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spk04: Good afternoon and welcome to the Molison Company earnings conference call for the fourth quarter of 2021. All participants will be in listen-only mode. Should you need assistance, please signal a conference specialist by pressing the star key followed by zero. After today's presentation, there will be an opportunity to ask questions. To ask a question, you may press star then one on your telephone keypad. To withdraw your question, please press star then two. Please note, this event is being recorded. To begin, I'll turn the call over to Mr. Chet Mandel, Head of Investor Relations. Please go ahead.
spk00: Thank you for joining us for Mollis & Company's full year and fourth quarter 2021 financial results conference call. On the phone today are Ken Mollis, Chairman and CEO, and Joe Simon, Chief Financial Officer. Before we begin, I'd like to note that the remarks made on this call may contain certain forward-looking statements, which are subject to various risks and uncertainties, including those identified from time to time in the risk factor section of Mollis & Company's filings with the SEC. Actual results could differ materially from those currently anticipated. The firm undertakes no obligation to update any forward-looking statements. Our comments today include references to certain adjusted financial measures. We believe these measures, when presented together with comparable gap measures, are useful to investors to compare our results across several periods and to better understand our operating results. The reconciliation of these adjusted financial measures with the relevant GAAP financial information and other information required by Reg G is provided in the firm's earnings release, which can be found on our investor relations website at investors.molus.com. I will now turn the call over to Ken to discuss our results. Ken?
spk07: Thanks, Chet, and good afternoon. 2021 was an outstanding year for Molus & Company, and I'm proud of how we executed this past year and the relentless efforts of our people. Our adjusted full-year 2021 revenues exceeded $1.5 billion, and we're up 65 percent from the prior year's record performance. We grew year over year across all of our products and all regions. Our M&A activity on its own exceeded last year's full total revenues, and we also produced record levels of capital markets and restructuring activity. We achieved a full-year pre-tax margin of 34 percent, which is our highest in history. allowing us to return a significant amount of capital to shareholders. And we now have 16 managing director banker promotes, the largest class in the firm's history. In fact, nearly 50% of our current managing directors have been internally promoted, and we expect this to continue to be a fundamental part of our growth strategy. By being laser focused on internal talent development and differentiating our advisory offering through an integrated one firm approach, we've been able to organically grow our revenues by 20% and earnings per share by 25% on a five-year compounded annual growth rate, while also paying out a total of $21.79 per share in dividends over that same period. I'll now turn the call over to Joe, who will take you through our financial highlights, and then I'll come back and discuss our growth strategy some more. Joe?
spk09: Thanks, Ken. First on revenues during the quarter, our adjusted fourth quarter revenues of $417 million represented our third largest quarter of revenue since inception. The performance during the fourth quarter was driven by continued strength in M&A and capital markets. There were non-GAAP adjustments that reduced revenues during the fourth quarter and full year related to mark-to-market of the firm's equity positions that were taken in lieu of cash to facilitate certain client transactions. Regarding expenses, our adjusted comp expense ratio was 58.5 percent for the full year, down from 59.3 percent in the first nine months and the prior year. For the full year, we reported a non-comp ratio of 8 percent, largely due to continued expense discipline, low levels of travel, partially offset by transaction-related fees associated with increased activity levels. Regarding taxes, Our normalized corporate tax rate for the year was approximately 27%, and our effective tax rate was approximately 23%, driven primarily by the benefit recognized related to the delivery of equity-based compensation at a price above the grant price. Similarly, we should recognize the tax benefit in the first quarter of 2022 related to the annual vesting of RSUs later this month. For purposes of quantifying the excess tax benefit in quarter one, For each dollar difference between the vesting and break-even price of $35 a share, we expect the impact to EPS to be approximately two-thirds of a cent. Regarding capital allocation, we remain committed to returning 100% of our excess capital. With respect to the 2021 performance year, including the dividend declared today, we will have returned approximately $576 million through dividends and share repurchases. And lastly, we continue to maintain a fortress balance sheet with no funded debt. And I'll now turn it back to Ken. Thanks, Joe.
