point? Thanks.
spk12: Thank you for your call. Yeah, you want me to take that one? Is that okay? Sure. Hey, it's Patrick. I think what we said before in prior calls is consistent, that we do capital deployment pretty consistently, and so that we have a very high return threshold. When that original commentary was made by the chairman, it was really regarding certain conditions that existed really before all the stimulus went into the market. And I think where we are today is we're very focused on maintaining our investments in our existing markets. We've deployed a lot of capital in the last 12 months into these markets. As Grant and Rob mentioned, you're starting to see the benefits in the return on premium mass in Macau today and these very high-value investments. And we're also looking to maintain liquidity to ensure that we have the ability to take advantage of opportunities in the future. So, you know, I think we're looking around. I think we're optimistic about the future of our key markets. If an M&A opportunity comes up, We'll look at it. But again, our return thresholds are very high. And as of right now, there's nothing that's really compelling. So we'll continue to play capital on our markets and hopefully get the continued high returns that we've been seeing previously in these markets. But no M&A as of right now.
spk01: Thank you.
spk12: Thanks, Robin.
spk10: Your next question comes from Thomas Allen with Morgan Stanley. Your line is open.
spk05: Thank you. Just following up on that last question, we've been getting a lot of questions about when you may resume your dividend, and would you go back to the kind of 79 cents you were paying at the beginning of the year? Can you just update us on your thinking there? Thank you.
spk12: Patrick? Hey, it's Patrick. You know, I think return of capital has been a cornerstone for our shareholder value creation program, and I think we're very focused on getting back to being a dividend player. You know, you've heard our chairman say, yay, dividends, many times. I think he still feels that way. I think the company is very motivated to grow its cash flow beyond where it was in 2019 and ultimately return to being a dividend payer. But I think the key thing right now is that we're in the early stages of recovery of COVID, and we're going to see how that trajectory goes before we make a determination about return of capital. We're very focused on growing the business back and exceeding the prior levels, and we'll evaluate where things are at that time as things progress and make an assessment about sort of dividend payouts at that time.
spk05: helpful color. Thank you, Patrick. And then just as my follow-up question, appreciate all the color you gave on Macau around Golden Week and how things have been progressing there. Can you give any more color around Vegas and Singapore? Obviously, sequentially, third quarter looked better than the second quarter, but was it similar in terms of a month-by-month progression, and have things continued to improve in October and And would you expect them to continue to improve, or are there seasonal factors we should be thinking about, too? Thank you.
spk06: Do you want to think more in Las Vegas? So in Las Vegas, I think things have, I'm not sure the season or issue, we're in a different place right now. I think it's now about summer versus fall. I think it's pretty much staying stable. I'm curious to see what happens in the winter if the leisure business holds up as strongly. But I think things are going to stay where they're at until there's some type of a catalyst. I mean, you're seeing leisure travel, I think, be stronger in weekends. not a strong midweek. I still think the airlift thing is very, very difficult to overcome. We still are operating as a regional market. I don't see how the group business will be increasing demand, but how it will get here and can it get here with the governmental restrictions. So I don't see a lot of change in Las Vegas for us until there's a change structurally in the governor's position, the airline position, and the willingness, again, of consumers. I think people coming here on weekends and sitting in a room is one thing, but when they come with a 30,000-room convention or they come and watch a 20,000-seat hockey game, I don't know how people think about those kind of large gatherings. I think Vegas stays where it's at. I think there's going to be demand. But we've got to change some things structurally to get people in the buildings. So that's Vegas. We're very encouraged with what's happening at MBS. We made some money this quarter, as you see. I think that will continue to grow. The growth at MBS will be contingent upon a few variables. For example, this entire building will grow from 1,500 current slot machines to 2,000 as of the first of the year. The wind per unit there is extraordinary. And that's driven mostly not by people think it's a locals market. Not really. It's a locals market for residents, Singapore residents. Very different thing. Because what we say that is it's farmers who achieve the status as a permanent resident. That's probably the big driver of our very strong spot. Not as strong on the table side where the market is not as, of the local residents. We need some airlift there. The other encouraging thing happening in Singapore, as you know, is the recent development with the Hong Kong airlift situation in the government. We're very fortunate to have a government in Singapore that's so proactive and recognize we need to rejuvenate our industry and its economy. That deal with CAFE AND SINGH AIR IS VERY FAVORABLE. IT GOES WELL FOR OTHER JURISDICTIONS TO OPEN UP. WE NEED THE BIG CATALYST FOR SINGAPORE GROWTH OBVIOUSLY IS FOREIGN TRAVEL, FOREIGN VISITATION. THAT'S INCENTIVATED BY AIRLIFT AND THAT'S LACKING. BUT AGAIN, MALAYSIA, INDONESIA, JAPAN, ET CETERA, VIETNAM, AS THOSE MARKETS OPEN UP, SINGAPORE CAN USUALLY GROW FROM RIGHT NOW 25, 35 MILLION A MONTH TO MAYBE 50 OR 75 MILLION A MONTH AND KEEP GOING. getting the airlift made for our visitation. We are comfortable in making money in Singapore. It's growing. October and Golden Week, as the business keeps continuing to feel better, to feel stronger, but the change will only happen there in a step change way when you have access by air travel obviously um and we're hopeful that in this quarter we'll see some more developments and we'll see even further as again unlike the u.s the the coveted situation appears to be pretty stable in most countries in asia so it makes us hopeful that more people open their borders up and allow air travel and that will drive singapore back the levels of comfort and uh if i could just a it's patrick if i just add one comment
spk12: I think it's an important thing to note that in Singapore, things really were open in a phased way after the circuit breaker. And so we really didn't have our full hotel towers until August 1. And I think the other thing that's important to note is it did ramp across the quarter. So Singapore is slowly resuming operations in a more normal way, and we're starting to see the benefits of that as we resume the profitability. And so it was a ramp across the quarter in Singapore, and the trajectory is positive.
