Jost Werke Se

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by. Welcome and thank you for joining Joost Werke Q1 2022 Results Conference. Throughout today's recorded presentation, all participants will be in a listen-only mode. The presentation will be followed by a question and answer session. If you would like to ask a question, you may click the Q&A button on the left side of your screen and then raise your hand. If you are connected via phone, please press star followed by one on your telephone keypad. For operator assistance, please press the star key followed by zero on your telephone or press the operator assistance button on the bottom left side on your screen. Our speakers today are Joachim Dürr, CEO of Joostwerk AG and Christian Terlinde, CFO. I would now like to turn the conference over to Joachim Dürr. Please go ahead.

Yeah, thank you very much and a very good morning. Welcome to the Joost Werke AG Q1 2002 conference call. Christian Terlinde, who is at the different sites today, and myself will guide you through the presentation and are happy to take your questions afterwards. So let's look at the highlights of what I think has been a very strong start into the year 2022. The highlights of the Q1 just has achieved a new sales record of 312 million euros. That's plus 21% with a strong growth in transport, 14% and agriculture, 46% in the first quarter. Our adjusted EBIT margin remained robust at 11% despite rising costs and we achieved a new record for the adjusted EBIT of 34 million euros in one quarter. Our high operational flexibility and our proactive cost and price management were the key success factors to manage the volatile market demands. We needed those factors because we're operating in low visibility. We have supply chain constraints, the war in Ukraine, ongoing pandemic lockdowns on top of the existing problems with semiconductors and global transport. So based on that strong start, we confirm our positive outlook for 2022, despite a more challenging market environment. Let's look at the markets for Q1 2022. And if you look at it regionally, region by region, you can see that the market in Europe for trucks actually somewhat contracted. That's due to supply chain issues that our truck customers had, mainly due to the war in Ukraine. So we had truck production a little bit down in Q1 2022. Trader production and trader markets were up by 8%. And the tractor market was also impacted a little bit by the Ukraine war and also by some semiconductor shortages so that that market also contracted slightly versus the Q1 of 2021. However, just benefited from the overall strong demand also in the aftermarket. And with the price increases that we've put into the market, we outperformed the European markets by market share gains, some price impact, and also with our strong aftermarket position. North America, very strong market, continued to grow in trucks 4% over an already strong Q1 2021, 13% in trailers, and more or less the same level for tractors but there we have a mixed effect the higher value tractors actually grew and the compact tractors actually went down a little bit so it was an overall quite strong market environment However, we had an extremely strong performance in that environment with a growth of 66% on sales. We achieved further market share gains and outperformed the market. And we also benefited somewhat from the product mix effect. APA, a very differentiated picture. China, extremely weak compared to an extremely strong Q1 2021. We all remember 2021 after the COVID shutdowns in 2000, there was an immense increase in production, an extremely strong market that has dropped and that actually dropped below the normal level. So the total APAR region, therefore, on the truck side is down 47% and on the trader side with plus 11% just dropped only 14%, so we were able to recover a big portion of that drop from the Chinese market with our other strong markets, namely Australia, India, South Africa, and also other markets in that region. So overall, I think we have a very strong performance in a supportive market, but that shows already some signs that leads in China and a little bit on the European truck side of a more stable development rather than continued growth. With that, let's go to more details and I hand over to Christian.