spk07: To summarize, I think there's been a secular shift in M&A. Historically, M&A has been used by companies as a tactic to accelerate growth and to seek cost synergies. And that continues to be the case for many of our most important clients. But now, in addition to that significant client base, global investment institutions have become the fastest growing part of the market. as their primary business is M&A. These businesses must transact and as a result are rapidly expanding and dominating the pace and velocity of M&A. Activity for them spans the globe and is across all sectors. Investment takes place at all stages of a portfolio company's life cycle and at all levels of their capital structure. The breadth of activity and growing size of funds requires these investment institutions to have an advisor who's plugged into their platform. We've been completely aligned with what they require since the founding of the firm 15 years ago. Our advisory offering has become an essential and recurring service to these institutions. As a result, our ability to execute has never been stronger and the market dynamics that contributed to our success in 2021 remain in place. We have a large pipeline today, a larger pipeline today than we've ever had at any time last year. and a significant level of ongoing new business activity. So with that, let's open it up for questions.
spk04: We will now begin the question and answer session. To ask a question, you may press star then 1 on your telephone keypad. If you are using a speakerphone, please pick up your handset before pressing the keys. To withdraw your question, please press star then 2. At this time, we will pause momentarily to assemble our roster. The first question is from Ken Worthington of JP Morgan. Please go ahead.
spk02: Hi, good afternoon. Ken, I think to my question last quarter, I asked about the number of bankers being sort of constant over multiple years, and of course this quarter you show some big growth to 136. You mentioned in, I think, the prepared remarks it was the biggest class of internal promotes that you've supported thus far. Maybe first, what's happening in terms of banker attrition? Is that sort of expected to increase to higher than typical levels as well? And if not, is this more consistent level of senior bankers that we've seen for the past couple of years, is it time for that to sort of break out to new higher levels, given the internal promotes and based on what you're seeing on the attrition side?
spk07: Okay, the answer is yes to that. I actually believe, and I'll get into that, I feel very strongly that we have a great base group of talent now, and we're also in a wonderful position to continue to expand from there. Now, your point, Ken, on attrition, do I think attrition is coming? There's a lot of things we get to see in life. Attrition is always, I get to hear about that at about 4.59 on an afternoon when somebody tells me that they're thinking about that. There's very little insight. But let me say this. You can look at our numbers. The last year was spectacular for us, for our bankers. We run the company extremely efficiently, 8% non-comp. And, you know, look, the numbers are fairly transparent. I think we have an energized, motivated, energetic group of people here. The addition to that, by the way, is that other people can see our platforms. And if I were a banker, I would want to work for a place that lost eight cents to non-comp between the dollar of revenue I took in and the decision of whether to pay comp or put it into pre-tax. After you're non-comp, you have two choices. One, the shareholders got 34% and the bankers got comp. So I believe that where we are, look, we're a fairly young firm in the history of investment banking, but where we are now, is our go-to-market has matched this incredible surge in M&A as a recurring, growing, dynamic primary business, by the way, as well as our strategic. And I think there's a lot of people around the street who would look at it and say, that's where I want to have my career. And I think you'll see both our internal promotes continue to be, well, last year was, I think, unique, but we have great people. I hope it's not unique. And then I think we're in a really good position to attract bankers who want to work as a team and get revenue delivered to the bottom line or to both the top line and the bottom line.
spk02: Got it. Okay. Thank you. And then maybe just to follow up on the outlook for 22, maybe things that are different as we look forward this year versus the last two years. Maybe one, we're in a rising interest rate environment. and two, there seems to be a transition in leadership from growth towards value. You're diversified clearly. Do either of these really change the outlook in the second half of the year, maybe even in 2023, versus the record pipeline, strong environment that you're kind of seeing today and the sponsor-driven environment you know, business that's really, you know, driving some of this, you know, great, great, great activity levels that we're seeing today?
