Noah Holdings Limited

Good day, and welcome to the NOAA fourth quarter and full year 2024 earnings conference call. All participants will be in a listen-only mode. Should you need assistance, please signal a conference specialist by pressing the star key followed by zero. After today's presentation, there will be an opportunity to ask questions. To ask a question, you may press star, then one on a touch-tone phone. To withdraw your question, please press star, then two. Please note this event is being recorded. I would now like to turn the conference over to Melo Shi, Senior Director. Please go ahead.

Thank you, operator. Good morning and welcome to NOAA's fourth quarter and full year 2024 earnings conference call. Joining me today on the call are Ms. Wang Jingbo, our co-founder and chairlady, Mr. Xander Ng, our co-founder, director, and CEO, and Mr. Grant Pan, our CFO. Mr. Yin will begin with an overview of our recent business highlights, followed by Mr. Pan, who will discuss our financial and operational results. You'll all be available to take your questions in the Q&A session that follows. Starting this quarter, we'll begin disclosing net revenues for each domestic and overseas business unit to better reflect the organizational restructuring we have undergone and provide a clearer understanding of the financial performance and strategic process progress each unit has made. Domestically, we've broken down revenue into domestic public securities under NOAA Upright, domestic asset management under Gopher Asset Management, and domestic insurance brokerage under Glory. Overseas businesses have been broken down into overseas wealth management under ARC Private Wealth, overseas asset management under Olive Asset Management, and oversees insurance and comprehensive services under Glory Family Heritage. In addition, please note that the discussion today will contain forward-looking statements that are subject to risks and uncertainties that may cause actual results to differ materially from those in our forward-looking statements. Potential risks and uncertainties include but are not limited to those outlined in our public findings with the SEC and the Hong Kong Stock Exchange. NOAA does not undertake any obligation to update any forward-looking statements, except as required under applicable law. With that, I would like to pass the call over to Mr. Yin.

Thank you, Melo. Good morning, investors and analysts of NOAA. I will share with you the agenda of today's phone conference, which is a summary of the overall market situation and NOAA's business results in 2024. Next, we will talk about the performance of foreign and domestic business development strategies and division blocks. Finally, we will report on the plans for 2025. 2024 is a challenge for us, but it is also full of opportunities. The challenge is the low price of the customer investment hospital brought by the macroeconomic situation. The opportunity is due to the change of major organizations and businesses when the market is not good. Opportunity costs are relatively controllable. In 2024, we firmly promoted the change of the organization in the domestic sales team, and did the branching business fully according to the requirements of supervision. Noya Formation, Gefei Wealth, and Glory Insurance Economy have all completed the organization of independent sales teams and achieved the completion of the end-to-end business. In addition, we firmly promote the construction of new financial teams in Hong Kong, Singapore, the United States, and other places. to recruit and train sales teams. At the same time, in the insurance business, we can start to build a team of top-notch managers. After 2024, these strategies have begun to show good results. 2024 is a year full of challenges. But as managers, we are also full of confidence. After 2024, We felt once again that our business model is very resilient. The cash flow is strong, and the security barrier is relatively high. Currently, we are in the early stages of building an outdoor sales system. It may take a while for it to grow significantly, but I have already felt the momentum of the early days of entrepreneurship. And this time, it is a double-edged sword between indoor and outdoor business. and the ability to serve customers around the world.

Good morning to everyone joining us today. During today's call, I'll provide a summary of overall market conditions and our results for 2024, before diving into strategies and performance of each overseas and domestic business unit. I'll then outline our priorities and outlook for 2025. 2024 was a year of both challenges and opportunities. The challenges arose from subdued client sentiment due to macroeconomic conditions. This, however, created an opportunity to implement necessary organizational restructuring at a time when associated opportunity costs were relatively low in the challenging market environment. Throughout the year, we made significant progress in restructuring our domestic sales team to fully comply with the evolving regulatory requirements. As a result, sales teams from NOAA Upright, Gopher Asset Management, and Glory have now been separated into independent and licensed business units, creating a seamless end-to-end business model. Overseas, we'll also continue to recruit and expand our team of relationship managers in Hong Kong and Singapore, as well as the anticipated hiring in the United States and other locations. We also launched a commission-only agent model for our insurance businesses and began building this team from the ground up. By the end of 2024, these initiatives have already begun to yield promising results. Despite a challenging year, we remain confident in the resilience of our business model and the robust safety margin from the strong cash flow it generates. While our overseas expansion efforts are still in their early stages and will take time to scale significantly, I can already sense a momentum and excitement reminiscent of founding NOAA 20 years ago. This time, however, we're pursuing growth on two fronts, mainland China and international markets. Our ability to manage risk effectively while serving clients globally will position us well for future growth.

2024年全年实现净收入26亿人民币 It is a reduction of 21.1%. It is mainly due to the slowdown in the insurance economy in China and the reduction in the management fee of the product management fee in the private market in China. The overall net gap of the group is 5.5 billion RMB, which is a 46% decline. There are two main reasons. One is the reduction in the number of points in China, from 40 cities to 11 cities. The current The one-time processing cost is relatively high, but the follow-up will bring the optimization of fixed cost savings and management leverage. In terms of 20 taxes, in 2024, the actual tax rate has been increased to 31.5%. In mainland China, we have located all sales teams in different branches. Under the supervision background of strict branching and independent management, we have achieved 100% branching and independent management. However, this will inevitably lead to a decrease in sales efficiency in the short term. In terms of investment product strategy, in 2024, we will mainly focus on QDI, QDLP, and other people-based assets such as ETFs. The income of this type of product is relatively low, but customers have received good returns in 2024. In the domestic insurance section, we will fully adjust to the products of the same kind. The change in the product structure is the main reason for the decline in performance in China. In terms of operation and cost control, China retains the core city and core most outstanding financial system in China. It has cut off most of the city network points, saved fixed expenses, and reduced the cost of return, strengthening the ability of the online industry. In the fourth quarter, the second-tier market in mainland China is warming up. Our RMB private capital second-tier products have a net growth of more than 200%. The market share of public products has increased by 36.8% per quarter. We can see that when the market changes, we still have the ability to transform it. In terms of overseas, in 2024, we launched three new overseas brands, Arc, Olive and Glory, to explore the local Chinese customer service opportunities in the new market. Currently, we have 138 foreign customers in Hong Kong and Singapore. 我们会继续扩大理财师队伍,并在美国、日本、加拿大等高净值华人聚集的境外市场构建当地的销售团队。 2024年,我们在境内和境外保险经济端开始建设无底薪经纪人队伍,目前已经达到近100人,目标在2025年大幅扩大这支队伍。 Our core team is now very excited. It feels like when Noya just started its business in 2005, we saw the vast space of the foreign Chinese financial management market. We will firmly invest resources to open up the foreign market with new brands and new teams. This process takes time and patience. We are confident that in the long term, we will build Noya into the first financial management platform selected by Chinese customers around the world. Four-year net revenues with RMB $2.6 billion.

