Accor Sa

Welcome to the Accor Q3 2025 Revenue Presentation. Today's conference will be hosted by Martin Gero, Group CFO. For the first part of the conference, the participants will be on listen-only mode. During the questions and answers session, participants are able to ask questions by dialing pound key 5 on their telephone keypad. Now I will hand the conference over to the speakers. Please go ahead.

Thank you and good evening, everyone. And thank you for joining ACOR's third quarter trading update call. And without further ado, I will start with the key highlights on slide three of the presentation. In an environment which continues to evolve, we have made solid strides since our last call towards, one, accelerating the network growth, and two, mitigating the impact of FX, which leads us to upgrade our EBITDA guidance by two points. Starting with REF PAR, despite a challenging calm base in the ENA region in the month of July and August, Q3 REF PAR like-for-like remained positive at plus 0.8%, equally driven by price and occupancy. Softness in France due to the Olympic baseline and Germany was more than offset by solid growth in other geographies. And we were pleased to see the rebound in September with a 3% REFBA growth, which was driven by ENA, which returned to positive growth. Other geographies remained very solid. As we anticipated, NUG accelerated to 2.5% on an LTM basis, and our pipeline remains very healthy with a growth rate of 8.2% over the same period, benefiting from a very robust flow of signings. At constant currency, our management and franchise revenue increased by 3.1%, outpacing ref bar growth in the quarter. Group revenue overall was flat versus prior year at constant currency due to some asset disposals in the quarter and the Olympics value in kind service revenue in prior year. Those two together impacted revenue by about three points in the quarter. As highlighted during our July call, the euro appreciated both rapidly and significantly against most currencies and in particular against the US dollar. And as a reminder, our FX exposure is predominantly in currencies which move with the US dollar. What we noted in the third quarter is that the euro was actually broadly stable versus other currency. And as a result, we still expect to have a negative full year impact of 60 million on EBITDA due to FX. Now, against this backdrop, we secured profit protection measures of more than 20 million in the second half, which combined with a confident outlook for the fourth quarter leads us to upgrade our full-year EBITDA guidance. Therefore, recurring EBITDA guidance at constant currency is increased by two points, from 9% to 10% growth to 11% to 12% growth, for the fiscal year 2025. And again, at reported rates, recurring EBITDA is expected to be impacted by a negative FX impact of 60 million. As a point of update, we have completed the second tranche of the 2025 440 million share buyback program, driving the total shareholder return since the beginning of the year to 743 million, which is roughly 6.5% of the market cap at the beginning of the year. And I am pleased to announce that we have decided to launch a new tranche of share buyback of 100 million during the fourth quarter of 2025 to take advantage of the current market conditions. Let's now turn to the ref bar for the third quarter on slide four. Starting with PM&E, which posted a third quarter ref bar decrease of 1.1% versus 24. Occupancy was actually slightly up to 71% in the quarter. with sustained demand. Prices were down, and that's really what drove the REF PAR decline in PM&E, and that is really reflective of the high Olympic comp base in ENA. In ENA, REF PAR was down 4.6%, driven by France, primarily. Demand was sustained with occupancy reaching 74% in the third quarter, which is a one-point gain versus prior, but obviously less constrained stays in France than during the Olympics period resulted in the rate decrease, which you see here. In France, again, REFBAR was basically mechanically down, high single digit from last year, driven by Paris. Provence REFBAR was slightly negative over the same period. But again, September saw a rebound from July and August, although the activity remained soft in a context of political uncertainty, which has an impact on business confidence. In the UK, REVPAR rebounded from the second quarter and was up mid single digit both in London and the regions, thanks to what was a supportive leisure and corporate event calendar. In Germany, which is a market primarily driven by business demand, REVPAR was down high single digit in the third quarter as the country is facing persistent economic challenges. Sequentially, September did improve from July and August, but still negative, and October is expected to be slightly improved due to a more supportive fair activity calendar. Turning to May-Apac, where the REFBAR in the third quarter was up 2.7%, primarily driven by Middle East and Pacific regions. China, still negative, high single-digit REF PAR growth, which continues to weigh on the region if we exclude China. MEAPAC REF PAR is up 5.3% in the third quarter, driven by price. Starting with the Middle East, the region rebounded strongly, posting a low double-digit REF PAR, driven by solid UAE, as well as Saudi Arabia, which had a very strong pilgrimage season. Southeast Asia flattish due to security concerns in Thailand, as well as the worsening of travel conditions in Indonesia. Pacific ref bar strengthened again in the third quarter with mid-single-digit growth. And China, which was still negative high single-digit growth in the quarter, actually improved sequentially during the quarter with a better September ref bar. Still negative, but at a much lower rate than July and August. Americas continues to post solid growth with Q3 Ref Bar up 7% versus prior year, primarily driven by Brazil, with very solid pricing and corporate demand. If we turn now to luxury and lifestyle, on the right side, Ref Bar growth was a solid 5% versus prior year, driven by pricing for two-thirds and occupancy for one-third. Occupancy was up one point in the period. Luxury REFBAR was 4.3%, driven by both price and occupancy, with solid momentum across all brands, particularly Fairmont and Raffles. Lifestyle posted a very solid 6.9% REFBAR growth, driven by price primarily, with some occupancy gain. And despite geopolitical tensions, resorts in Turkey and the Middle East had again a very strong quarter, with REFBAR up in the low teens. Moving on to slide five, which breaks down our hotel portfolio and pipeline by division. So at group level, net unit growth on an LTM basis reached 2.5%, which is an acceleration from June and in line with our expectation. And again, pipeline growth LTM is 8.2% versus prior, which supports further acceleration. Starting with PME on the left, NUG on the last 12-month basis was up 2%, again, accelerating from H1, as we expected, as we have lapped over the opening of the Daiwa portfolio in the second quarter of 2024. And we expect PM&E to continue to accelerate NUG in the fourth quarter. Notably, we