spk07: Yeah, look, I think there's, there's several cross currents going on that are interesting. So we do we have our largest backlog, I believe pipeline ever. And it's interesting, because we probably have one of the lowest backlogs in restructuring. And I think we signal that at the end of the third quarter, really, to us, restructuring is a very visible predictable, it's the most predictable of your businesses, because you usually get hired, and you know, in cases unfold pretty steady over six, nine months, something like that, you know, and a year could be so, but you know what you have. And so we saw that coming down. So very interesting that our M&A backlog has replaced, essentially all of the, I call it missing restructuring, and believe me, restructuring is very light right now. And the ability, there aren't many targets. To your point, rising interest rates might change that, but it has not yet. The other thing that we're seeing, and I think it's very fair to say this, is all of what you just said, Ken, the change from value to growth, interest rates, even some geopolitics probably, has caused an enormous amount of volatility. We started to see that really in maybe second or third week in December. You guys probably can track it better than I, but it immediately started to elongate closures, even in the back half of December, the fourth quarter. And we definitely are seeing that in the first quarter. The pipeline and the activity level is extremely high, but the pace of closures is accordioning out a little bit. You know, it's just taking longer. So everything... that you're working on is just a little harder a little longer a little tougher by the way we don't see any i shouldn't say anything we we don't see a lot dropping out of pipeline we just see it you know the thing you thought would close uh next week is going to close in three weeks or four weeks and um and we're we're seeing that pretty we're seeing that in the first quarter so although our pipeline remains extremely high and every every banker i talk to seems to be almost busier than they were last year, we're definitely seeing pace of closings slow in the first quarter as a result of the volatility, I think.
spk02: Great. Okay. Thank you so much.
spk04: The next question is from Stephen Chuback with Wolf Research. Please go ahead.
spk10: Hey, guys. This is Brendan O'Brien filling in for Stephen. So Margin expansion has been quite substantial since the onset of the pandemic, but with inflation and return to travel putting upward pressure on your cost base as well as peers, how should we be thinking about the sustainability of 30% plus operating margins in an environment where revenue growth is likely not going to be as strong as what we've seen in recent years?
spk07: I think we should be able to sustain, I think travel, Joe and I talk about it, travel's probably, you know, if you went back to pre-COVID, it's probably two or three points. Joe, what do you think?
spk09: Yeah, I mean, we're probably, as of 21, we're 40% of pre-pandemic levels, and we've got 10% more headcount.
spk07: And I don't know that it's going back. So, you know, that won't kill. The leverage in the model is substantial. I think there's more leverage to be had out of the model. I actually believe our customer base that I described in my remarks is a large customer base, and almost everyone has a plan to double their size. I don't listen to all the alternative asset manager calls you do, but I would suspect every single one of them has a plan to double their size, where the fundamental input that they need to, which is the information, the deal flow, the app, the ability to, uh, to, to show transaction flow. So I feel very good about that. And, um, and getting margin out of that, or when you talk about inflation, I, our comp was, um, was on a absolute level was fantastic. You know, that's me talking, by the way, you might have to ask some of the people, but. I believe it was excellent and we hit a 34% pre-tax margin. Now, am I positive we can stay at 34? No, but you gave me 30 as a number. I would very much hope to stay in excess of 30.
spk10: That's great, Collier. Thanks for that, Ken. On capital raising, you guys have obviously had a lot of great success building out that business, but with industry uh issuance slowing meaningfully doing parts of the recent volatility and equity equity markets i was wondering how your outlook for the business has changed and was hoping whether you could give us some color around how meaningful of a contributor capital advisory was to results this past year a couple of markets uh started to uh look we we set out to make it a big
spk07: uh contributor and I think it was if I didn't think it was mid double mid double digits like 15ish percent probably if I had the plus or minus um remember we're not we're not doing the IPO markets we're not doing regular way I in some ways when things get volatile people go to the private markets they structure they go to structured Finance because you're unsure that you know The public markets are based on tremendous confidence. You have to file a document and go out there and distribute shares into the public. If you're uncertain, like at the beginning of COVID, when people were uncertain, it was all structured private. So I'm still very bullish about that. The markets are large. And again, I will tell you, the alternative asset managers are all getting very creative and aggressive in taking down credit money. Really, if you look at most of these alternative asset players and you say, what's substantially different about them from five years ago to today, it would probably be that almost everyone has a credit fund or a credit asset class that's growing significantly, and they want to do interesting things. That's not something where they want to go out and buy a single A-rated bond. They want structure. So I'm really very – I think that'll be great. for a long period of time, that'll be a good business. And lastly, again, to this volatility, you know, when I look back, the volatility always affects things pretty significantly in the short run. But what volatility then makes every corporation do is make decisions. So, you know, COVID, the first three months of COVID was extremely negatively volatile. But then the world woke up, everybody had to make a decision. And we had two years of helping people make decisions about the future of their business and strategy. And it was great, you know, we had a great two years. Even, you know, I go back to maybe even the crisis, it was it was horrible for a, and by the way, we're nowhere near that I don't want to I'm not comparing this volatility we've had over the last eight weeks. But, you know, what happens then is people come back and to the point that Ken might have said, if, if people are revaluing growth and versus different forms of cash flow, you can bet there'll be a lot of decision-making and a lot of focus on strategic go-to-market, and that usually leads to a real upturn in our business. So it's a small price to pay, I think, and capital markets will be part of that. I mean, the short answer is that capital markets will be key to that as well.