Thank you very much, Joachim, and also a very warm welcome from my side. Pleasure to be able to present to you the Q1 results for our group. And as always, let's start with the different regions. So we start with Europe. In Europe, you can see a tremendous sales growth, up to 180 million in the first quarter. That is up 16% compared to the prior year. Organically, it's even 18%, so a strong development, despite already some initial negative impacts of supply chain interruptions and also, of course, the war in Ukraine. Overall, JOST grew very strongly in both sides of the business, so agriculture as well as transport, and we believe we were able to outperform the underlying markets quite well, and this was certainly supported by prices negotiations and therefore achieved price adjustments with our customers that we already started last year and continue to do so this year. Overall, the FX headwinds amounted to minus 2.2%. When you look at the result, I'm quite happy that we are back from the 2.6% that we reported for Europe in Q4 last year. We're now back to 9.7%. That is, of course, slightly below the 10.6% margin that we achieved a year ago. But we need to bear in mind that Q1 2021 was still a quite unaffected year or quite unaffected quarter by price increases or material price increases and inflation at all. So I believe the Q1 last year was probably the last normal quarter that we had seen. So overall, the margin went down to 9.7%, but we see a 5.8% growth in EBIT in absolute terms. That is 17.5 million, and that is significantly more than the 4.1 million we achieved a quarter ago in Q4 2021. We did also here have some negative FX effects of roughly half a million included here. So overall, the result would have been better had the euro been slightly stronger. With this, I would like to go over to the next region, and that is North America. North America, the growth story continues. This is all I can say. I need to say, if you look at the result, or first of all, look at the sales numbers, you see a growth of 65.5% compared to Q1 2021. And also an absolute figures from 55 million, we're now up to 91 million within one year. And even if you take out the strong appreciation of the US dollar, it's still a 54% growth. So this is already a significant indication that we have further increased our market share in North America. And this is already challenging on the landing leg side where we already command a very high market share of above 80%. But now we're also we will continue and we are continuing to grow on the fifth wheel side. So this is also very nice. Aside from that, we see some growth also in the Exide business. So there we are no longer significantly impacted by supply chain disruptions. So that was very helpful in both business lines. If you compare it also to Q4 last year, you'll see there a 20 million gain in sales as well. So overall, a very successful quarter for the region North America. And that is also visible if you look at the result, a 91% increase of the adjusted EBIT from 4.1 million to 7.9 million and now an adjusted EBIT margin of 8.6%. Certainly the much higher capacity utilization and therefore an operating leverage always support that development. But as I mentioned already before, the X side was significantly supported by the higher or the better logistical situation, no longer so terrible logistics disruptions. And therefore, we could benefit on both parts of the business, agriculture as well as transport. Let's move to Asia-Pacific Africa. And Asia-Pacific Africa, Joachim already mentioned that basically, and I had said it already during the two previous calls about in Q3 and Q4 last year, it's a two-sided developments. On the one hand, we have the rest of Asia Pacific, and that is India, the Pacific region, which is Australia, New Zealand, but also South Africa, and last but not least, Southeast Asia with Indonesia, Singapore, Taiwan, and so on. Those countries are continuously developing very, very nicely and very strongly. On the other hand, China, China, where we had a tremendous Q1 and Q2 2021. And with the significant pre-buy effects due to the new emissions regulation, China 6 going into effect 1st of July 2021. And then we had the sudden drop, the expected sudden drop in the Chinese truck market, where it just significantly contracted. And just to give you an overall idea, while in 21 China made up 55% of our sales in the region, in 22 it's down to 30% of the sales. But that again, it shows how balanced and how well balanced our portfolio is and how important it is not to be in one country alone, Yes, China is the biggest economy, but still for us, the other countries are just as important and they're now pulling the weight for the region. So this is very, very helpful to have that balanced exposure there. In terms of profitability, Asia-Pacific Africa remains our stronghold with 18.2% margin despite China going down so much. It's a very, very positive development. Obviously, with such a decline in sales, it's not possible in absolute terms to remain on the same level. But we are still with 7.3 million, extremely profitable. It's the best region that JOST has and therefore a very positive development from our end. Of course, this is something we said several times, but let me stress it again. The countries outside of China have a significantly higher share of off-duty applications, off-highway applications, which means heavy-duty applications. And these typically come at a much, much higher rate of return. And therefore, we were able to even increase the margin compared to prior year. So for the group, what does that mean? If we move to that slide, yes, first of all, a 21.2% increase in sales on paper, 19.3% organically. And very happy to say that we are continuing to grow our agricultural exposure. With the acquisition of ALO, of course, there was a significant boost. The ag sales have been somewhere between 20% to 25% for the group. In Q1, ag sales make up 28% of the group and therefore it's balancing our portfolio even more also on the industry side. So positive development. I am also extremely happy to report that we've achieved three consecutive months of over 100 million in sales. And Joachim mentioned that this is a new sales record for Joost. So 312 million in sales, three consecutive months, over 100 million in sales. Very, very positive, of course. Also supported by the sales price increases that we were able to, where we were able to pass on our costs to our customers. Also, we have a slightly better balance between OE first fit and aftermarket sales. Aftermarket make up now 27% of our sales in Q1. And the regions, very, very much again, and you hear me say that quite a bit, also there is a nice balance. Europe made up 52%, Asia-Pacific 24%, North America 24% of our sales. And therefore, we are much less influenced by negative developments in one region, which, of course, is positive for us as a group. Still, the Europe exposure certainly is significantly higher than in the other regions. So in terms of profit, also their new profit record, 34.4 million in sales and an 11.0 margin. It's a 15.5% increase in adjusted EBIT. And again, I will now just repeat what I already said. The very high operational flexibility means that we are able to react on quickly changing market environments. On the other hand, high sales mean also high operating leverage. And on the other hand, we cannot neglect the fact that rising material costs, rising energy costs, rising costs for certain parts and components that we use will have a negative or have a negative impact on the result. And this will be our focus for the remainder of the year to fight those price increases on the purchasing side. Now, let's also speak about the bottom line, because I believe this is also very important for you as our investors and also the analysts. The net income for the year amounts to 22 million. Then you have the usual development from net income to EBIT to adjusted EBIT of 34 million and then down to the adjusted net income. What I would like to point out and that I think also gives you a very good indication that the number of adjustment is quite limited. So 22 million of reported net income compares to 23 million of adjusted net income. And you see the main adjustments are non-cash adjustments. So it's the positive adjustments is the appropriate purchase price amortizations. And the other one is the much, much higher than actual performer tax rate of 30%, which is negative. But comparing that to 4 million of actual taxes paid, you see that the 30% is something that we need to report on. But it's nothing that we are paying. And therefore, this is also a quite positive development. Adjusted earnings per share went up by almost 20 euro cents, up to 1.54 euro per share. And the reported earnings per share went up by also here up to 1.44 euro cents. per share, also quite positive development. So with that, I would like to go quickly through some balance sheet related items. Return on capital employed slightly down to one year ago, to year end, 16.6. It was at year end, 16.3. But compared to prior year, Q1, where we recorded 14.2% earnings per share, return on capital employed were up 2.1 percentage points. The equity ratio increased further from the 31.2 at year end. We're now at 32.7. So that's a 1.5 percentage point gain. And also here, I like to make the comparison to Q1 2021. where we had an equity ratio of 29.7. So we have three percentage points better in equity ratio. And this is just entirely driven by the positive result of the last year, the last four quarters, where we had continuously positive earnings. Net debt increased compared to the year end number of 1.45 times, now at 1.51 times, so slightly worse. Still significantly better than the 1.76 times at Q1 2021. But still not very happy about this development. I mean, with this growth in business, we do see also an increase of working capital and working capital increase means lower cash flows and therefore a burden on our net debt. And that brings me straight to cash flow. If we look at the cash flow development and here you see probably the only negative point of our results, we did have a negative free cash flow. And this negative development is basically entirely driven by the development of working capital, which increased compared to a year ago, compared to last quarter. And therefore, it's negative. The good thing about investments in working capital is that they are typically not lost money. It's just stored money, cash stored in a different place. And at this time, I would say it's stored in our inventory where we have a significant increase compared to a year ago. now at 208 million, which is 60 million higher than one year ago. Basically, there are two reasons. One, of course, is more mathematical. With all the price increases we're seeing on the supply side, obviously, the value of our working capital increases too. The other one is the uncertainty in the supply chain. The ports of Shanghai are now closed for about three weeks in a row. And all these supply chain disruptions do have a negative impact on our working capital. And we're trying the best we can to combat that. But on the other hand, it is important for us to be able to deliver. Being able to deliver to our valued customers is key and crucial for a good future of the company. And therefore, we are balancing cash flow and being able to deliver. And in this case, you see, we invested 60 million in networking cap, or rather in inventories. And we'll turn those inventories sooner or later, rather sooner than later into cash again. So overall, networking capital has percent of sales up to 21.4%. Quick word also on our capital expenditures, which are at 5.6 million or 1.8% of sales. This is actually, even though we have the 2.5% of sales goal, The 1.8 for Q1 is quite high. Typically, the investment starts somewhat later this year. We are trying to speed up the investments a little bit so that we can take use of those newer machines, better equipment earlier. And therefore, you see already 1.8%, which is much more than 1.5% we had last year. And with this, I would like to hand it over to Joachim Dürer for his outlook and some closing remarks.