spk05: Very helpful, Colin. Thank you.
spk10: Your next question comes from the line of Jared Tajarian with the Wall Street Research. Your line is open.
spk00: Hi. Good afternoon, everyone. Thanks for taking my question. On Marina Bay Sands, can you tell us what percentage of your business historically has come from mainland China? And then I guess on the cross-border issues, I mean, is it possible that For Macau, some of the cross-border issues, just the sentiment of that could be a headwind in the near term, but potentially positive over the longer term if more demand ends up shifting to Macau.
spk06: Well, to double-edged sword, we're not going to break out percentages as it relates to the profitability coming out of China into Singapore, but I will say it's a very important market for us. There's no arguing that it's fundamental to our growth and success, as is most countries in Asia, depending on China visitation. So we'll keep it at a very macro level. As far as the double-edged sword as I referenced, because I think it's very, very helpful in Macau that the Chinese consumer, one reason our retail business on the high end is booming, according to our our people in the ground is that they can't fly to France or the U.S. or wherever they travel to and buy their luxury goods. So they're buying it at home. And you see the surging retail numbers and the growth in the economy coming out of China. China's back to a pretty good place. Growth, I think, is back and remedy is strong. And China is doing very well compared to the rest of the world, including the COVID situation. So that bodes very, very well. Once we get inside the bubble of the China bubble and the containment, I think our business in Macau is going to be just fine and dandy quickly. It's not so positive for Macau, I've heard of Singapore, because there may be a hesitation over the country after air travel. I'm speculating, but we don't hear anything coming out of China right now as far as opening up the balance of not just Singapore, but Asia. Japan, Thailand, et cetera. So it will be helpful because the management, both gaming, retail, leisure travel, will probably be very strong in Macau as those IDS and COVID barriers come down. And hopefully they will come down because of the health situation in both Macau and mainland China is very positive. So it's very helpful in Macau, no question, and probably not as helpful in Singapore.
spk00: Okay. Thanks, Rob. And I'm curious, Rob, just to get your perspective on this. I think I know the answer to this, but I'm curious to hear your response. Given that Vegas is recovering, we're a little bit closer to a vaccine today, hopefully. And Macau has been, I think, a lot slower to recover than people expected. Is it still your expectation that Macau could and should get back to prior peak revenue before Vegas?
spk06: I believe so. I think Macau, let me be honest, China is the market for Macau. China is in a very favorable position. The records really recall Remedy, the economy, the safety of the COVID. They've done a great job in a sustainable recovery over there, and it feels as if we transferred to Macau in the near future. I just don't know when. But I feel very good about the prospects from Macau in the future, and hopefully in the near future. But we don't know. Again, it's not within our control. But I think the government took it slowly. And you've got to hand things to governments in China and Macau. They've been very – it's been frustrating, but they've taken it slow. And you see it opening gradually. We see the recovery in the pre and mass, the base mass to follow, and probably a chunk after that. So the cow, I think, recovers quicker. Having said that, I, for the first time, am feeling Vegas has some great spots. You feel some, there's definitely a leisure customer weekend. It's packed here on the weekend much more than it had been previously. It's not so available midweek. But, again, there's always a group area of strength. And we're seeing group calls. I mean, our team is getting in response. People want to come back to Las Vegas. It just, I think, takes longer. And to your reference, I pray there's a vaccine for all of us. I do think that's a tipping point. The U.S. has to get healthy. We still have about 70,000 people infected one day last week. It's still staggering. the level of what's happened. So until people feel safe, they're not coming to Vegas. But when they do, they're going to come back and they're very confident. But if I had to make a bet, I'd bet on Macau much quicker recovery than Las Vegas. Vegas has some challenges when Macau just has to have that barrier come down and let people come in. That's all it is.
spk00: All right. Thank you very much.
spk06: Thank you.
spk00: Appreciate it.