spk10: Thanks for taking my questions.
spk04: The next question is from Brennan Hawken with UBS. Please go ahead.
spk06: Good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. Ken, I wanted to dig into your comments on the backlog. I believe you said that it's the biggest backlog in history. Our history. Got it. Curious if, and I know the closing pace you indicated has been slowing, but when we're tracking the public data, the The public announcements have slowed too, and it very much looks like the public pipeline has diminished recently. So included in your backlog, are there deals that you're working on that are unannounced, and therefore there's sort of a double swelling on that front in order to help us reconcile between the two? I know the public is never a perfect proxy, but it's usually kind of directionally close. So how do you square those two different metrics?
spk07: I would encourage you. Look, my problem with that question, Brandon, is everybody always asks me about those, whatever public numbers you look at. And I spend almost no time looking at them because I have our numbers, so I don't spend a lot of time looking at somebody external taking a guess. And I just don't spend any time bridging that. Chet and Joe might be able to help you do that. But, look, there's a lot of things we work on. that are not announced until they're announced. I mean, that is the very essence of public market M&A. We announced a deal yesterday that wasn't announced until this morning. And there would be no sign of that. And so I don't, again, I don't know how to reconcile it other than I know what we have. And I know the activity. I know the bankers are also very much engaged I think what you're seeing is the volatility is causing things to turn a little bit all those conversations. If you and I were trying to, you know, buy each other's company, you know, your stock might have gone down. I mean, if you're in the wrong industry right now, your stock could again have 20% right. And I might feel I should be the beneficiary that you might feel you shouldn't. And we're still actively engaged in trying to make it happen. But you know, we need we need time for price discovery. So Again, I would encourage you, I don't know the answer to how to bridge it. But I'll just tell you what we see on our, you know, on what we're looking at is healthy, you know, as I said, record backlogs. And the amazing part is that's with, I think, I'm not going to say it's near record lows, because I don't know what the lows are. But restructuring is, you know, near record lows.
spk06: Yeah, okay. Uh, thanks for that color. Maybe I can try and approach it from a different direction when we've been analyzing some of the, and this is broad industry data. This isn't about most specifically, but when we're looking at the industry data and some of the trends, some of the announcements, the pace of announcements have certainly slowed, but also interestingly looking at sponsor activity as a percentage of industry volume, you know, that, that really got quite elevated in 2021 up to about 40%. And, here um this year we we've actually seen it start to decline um and it are from your perspective are you seeing um you know maybe the idea that the sponsors are looking out seeing the forward curve show higher financing costs and maybe we're seeing some bid ask spreads widen and there needs to be some time for for that market to settle out or uh Are you seeing something else? Or are you not seeing that trend at all the same trend that I'm seeing in the data?
spk07: Giant market to sit, but that's probably happening. First of all, but that'll get over very quick. I mean, I'm there, you know, again, I go back to the first six or seven weeks of COVID. You know, I went home and I thought, who's ever going to do a deal? Well, private equity went home and thought about what thought about their businesses, let six weeks pass and then came roaring out of the gate. Now we're nowhere near that kind of volatility. I think there may be some some gumbo, you know, we have lots of conversations going on. Their AUM I'm sure is growing. So again, to explain away what happens in any four or five week period, especially when there's volatility, you know, I think it's almost too much to think somebody can explain it. It's volatile. It will cause things to defer. By the way, there are things going on. I even think the pace, you know, when you talk about the pace of closing. So I think sometime in the third or fourth quarter, the SEC started to really kind of slow down the SPAC closing. I think that was almost purposeful on the accounting approvals and things like that. So all those things are in there. Um, And it started at the middle of December, maybe second or third week. And maybe we're coming out of it now. We'll see. But it definitely happened. It was definitely happening over the last eight weeks.
spk06: Okay. This one might be a question for Joe. There's a $7.7 million adjustment. It looks like a reclass from other expense into revenue for unrealized losses. Is that tied to some of the Atlas Crest SPAC activity, Joe?