an year-over-year decrease of 21.1%, primarily due to decreases in distribution of domestic and overseas insurance products, as well as recurring service fees from domestic private equity products. Non-GAAP net income for the year fell 46% to RMB $550 million, mainly due to two factors. is the upfront restructuring costs associated with reducing our domestic network from 44 cities to 11 cities, which will reduce long-term fixed costs and improve operational efficiency. Secondly, in terms of taxation, the effective tax rate increased to 31.5% in 2024. Domestically, we've restructured our sales team into fully independent and licensed business units to comply with the evolving regulatory requirements. While this temporarily impacted sales efficiency, it has laid a solid foundation for future growth. On the product side, we prioritized global RMB-denominated ETFs, QDII, and QDLP products, which generated solid returns for clients in 2024, despite the lower fee rate. Additionally, we shifted our insurance offerings towards medical and elderly care products tailored to long-term client needs. Operationally, we consolidated our presence in core cities while retaining the most outstanding relationship managers. This allows us to reduce face costs and compliance expenses while enhancing online capabilities. In the fourth quarter, the market rally in China drove demand for private secondary products of which the transaction value increased 200% sequentially, and revenues from public security products increased 36.8% sequentially, demonstrating our ability to capitalize on opportunity during market upturns. We launched new internationally focused brands in 2024, Ark, Aulis, and Glory Family Heritage. Together, these brands will lead our efforts overseas to serve both existing and new clients. We currently have 138 overseas relationship managers based in Hong Kong and Singapore, and we'll continue to expand this team as we explore opportunities in other markets with significantly underserved Mandarin-speaking communities, such as the US, Japan, and Canada. We also began building a commission-based overseas and domestic insurance sales team, which has expanded to nearly 100 people, with the goal of growing further as we head into 2025. Our core management team is very excited about the vast opportunities that the overseas Mandarin-speaking wealth management market presents. It feels very much like the early days of founding NOAA in 2005. We will continue to invest in expanding our overseas presence and build out our team to support it. This is a costly process that requires time and patience to ramp up, but we are confident that in the long run, it will position us as the preferred wealth management platform for global Mandarin-speaking clients. I will now drive into the performance operations of each business unit. I'll let our CFO, Grant Pan, go deeper into the group's consolidated financial performance later.

In terms of foreign brands and strengths, in 2024, we launched three new foreign brands, Arc, Olive, and Glory, and completed the preparation work of the Japanese office. We opened business points in Canada and Southeast Asia. The goal is to expand overseas local Chinese customers through international strengths. In 2024, foreign business revenue increased by 12.5 billion yuan, from 44% to 48% in the group's revenue ratio, and from 68% to 89% in the group's new business revenue ratio. Foreign investment product business has increased significantly. Foreign first-tier products and second-tier private property products with no cash management have achieved the same growth of 45% and 22% per year. With ARK's foreign financial management, we have positioned Hong Kong, Singapore, and the United States as three foreign working centers. At the same time, we are expanding the new market in Southeast Asia, Japan, Canada, and other foreign countries. At the same time, we are serving a large number of customers and expanding our local customers. In 2024, the total annual income will be 6.7 billion yuan. By the end of the fourth quarter of 2024, We have 138 foreign investors, with a growth of 55.1%. The foreign AUA, which includes retail products, has reached $8.7 billion, with a growth of 4.6%. By the end of the fourth quarter, ARK has registered more than 17,600 customers worldwide, with an increase of 18.3%. Hong Kong's number of customers reached 17,360. The total growth rate is 17.1%. The number of households in Singapore is 789. The total growth rate is 111%. In 2024, the number of active and high-quality customers outside the country is 5,544. The total growth rate is 15.8%. The total revenue is 43.3 billion dollars. The total growth rate is 29.8%. At the top of the line, our online fund, IARC, In addition to the continuous improvement of functions and user experience of the Hong Kong app, it has also achieved the localization operation of the Singapore app. The price of online products is gradually increasing, and the online sales of entry-level products has been self-sustaining. All year round, foreign cash management products have achieved a net profit of US$3.2 billion, which has been increased by 31%. In the process of expanding business abroad, cross-border online services have become more and more important. The ongoing online capability of Hangsha's foreign business will also be our next focus. Next, let's talk about the O6 foreign asset management version. In 2024, the annual net income of 4.4 billion yuan will be achieved. Over the past two years, we have greatly improved the competitiveness of foreign products and goods in the first-class market. and established the U.S. Product Center, making our private sector products not inferior to foreign private companies. In 2024, U.S. private sector products totaled $6.6 billion, which significantly increased by 44.9%. In terms of secondary market and hedge funds, we also increased the cooperation and coverage of global top managers. gradually enriches the category and strategy of structuralized products. In 2024, the total amount of 2.4 billion US dollars of capital for capital-based and structuralized investment in capital-based and structuralized investment in capital-based and structuralized investment in capital-based and structuralized investment in capital-based and structuralized investment in capital-based and structuralized investment in capital-based and structuralized investment in the same as 15.1% growth. The total AOM ratio also increased from 23.3% to 28.1%. In addition, AOM, a first-class market fund with private equity, reached $450 million, which increased by 18.5%. In terms of the comprehensive service version of Glory Family Heritage, in 2024, the annual income will be $1.4 billion. Without considering the internal income division, In 2024, the overall income of foreign insurance products was $5 billion, down by 21.9%. The Hong Kong insurance market is competitive. At the product end, Glory's average standard cost of insurance customers per year has increased by 30%. At the same time, we actively explore new marketing models by building a new sales team by setting up a team of top-notch managers. At the end of the year, Glaury recruited 50 undisputed insurance self-employed agents. More than one-third of the agents contributed to the performance. Glaury's goal was to set up a 150-person undisputed self-employed agent team in front of the end of 2025 to significantly expand and bring in new students.

