d'Amico International Shipping S.A.

Good afternoon. This is the Coruscall Conference Operator. Welcome and thank you for joining the D'Amico International Shipping Full Year 2023 Results Conference Call. As a reminder, all participants are in listen-only mode. After the presentation, there will be a Q&A session. For operator assistance via web call, please press the headset icon on the bottom left side of your screen. For conference call assistance, please press star zero on your telephone. At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Mr. Paolo D'Amico, Chairman and CEO. Please go ahead, sir.

Thank you. Hello, welcome to everybody. Good afternoon. Thank you for joining us on our call for the 2023 results. We go straight to the presentation. And I leave the floor to our CFO, Carlos Balaiz-Frenway, to start the job. Thank you, Carlos.

Thank you, Paolo, and good afternoon to everyone. As usual, we start with the slide here where we give a quick glance at our team composition, which is, as at the end of the year, was still composed of 36 vessels with BMRs representing the large majority of these vessels, 24, and then we co-presence in the other one and many side segments. As some of you that follow us closely probably saw, we announced the sale of a vessel recently, the Amanda Medley, at a very strong price and it was the oldest owned vessel in our fleet. 2010 built and we sold it for 27.4 million. So our fleet has changed slightly since then. We also, we delivered a vessel which was on time charter in, which was also a very old vessel which we had on time charter in. following a sale and time charter back deal many years ago. So we have an increasingly, I would say, modern fleet as we sell and deliver some of our older vessels. And going on to the following slide, we show our CapEx commitments as we the investments, the main investment last year was related to the exercise of the purchase option on the TCM vessel, the High Explorer, for around $29.8 million. We also had quite a lot of maintenance capex last year, around $12 million. This figure goes slightly down for the following two years, where it is pretty stable at around $9 million before it increases slightly in 2026. We don't have, as of today, other investments planned, but we will talk a bit more about that later. But there's a highlight that we will be exercising purchase options on other TC investors going forward. Here we show bank debt repayments. We have reimbursed at the end of last year a few of our more expensive loans, and therefore our annual repayments have fallen for the next two years. It's around $27 million. We don't have any values to refinance before 2026. Bank debt repayments have been falling quite fast on the right hand side as we have exercised some vessels which were previously bubble charted in and we have kept these debt free. And we were quite active in that respect last year. Going on to the following slide here we show And as you see from the table on the left, there were five of these options exercise last year. And so we now only have three options that can be exercised. One could have been exercised in March this year, but we decided not to do so and wait until next year. The next opportunity to exercise this option is in September 25. It's effectively a purchase obligation, and therefore we will be exercising the option at that date. The reason we did an exercise early is that the implicit cost of funds of this facility is very low, and it's better for us to keep it going. On the other two options, we plan to exercise them at the first opportunity, so the high discovery in September 24 and high fidelity in September 25. They are not particularly expensive deals, financing transactions, we were lucky to negotiate these transactions just before interest rates started moving up quite quite aggressively. So here we have the time chart that in vessels I was referring to previously on the left hand side those which were already exercised and on the right hand side those that we can still exercise and we are likely to be exercising two of these this year. and the remaining two next year. So I think they are all well in the money. And given the current market conditions and the outlook for the market, it makes sense for us to exercise them early. So that's the plan. Going on to the following slide, here we show our contract coverage. And it's slightly higher this year than it was last year. The average rates for these contracts throughout the year, it's pretty stable at around 28,000. dollars per day. And overall, we have 54% of our available vessel days of 24 kelp. Higher percentage coverage. There is some background noise. Somebody maybe left a microphone open. 40% falling to 23% in Q4, 24. And then next year, we only have 30% of our available days covered. At the bottom of the slide, we show the percentage of our fleet, which is Echo. And this also has been steadily