spk09: I mean, that is part of it. Basically, what we said in the third quarter was that we had these SPACs, and ultimately we took them in lieu of transaction fees, cash. Shares, you said SPACs. Shares, right. I'm sorry, shares. and that we would ultimately reflect those through revenues until we monetize them. So this quarter, we reflected a mark-to-market loss, and that went through revenues, which obviously would have an impact on comp as well.
spk06: Okay. So there was also the part of the $1.3 million adjustment was, it looks like that's related to enforcement of non-compete, but Was there some reversal? Because I know you guys took the comp on the marks initially. Did you then reverse it tied to the 7-7?
spk09: Yeah, exactly what that 7 or so million is about. 7 million was reclassed to revenues, and it was adverse. Got it.
spk06: Okay, that makes sense.
spk04: Thanks a lot. The next question is from Manan Gasalia with Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
spk01: Hi, good afternoon. So, Ken, I heard you on the backlog being low on the restructuring side, but any early signs or thoughts here? You know, we could get several rate hikes in quick succession here, and that's, you know, pretty different from the slow ramp that we saw the last time rates went up from zero. And then, you know, you're sort of starting to see spreads rise a little bit as well, you know, albeit from really tight levels. So I was just wondering, you know, if you're seeing any early signs of activity ramping on the restructuring side. Is it too early to tell? And, you know, do you have any opinion on, like, you know, where it would go as we get towards the end of this year?
spk07: I'd say too early to tell. We're not seeing it. And you do. You have a long – you get a pretty good – well, sometimes you don't. I mean, when things go into, you know, commodity cycles, when the energy cycle hit, you know, it happened quick. right now there's there's not much out there uh you're right at any point you know i know there's a lot of paper in the market and and anything can happen so look i'm not worried about it i think it's i just i just pointed out because it's it's a whole engine on the airplane that is is not you know it's not helping right now but let me tell you if i could hire into our restructuring business. I know how good it is. I know how good our team is. I hope they're getting good sleep. If they're listening to the call, I hope they're getting to bed early, getting some rest, because someday it'll hit. And in the previous cycles, it's very, very busy. And what happens in those cycles is why the business is so good. You just can't, you know, you can't create the people again. People all of a sudden say, oh, there's a restructuring cycle. Let's create a group. You know, it's not creatable in the instant it happens. And so I almost think this is good. There may be some, you know, some retirements, some people who aren't as committed to staying in the business. And I think that that would be great for us. So we are committed. We love the team. And I hope they're resting up for what will inevitably be a cycle.
spk01: Yeah, fair enough. And we did see that sharp ramp up in 2020. And then, you know, maybe a separate question on just the SPAC market here. So there's over 500 SPACs out there looking to find targets. And I think we will start seeing several of them bump up against their expiration dates as we get into the back half of this year. So just with the prospect of rising rates, the market volatility that we're already seeing here, what do you think it means for the SPAC market overall? And how do you see the SPAC activity trending from here as we go towards the end of this year and into 2023?
spk07: I always thought the SPAC market would be extremely volatile because it is an IPO market, and IPO markets go sharply into high gear, and then they go sharply out of favor. I mean, there have been, you know, years where there's no IPO market, and people forget how volatile the IPO market is. And then here, you know, you had a new technology, and you had a lot of non-institutional players try their hand at it. And I think the market for pipes and money is now focused on institutional, you know, doing their transactions with institutional players who they feel comfortable with. I think we're in, obviously, it's a very difficult part of the SPAC market now, but things are getting done. You know, if you have a really good quality product and you price it right, I think you can get something done. But like IPOs during the downturn, you know, I think it's, I wouldn't call it, you know, an attractive, it's not a hot market right now. But I think it's permanent. It will be back. It will professionalize. It will be done better. And it will be very cyclical. And there may be a lot of liquidations. You know, again, I don't track all the, I spend more time with what we're doing than what everybody's doing, but it is possible that there'll be a lot of liquidations.
spk01: Got it. Thank you.
spk04: The next question is from Devin Ryan with JMP Securities. Please go ahead.
spk08: Great. Good evening, Ken and Joe. How are you?
spk07: Great. Good evening, Devin.