Thank you, Christian. Yes, let's come to the market outlooks. And what we're seeing here is the expectations from external market experts. And if you compare that slide to the one that we showed a few months ago, you will recognize that they have softened. their expectations, especially for Europe and a little bit for trucks in general. So in Europe, they saw a rising market in the last projections. Now they expect more or less a stable market, maybe a slight contraction due to the uncertainties of the war in Ukraine and the related supply issues. On traders, a bit weaker, even though it's still on a very high level. Only for agricultural tractors, a continued slight growth. So that's the expectation from the external market experts on Europe. North America, continued growth, even versus a very strong calendar year 2021. They've reduced a little bit the truck picture that used to be 15 to 20%. And that's also due to supply chain uncertainties. For the rest, they still expect a strong growth or the same strong growth as before. And on APA, they've adjusted a little bit the Chinese truck markets. We all expect the Chinese truck market to come back in the second half. of this year but with all the uncertainties in china right now with the lockdowns that expectation is not as strong as it as it was before so that's why they've adjusted that downwards more on trucks than on trailers where they see for the overall region still a slight growth the just outlook is more optimistic than what you see here from the market experts and let's come to that So we confirm, despite the somewhat weaker picture from the external experts, our outlook for 2022. And that outlook is that our sales will grow mid-single digit over last year, where we had 1.049 billion euros of sales. And our adjusted EBIT will grow in line with the sales growth at a mid-single digit level. level so that our EBIT margin should remain about stable at the 10% that we've seen last year. Our capex in percent of sales as usual, two and a half percent. And so we confirm the guidance that we've given you previously. So let me come to the summary of the presentation. Just had a very successful start in the 2022 financial year. We posted new records for sales and also, very importantly, an all time high for our adjusted EBIT in one quarter, despite the existing market uncertainties. Both business lines, transport and agriculture, contributed to this good result. And our operational flexibility and our active cost and price management allowed us to limit negative impacts of the rising costs that we're seeing. And it demonstrates the resilience of our business model. North America was our strongest growth region. We benefited from further market share gains and the growing demand for JAWS products in agriculture and transport. So we confirm our guidance, as I've just explained, for the fiscal year 2022. And we're confident that with our abilities, we will be able to flexibly manage the regional shifts that we expect in the markets. So with that, thank you very much for your attention, and we're looking forward to your questions.