rising and there's another step up this year with the percentage of the trees, which is rising from 78 to 84%. Also because of the sale of the . Here we show instead, we give some highlights of how we are performing in this first quarter of 2024. I'm glad to say that the performance has been, this shouldn't be surprising given the market has been very strong in our performance. Therefore also, we on the spot market, we achieved an average rate of over 38,000, 38,250. on the days already fixed, which represent 53% of the available days in the quarter. We have another 40% of our available days in the quarter which are fixed through time-chartered contracts at an average rate of 28,150, which gives us a blended rate of almost 34,000 for 94% of the available days in the quarter. We have a very good visibility of our earnings in the Q1 of this year, and it's looking very good and stronger than Q1 last year. So it's a very good start of the year for us. And going on to the following slide here, So we show some graphs which give an idea of what our results could look like this year and in the following two years. On the bottom left, we show the profits on the days which are already fixed, both type charters and spot, which means that if in the remaining three days we work to break even, our profits for the year 2024 would be of around 93 million already which is already a very strong result only after only two months and a half into the year but if we instead were to fix the remaining three days at an average rate of 25 000 per day our profit for the year would be of around 152 million dollars if we were to fix these remaining three days at $30,000 per day, on average, our profits for the year would be off $184 million. So it looks as though 2024 is also going to be a very strong year for us. And going on to the costs. from, as we have seen in our previous quarterly presentations, and as was widely expected, there was quite a sharp increase in costs this year. We are not the only sector who has experienced this inflationary pressure. I would say that the inflationary pressure was present pretty much across the board for all from major cost items, but it was particularly pronounced for crew costs, also because of a lower availability of Ukrainian crew. Also on our vessels, we have a number of Ukrainian officers in particular, and therefore, That was one of the factors which contributed to this increase in costs. But we also saw quite a big increase in insurance costs as we had to insure our vessels at higher levels to reflect the increase in their values over the last few years. On the G&A front, there was a sharp increase this year, which is linked mostly to the increase in variable compensation, reflecting the strong performance of the company in 2022 and even more so in 2023. And so it is linked to the long-term incentive plan and short-term compensation for targets which were reached. And of course this additional compensation would largely disappear if markets for some reason were to weaken. um going on to the uh to the following slide uh we show here our leverage situation which has improved remarkably um at the end of 19 the ratio between the net financial position and market value was at 73 percent at the end of last year uh end of 22 it was at 36 percent And at the end of 23, it had fallen to 18%. And so we have today a very strong balance sheet. Cash and cash equivalents at the end of the year were at 111 million. But since then, it has already increased quite a bit because of the very strong performance in the first quarter this year. And going on to the following page, we show here the key line items of the P&L. Q4 was not our strongest quarter, I would say, but still we managed to achieve a profit of almost $44 million. Trading was a bit weaker, especially in the first part of the quarter, but then I would say second half of November and December, as is usually the case, was quite strong. And thanks to this result in Q4, we were able to achieve an overall profit for the year of $192 million, which excluding non-recurring items is almost $187 million. Moving on to the following slide, we show here instead the daily results for our vessels employed on the spot market and on type charter contracts. We see that Q1 was the strongest quarter of the year, 36,650, which as I previously mentioned is lower than the average rate we have achieved so far on the spot market in Q1 this year. The remaining quarters, the results we achieved were pretty stable on the spot market, actually, despite quite a lot of volatility during the year at high levels, but we averaged almost the same in Q1 and Q2 and Q3, around 31,750. and then 31,000 in Q4 for a blend for an average for the year of 32,900 on the spot market, which coupled with our coverage at an average rate of 28,100 left or blended rates for the year of 31,450. And now I pass it over to Paolo for the market overview.