spk08: Doing well. I just want to ask a question about average fees and what you guys are seeing. Obviously, you're talking about the sponsors getting a lot more sophisticated, and so they have, even in an M&A transaction, more needs than just kind of the M&A advisory role. So how are you guys playing a part in that? What are the implications on fees? And then as we think about maybe longer term, and I'm talking more on the sponsor side, If we think about portfolio companies roughly doubling over a five-year hold, that implies the deal values 2X what it was previously. Do you see the fee grids, if you will, holding up? These are sophisticated sellers in the sponsor market. So I'm just kind of curious if as we see the deal values hopefully continue to increase over time and sponsors become even a bigger part of the market, is there any compression on fees or do they kind of hold the line? So kind of short-term and long-term view on that.
spk07: Chris, just looking back, our average fees were up pretty nicely. And secondly, I think that's the exact opposite is going to happen. Um, we just spend a second, you know, walk through your your, your, you know, private equity firm XYZ. The reason you want to buy a $2 billion asset that we might have is you think in five years, it's going to be worth 4 billion. And that $2 billion profit goes into a carried interest 20% of those $400 million. The key to the success of your firm isn't getting our fee down from X to Y. I mean, because that doesn't even come out of the $400 million. The key is to get access to that $2 billion company, to get access, be shown it, be in the flow, so that when that company comes and you've trained your whole team in whatever specialty they're in, And they say, they go to committee and say, look, this is an unbelievable asset and, you know, and we want to buy it. So remember, our fee is the difference between, I'm just making this up, you know, $10 million or $15 million fee. It doesn't come out of the $400. It's the difference between $2 billion going to $4 billion or $2 billion going to $3,990,000,000. And then the carry is, you know, the carry comes out of that. So I'd say I'm, I believe the access to our intellectual property, the size and scale, the global integrated nature with which we can deliver unique, difficult to access places to put your capital, it's extremely worth it for them. That's the best part of being a supplier of very rare, super highly charged, valuable information and assets. And so I think, if anything, as these firms double in size and the amount of firms double, the desire to get access to that flow of information, assets, quality deal flow only goes up. And our ability, again, this goes, I know it's hard for anybody to see it, but the fact that we can deliver the one firm and do it across all you know, with that commission structure across the globe and across products, I think we can deliver to that financial institution very well. So I do not see any pressure. And if anything, I would like to try to, you know, extract more value for the quality of the information that we're working our butts off to get to them.
spk08: Got it. Okay. That's great, Keller Kemp. Thanks so much. And then Just to follow up on kind of the conversation on margins, and it kind of stood out that the expectation that margins can kind of remain at these very elevated levels. I appreciate you're not giving guidance that it's going to be 33% every year, but I like the way you guys think about the business as kind of the balance is not just about corporation and non-comp, but the overall margin, and so there's always puts and takes there. But if I think about just this kind of concept that non-comp expenses probably going up in the absolute and travels coming back you think about Martin just even if you were to think about margins remaining flattish or remaining particularly elevated is is the leverage going to come from as revenues grow from non comps or already see kind of leverage from here on the comp ratio you had a great year and you need to were able to deliver three thirty three percent margin so you people were paid well but I'm curious if there's any leverage I guess still in the system on the comp side as well?
spk07: I wouldn't look to it. What I would look to is the leverages in the revenue side. The 34% margin wasn't for me going after comp ratio. We just felt it was optimal the way we did it. The leverage came from all of our bankers taking that last phone call on December 15th and still executing transactions Because I wasn't going to take it out. You know, I wasn't going to say enough and stop work. You know, by the way, you'd be amazed. People understand that if they cap out and the last deal is not for them, you know, people work. They get motivated. So all the leverage, and I think there might be more, is in the revenue lines. And you saw it getting our non-comp down 8%. I mean, I never thought I'd see a number like that. I didn't know that was possible. That wasn't because I am a master of cost cutting. That was because the revenue was high. And if we're good at the technology, you know, we were talking about travel. Well, maybe travel is a revenue generator. Maybe now, you know, the base business is done via Zoom, the drafting and the commodity stuff. And maybe we're going to get another kick up because once we start traveling and meeting clients, the travel is actually an incremental revenue generator, not just a cost generator, if you follow. I think there may be a new way to do business, which is commodity stuff. Execution is done on the computer, and most of travel is for generation and relationship. But that's all I'll say is all of this is a result of the revenue. And when you start getting production throughout the system and integrate, you know, we were even talking about the, you know, I was joking a little about the restructuring team. We already have them doing other things because we're one firm and one integrated effort. And that's the key is to have revenue and relationships come out of every part of the organization. So, again, it's the revenue line that will generate the margins.