We launched a new internationally focused brand in 2024, Art Wealth Management, Olive Asset Management, and Glory Family Heritage. We also established an office in Japan and initiated pilot programs in Canada and Southeast Asia to better serve Mandarin-speaking communities in these markets. Net revenues from overseas for 2024 were RMB 1.3 billion, accounting for 48% of total net revenues, up from 44% last year. Its proportion in the group's newly generated business rose from 86% from last year to 89% this year. Overseas investment products performed particularly well with transaction value of overseas primary and private secondary products, excluding cash management products, growing 45% and 22%, respectively, year over year. ARK Wealth Management will use Hong Kong, Singapore, and the United States as three primary booking centers to serve existing clients and engaging with new ones in markets such as Southeast Asia, Japan, and Canada. Net revenues from overseas wealth management through ARK for 2024 will RMB $675 million. As of the end of the fourth quarter, we had 138 overseas relationship managers, up 55.1% from last year. Overseas AUAs, including externally managed products, reached US$8.7 billion, a year-over-year increase of 4.6%. ARC Wealth Management had over 17,600 registered clients worldwide in the fourth quarter, an increase of 18.3% year-on-year. Among them, the number of accounts opened in Hong Kong reached 17,360, a year-on-year increase of 17.1%, while the number of accounts opened in Singapore reached 789, a year-on-year increase of 111%. For the full year, the number of active overseas clients reached 5,544, a year-on-year increase of 15.8%, with overseas transaction values hitting USD 4.3 billion, a year-on-year increase of 29.8%. In addition to continuously improving the functionality and user experience of IR Hong Kong, our online wealth management platform, we also launched a localized Singapore version of the platform during the year. Our online product selection continues to gradually grow with a comprehensive online offering of entry-level products. Four-year transaction value of overseas cash management products was US $3.2 billion, a year-over-year increase of 31%. As we continue to expand globally, comprehensive across regional online services have become critical as we continue to invest in strengthening these capabilities going forward. In terms of overseas asset management, net revenues were RMB 439 million in 2024. Over the past two years, we have significantly enhanced the competitiveness of our overseas primary market product portfolio through our established U.S. product centers. Our private market products now rival those of leading global private banks. Notably, we raised U.S. dollars $663 million for overseas private equity, private credit, and other primary market funds in 2024, a significant 44.9% year-on-year increase. In the public market and hedge funds space, we expanded the ecosystem we have built with reputable reputable products and investment partners globally, allowing us to differ clients a rapidly growing selection of high-quality and exclusive alternative investment opportunities. In 2024, the aggregate transaction value of alternative public market products, including hedge funds and structured products, reached US$236 million, a year-on-year increase of 22.1%, including term deposits The aggregate value of private secondary products distributed was US dollar 1.5 billion, a year-on-year increase of 1.9%. As of the end of the fourth quarter, overseas AUM reached US dollar 5.8 billion, a year-on-year increase of 15.1%, accounting for 28.1% of the total AUM, up from 23.3% during the same period last year. AUM for overseas private market products reached U.S. dollar 4.5 billion, a year-on-year increase of 18.5%. In terms of the overseas insurance and comprehensive services, full year-on-year revenues was RMB 140 million RMB. Before internal transfer pricing, revenue from overseas insurance products during the year was RMB 502 million, a year-on-year decrease of 21.9%. The Hong Kong insurance market remained highly competitive. On the product side, Glory's average premium increased by 30% throughout the year. We continue to actively explore new marketing models and are building a sales team from the ground up with commission-only agents. By the end of the year, Glory had already onboarded 50 commission-only agents overseas, with more than one-third of them already contributing to revenue. Our target is to build this team to approximately 150 agents in the overseas market by the end of 2025 to drive new client acquisitions.

In terms of the domestic market, we have complied with the requirements of market supervision to collect data and people, and effectively reduce costs. As of 2024, we have followed the sales model of the branch business. The sales team is fully independent. In 2024, the net income of the domestic business contributed 13.5 billion yuan, which is 27.5% lower than before. This is mainly due to the lack of new business due to the impact of the market environment. The management fee for products such as renminbi investment and the decline in domestic insurance product revenue. NOEA's fund sales company achieved a total revenue of 4.9 billion yuan in the whole year. In 2024, the total revenue of the RMB public fund reached 25.6 billion yuan, with a decline of 35.3%. The total revenue of RMB private securities reached 5.4 billion yuan, with a decline of 31.1%. Mainly, the market environment in the first three seasons Causing the client's investment mood to be low. From the beginning of the fourth quarter, the A-currency and Hong Kong-currency markets were strong. In the fourth quarter of 2024, the company's revenue of RMB private second-tier products increased by more than 200%. For the strategy of the domestic second-tier market business, our strategy is the online and offline combination of business models. For high-tech clients, we provide a fund combination solution with RMB for global assets. In 2024, Gefei's asset version will achieve a total income of 7.7 billion yuan. Gefei's investment team will continue to promote the issuance and distribution of mass assets in the first-class market. In 2024, the issuance of assets in the first-class market will exceed 75 billion yuan. It will increase by 11.1% compared to 2023. Due to the lack of new revenue, mass products will gradually reduce management fees. In the next three years, will cause a certain impact on the overall income growth of the group. Our response strategy is to continue to increase the size of overseas investment products. In order to reduce the impact of the decline in the size of internal program management fees, our goal is to achieve an AUA of nearly $2 billion in the next three to five years. In terms of the secondary market, the private products managed by Gefei are mainly It focuses on using RMB assets to obtain global market beta profits through cross-border ETFs. During the fourth quarter of the product series, it achieved a target size of 0.9 billion yuan. The total target size of the whole year reached 200 million yuan. The domestic insurance and economic version achieved a net income of about 43 million yuan throughout the year. Basically, it is in the state of dealing with it. The main reason is that we are adjusting the product direction and re-establishing the sales team. In 2024, we will add 42 new bottomless managers. We expect to increase the sales volume for a period of time. In 2025, it is our main strategy to build a bottomless manager team. In terms of products, we focus on medical and nursing products that meet the needs of entrepreneurs. Domestically, we adapted our business to evolving regulatory requirements.

reducing headcounts and coverage across China to drive down fixed costs. We also streamlined operations of each independent and licensed business unit. Our domestic and overseas team are now fully independent. Net revenues from mainland China in total were RMB 1.4 billion in 2024, a year-on-year decrease of 27.5%, primarily due to a subdued market environment generating fewer new business opportunities and decreases in revenue from distribution of domestic insurance products and also the recurrent service fees from private equity products. Net revenues from domestic public security was RMB 487 million in 2024. During the year, the aggregate value of RMB public securities products distributed reached RMB 25.6 billion, a year-on-year decrease of 35%, while private secondary products reached RMB 5.4 billion, a year-on-year decrease of 31%, mainly due to the weak investor sentiment and the sluggish market environment during the first three quarters of the year. Starting the fourth quarter, however, the A share and Hong Kong stock market rebounded, driving a 200% sequential increase in RMB private secondary products. Our domestic public security business strategy will integrate an online and offline business model that will provide clients with global asset allocation solutions denominated in RMB. In terms of asset management, net revenues from domestic asset management was RMB 772 million during the year. Gopher's team continued to focus on managing exits in the primary market. During the year, it achieved over RMB $7.5 billion in primary market exits, an increase of 11% compared with the previous year. Due to the lack of new fundraising, we are facing a declining management fee base as products expire, which is expected to impact our overall revenue growth in the next three years. In response, we will continue to grow the scale of overseas investment product distribution to offset the expected decline in domestic management fees. Our goal is to grow overseas AUA to U.S. $20 billion over the next three to five years. In the public market, private secondary products managed by Gopher mainly focus on beta returns from global markets through cross-border RMB denominated ETFs. The aggregate transaction value of this was RMB 93 million during the fourth quarter, with a cumulative value of 197 million for the whole year. In terms of insurance brokerage business, net revenues from domestic insurance through Glory had a new low of RMB 43 million during the year. primarily due to adjustments we made to the product mix and the restructure of a sales team. We onboarded 42 commission-only agents during the year, but their ramp-up in sales volume will take more time. As we head into 2025, the recruitment of commission-only agents teams will be our main priority. Glory's product focus has been adjusted towards medical and elderly care products. that meets the long-term needs of first-generation entrepreneurs, but the demand is less urgent for immediate allocation, meaning it will take more time to scale.