Ladies and gentlemen, at this time, we will begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may click the Q&A button on the left side of your screen and then raise your hand. If you are connected by a phone, please press star followed by one on your telephone keypad. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star followed by two or please lower your hand. For written questions, please click the Q&A button and then the write a question button. One moment for the first question, please. The first question is from Gonzales Zadronil-Georges from HAK and Aufheuser. Please go ahead. Mr. Gonzales, you can speak now.

Hello, can you hear me? Yes. Perfect. I cannot see you. I don't know what I did with my mobile phone. Joaquim, Christian, thank you very much for the presentation and congratulations on a very strong start to 2022. I have a couple of questions, please. My first question is about the agriculture business. the business looks still booming and I was wondering if you can remind us how the seasonality works for this business and what we should expect for the following quarters as the growth in the first quarter was super strong and I think that makes it even more difficult for us to estimate the rest of the year and then regarding the trailer market Joaquin has just answered my My question, but one of your competitors have recently estimated the growth for EMEA trailers in about 8%. That is quite different to these estimates that the market experts have for the year. So I was wondering what is your view, your specific view on trailer market for the rest of the year? and also if you have any opinion on what we can see next year in 2023. Thank you very much.

Thank you for your questions. I will start with an answer and then I will give it to Christian. Then he can give you a bit more information on the seasonality. But yes, we did have some seasonal effects in the North American numbers in agriculture. So that is certainly an effect. And as I said, Christian will elaborate on that a little bit on the trailer. outlook for europe um the external market consultants as i said they previously said it's it will be around five percent growth they've now reduced that number and that is mainly due to the conflict that we see in ukraine that is limiting supply of woods there are some oems that have issues already with the supply chain and i think It's their expectation that they will carry through the year and will limit the capacity that is already as they're all operating at a very high operational level. They're almost all of them are close to their maximum capacity. And so if there is a supply issue now, there's nobody else that can compensate that. So that's the expectation from the analysts. My personal expectation is that it will not happen. hit it as much as the external analysts expect today. But certainly, there is some clouds and some question marks that are raised. And as I pointed out, it's a quite volatile situation. And the effects to our company from the conflicts, the direct effects are very limited. But the indirect effects that happen because customers don't have wood or don't have wiring harnesses, these are the effects that are really hard to predict. That's why it's so important for us to be flexible and to be actively managing the situation. So where it will end up and what hidden problems there are that we haven't seen, it's hard to predict. Wood is right now for the trailer industry one of the biggest problems. Semiconductors and wiring harness is the biggest issue for the truck industry. But they are also coping very well with the situation and their order book is still very strong. So I've just been with a large customer this week and they claim that they still have a very solid order book. But they're also saying that the new orders are not at the same strong level that they have been because the final customers are taking a bit of a cautious stand because of the price increases that is affecting their business case also. So they don't have a lot of cancellations, but the new orders are not flowing in at the same high level. But they still have very solid order books. That's why I believe it will be somewhere in the middle where we will probably see numbers that are around the level of what we've seen last year.

