Grasim Industries Limited

Ladies and gentlemen, good morning and welcome to the Q4 FY25 conference call of Grazie Mitashvi. As a reminder, all partisan lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star, then zero on your touch-tone phone. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Angit. Panch Matya, Head of Investor Relations. Please go ahead. Yeah, thank you, Rai. A very good morning to everyone. And on behalf of the Asim Industries, I would like to welcome all of you to our fourth quarter financial year 2025 results and business performance discussion. Hope you have got a chance to refer to our previous presentation and press release uploaded on our website and exchanges. Before we begin, I would just want to draw your attention to the disclaimer statement which is covered in the last slide of our presentation. Let me now introduce you to our management team present here with us on the call. We have with us Mr. Raman Kishapanya, Managing Director, Classroom Industries and Business Head, Birla Upad, RTI Business. And Mr. Pawan Jain, Chief Financial Officer, Classroom Industries. We also have with us Mr. Daryl Goodley, Business Head, Good morning, how are you doing? to all the participants who have joined this call from different geographies. I welcome you to Graphene Industries Quarter 4 FY25 Investor Call. It's an honour to be chosen as the Managing Director of Graphene Industries. Originally a textile company, Graphene Industries has captured an extraordinary path of growth, innovation and diversification over the last 28 years to become India's conglomerates with strong presence in textiles, chemicals, building materials and other industries. I joined the Arisabilla group in the telecom business in 1997. At that stage, the group was 2 billion US dollars in revenue and dollar convergence was Rs.36 with presence in textiles, aluminium and stock of cement, telecom, fashion, financial services and other businesses. In the last 28 years, under the leadership of Mr. Kumar Mangalam Dilla, the group revenue has risen to 66 billion US dollars and the dollar conversion is 85, thereby growing by 30 times at constant currency. This superlative growth has been driven by a. Believing in India and global growth story b. Combination of building scale in existing business and successfully diversifying to newer sectors. Similarly, the story of grassroots transformation, which has delivered consistent 15% year-to-year over a long period of 15 years, is akin to India's growth story. The company has incorporated multiple startups and seen through its journey until the unit becomes a force in itself. India is witnessing an unprecedented economic boom. has captivated the world's imagination. Very few countries in the world today have a multi-decadal runway of high growth or Amritkal as our prime minister calls it. Our economy is truly and well poised to hit the 10 trillion dollar mark in the next decade or so. The scale of our mission is now being matched by the scope of the infrastructure evolution set to unfold. I would argue We are not in just infrastructure development phase, but in Asian building. And the grassroots diversified businesses are all set to play a pivotal role as the heart of this monumental nation building endeavor. Our treatment from Alta Tech fortifies the expanding highways. Our pheromonic branch like IWA and ISIL power from inside the fractions for the new continent India. Our chemical business supports varied applications across metal, construction, textile, pharmaceutical and energy. Our renewables are making India more sustainable and our financial services from Al-Fadila capital give wings to aspirational consumers. In the last 18 months With the launch of B2B e-commerce business, Billa Pivots, and the recent launch of our paint business, Billa Offers, Graphing embodies the spirit of an aspirational India. This India, teeming with dynamism, audacity, and penchant for destruction, finds reflection in both our paint and B2B business. In fact, these ventures mirror India's risk for innovation and its refusal to settle for status quo. In 2020, at the peak of COVID, when our group chairman asked me to lead Grassland 4A into change, I wondered, why change? With a beam in both our eyes, we found the answer lay in the backdrop of India's booming infrastructure, the construction sector. This sector alone is poised to command 9% of GDP, translating to 900 billion US dollars in around 10 years. Drafting deep insights into building material ecosystems found over the years through brands like Alta Tech and Jilla White offered us a unique vantage point. Our journey into paint industry, therefore I discovered, was a strategic extension connecting the dots from the foundation to the facade across Indian homes. I also discovered that this 5-century-old decorative paint industry, India's first extra consumption, stands at a near 3.5 kg. This contrasts Sharpe with global average of 10 kg per capita and drops against 25 kg per capita of West nations. For a country at a forefront of economic acceleration, India ranks at bottom 10% of the paying commercial. This reminds me of my telecom stint when India liberalized telecom services in 1990 But till the mid of 2010 and even after 25 years, India was amongst the bottom 10 percent of broadband services adoption. However, when large-scale industries came in to build school capacities ahead of demand and industries focused on affordability, quality, technology and coverage, India rose to a numero uno, the highest broadband usage in the world and the second largest in terms of number of mobile subscribers in the globe, helping India in its inclusive or pervasive digital journey. Therefore, in the context of change, this represents a galactic opportunity. With rising per capita income, a young population, a booming real estate As a short-term repainting cycle, the potential for growth in paint consumption is immense. With all these factors, Grassland's board in 2021 made a long-term commitment to decorative paint business with a vision to redefine the industry with consumer-centric programs and practices. They empowered us with Rs. 10,000 crore investment to prepare for tomorrow with a single-mile diversity. purpose to revolutionize the decorative range business and pass on the fruits of competition to the consumers. The paint sector is at the top of a similar transformative impact which will turn India's Prakash into a beautiful place loved by one and all. When I look back at the last four years work especially the last six months, I can say with pride on behalf of Birla Office team that no paint company globally has ever lost in one shot factories, operations, products and services at the scale that Birla Office has undertaken. So it's a matter of pride to share that in less than six months of Pan India operations, as per internal estimates, Birla Office by itself has become India's number three decorative paint brand. Well done team Villa Opus, aptly led by CEO Rakesh Harwari, a strong, committed and agile force of over 4700 employees and lakhs of partners in the paint ecosystem. The driving factors for this early success include number one, fastest capacity ramp up in the world with five out of six plants commercialized till March 2025. adding 1096 million litres per annum in short MLPA capacity in FY25, representing 21% share of the organised decorative paint capacity. All these plants are fully backward integrated with our own emulsion and resin polymer, key to delivering innovative product consistent quality and cost competitiveness. The company's main plant needs stringent sustainability norms and a climate finance compliance as per ISEE funding norms. Our final plant at Kharagpur is scheduled to be commercially launched in H1 at Y26, taking our overall capacity to 1,332 MNPA. Core Kharagpur plant launch will offer capacity shares of 24% in this sector will provide us the pathway to travel from existing high single-digit revenue market share to penultimate levels