have two large hotel openings planned in the fourth quarter, the handwritten in Las Vegas and the EBIT budget high to our tower. PM&E pipeline also very healthy, 194,000 room, up 9.5% over the last 12 months and representing 26% of the portfolio. Moving to the right, L&L network growth also accelerated, reaching 5.3% on an LTM basis. with a more favorable phasing of opening and churn than was the case in the first half. The pipeline was up 4%, with the pipeline representing 44% of the existing network, which obviously provides solid visibility for the future growth of NUD. And among the most notable openings planned in the fourth quarter, we have Delano in New York City, Fairmont in Hanoi, and Hoxton in Dublin. Now I'll turn to page six. We have decided to provide greater visibility into services to owner revenue and EBITDA by breaking what is known as STO down in two components, which you see here on page six. These two components are reimbursed costs on one hand, on the right side, and SMDL, which stands for sale, marketing, distribution, and loyalty on the left side. And I'll start with SMDL on the left. SMDL regroups activity, which are expected to grow at a faster pace and generate at least a 6% margin over the midterm. And they can be further divided in two blocks, sales and marketing, where activities are funded by fees received from hotel owners and fundamentally should be EBITDA neutral. and distribution and loyalty, which regroups EBITDA-generating activities, including distribution, loyalty, partnership, and subscription, both expecting to contribute meaningfully to EBITDA growth. Over the midterm, we expect revenue growth for SMDL to outpace the growth of net unique growth plus REFPAR, and this is driven by gaining distribution in feeble channels, increasing loyalty penetration, and expanding non-REFPAR revenue from partnership and subscription. Reimbursed costs, on the other hand, are a pure pass through. For Accor, they're mostly staff costs incurred on behalf of owners primarily in North America with Fairmont. And as a result, that revenue line should fundamentally grow in line with the growth of the payroll costs in North America. So net wage inflation plus network variation. And again, you know, pure price through no EBITDA impact. And in order to provide better visibility into EBITDA generating revenue streams, we've chosen to present reimbursed costs separately from division revenues. as you will notice in the next slide. So turning now to slide seven, revenue by segment. The revenue by segment and by division is provided in the appendix, so this is an overall group revenue summary. Group revenue, as I was saying in my introduction, reached 1,369,000,000 in the third quarter flat to prior at constant currency and down 4.6% at current rates. We continue to be impacted by the weakening of the US dollar and related currency, with FX negatively impacting our revenue by almost five points in the third quarter. Scope effect was also slightly negative in the period, and I'll come back to that. As expected, management and franchise revenue growth picked up in the third quarter, growing at 3.1% at constant currency, which is basically in line with the growth of the REF bar and the NUG. Hotel assets and other revenue was down 3.1% at constant currency, reflecting the high Olympics comps for our catering business, Potel et Chabot, as well as some disposal, mainly the festive business of Paris Society, where the focus going forward is on the development of the restaurant platform. On a positive note, the PM&E hotel assets and other was up 4.4% at constant currency, mostly driven by Australia. You see here, SMDL, which is, again, sales, marketing, distribution, and loyalty revenue, down 1.6% at constant currency. Now, in the third quarter of 24, we recognized 26 million of value in kind revenue related to services provided to the Olympic Games organizing committee, which had no EBITDA impact. If we adjust for this accounting revenue recognition, SMDL revenue would actually be up 6% at constant currency, in the quarter reflecting Ref Bar Nug and better distribution mix. Turning to slide eight, management and franchise revenue by segment, which grew again at 3.1% at constant currency, which is more than two points above Ref Bar growth in the quarter down 0.9% at current rate, and this is the impact of FX. Starting with PME, MNF revenue is down 1.2% at constant currency. That's in line with REF PAR. The decline in ENA, which is really what drove the decline for the PME division, mainly reflects the negative REF PAR growth, as we've seen, and to a lesser extent, the conversion of some contracts to franchise, as we have called out since our first quarter call. Mayapak is quite impacted by FX. At constant currency, MNF revenue is up 2.9%, slightly above REFBAR. Turning to luxury and lifestyle, MNF revenue grew at the healthy rate of 11.7% at constant currency, almost 7 points above REFBAR. At current rate, growth was 6%. Both segments, luxury and lifestyle, reflect solid revenue conversion from NUG and REFBAR. And in addition, and as expected, lifestyle revenue grew at a higher pace, benefiting from a more favorable phasing of residence fees. I will now turn to our guidance on page 9. We confirm our guidance for like-for-like REF PAR growth at between 3% and 4%. As we anticipated, Q3 was our weakest quarter, and we expect a rebound in Q4, which is confident by the Q3 exit rate with the September REF PAR at plus 3%. Net unique growth is still expected at circa 3.5% as we continue to pick up pace in the fourth quarter with a high volume of openings planned, but as well a lower churn than prior in the fourth quarter. Now, based on current production projections, as I stated in my introduction, we still expect FX to have a negative four-year impact of 60 million, so consistent with what we shared with you in July. And against this backdrop, we have secured additional profit protection measures of more than 20 million, which combined with a confident outlook for the fourth quarter enables us to upgrade our full year 25 recurring EBITDA growth guidance by two points to a growth which is now expecting between 11% and 12% at constant currency. And I will conclude this presentation with an update on Anis Mor on slide 10. As you may recall, Anismore was created in 2021 with Accor joining its lifestyle brands with Hoxton. Today, Anismore is a leading player in the fast-growing lifestyle hospitality segments with 192 hotels and over 500 restaurants and bars. Today, the Accor board approved the evaluation of a potential listing of Anismore. Such a listing would enhance liquidity for minority shareholders, and provide additional flexibility to support Anismore growth platform. Now, in the event a listing would take place, Accor would remain the controlling shareholder of Anismore. And as this juncture, there's no certainty that a transaction will be completed. And obviously, we will inform the market of future development as appropriate. And thank you for your listening. And I will now open the floor to questions.