Looking back at 2024, our main experience is the change in the domestic sales team, the financial system entering each branch, and the construction of new sales teams abroad. In the next few years, we will focus on resources in both domestic and foreign markets. In 2025, NOEA will continue to work in the following directions. First, we will stick to the balance of quality and quantity. We will stick to the comprehensive harmonious work in different countries and regions. Second, we will build and expand the team of financiers in the areas and countries of the working center. 3. 保险经纪公司建设无底薪的经纪人的销售队伍 4. 优化全球投资和资产配置的方案 为客户提供更加具有竞争力的投资产品组合和资产配置方案 5. 持续提升在线服务的客户能力 最后 董事会已经批准2024年股息和特别股息5.5亿元人民币 Looking back at 2024, our primary focus domestically was on restructuring our domestic sales team, separating each of them into independent and licensed business units.

Overseas-wise, it was building out our team of relationship managers. In the next few years, our priority will be acquiring new clients, both domestically and overseas. Looking forward, our priorities for 2025 will be squarely on, first, ensuring full compliance with regulatory standards in all regions where we operate, prioritizing both the quality and quantity of our growth. Secondly, Expanding our team of overseas RMs in the regions and countries where we have established booking centers. Thirdly, expanding our team of commission-only agents for our domestic and overseas insurance brokerage business. Fourthly, optimizing global investment and asset allocation solutions to provide clients with more competitive investment portfolios and asset allocation strategies. And lastly, improving technology system to better serve clients online. In the last, the Board of Directors have already approved an annual and special dividend, which together amount to RMB 550 million, which is equivalent to 100% of our non-GAAP net income for the year. This complements our continued execution of our share repurchase program. I would now like to turn the call over to Grant to go over our financials in more detail. Thank you all.

That's my welcome. And thank you, Xander. And greetings to everyone joining us today. Throughout 2024, sluggish macroeconomic environments, increasingly stringent regulatory requirements, and shifting client preferences created significant headwinds for the wealth management industry. This challenging environment impacted our financial results during the year, with both full-year revenue and net income falling from last year. But with these challenges continue to impact short-term performance, as Xander has mentioned, our business remains profitable and continues to generate solid cash flows. This presented opportunities for undertaking our organizational restructuring domestically and investing our overseas expansion to reposition ourselves for long-term sustainable growth, while market sentiment was subdued. Building out new sales teams and infrastructure domestically and overseas is an expensive process. It will take time to ramp up before it begins to meaningfully improve our performance. While we expect near-term pressure on our business to remain, these foundational changes will position us for sustainable growth. It's already beginning to yield results for our financials in 2024, reflecting the progress we have made in expanding our portfolio of overseas alternative investment products. Additionally, we were ideally positioned to capitalize on the strong recovery of domestic capital markets, starting in late September, which drove strong demand for RMB to dominate the secondary products. and partially offset the decline in revenue from private equity products . Okay, so let's get into the details of financials. Total net revenues were RMB 652 million during this quarter, down 18.5% year-over-year and 4.6% sequentially. Total net revenues for the year were RMB 2.6 billion, down 21.1% year-over-year. Notably, overseas net revenue reached RMB 1.3 billion in 2024, accounting for 48.8 or 1% of total net revenues, up from 43.5% in last year. By region, domestic net revenues during the fourth quarter increased 18%, sequentially to RMB 362 million, driven primarily by a more than 200% surge in distribution of RMB-denominated private secondary products. However, full-year domestic revenues declined by 27.5% year-over-year, primarily due to significant swap in revenue from domestic insurance products and recurring service fees from RMB-denominated private equity products amid the challenging macroeconomic environment. Net revenues from overseas during the fourth quarter decreased by over 20% year-over-year and sequentially over 12% for the full year. This was mainly due to decreased distribution of overseas insurance products amid fierce competition in Hong Kong's insurance market and significant sequential fluctuations. If we exclude insurance products, revenue from overseas investment products actually grew during the quarter and year on a year-over-year basis, reflecting the progress we have made in spending our alternative investment offerings. By revenue type, during the quarter, one-time commissions decreased by 56.1% year-over-year and 23.2% sequentially, primarily due to a decrease in distribution of insurance funds, both domestically and overseas. Recurring service fees increased 4.4% sequentially, with declines in RMB-denominated private equity products partially offset by gains in RMB-denominated private secondary products. Performance-based income surged by over 300% year-over-year, driven by the recovery in onshore markets with RMB-denominated private secondary products, contributing nearly RMB 30 million to performance-based income. Total transaction values in the fourth quarter was RMB 16.3 billion, slightly down 1.7% year-over-year, but up 14% sequentially. Transaction value of domestic private secondary products was RMB 2.5 billion during this quarter, a significant increase of over 200% sequentially, while overseas investment products was U.S. dollar 964 million, a 16.4% year-over-year increase. The transaction values of U.S. dollar denominated products reached U.S. dollar 4.3 billion, up nearly 30% year-over-year, and accounting for 48.8% of total transaction value in 2024, comparing to only 32.1% in last year. Benefiting from the enhanced competitiveness of the overseas alternative investment product portfolio, U.S. dollar private equity products totaled U.S. dollars $663 million, up 44.9% year over year. And U.S. dollar private secondary products, excluding cash management products, totaled U.S. dollars $236 million, up 22.1% year over year. By the end of this year, U.S. dollar denominated AUM grew by 15.1% year-over-year to U.S. dollar 5.8 billion, with U.S. dollar denominated AUA increasing by 4.6% year-over-year to U.S. dollar 8.7 billion, reflecting our ability to capture a larger share of clients' U.S. dollar wallets for investment products. Moving on to the income statement. We implemented rigorous cost control measures in 2024, driving down operating costs and expenses by 10.5% from last year. Specifically, full-year compensation and benefits decreased by 7.4%, reflecting improved employee efficiency. Sending expenses fell by over 40%, and general administrative expenses remained stable. Even during the fourth quarter's peak marketing season, we maintained a disciplined approach to expenses. Total operating cost expenses for the quarter were RMB 514 million, a decrease of 11.1% year over year, and an increase of 16.1% sequentially due to seasonality. In line with revenue trends, operating profit declined 2024, with a full-year operating profit margin increasing to 24.4%, partly due to reduced government subsidies. Net income for the year was affected by certain non-recurring factors, including increased effective tax rates at 31.5% in 2024. Additionally, due to our GP share of investment in the products we manage, a loss of RMB 112 million was incurred in equity affiliates during the year. Taking these factors into account, non-GAAP net income was 132 million for the fourth quarter and RMB 550 million for the year. By year end, our client base remained stable with 9,334 total diamond black card clients, but our overseas client base continued growth to over 17,600,000 registered clients increased 18.3% year-over-year and 2.1% sequentially. The total number of overseas Diamond Black Card clients now exceeds 1,500. As Xander has mentioned, we would rather conserve in terms of acquiring new clients throughout the year. Over the next few years, however, this will be our major focus as market dynamics shift and create opportunities to gain more market share, both domestically and overseas. In terms of balance sheets, still remains strong and robust. Our cash balance decreased as a result of large dividend payouts in the third quarter. We're pleased to see cash and cash equivalents in short-term investments increases to RMB 5.1 billion by the end of the year. Our current ratio also improved with 4.5 times the debt-to-asset ratio remaining stable at 15% with no interest-bearing debt. This provides a solid foundation for us to further expand our overseas business. Lastly, shareholder returns. We're in accordance with the U.S. dollar 50 million share repurchase program. We announced in August 2024 we have repurchased over 600,000 ADSs by the end of 2024. equivalent of 0.9% of total issued shares. In appreciation of the longstanding support from shareholders, the Board has again approved an annual dividend and a special dividend, which together amounts to RMB $515 million, equivalent to 100% of our net non-GAAP net income for 2024. Although we are facing short-term headwinds, which impact our financial performance in the short term. We expect to see revenue and profitability recovering in the future as we ramp up our overseas business and domestic market recovery . We firmly believe that our stock remains undervalued and does not fully reflect our global growth prospects, robust balance sheet position, and special bonds with Mandarin speaking high net worth investors around the world. Guided by our vision to become the preferred wealth management platform for global management speaking clients, we remain committed to creating lasting value for our clients and continue to deliver sustained returns to shareholders who join us on this journey. Thank you all again for your trust and support. With that, I will now open the call to your questions.