of capacity share. Further, at the existing plants, Birla offers its ability to add 400 to 500 MLPA incremental capacity with minimum cost whenever the need for the same arises. The industry is also undergoing a structural shift with consolidation of players through merger and acquisition and same is expected to reshape the competitive landscape. Number two, fastest availability of near complete portfolio of 176 products and 1250 plus FTOs. Villa offers is now competing across all six business categories in decorative frames including interior and exterior water based frames including distemper, enamel frames, wood finishes, water proofing solutions, and what effort and design are finished in the economy, premium and luxury price segments and institutional business. We are delighted with the response received on our quality of product from retail and institutional customers and ecosystem partners including architects, designers, contractors, trainers and dealers. Our luxury and premium products are now contributing more than 65% to the company's revenue, a to Birla offers quality of products. Our unique polymer synthesis process and hybrid composite polymer design has helped to create paints without staining, dirt resistance, crack visibility, film integrity, excellent durability, high scrub, highest whiteness, and such steps additions to name a few. 3. Wide and deep distribution reaching every corner of the country across 6,600 towns in India. A network of 137 depots delivers across 33 states and union territories, supporting just-in-time delivery for the dealer network. Also, Villa offers this upgrading to the consumer experience and its transforming security paint retaining by building most of its kind company experience stores known as Birla Office Paint Studio in the metros and franchise lip-sized stores across 300 plus towns known as Birla Office Paint Gallery. Our compact painting machine has healthy adoption across all users. Fourth, all-round positive feedback from all key users of our quality and acknowledgement of our exceptional paint performance features such as paint-resistant, impassable, spotless finishes, scatter-resistant, superior dust-resistant, extra washability, and enhanced coverage and capacity. Laps of painters and contractors encouraged with product quality, innovation features, and better economics have joined our exclusive painter and contractor app and are recommending Villa Office products. There is a quantum jump on the number of architects and interior designers' recommendations for Villa Office products after the carry of vigorous steps on matrices such as tactile feel, adhesions, aesthetics, finish and longevity. Equally strong response from institutional clients with a number of sites executed has crossed five-digit mark just in six months across cooperative houses, large and mid-sized builders, factories and industrial units, government projects, including tourist attractions and religious places. Finally, the new age villa office brand is seen as a challenger and fast establishing itself as an embodiment of India's rich heritage but modern, vibrant and technological innovation. Birla office incorporates thrust from the house of Birla, 20 essentially Indian with a beauty personified from over. A meaningful and memorable advertising campaign, heavily supported with a 360 degree media strategy has helped in an exponential jump of all brand-serious messages, specially unedited recalls top of mind awareness, etc. In summary, Grassin's paint venture represents the indomitable spirit of a startup, which can be epitomized through five Cs. Creativity, Courage, Contemporary, Choice, and Collaborative. With these guiding philosophies, Birla offers team genes to revolutionize every facet of the decorative paint industry and pass on the benefits to all stakeholders. Moving on, as you well aware, Altajet sells white cement based kurti under the Villa White brand. All decorative paints players include kurti sales in their overall decorative paints revenue and volume reporting. Villa Opus does not sell white cement based kurti. Therefore, on a night to light basis, graphene-organized decorative paints present exist quarter-four FY25 has crossed 10% revenue market share mark as per our internal estimates when revenues of Billa Offers and Billa White Kutty are combined. We will continue to track this metric. Separately, Billa White is aggressively expanding its Kutty manufacturing capacity with a recent announcement of acquisition by Ultratech of Wanda Worldcare Pvt. Ltd. With this acquisition, villa-wide foot tea and gas capacity at the Cope Lounge in FY26 will rise to 23 lakh metric tons, besides 16 lakh for wide-shrink manufacturing. Moving on to our digital venture, B2B e-commerce. In line with government's vision of creating digital India and empowering SME businesses, Birla Pivot has created a new age, high growth B2B e-commerce platform that helps them with procurement of raw materials across various sectors and catalyzes their growth by streamlining financing and supply chain gaps. Birla Pivot has made significant progress in FY25 across all fronts. such as technology, revenue scale-up, category diversification, digitization, and working capital management. Billa Pivot has crossed annual run rate of Rs. 5,000 crores based on Exit Waterport at Y25 in less than 2 years of inception and achieved a 3.3 times revenue growth over FY24. heartiest congratulations to Birla Pivot team, heavily led by CEO Mr. Sandeep Kumdavu. The Birla Pivot platform now holds a catalogue of more than 40,000 SUs across 300 plus brands and OEMs in 35 product categories with private-level portfolio of darkware, tiles and plywoods. Birla Pivot customer base spans top tier EPC companies, civil contractors, real estate developers, OEMs, fabricators, dealers, and retailers, etc. With successful deliveries of over 375 pieces across 26 states and union territories, Billa Pivot has established a robust network of suppliers and logistics providers who facilitate a very seamless fulfillment experience. Moving on, we have separately shared existing business performance including cellulose with fiber and yarn, chemicals, caustic and pressure lethany, textiles, insulators and others in the Q4 FY25 investor deck. Existing investors and analysts have already been tracking performance of these evolved businesses for a long time and are familiar with its journey and way forward. In summation, we are pleased to report that Grafton Standard of Revenue has risen to its highest level at Rs. 8,929 crore in Q4 FY25 an impressive Y&Y growth of 32%. This reflects the initial success of new businesses and sustained strength of our existing businesses. Further to that, on the ESP front, we are happy to share that Graphene was listed for the second time in a row in the HMP Global Sustainability Yearbook 2024. Graphene also won the Master of Risk Conglomerate Award in the last cap category at the India Risk Management Awards, 2025. In conclusion, as new to this role, IT rafting at the cusp of transformation with increasing share from consumer-oriented businesses. This is driven by the cost-moderate opportunity in the Indian economy and the values and purpose of the adjustable growth. Arasim now uniquely combines dynamism, frugality and energy of a new age startup businesses like Pinch and B2B, e-commerce along with muscle, reliability and brand strength of well established businesses in the textile, chemicals and energy spaces. We will not just grow but also nurture the ecosystem enriched lives and contributes to the foundational elements of New India. I take this opportunity I would also like to thank Mr. Pawan Jain for his superannuating on 15th August 2025 for his stellar role played in shaping Grafton's transformative journey. I would also like to welcome Mr. Hemant Yadav, a Grafton veteran and a colleague of Pawan who will take over from him as Grafton CFO from 16th August 2025. I will now hand over to Pawan to give details on his performance.