Ladies and gentlemen, if you wish to ask a question, please dial pound key five on your telephone keypad to enter the queue. If you wish to withdraw your question, please dial pound key six on your telephone keypad. The next question comes from Jamie Rollo from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Thanks often, everyone. Three questions, please. Just on the manage and franchise division, it's obviously encouraging to see the revenue growth back to positive territory in constant currency terms. But as you call out, there are some benefits from the termination fees in the Americas and some residences income. Could you please quantify those? It looks like it's about 5 or 6 million euros combined. Secondly, clearly also positive to get the BIDAR guidance upgrade. That 2%, as you say, is all on efficiencies. Should we then annualize that next year so there's an extra 2%? Or is it maybe just a one-off for this year? And then finally, just on any small, so just to clarify, the board is evaluating the possibility of this IPO. You're not obviously announcing an IPO. But could you please just talk a bit about the process when we might hear about the decision and any other little factors we need to think about in judging the likelihood of it happening. Thank you.

Hi, Jamie. So on the Americas, yes, you're right, that's the order of magnitude. On the profit protection plans, no, you should not double that. What that 20 million plus is, is really a combination delaying some and reducing some hirings and as well as reprioritizing some projects. So you should not expect that 20 million to become 40 million next year, but you should expect that 20 million to be sustainable next year. And with respect to any spore, you're right. Right now, we have started a process of evaluating a potential listing that will obviously take a number of steps and will probably be, if indeed it is completed, at least a 12-month process.

Thank you. So presumably the Ascendi disposal comes first, but any update there?

Correct. The S&D Disposal should come first. The process is ongoing. We expect to receive offers during the month of November. And we still expect the transaction to be completed by the end of the second quarter next year.