spk08: Okay, great. Just real quick for the model for Joe. Sorry if I missed this, but the fourth quarter ending MD headcount, is that 120 if we just make the adjustment for the internal promotes? Or just if you have that number, that would be helpful. I think with the internal promotes, we're at 136. As of year end, sorry, or as of right now? I guess we're just trying to plug in for the year end. As of right now. But if you need year-end, I'm sure a check can help you. Got it. Okay. That's fine. Thanks so much. I appreciate it.
spk07: Yeah, Devin, as of right now, by the way.
spk04: The next question is from James Yarrow with Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.
spk05: Thanks for taking my questions. So maybe you could just speak geographically to the strength of the M&A environment, and specifically whether you're seeing activity remain robust in the U.S., and then what the environment looks like in Europe.
spk07: You know, we said we were actually up every single geography, which is stunning. The U.S. is definitely – and again, I'm going to hold back again on this, you know, sort of near-term volatility. I'm just going to give you what I see on the rolling on a 12-month view. Europe is definitely – up and exciting. And by the way, because Europe is also starting to go to the same model, I think you're starting to see a real recurring client base, much, much more significant than it ever was much more diverse in in sponsors and middle markets. So you have the big strategics, which Europe always had. And I think they're developing a much more recurring sponsor in diverse sponsor model. Uh, interesting Asia was pretty good. Uh, episodic of course. Uh, but we had some, uh, some pretty good China, Hong Kong, Asia business. Um, we, we had, uh, our office in Brazil had a very good year. Um, you know, I'm going through our offices. Our, our Middle East officer is on fire. I think every thing we, you know, in the Middle East, we just seem to be, um, you know, win a lot and do a lot in the Middle East. That's a fantastic franchise for us. And even India, which, you know, has ups and downs, had a very good year. And that might be the only economy right now. You know, I don't off the top of my head know if next year looks as good. But, you know, everything feels like it's a continuity from that trend.
spk09: Yeah, and we're going to be issuing our 10K in a couple of weeks. And I think you'll see that the non-U.S. entities basically rode the same wave as U.S. So the contribution to revenues has been around 15% for the last several years, and it was still 15% in 21.
spk05: Okay, that's extremely helpful. And then I just had one other one, which is, you know, you've seen tremendous growth in revenue over the past few years. but you still only disclose one revenue line. Do you think there's a scale your business will reach at some point at which you might disclose a little bit more granularity across the various business lines? And if so, how would you sort of think about that?
spk07: I'm going to give that to Joe as a financial question. In my mind, we run one business. We work as a team.
spk09: Yeah, I think that's exactly right. We've always... We always think about it that way, and the way the teams work, it's that way, that an M&A, a restructuring, a capital markets, it's like there's a continuum, and it would be very difficult to start parsing that and start allocating it, and I don't think it would be real, and I don't think it would be particularly useful internally to try and start mashing up and crediting various
spk06: product areas because it's not how we work and it's not how we're organized okay thanks a lot the next question is a follow-up from brendan hawkin with ubs please go ahead hey thanks for taking my follow-up i i just wanted i think you know devin was kind of poking around in this direction and i i'm kind of curious about it um The range of compensation ratios initially was 57 to 59. This is an epic year for revenue, great leverage and whatnot, and a lot of attention to the pre-tax margin. But this T&E, low T&E is going to go away to some degree and whatnot. So why wouldn't in a year like this we go to the lower end of the comp range, particularly given – how can you spend a lot of time talking about how it's not a commission model and, and it's, you know, it's, it's not prescript, prescriptive like that. Wouldn't, wouldn't the, what draws people to the platform not be that extra point of comp ratio, but rather the revenue opportunity to generate.