Thank you immensely for giving a detailed business review on the new businesses in the year gone by. I would like to end with our established core businesses, namely cement, cellulosic fibers and chemicals, continue to deliver strong performance. With market leadership across businesses, delivering quality products to meet customer requirements and healthy cash flows, the core businesses provide both stability and strategic leverage. Some estimates in the year gone by in respect to our core businesses are, number one, Alunosic Fiber has achieved highest ever annual revenue of Rs. 15,987 crore, growth of 6% YOY, primarily led by volume growth of 4%. However, the profitability of this business during the year was lower by 12% on YOY basis due to higher key low material prices, absorbed by the company partially. In Q4 and entering Q1, slight moderation in China's capacity utilization and higher inventory days have resulted in correction in global prices of cellulose fibers and at the same time, pulp prices have also started to drop. As approved by the board, the work on the first phase of lyophil fiber projects of 55,000 tons per annum out of a total plant capacity of 110,000 tons at Haria Karnataka, the work has commenced. The new plant is expected to be commissioned by mid-2027. In chemical business, while available capacities increased by 300 TPD expansion at Velayat plant in Q3 FY25, caustic cell volumes were lowered by 3% YYY due to planned shutdowns at Karwar and Gigi Puram for two days during the quarter. Moreover, higher negative chlorine relations due to continued oversupply and lower demand from end-user industries have moderated EQ growth. However, chlorine derivatives business performance is improving significantly with focused business development activities across products of portfolio. We enter FY26 with full available capacity of caustic and specialty chemicals. The projects of ETH and CPC plants at Zillai are expected to be commissioned around Q2 FY26. One highlight over the past three years, both Cellulosic, Cyber and Chemicals business combinedly have consistently delivered top line of over Rs. 30,000 crores with EBITDA of over Rs. 2,500 crores across cycles, reflecting the strength of these businesses. Cement business under Intratech has been growing with total capacity of up to at least Rs. 215 million with estimated EBITDA per ton saving of about Rs. 250 to Rs. 300 by 2027. In financial services business, with AUM now over 5 lakh crores, growth of 17% YOY and total lending portfolio of over 150,000 crores, growth of 27% YOY, Abhishek Mahesh Patel is one of the fastest growing ADFC in India with consistently growing revenue and profits. Happy to announce that the Board has approved a final dividend of Rs. 10 per share, reinforcing our legacy of consistent shareholder relocation. This marks the 62nd consecutive year of uninterrupted dividend payments. A testament to our financial strength, resilience and commitment to reward the shareholders through all business cycles. With this remark, I will now open the floor for questions.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchstone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use their handsets while asking a question. One moment, please, while we poll for questions. The first question comes from the line of Amit Purohit from Illara Capital. Please go ahead.