spk10: Your next question comes from the line of David Gatz. Jeffrey, your line is open.
spk04: Hi, afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. Good to hear all of your voices and hope you're well. I just wanted to follow up on the IVS circumstances. What we see in here is a negligible number of cases. both in Macau and the relevant areas of China. What light can you shed on what the Chinese government and the Macau government might be looking for change to occur? Or is it just a function of taking the time administratively to convert back to the kiosks that we've known about in the past? Mr. John, are you still awake?
spk08: Yeah. Well, I think the way you have to look at it, and it refers back to what Rob said, what a great job I think the governments in China and the local government in Macau have done in terms of controlling the pandemic. But One result of that is I think each step of relaxation is handled very cautiously. So I think it's more the case that we need the passage of time where we can see that everything is working in order and there are no issues arising from people movements of large numbers. um and i think your point about you know did they move from manual to kiosk i mean we we already do uh have feedback from uh from from customers and and consumers that you know different parts of china you do have a a much more abbreviated application process so i think this will work its way out um assuming that everything remains in order as it relates to the control of the pandemic. Rob, this is Wilfred.
spk11: Can I jump in? Please do. Now, I think the current situation is the government knows what needs to be done, including persuading the Chinese government to work on the kiosk rather than manual processes, extending the 14 days of the validity of the test certificate. But we must remember one thing. What you want to avoid is a shutdown again. So that's why both the central government and the Macau government have been working very carefully, because they don't want a resurgence or an outbreak of COVID in Macau, which has held its fort for so long. And that's why they're moving slowly but surely. But what we're seeing is that both the central government and the Macau government knows exactly what needs to be done, and they're moving in the right direction.
spk04: Thank you for that. It sounds like a fair plan. Sorry, go ahead, please.
spk06: No, it could be more. I think we're lucky that they're thinking long-term. It's frustrating for all of us who wanted to happen yesterday. We wanted so badly to see this market open back up. We want to get back on track, and it is frustrating. It's frustrating, but I think the comments of the guys in Macau, it's going to pay off long-term with long, sustainable growth and back to a better environment. It's hard for us in here to accept it without getting antsy, but I think when those restrictions are lifted or revisited, I think it would be great for all of us.
spk04: I appreciate that. And if I can ask one detailed follow-up, you know, within the context of the recovery in Macau, and I appreciate the color around, you know, October, you know, starting to, you know, approach or get to break even, how should we, how would you have us think about the Londoner, you know, and its ramp within the context of all that? Presumably it's on a different track and a different trajectory given the capital.
spk06: Sure. Rob, you want to? I think the first point is what Rob said earlier, that this is a product-driven market.
spk08: And it's, I don't know, it's hard for us to convey to you over the phone just how excited we are about the products that we're about to bring on. And of course, we have brought some of that on already through the Four Seasons, the new hotel at the Four Seasons. But obviously, the bigger piece will be the comprehensive product that we're going to put out there through the London and Macau. And I think... When you think about the construction progress we've made there, obviously we've taken full advantage of the pandemic cessation of some of this business in the SEC side, and we've accelerated much of our programming as a result of that. And I think when we see the segments that are recovering, chiefly through premium masks, we really feel very good about the natural rollout progressively of a number of these new products. And that will start potentially towards the end of this year and will move on to the rest of the resort. during the course of 2021. But we're very, very excited about what we're about to bring onto the market.
spk06: I just want to add one comment. When we had the SEC for years, it was not a great product. It didn't deliver. And here we've redone this product with 6,000 rooms and suites. A casino that you see, the images are spectacular, a redone retail environment with the epicenter of the coat-type strip across from the powerhouse, which is niched with twice the key count. I don't think we couldn't be more excited to get Toyota open and operational. David Beckham will cut the key and tell me over there, hopefully, to do this with him. And I think it's been an extraordinary product. And the rethink of how our products perform in the Cal is open being a very underwhelming product to an overwhelming competitor to, I think, the nation. We just can't wait to get back to Macau and see the impact. The same with the Four Seasons, which is now open. This is quite a product. And I think our future is tied to not the overextending giveaways and promotions, but building great product that the customers in Macau come to. So we couldn't be more. I'm just very excited about the prospects of our new developments in Macau. Look forward to seeing it. Thank you for taking my question.
spk04: Thank you.
spk10: Your last question comes from the line of Sean Kelly with Bank of America. Your line is open.
spk13: Hi, good afternoon, and thanks for squeezing me in. Really just wanted to kind of do two quick follow-ups on topics.
spk10: He got disconnected. He got disconnected.
spk02: We'll deal with Sean since you got dropped off. We'll deal with him directly. That's it. Okay. Thank you. Thanks so much for joining us.
spk06: Mr. John, Mr. Dr. Wong, great thanks for joining the call. We really appreciate it. Great call.
spk10: thank you thank you ladies and gentlemen this concludes today's conference call thank you for participating you may now disconnect
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