Okay, and then let me take the question on the ag seasonality. The ag seasonality is slightly different from the transport seasonality. So in agriculture, we typically expect the strongest quarter to be Q1, followed by Q4, and then you have Q2, and last but not least, it's Q3. And that obviously has to do with the natural seasonality, where you would see farmers invest into new equipment before the season starts. And that's why Q1 is typically very strong. And then at the very latest, before the summer, when they need to harvest the fields, they will have invested most of their equipment. That's why Q3 is usually the very weak quarter for the agricultural business. Now, we do have certain changes this year, not really in seasonality, but in terms of sales. Joachim and I both already mentioned that in North America, last year during the pandemic, we saw very high numbers of compact tractor sales. And compact tractor sales are, as we would call them, toys for boys. So it's very small, rather more lawnmower than a tractor. And they obviously carry small margins. While now we're now going back to a normal trend where farmers, and I mean real farmers, are investing into real higher horsepower tractors. And they not necessarily come overall with higher sales, but higher margins. So much for the ag seasonality.

One follow-up about this. So the growth in the first quarter was driven more by the volume or the prices increases in the agriculture business are above the ones of the transport business, for instance?

say that it's certainly volume growth what contributed most. There were already certain price increases, but not all of them were effective in the first quarter. So I would expect to see more price effects going into the numbers going forward and the high volume to continue. But the volume is certainly something, and you saw the market outlook, that is very volatile.

Yes.

And I think you're sorry. Yeah. And for North America, I think You had some FX effect in there, so you cannot project the growth rate that we had in Q1 for the remainder of the year. You have to deduct the FX impact and there is seasonal impact. And there's also, and I mentioned it briefly through the presentation, there's some product mix impact where, and Christian mentioned it too, where more expensive tractors and more expensive loaders are sold rather than compact loaders. And that also contributed. So these are the adjustments that you need to do when you think of those numbers.

Okay, and regarding the market share, I think you commented that you have gained market share. This wasn't a specific comment for the agriculture business or for all the businesses in North America? No, it's more...

On agricultural business, typically with the loader business, we have customers and we are typically the only supplier. They usually have 100% share. So we more or less breathe with their market share. So if our customer gains market share, we gain market share with them in the OE. But then, of course, there's also an aftermarket business. And that is then depending on the existing fleets that we have in the market. But I would say that the market share gains mainly refer to the transport business where we're now offering more services, our products, including logistics services, for example, and where we've continued market share gains in fifth wheel and landing legs. But it's also that we're selling higher value content to our customers by adding additional services, just like logistics services and other services.

Okay, I understand. Thank you very much for the answers. I go back to the line.

Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please click the Q&A button and raise your hand or press star followed by one at this time. The next question is from Nikolai Kempf from Deutsche Bank. Please go ahead.

Yeah, good morning, Nikolai. I'm speaking from Deutsche Bank. So my question would also be on APEC, and it's very impressive how you managed the slowdown in China. Given that I think the lockdowns ended mid of April, do you see any sign of recovery as of now or still an issue to produce in the region? And my second question would basically be on the European market. So the main pushback we get when talking about German industrial names is the potential recession next year. Do you see for any slowdowns in your order intake or that customers are getting more cautious in taking orders or increasing prices?