Yes, sir. Hi. Congratulations for the excellent performance and hitting the targeted market share that you indicated at the last call. Two things I wanted to understand. One, on the dealer counts, if you could highlight what would be at the exit of March 25th,

and how do you see that over the next say three years reaching dealer counts that's my first question okay so honest uh um like we said our objective was to hit six thousand uh lockdowns and try and draft close to fifty thousand dealers at the end of the first year So we are very close to where we had targeted and in terms of how do we look at it in the next couple of years, there is scope for more numerical dealer edition which we believe and you know there are dealers who want to join us, there are also territories which we have not covered but also along with that we will be converting it on the dealerships that we have created and extract more output shares from them.

Sure. And sir, on the comment that 65% of the portfolio is on the premium and luxury side, could you just provide some insights into it? Because, I mean, what we would understand is that if you have a a complete range of products but are you saying that in the emulsion segment as well the premium side or this also includes the waterproofing premium side or a boot finish premium and because that's a significant because what we understand is that the leader would also would have a limited premium when we look at the emulsion side of the portfolio because that market expense is small so just clarification on that will be helpful yeah

Okay, so you know the way we have a kind of portfolio is that most of the products that we have are powered under three sub-brands. One which is a Marjaneen brand, Kalista was his premium and Style which is the so-called economy brand. Now, we have a branding philosophy where even our enamels are branded either a Kalista or a Style. So, when we say this is not addressing only merchants, but this is addressing the premium and the luxury segment in all the categories where we play, where we have these sub-grants leading them. So, that's the clarification. It's not only for merchants.

Sure. Thank you. And any targeted market share guidance you would like to highlight right now for March 26th?

So, like we said, we have a team that works by class of high single digits. And for next year, the ambition is to be a double digit player. That's all we can say.

Okay. Thank you, sir.

Thank you. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we request you to restrict to two questions per participant. The next question comes from the line of Rahul Gupta from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Hi, thank you for taking my question. I have a couple of questions on cellulose business. I remember there was some disruption in third quarter. However, fourth quarter volumes are still much lower versus 2Q levels. Can you please help us extend what's happening over there? That's my first question.

Now, in terms of our volumes, the demand has been quite stable, except that in quarter 4, we had seen some minor drop in the demand in the Indian market. So, we actually had to increase our exports. So, we have not lost any capacity.

It's more about diverting some of this capacity to export markets. Plus, we also had increased certain speciality kind of products, because of which, you know, there is a certain change in the productivity levels, changeover, etc. So, there is no significant change in terms of our Of course, there are certain machines that can be taken for maintenance on a periodic basis. So, on a quarter to quarter, you would see certain kind of variations in resistance to volume.

My second question is that I see that your capex in the serialized business in fiscal 25 was much lower than what the management earlier targeted. How should we look at this for fiscal 26? And what kind of capacity can be unlocked by de-bottlenecking over the next couple of years? Thank you.

One, yes. We, you know, depending on how do we, at a graphene level, how do we look at traffic allocation?

You know, various businesses get different kinds of traffic allocation. uh so uh in terms of certain non-critical characteristics we have been take up this one in 525 but i think uh we have major projects ongoing now as far as the 526 is concerned in terms of cash flows one uh there is a liaisal project uh you know setting up uh 54 000 tons per annum of capacity uh you know is being uh approved so that project is started but in terms and also in terms of present de-bottlenecking of five capacity maharija there is a couple of other projects which are happening in our vilayat and magda plant for de-bottlenecking they are on course and by end of h1 we would have a slight increase in the capacity of this first fiber so our capex plants all of them are now they're going pretty well while some of these capacities will get actualized later but the projects are professional and we will have minor increase in the capacities in some of our existing lines by h1

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Virthi Panthaki from IIFL Securities. Please go ahead.

Hi, Rakshit. Congrats on reaching 10% market share exit first year. My question is, can you give some idea on what would be your targets for exit FY26 in terms of market share? And also, can you tell me what is the total number of printing machines that we have to set up as of FY25?

So, Prati, you know, the 10% market share, you know, the double digit market share between the shares is actually the consolidation between Birla Opal and the Kutty business of Birla Bhai. Sure, sure. all the paying companies also have putty but Opus by itself does not have so that is what we have given now like I said from you know we are not giving a guidance or a target for next year but there is a Opus by itself by itself should be a double digit share price is what our aspiration is and whenever you add putty onto it it will obviously incrementally Specifically on number of tinting machines, you know we have a good tinting machine penetration. So rather than giving an actual number, I can tell you that the tinting machine penetration that we have is close to 80%. So nearly 80% of the outlets we have opened have the bill of tinting machines.

Got it. Second question is if you can give some flavor, I'm not looking for any exact numbers but some kind of flavor on what is the geographic mix and what is the product segment mix in terms of are you strong in, of course east you've probably not yet had a plan so it will be weak but among the three regions relatively which one is stronger, weaker and in the product segment that is your premium, mid and mass, where would you have relatively the best market share? Where would you relatively have the lowest market shares?