Thank you very much.

The next question comes from Jared Castle from UBS. Please go ahead.

Good afternoon, everyone. Yeah, also three for me. Can you just spend a little bit of time just telling us, you know, how the residence phasing has gone in the second half? Obviously, it was a little bit slow in the first half, so any thoughts there? Secondly, 100 million buyback. It sounds like it completes in 4Q. What made you decide now was the right time rather than, let's say, February time? And then just thirdly, a very strong pipeline, NUGS obviously lagging a bit behind, but how should we think about net unit growth going forward from 26 onwards, just given this pipeline growth? Thanks.

Hi, Gerald. Thanks for your question. So in terms of residents, what we say is that overall residents will be slightly up year over year, and the growth will all take place in the second half, mostly in the fourth quarter. With respect to the buyback program, we'll start the buyback in the fourth quarter. Our view is that last year we started the share buyback after our full year 24 earnings goals. So in March, we felt that given where the share price is today, it was appropriate to have a bit more of a regular share buyback and be active in the market on a more regular basis and not have to wait for our full year 25 earnings release. And with respect to the NUG going forward, yes, we are, you know, obviously pleased with the growth in the pipeline and our expectation. Our CMD calls for an acceleration of the NUG towards, you know, the upper range of that 3% to 5%. You know, this year we are circa 3.5%, and the expectation for 26 is to improve from that level and gradually move towards by 27, the upper range of that range.

Okay. And it doesn't sound like, you know, there's any economic headwinds which is impacting the pipeline.

No, and you have to recall that most of our, you know, the majority of our pipeline sits actually in the Middle East and Asia Pacific, you know, very, very, very little actually sits in. in the U.S., which is obviously more constrained. And, you know, we have a very high conversion rate about, you know, 24 was about 60% of our open-door conversions. You know, through September, we're running at 56%. Great.

Thanks very much.

The next question comes from Muniba Kayani from Bank of America. Please go ahead.

Thank you for taking my questions. The STO breakdown, that's really helpful. You've given the revenue breakdown for 3Q. Just in terms of details going forward, will you be giving more breakdown at an EBITDA level on STO as well? And if yes, Could you maybe share something on how this would be for 1H if you had given it to us? It's just indicative. That would be helpful. And then just a bit on this NS More listing. Why now is the board looking at it? And what is really being evaluated in this process? And you said Accor would still remain a controlling shareholder, so you'd be selling into a listing. How would that work, if you could just talk about that? Thank you.

Sure. So on STO, actually, the EBITDA that was reported in the first half is the EBITDA for SMDL, because the reimbursed cost is pure pass-through, so that has zero EBITDA. all of the EBITDA that was reported in the first half is SMDL. And so going forward, we'll continue to isolate revenue from reimbursed costs. Again, zero EBITDA for that block and SMDL revenue and EBITDA. And in terms of Anis Mor, Anis Mor has minority shareholders. Those minority shareholders had certain liquidity clauses, which were... essentially exercisable during a certain timeframe. We've reached that timeframe and therefore this is why we're now considering and evaluating a potential listing of Anis Mor. And it's yet to be decided if Anis Mor was to be listed, how that liquidity would be composed of, but there's an expectation that all shareholders probably would have to contribute. to that liquidity. But again, ACO will remain the controlling shareholder of any small.

What are other options if you don't, if the board decides not to do a listing?

Status quo.

Okay, thank you.

Thank you for your question. The next question comes from Leo Carrington from Citi. Please go ahead.

Thank you. If I could ask two questions. Firstly, on these profit protection measures, would you be able to elaborate a bit further on the remarks earlier on delayed hiring and re-prioritization? Is this purely a reaction to the currency headwinds or does market conditions changed that meant these investments were no longer so pressing. And in terms of where these fit, will they be more visible in STO or management and franchise EVPA? Second question, just on the STO breakdown, thank you for splitting out the reimbursed costs. It felt like some of the discussion at H1 implied more disclosure was being considered in terms of the SMDL categories. Is this something that's still under consideration? Thank you.

Thank you, Leo, and hello. So with respect to the profit protection plan, no, it is not related to a change in market conditions. It's really our intention to cover part of that foreign exchange impact. And, you know, that's really what's driving the, let's say, you know, reprioritizing of, you know, of projects, of hiring and of spending, you know, generally speaking. In terms of where those savings are coming from, they're, you know, relatively balanced, a bit more coming from STO, SMDL than from M&F, but relatively balanced. And in terms of splitting further SMDL, no, we do not intend to split further SMDL than what we have, you know, than what we're reporting currently. We're really just isolating reimburse costs from SMDL.