Thank you, Carlos. So basically, since the invasion of Ukraine, freight rates and value, ship value went on, increased quite a lot. Probably freight increased faster than the values of ship. But I have to say, as we talk today, probably also value has gone really to an high level. And I think the prize we achieved on our Atlanta shirt, which is a 14 year old shirt at 27.4 is the proof of it. But looking at the market it is, we have on top of positive fundamentals that the tanker industry had before, we have three elements of disruption, improved of course the yearnings the first one and is the oldest one is the russian and ukraine war due to that as you know europe sanctioned the russian exports since february 2023 so russian uh i remember you that um russia is was the first supplier of diesel oil to europe and europe is the biggest market of diesel in the world now russia is a few days steaming from europe stopping supplying stopping the supply from russia europe had to resupply yourself by far away, like Middle East, Far East some ways, and even in the United States. This already increased the ton mile a lot. In the meantime, Russian exports had to go to India, to China, to Turkey. Okay, this has not been affected because this trade is affecting, let's say, our market only as far as the price can. Of course, it's outside the price cap which is touching us. So this is the first trade disruption that you know very well. The second one has been the Red Sea situation. Due to it, all the reputable owners are avoiding the Red Sea and the Suez Canal. We are moving south of Africa. This means 14 days longer trips. This means another ton mile increase. I would say the result of this are becoming more and more, becoming stronger and stronger than what we were forecasting. So it is a bigger, let's say, effect of what we thought. And the third one is the Panama Canal. as you know the panacana cannot for an environmental reason it's lack of water basically had to limit the transit slots so less and less ship are passing through now probably they are going to increase again but up to now the effect that we had here is that all the west coast of the american continent so from Canada West Coast all the way down to Chile, they had to supply themselves from the Far East. So we had more and more trips out of the Far East, Korea, Japan, China, Singapore, to the West Coast of the United States, to Peru, to Chile. And these, as you can imagine, are by far longer And here again, the ton mile elements start growing. On the demand of oil, the world increased. The global oil demand decreased by 2.3 million barrels in the full year 23 to 101.8 billion barrels per day. The IEA expects global demand to grow by a further 1.2 million for the full year 2024, and the global refining throughput increased by 1.5 million barrels per day in 2023, with probably another million coming in in 2024. On the supply side, even if we have the casks from OPEC+, the oil producers outside OPEC have been increasing their production on the united states in 2023 increased by a million barrel and they are supposed to increase this year by another half million and offsetting basically the cut at open in force the refined product inventories are at the lowest level over the five years average which you so we we must expect an increase in resupply the middle district cracks are high level due to oil demand so we we can expect a lot and here again we go back a lot to the to the diesel trade, which is the biggest one of all the oil products trade. Nafta and diesel will lead the demand in 2024. The demand was, the leader last year was more jet fuel. Jet fuel this year is probably going to have stopped because the airplane manufacturers cannot deliver planes the way they should. So the airlines are probably going to cancel a lot of flights. You know very well about the problems that are affecting today. The crew tanker market is very well supported. For us it's important because We have the LR2 segment, which is a sweeping segment from crude to clean. With a crude strong market, ships tend to stay, if they are already dirty, they tend to stay in the dirty trade. The long-term demand is healthy. The share of products in seaborne Refining the seaborne oil trade is 25% and it stays there. The growth of refining capacity worldwide is outplaced because it's all concentrated in Middle East, in India and China. So far away from consuming market. U.S. Shell is still growing even if this year this forecast is going to grow at less speed than last year. So on the demand side we have a lot of elements of positive elements for our industry. But if we go to the supply side We see that vast, first of all, the number of forces that will push inefficient and old ships to demolition, because even if it's only limited to Europe, we have all the various indexes coming in force. And on top of that, we have the European emission trading system, which this year is still free of charge. We start paying next year. And going on is going to be the most expensive cost of the old borrower's cost, more than even bankers. Going on, the candidates for demolition, looking at demolition from 20 years of age going onwards, they are increasing. a lot the deliveries in the coming months are very low and will keep will stay at this level for quite a while we are going to have some deliveries next year but nothing is marginal against the overall picture the new building orders are rising but they are still limited as i said also because they are expensive and um People are worried about the technology to be used on new ships and also the deliveries are very much in the future because today we are not talking about anything earlier than 2027. So the fleet, the final result is a very slow and limited fleet growth. So if we had this supply picture to the demand picture that we have been talking before. Of course, things are, they look quite positive for the industry itself. Thank you.