spk07: Well, you know, you came up with a range, but we, I mean, we were at 59 three and went to 58 five. Look, I will say this, uh, We manage the company. We don't have like a Microsoft Excel screen and put these numbers in and out pops a number. We think this was optimal. And by the way, I've never felt better about being optimal. What am I trying to do? It would be like if you hold a hotel and you go, well, why don't you just pay your shareholders more? Why do you refurb the rooms? Why do the rooms really need a new – why do that? I mean, you could do that every eighth year. Does anybody – It's like asking, you know, why don't we stick to some modular thing? I will tell you that the reason I am so excited about the future is our people are motivated. They're enthused. They feel great about working here. Our junior people are, you know, are heroic in what they've accomplished, and we treated them such. This was an optimal way to make this franchise on February, what day is this? February 9th. the reason we did it is because it optimized the value of this franchise on february 9th for the next five to ten years now we can debate that because there's no scientific formula that says that but myself the board of directors and the executive team came to that conclusion and i believe it now and and um and and i'd much rather be at a firm that optimized the way i just did it than tried to to They did it a different way. And I think hopefully all our shareholders will be the benefit of that decision.
spk06: Okay.
spk04: Thanks for taking my follow-up. The next question is from Michael Brown with KBW. Please go ahead.
spk11: Great. Thanks for taking my question. Yeah, Ken, I was just looking at the promotional class, and great to see a broad base of sectors and capabilities represented there. When we think about the next leg of growth, where is that white space for you now? It's obviously, as you've gotten larger, it becomes less obvious from us on the outside. So I'd love to hear a little bit more about that. And then you also flag a strong pipeline of internal and external talent. How does that pipeline compare to last year, if you could just give us a frame of reference there?
spk07: Okay, well, it's sort of embarrassing because you're in my seat. I look down and all I see is white space. I can name, you know, two or three of the largest sectors for fees and we should be much bigger or better. I mean, it's extraordinary to me what we haven't done. By the way, you know, I know there's a billion five revenue and I go, right, it's a lot of revenue. Then I look and I see the The substantial sectors that have huge market shares. And look, they're out there. I mean, we could be, just to pick one, look, we could still do a lot more in tech. It's a gigantic feed pool. We have a great team. I like what we do, but we could do more. And then there are other tremendous ones like that. And I don't want to signal them out. But from inside, I've seen more white space than I see blocked space by far. So I don't worry about that. Sorry, what was the second part of the question?
spk11: Just the talent pipeline. You mentioned that it's, in the press release, it's a strong, at a very strong level. Just wanted to get a frame of reference out of that compared to, say, last year.
spk07: Higher. I mean, we're definitely higher than last year and much more skewed to M&A, as I said. And again, to your point about our young talent, and the up-and-comers, you're right about one thing. I think we don't even see these things coming. I mean, you know, if you would have told me, Ken, who's your banker in the metaverse two years ago, I would have asked you to spell that. So I think you're seeing, you know, what we ended up doing in places like online gaming. It's some of these things where new industries are being created all the time. You're right. And that's the brilliant part of having these young, energetic people who are finding their own sectors and niches and places where you and I might not even know there's an opportunity in the next three to five years and they know it and it's not top down. I'm not hiring a banker. See, that's the difference. I'm not going out and finding a 50-year-old banker in that space. What's happening is the young people that we're hiring out of school are coming in the middle of it saying, hey, I think there's a huge opportunity here. Can I attack that space? And that's really refreshing, and it will lead to a lot more value creation, and it's bottoms up. So that's the excitement of having the internal talent promotion grabbing new sectors and market shares that they see way before I would.
spk11: Okay, great. I appreciate that, Ken. And then just a quick one for Joe. You know, I heard the commentary on the tax rate for the first quarter and always appreciate that color in terms of the impact of the share based comp. You know, the tax rate was high this quarter. Apologies if I missed it. What was the key driver there? And then after the first quarter, where should we expect the tax rate to be? Just kind of fall back to where it has been historically?
spk09: So I would answer the second part. I would expect it to be at or around the 27 level now. I think there's two items that are primarily affecting it. One is an increase in the non-deductible expenses. And the other one is really what we were talking about earlier is the increase in income coming from outside of the U.S. In some cases, it relates to income earned in higher rate jurisdictions. And in other cases, the income earned is subject to foreign tax credit limitations. And so that combination basically has given rise to a little bit of rate creep.
spk11: Okay, got it. Thanks for that, Collar. Thank you both. Sure.
spk04: This concludes our question and answer session. I would like to turn the conference back over to Ken Mullis for any closing remarks.
spk07: Thank you all. I appreciate your time, and we'll see you after the first quarter.
spk04: The conference is now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.
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