Thank you very much, Fatih.

You're welcome. The next question comes from Estelle Weingrad from JP Morgan. Please go ahead. Mr. Estelle Weingrad, your line is now unmuted. Please go ahead. The next question comes from Jaffer Mestari from BNP Paribas Exane. Please go ahead.

Hi, good evening. Actually, can I just start by making you repeat one thing you said on the profit protection program? What I heard is you should not assume an extra 20 million next year, but you should assume the 20 million is sustainable into next year, just to confirm.

That's correct, Jafar.

Super. Thank you very much. I guess on SMDL, first question. apologies for asking for more detail and you're not going to split it further down but can you help us with some granularity because presumably marketing even if you don't have contractual obligations to spend it like some of your USP within SMDL marketing you still pretty much zero margins so how much is marketing how much is sales and distribution I guess low margins and then how much right now is loyalty memberships partnerships which presumably is 30% plus margins, please.

So you're right, Jafar, you know, sales and marketing is fundamentally breakeven, you know, zero plus, zero minus, you know, depending on the years, but it's fundamentally breakeven. So where, you know, where the EBITDA comes from is from loyalty distribution partnership and subscription. And within that, it's really distribution that is the major driver of that EBITDA.

Okay, thank you. And then the conversion of some contracts from managed to franchise, I don't think you've quantified them explicitly so far. Presumably they were still work in progress, but you're getting closer to the end of the year. Do you have an estimate on the revenue impact for full year 25? And then my last question is on Enis more, when you say provide additional flexibility to support growth, what does that mean in the context of a pure asset-like business where you've been saying that the requirements for key money are not increasing?

Sure. So on management to franchise, I think what we called that in the first quarter was that we expected the impact to be roughly two points of MNF revenue for PME, so slightly above one point at group level, and it's really in the NR region. With respect to, you know, to Anis More, you're absolutely right. We don't intend to go asset heavy in, you know, in Anis More, but Anis More historically, you know, has grown through acquisitions. And this is, you know, potentially something that could be on that roadmap going forward. And that's where, you know, the flexibility comes in.

Super. Thank you.

You're welcome.

The next question comes from Estelle Weingrad from JP Morgan. Please go ahead. Hi, good evening.

Is it working this time?

Yep.

Yes, okay, cool. Perfect. First question on the REFPA. We've seen an inflection in September, as you pointed to, but also in Q4 in the last STR data. Are you confident this regain momentum can be sustained over the quarter? Also a question on France. I mean, there's lots of things going on there. likely having an impact on consumer sentiment, perhaps, as we've seen in the Q3 data. How is it evolving at the moment? Any colors, I don't know, on the books into the year end? And also a question, last one, on any small as well. I mean, I always thought that there could be some potential dis-synergies in terms of cost duplication and that could be an issue. Can you explain what's driving the announcement today in that regard? And clearly it's been talked about for a little while, but I thought maybe it would be something to be considered at the end of the CEO mandate, perhaps. Thank you.

Hi, Estelle. Sure. So, yeah, in terms of REF PAR, I mean, we're encouraged by the month of September. And our view today is that we should sustain that rate of growth pretty much in the third quarter. October probably will be our strongest months in that quarter. And so far, October is looking good. With respect to France, frankly, our view on France right now is that it's a relatively flattish environment. That's what we've seen in September. And we don't see uh, any particular, uh, uh, you know, change, uh, or, or factor that would, you know, that would, that would change that. I mean, it's basically very, you know, it's basically a soft environment for the reasons you can, uh, you can imagine. Now on any small, uh, what, uh, you know, in, in, in, we do not, you know, we, we, uh, again, uh, we will remain the controlling shareholder of Anismore and Anismore will continue to benefit from the platforms that I call on mainly loyalty. So actually, you know, any potential listing of Anismore will not in and of itself create the synergies from what Anismore is today. And in terms of the timing, again, the timing has to do with some liquidity windows that minority shareholders had and that we had to essentially abide by.

Okay, thank you. Before we take our next question, as a reminder, if you wish to ask a question, please dial pound key 5 on your telephone keypad. The next question comes from Alex Brignall from Rothschild and Co. Redburn. Please go ahead. Alex Brignall, your line is now unmuted. Please go ahead. The next question comes from Migna Abrall from BlackRock. Please unmute your microphone. As a reminder, if you wish to ask a question, please dial pound key 5 on your telephone keypad. The next question comes from Andre Joulard from Deutsche Bank Equity Research. Please go ahead.