We will now begin the question and answer session. To ask a question, you may press star then 1 on your touchtone phone. If you are using a speakerphone, please pick up your handset before pressing the keys. If at any time your question has been addressed and you would like to withdraw your question, please press star then 2. At this time, we will pause momentarily to assemble our roster. The first question today comes from Charlotte Lu with UBS. Please go ahead.

Hello. Hello, Helen. Hello, Helen. Hello, Helen. 我这边有三个问题,就是第一个问题是今年以来高级值客户他们对投资产品的需求情况如何? 哪类产品的相应的销量比较大? 然后目前我们CIO的投资策略是什么? 主推哪类产品? 然后最近三个季度以来就是保险产品的销量同别有所下滑,这个趋势是否会继续延续到2025年? If we look at it from the perspective of revenue, what kind of products will we get in the future? Then the second question is that the income of our foreign business is also an immediate improvement. I just mentioned that the U.S. is also a Booking Center. I would like to ask about the current situation in the U.S. and the future business expansion plan. Okay, let me translate. This is Helen from EBS. Since the beginning of this year, what has been the demand for investment products among high-level clients? Which type of products have been more popular? What's our CIO's current investment strategy? And which types of products are being promoted? In the past three quarters, the sales of insurance products have declined young year. Will this trend continue into 2025? In the future, which products will be the main source of revenue growth in terms of one-time commissions? My second question is overseas business growth. Overseas revenue has been increasing quarter by quarter, It was just mentioned in the meeting that the United States is being used as a booking center. Can you provide information on our business development in the United States? Currently, which countries or regions are the main sources of overseas revenue growth? My last question, in this quarter, we have seen a sizable settlement reversal and contingent litigation reversal. Can you give us more color on this? Thank you.

Thank you, Helen. I will answer some of your questions. The first one is about the demand for investment products and our CIO's point of view. In the first quarter of 2025, we did publish our new half-year CIO report. The theme of this report is to use exclusion to choose the best. In fact, there are several logics behind it. The first one is that the global market is still and uncertain factors. This can also be seen in China, the United States, and so on. After the U.S. election, after the U.S. election, its uncertain factors. So our plan for customers is actually to seek the most reliable long-term direction of investment in uncertain factors. So global configuration is still a very important point of view for our customers. In terms of the demand for customer investment products, we have seen that since the fourth quarter, including the first quarter of this year, the demand for customer investment is gradually rising. On the one hand, it is due to the fact that the market economy has dropped from the global market confidence to the lowest level after the epidemic in the past few years, especially in China. In other words, in the past few years, investment has not been able to develop investment. Now, there is a recovery of demand. Or after a long time, they still have money in their hands. So they still have to make a reinvestment. So this is a change in investment demand. The second is the performance of the second-tier market. Whether it's China, A-share and Hong Kong shares, and US-share, these performances actually make customers gradually return to the demand of the most invested product. So from the demand of the product, indeed, customers... The demand for mobility is also stronger. We see that whether it is a second-tier market product, because it is a strong mobility product, including low-end market products, such as those with a relatively moderate deadline, and products with a certain semi-slip, may also be a relatively needed place for our customers. Overall, we still follow the customer's asset configuration and combination solutions to meet the customer's diversity of needs. At the same time, we must follow the customer's configuration, that is, we must promote It's not just focusing on one market. So from our CIO's point of view, we can actually see a direction. Finally, in terms of investment needs, we also see a very big opportunity. This has actually started from 2024, from the CIO report to the customer proposal, which is an opportunity brought by AI. So in this year, 2025, we see that AI is in the process of fully application landing. So in this aspect, there are all kinds of strategies and products, not just the first-tier market, but also the second-tier market. Okay. Thank you, Xander.

So I'll do a translation of Xander's response. So like Kenley has mentioned, we published our newest version of addition of our CIO report in the first quarter of the year. And I guess the overall logic behind our house view is that we think that the global market will remain very volatile due to various uncertainties in the market. So our suggestion to our clients is to seek the relatively certain investment products within these uncertainties. And also we stress that global asset allocation is also very important. So in terms of client sentiment and demand, we saw the trend since the fourth quarter and also extending into the first quarter this year that the investment sentiment and demand among the Chinese high-net-worth clients have been rebounding. I guess from two main factors, First is that the subdued investment sentiment since the COVID situation in China has reached a relatively bottom point, I guess, before the fourth quarter last year. So in the past few years, our clients and also most of the Chinese 10-hour clients didn't really engage in a lot of investment activities, but now we're seeing their confidence starting to pick up. And secondly, I guess, is the market performance, whether it's the A share, the H share, Hong Kong stocks, or even the U.S. stocks have been rebounding. So a lot of clients have, you know, coming back to the investment demand. And thirdly, in terms of what types of products our clients currently prefer, So I guess in times like this, liquidity is also a very important consideration among our clients. So a lot of the public market securities hedge fund products themselves are NAV-based and liquid. And also some of the semi-liquid primary market products, such as private credits, infrastructure and the like, are also very popular among our clients. So I guess our concern or our target is to, on the one hand, to enhance our product shelf to meet with our clients' demand. But on the other hand, it's really to suggest our clients to engage in a global asset allocation strategy. And also on top of that, you know, in 2025, with all the advancements in the artificial intelligence industry, you know, whether it's primary market or public securities, anything related to AI is also a very important theme or an investment theme for our clients.