As usual, here we have our last slide with the end of presentation where we look at our NAB. And once again, it has risen since our last update. And we are now at, at the end of the year, we were at $993 million. And on a per share basis in dollars, we were at 8.23 NAB per share. And so we are still trading at quite a big discount to our NAB. And of course, with the results that we have been achieving in the first quarter this year, we expect our NAB to have risen firmly. I think that's basically it in terms of our presentation. And we pass it over to you for the Q&A session.

This is the Coruscant Conference operator. We will now begin the question and answer session. To enter the queue for questions, please click on the Q&A icon on the left side of your screen and then press the raise your hand button. Please do not mute your microphone locally and when prompted make sure you turn on your webcam in the pop-up window. If you are on the phone instead, please press star 1 on your keypad. The first question is from Matteo Bonizzoni of Kepler. Please go ahead.

Yes, thank you. Good afternoon. I have three questions. The first question is regarding the size of your fleet. and also the age of your fleet. So if you go back five years in 2018, your fleet was more than 50 vessels. Now it's 36, it's going down to 31 by 2026. So all in all, this means around a 40% decline of the size of your ship. At the same time, the age of your ship is still younger because it's 8.5 years and it's predominantly composed of ecovessel. But let's say that it's going to be gradually up. My question is, what is your approach to capital allocation in relation to rejuvenation of your fleet and potential expansion? Are you ready to consider that, or maybe you have said that it's too expensive to build fleets, there is a technological uncertainty, and so you are still going to remain on hold on this capital allocation and CapEx decision for the next quarter? This is the first question. The second question regards the coverage strategy which you have. You have increased the coverage for 2024 to more than 30%. But 2025, for example, which is still far away, is only 13%, I think. So still low. But the question is, are you in a hurry, let's say, or let's say, are you willing to significantly increase the level of your coverage given that the rates continue to be very healthy? And maybe there could be opportunity to do so at good condition. or you are going to proceed to go ahead slowly in that direction. The third and last question relates to the evolution of your cost base. We have seen in 2023 an increase, I would say, for the G&A cost, pretty significant. I think it's mostly related to the variable remuneration, if you can a little bit elaborate on that. But also on the operating costs, we have seen an increase for the reason which we have also explained. What's the outlook for operating costs and G&E costs for 2024? Thanks.

I pick up the first one and I leave the second referred to Carlos. We realize very much the evolution of the fleet. It's a discussion that Carlos and myself, we have basically on a daily basis. and we are looking at whatever opportunities are around. Of course, today is easier, let's put it this way, today is easier to be a seller than to be a buyer, so when we had the opportunity to sell the Glenda vessel, we did so, because it was a number which, to my experience, is quite unique. Of course, we are looking for a replacement of that Glenda ship. You cannot do everything in the same manner. So we have to look around with what are possible candidates and see if it is today the moment to move on or not. The same time we are looking, of course, to shipyards. As I said, we have two elements. One, yes, they are... They are expensive, but in the overall picture of a fleet of 36 plus ships, you can afford also a more expensive, let's say, choice. Technological is a limit. Personally, we think that there is still space for at least one generation of new ships traditionally built and with traditional engines. Of course, traditional engine doesn't mean that we go back to the old heavy fuels. It means that probably we are going to burn more and more biofuels. We are going to implement less and less consumption systems. So we are going to use... The thing is, I don't think nobody is really ready to jump from the fuel system to ammonia or God knows what. You will see a lot of announcement on the press of... Ammonia ready or methanol ready or whatever. Yes, ready is a shape, a shape which really runs on methanol, excluding fuel, container vessel, they do not really exist. So we look to new building and we are trying to understand what is the most or the best opportunity for the company. And of course, we are looking also for replacement of what we are selling. I leave to Carlos the rest of it.

Yeah, thanks for the questions. In relation to the coverage strategy, it is true that there are currently attractive opportunities to take even more coverage than we have done so far. And we have now, as I mentioned, around 34%. available days covered at an average rate of 28,000. The good news here is that we have covered mostly our handy size. So relative to last year, we have a higher proportion of our LR fleet, which is exposed to the spot market. And this was an intentional strategy by us because we, given the the tightness of the market we are experiencing today. At the time we approached renewal of these contracts, we felt that the levels at which we could have renewed some of our TC contracts for LR1s were not attractive enough and did not reflect properly the market fundamentals. I would say that so far this year, this strategy has proven right. It's a bit early to be sure that we made the right decision in this respect, but we have seen a strong outperformance by the other ones in the first few months of this year. And that also explains the very strong result, average results on the spot market we have achieved so far. And hopefully that will support our earnings going forward for the rest of this year. We do have charters reaching out to us that want to take PESOS on time charter and sometimes at very attractive rates. We are open to evaluating opportunities as they arise, but we are also quite happy today with the coverage we have. And given the very strong outlook for the market, we are happy to report the spot exposure we have, and we think they're going to do very well in the spot market this year. on the GNA front and on the costs front in general. On the optics side, we do not expect costs to increase markedly this year. We expect a more organized increase in costs. of around, I would say, two to three percent in direct operating costs. On the GNA front, instead, since a lot of increase last year was linked to the very strong results achieved last year, I would say that the if we do confirm this year that the same strong results we achieved last year, the GNA was probably the same at more or less the same level. But of course, if results was slightly weaker, possibly the GNA could actually be lower this year than it was last year. So that is the

I hope that answers your question. Yeah, thank you very much. Once again, if you wish to ask a question, please press Q&A on the left bar and send your request or press star 1 on your telephone. The next question is from Michele Monbelli of Equitasim. Please go ahead.