Yeah, let me start. Well, thanks, Nikolai, for your questions, first of all. So I'll start with the Europe question. Do we see any weakness? I mentioned that, of course, the order books are very, very high there's a lot of people waiting a lot of final customers waiting for their trailers or for their trucks or for the agricultural tractors and while they're waiting they're not putting new orders in so we don't see the order books growing now is that a sign that it's going down not necessarily the fundamentals of our business are still very strong the In the ag business, we will have to provide more own agriculture to the European population. We cannot rely as much on imports because there are one from the east not happening and two from the west or from Brazil getting more expensive. So there is a strong fundamental demand in agricultural products and therefore in agricultural machinery and equipment, which we are providing with our brands. And on transport it's more or less the same story. There is still. a fundamental need for transport, despite the fact that there may be less imports from other countries. There will be more traffic within within Europe because we will have to provide more products here in Europe and in any activity that creates usually transport. So we see the business fundamentals strong and we still see unfulfilled demand in the market. The only soft point that I see is that the auto intake is not growing as it used to be, but that I think is more effects that people are still waiting for their products and they're also getting a bit more hesitant with the higher material and energy prices reflected in their bills for their products. And then of course there's a microeconomic question with raising interest rates and things like that, how that, how that will happen. But but I think that that's really hard to judge. But the important message is that the business fundamentals in the businesses we are operating in there, they're still very solid. And I don't see that's the demands that that base demand is going down quite the opposite of agriculture. I actually see that there is more investments required in the future. And then on China, you want to answer the question, Christian?

Yeah, sure. So the lockdowns in China, well, right now, I mean, the lockdowns are not only occurring what is being reported in the European press. So everyone knows about the lockdown in Shanghai, which, by the way, is not over yet, but it's getting better. So certain parts of the city are being reopened. But then there's also lockdowns in part of Beijing. But more importantly for us, There was a very significant lockdown in the area around Qingdao, where one of our key customers is, as well as in the area of Changchun in the north of China. So, yes, in the end, the positive thing for Yoast is our plants are not in one of those, but from a lockdown, infected regions are. So our transport plant is in Wuhan, as you all know by now. very affected in 2020, but not this year. And our agricultural plant is in Ningbo, also not affected by this. But in the end, exports go typically through the ports, and the biggest port is Shanghai. So there could be or is an impact, but also our customers locally sit in Qingdao. They are in Changchun. So there are effects of the lockdowns in China also on our business. But in any case, we believe that most of those sales, if any, are postponed and not lost sales. So once the customers come back, they will continue to take our products and restart their production.

Okay, understood. Thank you.

We also have one question that was submitted by a chat, and that's from Matthias Meerbald. Any updates on M&A targets? Have prices of attractive targets come down enough? And how narrow or wide is your target list?

Okay, well, thank you, Romy, for reading the question, and thank you, Matthias Meerbald, for posting that question. We've said at the Annual General Meeting that we are continuously looking at M&A targets and that has not changed since last week. Let's put it like that. We are interested to grow. You've seen in this quarter how we have been growing out of our own business and out of our own products, but we also see M&A as a integral part of our growth strategy and we just have this successful integration of Quicke completed. So we are always interested in seeing if there are strategic fits that add contribute to our business and we are continuously analyzing that and it's compared to the or referring to the prices of M&A. We don't necessarily see that the multiples are going down at this point in time. It's a bit like real estate where people, they are used to a certain level. And if the market, if they cannot sell at that level, then they will not sell. So I think this will take a while until the M&A multiples will really go down based on a softer market or a less interesting environment for M&A. To summarize the answer, we are continuously looking at M&A targets. We are investigating some interesting targets, and we believe that we do have the capabilities, one, financially, and second, the integration capabilities to do it. um but we look at both um uh growth out of our own existing organization and products and and m a and on the prices you know not yet i would say we don't see the prices uh come down at this point in time okay that was the the only question we have in the q a chat i think there are no more questions on the line um

Thus, I would say, Johann Dürer, if you could please do your closing remarks.

Yes, I think we've started very solid in the year. And I think the whole organization is quite proud that in this volatile environment, we were able to put new records for sales and for EBIT. We are operating in markets that are fundamentally needed and we don't see quite the opposite. We see that these fundamental demands will continue in the next years and actually even grow in the next year. So we are quite happy, but it's a daily ongoing activity and we need to continue to very actively operate and manage our business to make sure that we keep that success running so that we will come to our guidance at the end of the year. With that, thank you very much for your interest in JOST. Thank you very much for your time and for your questions. And we're looking forward to see you at the next meeting.

Thank you very much also from my side. Thank you.

Bye-bye.