Especially for Hong Kong insurance products, the competition is very intense. It is full of irregularities and countermeasures. For NOA, we have always insisted on regularity. We do not make countermeasures to customers. In this way, it is also a sustainable development. But more importantly, we think that our customer group is not the same as other insurance customers in the market. We have always insisted on the aspect of configuration. For customers, it is a bottom-level uh uh About insurance products, I think there will be a continuous competition this year. But we think that our core is still to create value for customers. So we also launched some discount plans for big customers. And these discount plans are all cooperating with Baos. After the product is reformed, it will give customers a better value for its configuration. Through this way, It's a continuous competition against the market. But we also saw that this year, the Hong Kong government in July also introduced some new rules that are gradually introducing some insurance policies. I think these new rules are good for us. Because relatively speaking, we are in line with the rules. But the challenge is that in the market, there are a lot of . . . Regarding the U.S. industry, it is a very important part of our future in the U.S. In 2015, our strategy began with the establishment of a product center and product system. In 2024, we invested in a more important part in the U.S. We now have four small teams in the U.S. Three of them are related to our investment and product selection. uh uh uh Covering and continuing competitiveness Because from the perspective of investment products We have a better advantage on first-tier products But at the same time, the continuous competitiveness of this product Is based on our team continuing to cover In this process, it is done by establishing a connection with suppliers So in the future, I believe that the development of business in the United States this year Will also become a driving force for future core development

Thank you, Xander. So the first response is related to insurance products. So I guess the insurance market, especially in Hong Kong, is still very highly competitive because there are quite some operations that are not so compliant with the regulatory requirements, including you know, commission kicking backs, but we never did anything like that. We, you know, stick to compliance and regulatory requirements, and we never kick back any commissions to clients. And I guess the difference between NOAA and the other insurance brokerage firms is that the fact that we provide our clients with an overall asset allocation advisory And insurance is part of that advisory or solution where we suggest our clients to use insurance as a tool to protect the safety net of the overall portfolio. So also the clients that we serve and also the average, I guess, ticket size for insurance is higher than the peers or the other brokerage shops in the market. And as Sandra has recorded in the previous slides, earnings call, the overall insurance premium increased by 30% this year. So the decline group is still quite different from the market competitions. So looking ahead to this year, to 2025, we think that there will still be competitions in the market. And to counter that, we've also worked with the insurance firms or the product providers to come up with discounted plans for our clients, but this is on the product side rather than kicking back commissions. During the past year, we've seen the Hong Kong government coming out with many of the new requirements to counter the non-compliance operations in the market, which is I think to our end, it's beneficial to compliance firms like NOAA. But I guess really the challenge is that the fact that a lot of the unsure wealth management platforms collapsed after they collapsed, a lot of the employees or their relationship managers turn themselves to do overseas insurance so that the supply or the labor supply in the market is increasing. So I guess our overall strategy for 2025 is still to, I guess, use asset allocation overall advisory coupled with multi-strategy and also giving, you know, providing a better value to our clients working with the insurance firms to increase our competitiveness in the insurance product segment. And also Helen asked, about our operations in the U.S. So U.S. is a very important market and also a planned booking center for our business. In 2024, our majority of our focus in the U.S. has been on the product side. So right now we have four teams, four different teams in the U.S., And three of them are focusing on either investment or product selection. And we're also very happy that recently and also in the near future, we will be welcoming some of the very top tier talents joining us who have worked in top-tier hedge funds or fund managers previously. And we think that this will increase our competitiveness and effectiveness in terms of product selection and also GP and fund manager coverage because we think that even though we think we are pretty competitive in terms of our product selection and our product shelf, But to keep up the competitiveness, we need to continue to cover and work with the GPs, especially in the local markets in the U.S.

I'll take the second question regarding the U.S. market. We actually... are now constructing in four cities, four locations, actually. We used to have, in the past, two investment teams. One is in the Silicon Valley, mainly focusing on the tech-oriented VC funds, and also another real estate team in New York. And we're in the process of acquiring advisory capabilities that will allow us to have a third booking center in addition to Hong Kong and Singapore in the U.S. market. And we also have built, as Xander has mentioned, an OPM, which is the Product Selection Center in Palo Alto, and also has a local corporation, some local banking partners, and also another fourth location in Irvine, Los Angeles, mainly serving our clients on, one, the U.S. insurance side of needs, and two, as a general reception site to host various client activities. So the new revenue from two additional locations are still slowly coming into shape. But I guess the capability of adding another booking center in North America, especially to serve Chinese immigrants, in both U.S. and Canada will give us a lot of advantage, especially competing with other Chinese-backed firms. So that's the second question. And third question, I think briefly you mentioned about the quarter four one-off reversal from the accruals. It is a one-off event. the final outcome of a pending case was actually more optimistic or preferable for us, but it's one of them. 王总要不要整体再帮我们整体补充一下?

好的,我也整体来几个点吧。 第一,我们认为2024年整个华人客户,中国客户的这个 China China China China China Chinese customers are taking active action, whether it's going out to sea, investing, and the direction they want to go. Our CIO strategy, I think the most important thing is, we think that in 2024, Chinese customers, especially customers who make money in mainland China, the key moment to adjust their strategic asset configuration is not tactical asset configuration, but strategic configuration. We are also guiding our customers to China China China China But now some of the B-points have also come out. We see a lot of customers think that they are not really served well. I think Loya's core strategy is to serve big customers first. The second is to help customers do financial configuration, including the configuration of global insurance. We have adjusted this part. That is to say, at the insurance end, we need to understand this thinking. For example, an unbiased agent. Thank you. Thank you, Chair Lady.

So, Chairman Li mentioned that during 2024, I guess, especially in the first three quarters, the overall sentiment among Chinese investors in terms of investment has really reached a bottom. But we've seen a rebounding trend since 2025. And, for example, we hosted a public market summit in Hangzhou, China, this month, and we had over 1,000 of our clients attending this summit, a lot of people. And the feedback that we got was that the clients are now having more interest to listen to what the managers have to say, and they feel the urgency to act on investments. And also, this is also the case in overseas markets, whether it's Hong Kong, Singapore, or Japan. We're seeing that the Mandarin-speaking or Chinese clients actively on the move, whether it's businesses going overseas or global investments or overseas investment opportunities. So in terms of our CIO view, we think that this is the moment right now is a critical moment for Chinese clients to adjust their strategic asset allocation, not only on the tactical side, but really on the strategic asset allocation side, which is also what we are doing to guide our clients to make the changes in their asset allocation strategy. And also she mentioned that in the Hong Kong insurance market, the competition is not, I guess, a healthy state of status. First, on the product side, the expected rate of return of the insurance product used to be I guess, an ordinarily high. And we're seeing that the Hong Kong government is now stepping in to make adjustments to the expected rate of return or investment return on these products. And secondly, in the competition side, there are a lot of, quite a lot of so-called family offices or multi-family offices, but are not really operating like family offices. So their clients, you know, the feedback from their clients is that they don't feel like they are served really well. So to our strategy is really for NOAA is to serve large clients and also use global asset allocation strategy to serve these larger clients. And, you know, in terms of insurance, We're also trying to learn and adjust to different markets, and that's why we are engaging the new commission-only agent space to acquire new clients, similar to some of the other firms are doing. And really for our in-house relationship managers, insurance acts as a tool to help our clients to secure their safety net in their portfolio asset allocations.