Even in the last two calls, I have mentioned that Birla Opus is truly a national player. So, we don't have too much of variation between the best performing regions and the so-called bottom performing regions. So we are doing well in most of the regions but like I said the spread is not anything different from 80 to 120. On what is selling well, you know obviously our emulsion portfolio and that was also if you see over the last 12 months we entered the market first with our emulsion portfolio and then we introduced waterproofing and the enamel portfolio came a little late in the day because it was carbon manufacturing and initially only two of our plants were making. So if you go by that sequence, our overall emulsion portfolio has got a very solid response. and that includes both the Hathini segment led by Mirla Opus 1 and the economy segment led by Sky. We have excellent uptake in both the exterior and interior segments. So what I could say is that the quality differential that we have been able to give in the product which is easily discernible is most easily discernible in the use of an emulsion. So this is why the adoption of our emulsion range across Sky segments has been excellent. To top that, Oil Drive, which is our waterproofing range, also has got excellent feedback and Warren Group 10, which is the active product, is, you know, in fact is also the waterproofing season and I can tell you that it's extremely high demand and the adoption from fakers and contractors for waterproofing is also high. Our enamel entered the market I would say 3 to 4 months after the emerging business and also it took some more time because enamel comes in multiple sizes and small packs. So that took a bit more longer. Nonetheless our enamel is also picking up but yes it could be creating the emerging business by a few months. Apart from that like we said that we have launched the whole portfolio, we have designer finish, we have our good finish which is there you know so we have both the Italian range and the Indian range and the market acceptance of all that is restaurant. In this year we will only develop these categories even deeper and we will also add more products to make these portfolios even more complete. So that's how I would put it. Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Naveen Saudeh from ICHA Securities. Please go ahead.

Yeah, thank you. Thank you for the opportunity. My question first was in the change segment related to premium segments and then the overall list. Now our understanding basically was that with the Mahad unit commissioning the company will be able to offer a much larger bouquet or in a sense could emphasize more on the premium segment offering so to say and in that context I also had an observation that amongst the large competitors premium segment actually contributes over 50% of EBITDA. So, first of all, is that a fair understanding that premium or those premium segments from Mahat plants will be the niche offering or the main offering and hence overall portfolio will tilt or focus on that and then in the same context, if that profitability in that segment is high for peers, will it be fair to say that there are obvious EBITDA losses would be a significant reduction as part of this.

So, Naren, I would like to correct each of your statements. Directionally, you might be hitting on the right thing, but number one, Mahatma Gandhi is making the same product which is being made at all the other factories. So, Mahaj is not adding anything new. My understanding is when you use the word premium, you basically mean there is a majority segment, there is a premium segment and there is an economy segment. I assume that you mean both the premium and the luxury segments. Am I right? Yes. Heart does not add anything new. Heart only gives us, you know, gives the opportunity to present and allows us to equate our distribution more economically and obviously it produces the whole thing. It produces tolerance also and emulsion also. From a profitability or a loss making point of view, I think the assumptions that you are making, yes, all the companies, you know, emulsions with the most profitable category, but our emulsions are manufactured in each of the five factories and also in Coruscant, which is going to thriving next year, the next one. So, I don't think there is any business differential coming because of Mahat. And like we said, our emulsions are doing well across the three price segments. I will tell you about that. When incrementally I had that advantage of strategy located launch is in the freight and logistics cost. That is the benefit that will accrue to us as more plants coming up. So with mahar, you can see from our results also, there is improvement in our freight work and this will further go down with khadak. Previously there was somebody's comment that our presence in east is not there. We have to correct that. We have a full presence in east as well. Those supplied from northern, western and southern parts of the plant. And once Kadapur comes up, it will give us a logistic cost reduction. So Kadapur will reduce the per kilometre per litre travelled by the other users.

Understood. That's clear and helpful. My second question was in the B2B e-commerce space and Glad to know we have crossed the annual run rate of 5000 crore in the quarter. So here I just wanted to understand if the target seems to be very much in reach and much sooner probably. But from a profitability perspective, isn't the run rate of 5000 crore itself helping us to turn positive? in the at the EBITDA level or you think no it still will need more time to be profitable if you could just give some directional guidance will be very helpful. Thank you. Okay thanks again for the question. This is Anish here. So couple of pointers on what you were mentioning.

Yes, on the scale up part, we've been doing pretty well and every quarter we've been seeing consistent growth because of our increase in the number of categories that we are presenting and also the geographies that we cover. It's a really high target, you know. grow our customer base and also the overall revenue. Also a lot of the things that we are doing on the technology front whether it is logistics capability or providing L2L usability for our buyers, we also have seen a steep growth curve. And as you rightly hinted, our earlier stated goals of hitting 8500 crores which is a billion dollars will probably get there faster if we continue on this growth rate. What we have earlier also stated is that at that particular scale is when we will probably break even at the data level. We are still a new business. We started around two years back and we are probably one of the fastest growing e2b commerce platform to have hit this scale in two years. But we still remain in the investment phase. We are still building our overall teams, our technology capability,

a lot of what we build is built ground up given the complexity that is involved in how B2B e-commerce platform needs to operate. So, we continue to invest in that, continue to build, continue to build capability around logistics infrastructure, around, you know, how we build seamless fulfillment experience.

So, those investments will continue even into the next year. But at the scale that I mentioned, we should be taking it at a bit earlier. That's our guidance right now. Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Russell Kumar from Diamond Asia. Please go ahead.

Hi. Good morning, sir, and thanks for the opportunity. Sir, many congratulations on a great, you know, visual office performance. Just one question. You know, when we lost the brand, we had a 10,000-crore top line in three years' vision. Given this, you know, macro slowdown that we are seeing and the seasonality in the S2, which... you know, if we analyze over time, how do we, you know, intend to reach that, you know, target in terms of top line because a lot of distribution and initial, you know, excitement about the brand is already that we are seeing in the quadrillion rate.