Good evening. Thank you for taking my question. I had more or less the same question than Estelle asked you about. I just wanted to better understand what you are thinking about in terms of potential spin-off or independent listing and what it would imply in terms of shareholding because saying that you want to keep the majority stake in any small means that you would keep 50.1% or more considering that you have 62. And what about the other shareholders? What about the idea behind that considering that any small is not a really independent group at the moment?

Thank you. It doesn't work that way.

I'm sorry, but I'm not sure he listened to you. Did you hear the answer of the speaker, please? Can you tell us? André, can you tell us if you hear the answer of the speaker? Yeah, yeah, I hear you. Did you hear the answer to your question? Thank you.

The next question comes from Alex Brignall from Rothschild and Co. Redburn. Please go ahead.

Good afternoon. Can you hear me this time?

Yep, can hear you well, Alex.

I think it might be using Teams. Let's tell people not to use Teams in future. I'm on a real phone now. Thank you. So the first question, H1 or Q2, one of the big questions, I think Jamie brought it up, was on revenue timing against RevPAR and NUG. they broadly match this quarter. And you've obviously, you talked about residence fees already, but there's probably a suggestion that a bit of the unwind and the negative timing of H1 would come through. Is that really the same answer as the residence fees? And so should Q4 sort of give back some of the myths on the timing that came through in Q2? And then the second question is on the reimbursed costs, obviously incredibly helpful to now have that detail. One of the big areas of difference that happened during COVID was that the sort of STO piece or what name it had back then, obviously had a big negative during COVID, whereas for the US groups, they broadly stayed even. So I guess my question is, did the negative impact from that line item during COVID, was that all the smdl piece um was reimbursed costs kind of do you always run it exactly to zero every every year or is there still times when it wouldn't and should we kind of think about outside of adjusted ebitda as as the us groups reported and then the third question if i dare um conversions hilton talks a lot about um well they got a new conversion product that they're pushing and they talked a lot about really the opportunity outside the us which can be diagnosed as a lack of growth opportunity in the US. But as it relates to your own growth, which is obviously a lot of it is not in the US, how are you feeling about the brand mix and the conversion versus new build dynamics? Thank you so much.

Thanks, Alex. So on your first question, yes, I think what we shared in our H1 call was that, again, those timing elements that obviously were headwinds in the first half would reverse in the second half. And so resident fees, again, will be slightly up on a full year basis and all the growth will be in the second half. In terms of the, in terms of the reimbursed costs and SMDL, so during, reimbursed costs fundamentally, you know, are, you know, zero, you know, zero EBITDA activity. You know, if you don't have the, if you don't have the payroll costs, you basically don't have those revenue, neither do you have those, neither do you have those costs. So, you know, during COVID, that line was also at, you know, at zero and all the, you STO loss that took place during COVID was really the SMDL activities. And, you know, going forward, which is why we, you know, provided that midterm guidance, we do expect SMDL EBITDA to be contributing to the overall growth of the EBITDA for our core. And on your last questions, conversions are a very important part of our growth. Again, 56% year-to-date, 60% last year. And therefore, we believe that the conversions will continue to be the majority of our openings. With respect to the brands, we already have some conversion brands in the portfolio. And we think we have the right, let's say, basket of brands. to drive those conversions going forward. We have a brand which is handwritten, which is actually a good example of a conversion brand that we are going to push probably more aggressively going forward. And this is actually the brand that will be on the Las Vegas property that is scheduled to open in the fourth quarter.

Brilliant. Thank you so much.

You're welcome.

André, Julia, we are going to answer back to your question because apparently you didn't listen to me. You didn't hear it.

Sorry. André? OK. So I believe your question was on any small. So what I, you know, what I say is that, you know, one, it's, you know, obviously, it's, you know, we're evaluating the potential of listing any small, we will, you know, remain the controlling, controlling shareholder. If that transaction were to take place, there's an expectation that all shareholders would contribute to that transaction. And I'm not going to comment further of what that would mean for Accor in particular.

As a last reminder, if you wish to ask a question, please dial pound key 5 on your telephone keypad. There are no more questions at this time, so I hand the conference back to the speakers for any closing remarks.

Well, thank you, everyone. Thank you for your questions. And thank you for listening into this third quarter call from our call. And I wish everybody a good rest of the day. Thanks.

Thank you. The conference is over. You may now disconnect.