Helen?

Thank you. Helen?

Thank you.

Once again, if you would like to ask a question, please press star and one to join the question queue. The next question comes from Peter Zhang with JP Morgan. Please go ahead.

Thank you for the opportunity to ask questions. I have two questions. The first question is to ask the management to introduce the What are the trends? For example, the customer sentiment and the sale of financial products. I would like to ask, with the transition and investment sentiment in China, can we look forward to the trend of income in 2025? Can the income rise steadily? My second question is about overseas relationship managers. I see that the number of overseas relationship managers has decreased in the fourth quarter, and 138 people are also lower than the 200 people we gave before. I want to ask what is the reason behind this, and could you please give us a look Thank you for giving me the opportunity to ask questions. This is Peter Zhang from JPMorgan. I have two questions. regarding the first quarter trend. Commendable helped to give us an update on the first quarter trend in terms of the client sentiment and the wealth management part of sales in first quarter. And with the completion of our domestic strategic transformation and some improvement in domestic investment sentiment since late 2024. How should we expect our 2025 revenue trend? Can we expect the revenue to see a stabilization in 2025 or some recovery in 2025? My second question is regarding the overseas RM. We noticed that a number of overseas relationship manager has become 5% sequentially in fourth quarter and fell short of the previous target of 200 for 2024. I wish to understand what was the reason behind of this relationship management adjustment in fourth quarter last year and what will be our overseas RM headcount outlook for 2025. And I also wish to understand our overall headcount outlook for 2025. Thank you.

Thank you, Peter. I will answer the first question first. Indeed, in the first quarter, we can feel that the mood of the customers is still very much reversed. This can be seen from last year, at the end of the year, in our one-year round of black-and-white customer annual meetings. Last year, the black-and-white customer annual meeting covered the largest number of black-and-white customers. foreign foreign In the past, some of China's wealth management institutions have fallen. So, if the market can focus on the trend of the market, it may be the only choice or the first choice with the highest quality. Then this can also be seen that the annuality of customers is still very high with us. We actually do it as a statistics. In the past, in the history, the profit of black customers and the proportion of customers is more than 90%. So this is actually our base. Then this year, Wang Dong also said that we held a summit in a second-tier market in Hangzhou. The second-tier market is just in China's two meetings are over. In addition, Hangzhou's technology is small. We chose Hangzhou, which is also a few advantages. The number of customers at the venue is more than 1,000. It has been open for two days, two whole days. The customer's enthusiasm is still very high. The general feeling of the customers is that the market is not just China. They have the opportunity and are willing to listen to more management ideas, including the growth in investment, which is actually a good performance. Then there is the global configuration. In the past few years, we have been working with customers through a series of eight CIO reports. Customers are gradually accepting the importance of our global configuration, rather than a single region and market. So from these words, it is also reflected that the mood of customers, in fact, is the mood of investment. The recovery rate is relatively fast. This also has to do with our business situation in 2025. Although we can't give guidance, we don't give guidance now, but we have already divided our mission goals in 2025. Among them, investment products, especially overseas global investment products, that the target is still growing significantly. Because in this regard, it is also due to the demand of the main customer. In addition, we have a judgment of a house view. I think this is a better opportunity to give customers a very important critical period of strategic configuration, adjustment, and construction. In other words, I think in 2025, the investment business will grow significantly. Then, just now, we also said that because There is a management fee, that is, the amount of management fee income in the first-tier market will continue to decline. In other words, in fact, on the one hand, the head of the sea is growing, but at the same time, we are in the insurance business, there will actually be a certain growth. We also found that the insurance needs of customers were not completely satisfied. In fact, many customers, in the process of configuration, in fact, if we In terms of security and security, it should be more than 20% of the personal assets. In terms of security and security assets, it is far from that. But the market is competitive. So we can use this window period to accelerate the realization of security and security assets for customers, especially the construction of security and security assets and the construction of the overall asset configuration. Especially in the global market now, It's still uncertain. In the case of fluctuation, the safety is still very high. So in 2025, we also expect that it will be more than this year. As we said before, we hope that 2024 will be a first step. In 2025, there will be a gradual rebound in the next few years. In terms of overseas personnel, the data we published in 2020 is lower than the previous one. The main reason is that in the fourth quarter, we usually say that the fourth quarter is review. In fact, the construction of the sales team, our past domestic experience is that if a new person comes, he needs a process of adaptation. Not all of them are adapted. . . . . . . . .

Actually, we are very grateful to Peter for paying attention to this point. In fact, when we were at the end of last year, there were 89 people overseas. Then we reached the end of this year, the end of 2024. In fact, it has grown to 138. In fact, there is a growth of 55%. In this process, there must be a lot of selection and optimization. Especially when we maintain the entry of fresh blood, when there is inflow, in fact, we can to better adjust to the early stages of the past, including performance. It's not as expected, because the cycle is about three to six months. So there will be some seasonal changes. By 2025, we will clearly have a two-term project. There are a few ways to achieve this, but it is indeed a strategic project. This is not just about us blindly pushing the number to 200. In fact, there are still a lot of structures. In addition to R&M, social experience R&M, in fact, there is also a part from campus hire. In fact, we continue to insist on doing this. Last year, we had about 40 QF50 students. So this year, in the R25 plan, may still continue to recruit our entire target group, the global QSKC. At present, the overall progress of the first quarter is relatively satisfactory. Secondly, we are also trying to find a new way. It's not just about recruiting experienced hires directly to do R&M. There are many people who we think are capable, or the overall resources have not yet reached the requirement of R&M. We may also consider First, we asked them to do BD. In today's meeting, we also discussed a lot of BD. At the same time as they bring us customer clues, they are more familiar with the company, the brand, and the products. Among these people, those with better ability, higher professionalism, and can take the lead, will also become an additional water tank for RM. So, especially in high-end companies, where there are more talented people, In Shenzhen and Guangzhou, we will also hold some ARC-specific job fairs. On the one hand, we want to expand the influence of recruitment, and on the other hand, we want to promote our brand. We are very committed to our goal. I believe we will see a significant growth in investment in 2025.

Mr. Wang, do you have anything to add?