So, you know, the 10,000 bookie guidance within three years of full-scale operations, Obviously, it takes into account that here is a long period and you will have periods of some slowdowns and periods of growth. As far as we are concerned, we are absolutely positive that the medium term outlook will definitely improve and the market has been smooth. So, I think a couple of quarters here and there have been very good. The outlook for India is very bright. So, we don't really have, you know, we can't manage the peak. We can't really do that.

And sir, second question is on the pricing. Any, you know, given the leader is obviously, you are taking market share, any action on the pricing that we are seeing lately in the market and how is your brand positioning versus the leader in terms of pricing today?

So, you see, there are two aspects of pricing. What is really relevant for the consumer is what price is he paying to my developers, which means what price dealers are charging to customers. And there the dealers are charging the same price as the market dealers. So, their law offers is able to charge and the consumer rate is the same price. In terms of other aspects, yes, we have seen that maybe in the economy segment, some of the competitors have tried to drop some prices etc. But those were all factors in the plan. As we are concerned, we are giving great value to our customers. We are also having a unique proposition that on 20 litre and 10 litre emulsions anybody who buys those gets 10% free which is actually going to be end user and not going to be diesel that makes the value proposition very strong so from that point of view we are well placed and we anyway want to market wherever we need to make any type of machines Thank you sir and all the best and congratulations again Thank you The next question comes from the line of Nirav from Angel Wealth. Please go ahead. Sir, thanks for the opportunity. I have two questions on the chemical side. Sir, first is like when you see two bigger players putting up their caustic chlorine plant for captive chlorine requirement and existing players also putting up their downstream chlorine plants. Is it a possibility that industry dynamics would change over a period of time in terms of flooring pricing improving on the positive side your thoughts here and also exo pipeline what is our flooring consumption internally and how this ratio would look like once our CPVC and ECU plants are commissioned yeah I am sitting a bit far away from the phone so I hardly get any chemical questions so couple of things look India, as you know, is a country with a very strong domestic consumption growth. So, you can do a calculation roughly 700 to 1000 TPD per year is the organic growth of the industry as far as cost is concerned. Domestic growth in India is going to grow strong. You know all the macroeconomic indicators. So, I think the first point I want to make is whatever excess capacity or new capacity comes into India will be absorbed by the Indian market through its natural growth rate. So, that's the first point. Second point, as you correctly mentioned, the capacities coming in essentially are PVC capacities. Now, India of course is importing PVC. Correct. So, PVC ultimately is a zero-sum game. PVC demand is not going to increase just because there are two large plants in India. So, somewhere the higher cost plants, and my guess is those would not be in India, would have to reduce their operating rates. Because cost is at their best by far. So from that perspective, and then there are certain players in the industry maybe who are less integrated, have a higher cash cost position, etc. So from that perspective, while we may face one or two years of choppy waters, it is unlikely that the that there is going to be a longer term structural impact on the industry. Again, mainly because domestic demand is growing, Indian capacity of PVC will substitute capacity of PVC somewhere else, and within the Indian industry itself, there will be some or more production capacity. I think the second point you asked is on integration. So, we basically look at overall integration. which is after completion of our existing project going to go from 65% to 70% and they are reasonably happy with that level of integration. And I will also tell you why they are reasonably happy with that level of integration. Because the newer capacities which are coming in related to PVC will be fully chlorine integrated. And chlorine demand typically grows 3% or so faster than faster demand. So, over time you will see the result of the PVC capacity additions will mean that the net flowing available to the Indian market is reduced and to that extent the negative flowing will also start becoming very negative, right? Correct. The second question is on the epoxy side. So, we have seen good sequential growth in the top line from the epoxy division. So, how do you see the volumes of epoxy ramping up in FY26 over FY25 basically?

And with this tariff scenario playing out, do you see opening up of newer businesses in the export markets in terms of newer applications like advanced composites, thermoplastic, etc.?

Thank you so much. So, I will answer your second question first. Right now, what is happening is because of the entire tariff situation of the global flows are very uncertain. So, you know, everybody is in a kind of, you know, situation where they buy only what they need. And this will take a little bit of time to settle down. Now, assuming there will be differential tariffs on different countries, in some cases, of course, India will have an advantage, right? And while our current export volume is small, we may get some upside and we may even get some ability to to provide, you know, formulation products to countries outside of India. Now, having said that, the majority of our ecosystems actually are catering domestic industry. They are catering domestic demand which continues to be strong at first. So, if the tariff situation creates any opportunities for us, you know, there will only be upside. I have to also say that Some of it may also be countered by a few downsides. As you know, there is a Korean FDA that the industry is unhappy about on imports and epoxies from Korea. So it's a bit fluid situation, you know. I can paint scenarios, but I can't tell you which scenario will actually work out. But again, most of our epoxy sales by and large are catering domestic demand, which over time will continue to grow. So we expect the epoxy business in India to to have a solid growth rate and we will continue to participate in that growth and continue to maintain and increase our market share. Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Shreya Bhantia from Moklin Capital Management. Please go ahead.

Thank you for the great set of numbers. So my question is also regarding the chemical division. Am I on to the next? So, if you could just give some light on the capacity utilization of the epoxy plan and what was the marketation into your liquid epoxy and the value added product. That would be my first question.