Hey, hello. Thanks for the presentation. I wanted to ask you something related to the remuneration on top of the dividend maybe. If you're thinking of something related to the buyback in 2024, if you thought about something related to that. I mean, that's mainly my question.

Thank you a lot.

Yeah, thank you for the question, Michele. I think that what we referred to, I think we didn't cover this in our presentation, but of course it's an important point. There was a proposed dividend by the board to be approved by the AGM of $13 million. which is higher than the proposed dividend last year, or the approved, finally approved dividend last year, which was of $22 million. Last year, we also paid an interim dividend at the end of the year of $20 million. So what we have been mentioning to the market is, okay, although we don't have an explicit dividend policy, our intention is to distribute a higher proportion of our earnings as we did average our balance sheet. So now that we have achieved more or less what were our objectives in terms of the leveraging, the company is happy to reward increased, let's say the cash returns to its shareholders. Last year, we were quite active on the buyback front. We bought back shares worth 6.4 million euros. We were active, especially when the share price showed some weakness, which we felt was not justified when we saw that there was really an opportunity to make a good investment on that front. We think our shares are still a very good investment, but the reason we have slowed down, more recently stopped on the share buyback front is mostly linked to the liquidity of our shares. The controlling shareholder already has a big participation in the company and we also have quite a few shares which were repurchased. and therefore the free float is not that important and we don't want it to fall further. But nonetheless, we are open to pursuing further repurchases and we have a mandate that allows us to repurchase. We have an authorization which allows us to repurchase up to 15% of the shares issued. And therefore, there's a lot of room for us to do more in that respect. So if the share price were to show some weakness again this year at a certain point, which we feel is not justified, very likely we will be intervening to support the share price to repurchase it. And as I mentioned on the dividend front, the expectation is that this year, if the market, if we do as well as we did last year, we should be distributing more dividends than we distributed last year. And we are starting already now with this proposed dividend, which is already quite a bit higher than that which we approved in April last year.

Thank you. Thanks a lot.

Thank you. The next question is from Climent Mullins of Value Investors Edge. Please go ahead.

Good morning. Thank you for taking my questions. I wanted to follow up on the question on the dividend. Including the distribution declared today, you ended up distributing around 30% of 2023 annual net income via both dividends and repurchases. And by your latest commentary, it seems additional dividends are to be expected going forward. Is it fair to expect an increase in the percentual payout as well?

Sorry, can you please repeat?

Yes, sorry about that. In the percentual payout.

In the percentage? Yes, I would say so. I think that's correct. I would say that if we do, the idea is that as we deleverage, we can pay out a higher percentage of our of our profits. Of course, we don't have, also one of the reasons we don't have an explicit dividend policy is because we want to be able to also move opportunistically as opportunities arise. And there was also a question today relating to capital allocation and to the fact that our fleet fallen quite a bit since 2018. And therefore at a certain point, yes, we will look to make more investments, probably not major investments as Paolo was saying at this point in the cycle, but some opportunistic investments to at least ensure that our fleet doesn't decrease any further from where it is today, are, let's say, in the table. And therefore, the dividends that we will end up distributing would also have to factor in these other capital allocation priorities that we have.

Makes sense. Thanks for the call. Thank you for taking my questions and congratulations for the quarter.

Thank you.

Thank you. The next question is from Daniele Alibrandi of Stiefel. Please go ahead.

Yes, good afternoon. Thanks for taking my question. Actually, they were already taken, so just maybe an update, if you can, on the order book of the new build sheets, if you can highlight when the Most of the ships will come out, will come to kick into the market. I understood that it was in late 2025, but just an update on this.

Thank you. Sorry, the question is relating to the order book.

Yes, exactly. The general order book and when do you expect, if you have more visibility. when the new ships will come to the market, understood late 2025, beginning of 2026, but just to understand if you're seeing a pickup or what's the situation there.