我补充一下,就是说,我觉得2024年我们因为变革嘛,主要是内耗和内卷,很多熟悉我们的分析师都知道我们的理财师状态也不太好,因为他们在国内要分业经营嘛,全部回到业务主体。 2025年,我想我们已经完成了新的激励机制的发布,就是清晰简单国际接轨。 我们现在主管销售的这个老大呢,他昨天说, He ran the first line, he felt that everyone was in a very good state, so he was full of passion. His speech and voice were all fighting, he felt particularly good. I think we have indeed completed the change of this incentive mechanism. For overseas, we have been insisting that one-third of the country will turn to excellent financial institutions, one-third of the social recruitment, one-third of the graduate students. We are in the social recruitment, especially in the private sector, these senior financial institutions are not very successful in the recruitment process. 我们现在可能除了国内转换 然后当地我们招一些不是那么资深的 但是潜力比较好的 可能做过两三年一两年的 还有一些就是要培养应届毕业生 所以我想我们在海外, 第一是会坚持在booking center的地方, 香港,新加坡,美国, 我们都会招这个理财师, 我们要花时间投入去建设这个理财师的队伍, 但是我们同时是比较有耐心的, 我们也让这些RMU, 至少是两到三年的成长周期吧, 第一年要求低点, 第二年这个逐步上升, 到第三年达到我们的基本标准, 这是我们的一个, So I guess, thank you, Peter, for your question.

So I guess on the first question is related to, you know, the investment sentiment right now and the outlook for the financials on 2025. So I guess the overall trend, as we previously mentioned, is that we see that clients' investment sentiments have been rebounding significantly, which was I guess pretty, you know, we saw the trend starting since last year and Black Card and Diamond Card Client Summit, which was actually the largest in terms of scale in our history in terms of client coverage and the number of clients attended. So we hosted these summits in the key major cities in China as well as we had five sessions in Hong Kong alone. So the feedback that we got from clients was that it's very rare to have these large-scale and also high-quality events for individual investors or Hannaworth investors because on the one hand side, a lot of the Chinese wealth management firms have really exited this market And some of the foreign firms are less motivated to host these events given the market condition. So the clients who attended our summit tell us that the quality of the content and also the scale is probably the best in the industry. And also we did a data summary that, you know, basically over 90% of our diamond card and black cards are overall profitable. So this is also our, I guess, the most important client base. And also it's a reflection of the quality of asset allocation advice that we continue to provide to our core clients. And also, you know, Chair Lady also mentioned that this month we hosted a public security summit in Hangzhou, which has been quite a hot city considering all the technological announcements, for example, DeepSeek, which is also based in Hangzhou. So we hosted two days. Over 1,000 clients attended. We saw that the clients are very active and very keen to learn and listen to what the managers have to say. And they think that the investment market in China, you know, there are opportunities to invest in this market. And we also see a lot of transaction value generated from this summit. And also in terms of global asset allocation, I guess, what we have been doing the past two to three years with eight consecutive Seattle House View reports, I think the clients are now starting to buy into our advice that they shouldn't just allocate their assets in a single market, which is China, but really to consider global asset allocation and investment. And that's exactly what they're doing now. So speaking of 2025, since we don't give out, we are not allowed to give concrete guidance on revenue and profits. But I guess the overall trend is that we've set our KPIs and requirements for each business unit. And especially in the overseas investment product segments, I guess, first of all, the client's sentiment and demand is growing. And also, you know, according to our house view, this is a critical time to act. So we hope that the, I guess, the downfall in our RMB private market product and also the associated decline in recurring service fees can be gradually offset and overcome by the growing overseas investment portfolio. And also in terms of insurance, we think that although the market competition is fierce, but among our clients, we see that a lot of them are not subscribing enough insurance products or related tools for their succession planning and asset segregation purposes. So we want to utilize this window of opportunity to, I guess, help our clients refine their safety net within the asset allocation, especially in a highly volatile market. So overall, we hope that year 2024 was kind of the bottoming and 2025 should be able to see some rebounding from the bottoming out. So that's the outlook on 2025. So also the second question, Peter mentioned about the decline in foreclosure in terms of the overseas relationship manager and also the reasoning behind it. So I guess, you know, Sander, Grant, and the chairlady all mentioned about this decline. basically our overall hiring plan. So first of all, fourth quarter is usually the year-end review window. So in our prior experience in China when we established our sales team is that typically new people who join us need some time to get used to our system and also basically our product and asset allocation advisory systems. Um, so, uh, obviously there will be, um, you know, uh, I guess people who do not meet our expectations. So, uh, actions will be taken, uh, at the year end time. Uh, and also, especially because overseas, uh, you know, the labor costs and, uh, I guess the overall salary is higher. So, uh, we are, we tend to be more conservative, uh, compared to, you know, in, in domestic market. So I guess also Grant mentioned that the overall RM team in overseas in 2023 by year end, it was 89 people. This year was 138 people, which was a 55% increase. So I guess on the one hand we keep having fresh inflow of talent, but also we, have the opportunity to, with the new people hiring, joining us, we have the opportunity to re-evaluate the RMs that joined us previously, but didn't meet the expectation. So typically the cycle is about six months, three to six months. So in terms of the hiring plan in 2025, so we have a strategic program internally, which is called ARC 200. but it's not really just to get to the 200 mark. And we are, aside from the lateral recruitment from peers in the local market, we are also stressing the importance of campus recruitment. So we had about 40 fresh graduates joining us last year, and this year we're still continuing to target the top schools globally to recruit the best of their class of the graduate students. And aside from the relationship managers, since we're putting a lot of resources into new client acquisition. So we are also establishing a so-called BD team or business development team, who I guess on the technical side might not be able to sit within the RM requirements, but they can be able to acquire clients and manage client relationships. And once they become more sophisticated in asset allocation and investment advisory, then they become future candidates for relationship managers. So I guess lastly, Chair Lady added and mentioned that in the previous year, in 2024, it was really a process of involution. So a lot of the investors and analysts who are familiar with us and probably know that, especially in the domestic market, the relationship managers didn't really have a good time or didn't really feel like on their best time or best days. But I guess right now, especially starting from 2025, we've already sorted out the compensation scheme and which we feel that will motivate our sales team. You know, the head of sales of NOAA spent a lot of time, you know, interviewing an executive speaking with our relationship managers in China, and his feedback was that they feel like they're ready to go now. So I guess, you know, coming out from the bottom in 2024, we're better positioned, both in terms of client acquisition and also our sales team status. Yes.

我想补充一个挑战就是说 我们确实在内部端的话 我们解决了这些内耗 逐步解决这个过程吧 就大家也共识了 但在客户端的话 他可能还有个习惯 因为过去我们的客户 习惯了一站式的服务 那现在我们在国内 就分成了好几个主体 完全是在每一个磁排主体 可以端到端的完成销售 但在客户服务端 Thank you, Chair Lady.

So one more point is that, you know, as we mentioned, we've broken down our sales team into different business and license segments which, you know, on our client's perspective, it also needs time for them to get used to because previously they used to only deal with maybe, you know, one RM who takes care of all his needs, his or her needs and everything. But right now, each client needs to deal with, you know, sales personnel from different business units, which in the long term will be beneficial because of the different expertise every RM has. you know, specialize in, but it does take more time for our clients to get used to. So that's also a near-term challenge for us. Peter, I hope that answers your question. You sure, Wang Zou?

I'm done. I'm done.

Ada? Operator, back to you.

This concludes our question and answer session and concludes the conference call today. Thank you for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect.

Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you so much.

Bye.