I will not answer the second question. You know, that is trade sensitive for us. You know, I would be giving a... Okay, I understand. If I can close that number. Neither did I actually disclose the exact utilization of my epoxy plant. I would continue to maintain that we have a high market share. We continue to maintain our share and we continue to grow our share.

Understood. And what was the negative chemistry realization for the quarter and for the year?

Yeah, so cloning realization last quarter was not so great, right? You know, at the lowest, IT even crashed like minus 9000 or something. However, it is showing an improvement, it's improving quite soon.

And for the full year, sir?

For the full year, negative cloning realization was in the range of about, you know, 6 to 7.

I won't quote an exact number, but in that range. Thank you.

We take the next question from the line of Sandeep Kumar Singh from Motivalo for Financial Services. Please go ahead. Thank you for the opportunity, sir. My first question is on the paint business. So, we have given in the investor presentation that B2B e-commerce annualized revenue run rate was around 50 billion rupees in this quarter. So, does it mean that there the revenue was closer to 12.5-13 billion rupees as it was from the paint revenues Also, if we exclude the putty business, then is our market share closer to 7.5-8%? And would you like to set some entry targets for losses? We have said that we will be profitable when we reach the revenue of 10,000 crore. Does it mean that we should look at a situation that we will be extra-vacuous and only when we reach that 10,000 crore or it should be prior to that? You talked about the revenue of B2B e-commerce business. But you know the Birla Opus is separate and our B2B business is separate. So I focused on the Birla Opus part. So on the Birla Opus part, we said that the market share of the Pucci business and the Birla Opus chain business put together is in double digits. And like we said, Birla Opus by itself is in high hundred digits. So, you can work backwards as you feel like, but the number will come in the same ballpark range that we are talking about. As far as profitability is concerned, we said our ambition is to be end-of-the-road in full-scale 3-year operation and be a leader of 18 months. Now, whether I break even at 10,000 crore or whether I can break even at 9,000, 9.5 or somewhere in the running in that ballpark range, we will manage it as we move ahead. That is the guiding point. But I think that's all you should read that number. And just to clarify again, the B2B business is a separate business. And they have an annualized type of growth. And Zilla, of course, is separate with the market share, the kind of market share that they are working on. So, what I meant that our building material business segment if we have to work to take this closer to 2100 crore and B2B business if we go by the presentation number is around 1250-1300 crore. So, pen business comes out to be around 900 crore that is what I meant when I quoted this number. So, yeah. I think you have to calculate on that we are not giving any further guidance. That is you are working and you know you appreciate your working but like you know also power has declared on earlier calls also that at the suitable time we will share all the numbers. I think you should take that right now. My second question is on GSF. So how is global demand supply now? Because I see that there has been a pressure on GSF crisis At the same time, bulk prices are also coming down. So, does it mean that all the benefits are being powered by global players also because of the demand situation or do we read something different into this? The demand actually in terms of operable demand globally it is muted. It is not growing big time but China has seen the dip. And the demand is also because from mid 18 onwards, because of tariff uncertainty, there is some kind of wait and watch approach being taken by the value chains layer. This is getting a little better now. So I think the price correction CP are on two pounds. One is because the regime, China demand has slowed down. And of course, China has a large capacity, so they determine how interest prices play out.

Two years, some prices have significantly come down from the last two to three months. So, yes, product is also, that is also healthy, you know, contained in terms of margin. So, obviously, when the price drops, there is also an effect on the pricing in the market. So, let's say you are right on both terms.

Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Pratik Kumar from Jefferies. Please go ahead.

Yeah, Dr. Sir, my first question is on would we assess any chemical capacity or we assess first We have ended this quarter at like a 7-8 quarter low unit EBITDA per kg for the segment with the declining prices for both pricing the top line and the cost as you said. So, we are looking at even weaker performance like in first half of 2016 or like this is the bottom of 8 quarters which we have made like in Q4. And in chemical business, Another question, like we have now hit like a 1.5 million capacity there. So, do we expect to grow past and double the industry growth in FY26 or like in non-industry growth at like probably 5 to 10 percent because there has been a kind of growth in past few quarters or the segments?

So on the BSF profitability, as Vishwadiyad has already shared in the last question, that there is a kind of uncertainty because of these tariff issues globally and in different countries playing out that tariff issues. So there is a demand slowdown in the Changna market. So to that extent, yes, there is a weakness. We don't give the guidance for FI26 kind of traffic numbers. We have given you the macro kind of situation. But as the tariff uncertainty situation has a greater clarity about how the sale is going to pan out, I think we will have to wait and watch kind of situation.

In chemical capacity, I take the chemical question. So look, you have correctly pointed out the headline capacity number, but as we have declared in the last couple of calls, including this water call, we have had a few technical issues in our plant where we have lost a few percentage points of utilization. So as we go into next year, we will be benefited by the improving reliability of our plants and we are already starting to see that. So, if you look specifically at next year, then we will be able to grow equal to and probably higher than the market because our plants will perform back to their usual level of utilization. The last three to six months have been a little bit abnormal for us. If you look at the specialty chemical part of our portfolio, we have more than sufficient our chlorine derivate is to continue to grow with the higher growth rate of the chlorine derivative industry that usually grows 2-3 percentage points faster than the base concentration. And it's a portfolio, so capacity calculations are complicated, but what I can indicate is that we have enough capacity to grow equal to the market. And the same lies for our epoxy portfolio. We have more than sufficient capacity both in base regions formulations and specialties to grow with the much higher growth rate of the offshore industry. So I think you can expect equal to or possibly above market growth for next year. Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Sheila Rati from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Thanks for taking my question. My question is on the pre-inspector. Just want to understand as we are in F26, given the current demand scenario and also the competitive landscape, from your lens, how do you see F26 panning out from a growth perspective? And also, is there a need for us to embrace higher discounting this year versus what we have done last year? That's my question.