I would like to, maybe we can go back to a few slides of the presentation, which I think are helpful in answering this question. On... Here, I think this slide here is, I think, quite helpful. I mean, we see here that the order book, yes, it did increase relative to the end of 2022, where we were at the record low of 3.5% in the segments we operate in. It's now at 7.7%. Now, what happened is that the fleet continued aging in the meantime. So at the end of 22, we had 7.2% of the fleet, which was more than 20 years old. But now February 24, we have 10.8% of the fleet, which is more than 20 years old. So the gap between the percentage of fleet, which was more than 20 years in the order book was at 3.7% at the end of 22. And now it's at 3.1%. pretty stable, despite the order book having more than double, this gap is pretty stable, which means that we don't expect, we expect very limited fleet growth going forward. I think that the graph at the bottom, I think is also quite interesting. This is a bit longer term because we look at potential demolitions here from 25. So we are looking at vessels which turn 25 years of age from 2025. And we see that there is this sharp increase starting from 2027 in the vessels turning 25 years of age. Now, product tankers can and occasionally do trade beyond 25 years of age. They rarely trade beyond 27 and a half. After the 15 years of age, they have to stop every two and a half years for special surveys. So they usually surround those dates that you see demolitions, deciding when the vessels reach. In a very bad market, it's when they reach their special survey around 22 and a half years, or an average market around 25. In a very good market, occasionally some vessels, if they have been well kept, can reach 27 and a half. But also given the regulations we referred to previously, unless we are in an exceptionally strong market as we are today, where we are seeing very little being demolished, we expect that most likely, you know, as these vessels reach 25, a lot of them will be demolished. And so we will have this very sharp increase in demolitions. Now, if you look at the slide, you have 5.2 million deadweight tons in 2028, for example, which are going to be reaching 25 years of age. And in 2029, you have 7.7 million deadweight tons. So these are very big figures. And if you look at here, so in 25 you have 4 million deadweight tons which is so it's much more than 2024 but it's 4 million deadweight tons it's less than the vessels turning 25 in 2028 and it's much less than the vessels turning 25 in 2029 so it's it is going to be very difficult for the yards, in our opinion, to deliver enough vessels to compensate for the vessels that will need to be demolished over the coming years. The fleet growth in the sectors we operate in in 25 is we estimate a small pickup in demolition in 25 because of the very limited demolition we have seen over the last few years, but still at quite low levels. And that would translate to a feed growth of around 1.5%. Okay, we don't have LR2s here. We are not present in that sector. It's true that if you look at the LR2 order book, it's more important than the other sectors of the product type. of the product anchors, but it's also true that LR2s are a bit of a different animal because they compete a lot with the Afromax generally, where the order book is much more limited because they switch between dirty and clean trades. And if you look at the order book for the crude tanker fleet, it's at a very low level. Overall, it's at 4.6%, so it's still very close to the historical minimum reached at the end of 2023. So I think that the supply picture is very good. And as Paolo was saying, if you order vessels today, it's for delivery at, maybe there are some yards you can still deliver end of 26, but in most cases it's 2027 and possibly even the end of 2027. so it's uh the deliveries are which this order book which is already not particularly big is actually going to be delivered over many years um and therefore fleet growth should be really very limited and we could even go i think from 2028 onwards into a fleet contraction mode because yard capacity is unlikely to increase significantly it actually fell quite a bit over the last few years after many bad years for yards where they were losing a lot of money. And therefore, we don't think that they are going to now change their mind and start increasing capacity quite fast. It's not going to be an easy decision for them to revert to now or go back to increasing capacity.

Understood. Thank you very much.

The next question is from Tin Hang Tang. Please go ahead.

Just to follow up on the questions regarding diffidence, I would like to know whether we should expect any quarterly diffidence going forward or whether the diffidence will continue to be declared on a semi-annual basis. Thank you.

No, we don't. We look at this possibility because some of our investors, particularly in the US, they would prefer to receive dividends on a quarterly basis, and they are used to receiving, in some cases, dividends on a quarterly basis. But we are not contemplating this possibility, but we will be distributing dividends twice yearly. That's our plan. So dividends, the annual dividends that we distribute in April, around the end of April, following the approval by the AGM, and an interim dividend usually distributed around November, end of November, like we did last year.

Understood, thank you.

As a reminder, If you wish to register for a question, please press Q&A on the left bar and raise your hand, or press star 1 on your telephone. For any further questions, please press Q&A on the left bar and raise your hand, or press star 1 on your telephone. Gentlemen, there are no more questions registered at this time. Back to you for any closing remarks.

Okay, thank you for joining us at this call, and I hope to hear you at our next call in a few months. Thank you very much. Thank you.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining. The conference is now over. You may disconnect your devices. Thank you.