If you look at it from a one-way point of view, if you exclude Birla Opus then the market has actually been negative. So the market has actually been negative and if you add Birla Opus then the market has been positive in low single digit numbers. What we see today is that the market is still slow. And while it would be difficult to predict how FY26 would go, but it could be that FY26 remains the low interest rate growth year. Obviously, the basis for last year are also low, so that would be slightly different. Whether you need to do price discount is a strategy which I think the other players also have to decide what to do because usually when you do a price discount, it leads to more price discounting by all the players in the market. What ultimately is needed is that the end consumer whose viewing should get the product at a lower cost which is not usually guaranteed. So, we will have to watch in terms of how the price evolves in the market. As far as we are concerned, we are getting good value and we will continue to do what we are doing. But yes, the market seemingly at the moment seems to be on the same track as it was in the last question.

Understood. One follow-up. When you talked about luxury premium segments to be 65% of revenues and I know you clarified in one of the earlier questions Just want to understand, is there any market flavor which you can add here as to which markets are kind of accepting these kind of products?

So, you know, luxury and even products actually sell across India. While yes, there are certain markets which sell, for example, Kerala sells very high proportion of exterior luxury products. In Gujarat there are high proportion of interior lingerie. There are definitive markets up north. In Punjab there are a lot of high value goods. So the market behavior for us, lingerie premium our products are top exception in all the markets. And, you know, because we've done a lot of work with contractors and contractors are able to appreciate the quality of products. So, from my point of view, there are markets where these categories are already big. But, as we are still a single share player, we have found exceptions very rare in all regions of the world. Incidentally, I'll add that in aspiration consumers today want to upgrade their quality of range. So, I am really surprised that the industry has been down trading their products by offering the larger screen with the lower range while the consumer aspiration is more at the medium and the upper line of this. Because more as they want to upgrade their quality of phones and their focus is to get better aesthetics. So, whether it is in water proofing solution there is more demand for a 10 year plus product. The same applies to mushroom products for the interior and exterior and even in wood finish clearly demand is more on the luxury and premium side of the product. So, there is an overall trend change and while Rashi did mention there is a slow down, I believe the slow down was more led by over focus industry on the by down trading their products as the price stabilization happens the industry will come back to its natural diversity demand. Because if the volume was not slowed down, the issue was primarily on the value prices. And once the overall industry focuses on the mid to higher end of the product categories across all the business categories, you will find the industry should come back to its religious growth. We are very confident of that over the period of time. So to act, we had done a lot because, you know, the quality was not changed. And it was very clear that even the scope for lower LSM or lower SEC consumer was of the opinion that if I'm going to change my house once in 5-6 years, I actually want something which is good in quality. And then focusing on the higher value and quality could have, if they actually worked on that line, it would actually benefit them greatly. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, due to time constraint, we take a last question from the line of Rohit Nagraj from B&K Securities. Please go ahead.

Yeah, thanks for the opportunity. So my question is on the non-alcoholic business. So, in the earlier question you alluded about the chlorine situation being on the long side, given that the chlorine will be captively consumed for PVC by the new players and there will be a long on the caustic side, what is your perspective in terms of the ECUs whether structurally the ECUs will be closer to say 30 plus, right? or there is a possibility that the current kind of ECUs and slightly improving trend, we will be able to see even after those capacities come in. Thank you.

Your question is very similar to the question that Nirav had asked. So, I will give a similar reply. Remember, the pricing of caustic in India is set by import parity. Similarly, pricing of PVC in India is set by import parity. Now, when these large PVC players come in, it's not going to change India's demand significantly. There will be a substitution potentially of imported PVC by Indian PVC. Correspondingly, PVC operating rate outside of India will come under pressure. If you study the markets in North Asia, you will realize which are the higher cost PVC producers. Correspondingly, supply of caustic in the international market will also come under pressure. And ultimately, as I mentioned earlier, you know, it's a big market. Caustic is a very big market. There are many moving parts, then only, you know, the PVC capacity that is coming is going here. So, we don't feel that structurally, Over the long term, it will have a negative impact on cost pick prices. However, there will be certain quarters where there will be demand supply mismatches, price dislocations will happen. So, there will be more volatility for sure. But it's not like, you know, there is going to be a structural issue in the industry. At least that's not what I was thinking.

Sure, got it. Thanks. And second question is on the ETH front. So, the ECH that is coming up, will it be completely dispatched for capital consumption? And if so, will there be additional requirement which we will be taking from the market that we are probably currently doing?

Sorry, only answer one part of your question. So, yes, the ECH project that we are doing is meant for capital use. What my commercial strategy is only says, I would not like to disclose on this call.

So, that's all from my side. Thanks a lot and all the best.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, with that, we conclude the question and answer session. On behalf of Graftam Industries Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.