Konecranes Plc Ord

Hello, all, and welcome to follow Conecranes' Q4 2025 results webcast. My name is Linda Häkkilä. I'm the VP Investor Relations here at Conecranes. And with me today as our main speakers, we have our CEO, Marko Tulokas, and our CFO, Teo Ottola. Before we proceed, I would like to remind you about the disclaimer, as we might be making forward-looking statements. As per usual, we will first start with presentations, both from our CEO and CFO, and after that, we will start the Q&A session. We are happy to answer your questions through the conference call lines. But now, without any further comments, I would like to hand over to our CEO.

Thank you, Linda, and good afternoon from cold but very sunny Helsinki. I'd like to start with some general statements. It was a really very strong year for Konecranes and I'm very, very proud of our team and very proud to be part of the Konecranes team, particularly in a year like 2025. Konecranes has a very sound business model. We've been executing our strategy and that, of course, in this sort of environment has really improved resilience in our results. There was a very uncertain environment last year. We focused on executing our strategy and focused on the most important things. The year started on uncertain terms, but we acted fast and early, whether it's on pricing, focus on execution, or tight cost control. Towards the second half of the year, the market environment stabilized and particularly in the delivery side it was feasible, and that helped us to finish the year strong. And now when we look at towards 2026, we have a good order book in place, the structure is solid, and our strategy for 2026 has a very good roadmap in place. So I'm really confident for year 2026. So now let's look at how the year turned out. And then also how the quarter four looked like. Throughout the year, the demand environment stayed positive overall. There was a lot of positive development in many customer segments and connections, broad presence in different customer sectors and geographies, of course, helped us in this sort of volatile environment. Our orders were very strong, particularly in port solutions and industrial equipment, so we grew almost 12% in 2025 in comparable terms compared to 2024. The demand on industrial service instead was quite a tough demand environment, but even in this environment, we were able to strengthen our agreement base. We took very good care of our pricing and also made sure that we adjusted our cost base to the prevailing conditions. We also took care of our margins and our cost structure, good execution in our project business, and we continued to roll out our products according to our strategy. And that of course meant that we were able to complete the year with almost one percentage point improvement in the comparable EBITDA at 14% record high level. Moving on to quarter four. And in quarter four, our orders were also very good. So we continued very solid order intake and also sales. But it's also noteworthy that both decreased against a very strong comparison quarter of 2024, quarter four of 2024. So orders were down 4% and net sales roughly flat in comparable terms. Quarter four in 2024 had a very strong order intake in both solutions, but also in industrial equipment areas. where both actually had the second highest quarter of all time in Connexus. And that makes quarter four of 25 also very satisfactory for us. Our order book continued to strengthen and it was three percentage points higher or seven percentage points in comparable terms. Our profitability improved and increased to 14.1%. It was really very good pro-tech execution in industrial service, industrial equipment, and in port solutions. Port solutions with very good margins, but with slightly lower volume. And we kept our cost control intact and had a bit of pricing and tariff tailwind, but less than we had in quarter three. And of course the order book improved and that means a solid start for 2026. Now if you look at the market environment in general, how the best to describe it, maybe one way to say that the market and the customers have maybe got used a little bit to the uncertainty. So there's a course of positive development in the capacity utilization rate as it's visible in this industrial service and equipment. which shows the capacity utilization rates in the three main market areas. And our own funnels and our customer demand, how we see it, European sales funnels are good on solid level. There's some signs of improvement, but of course, customers continue to be rather cautious around this type of a volatile environment. In the United States, the previously very strong industrial equipment, funnel has somewhat flattened out, but on the other hand, on the service side, we see some signs of improvement, so customers starting to do the service that they may have put on hold temporarily during the kind of tariff-related uncertainty. It's, of course, too early to say how this actually pans out during this year, but we are optimistic in general about the marketing environment, or continue to be so. And in Asia Pacific, the market continues and the funnels continue to be on a stable level, but the tough competition continues, particularly from the Chinese competition. And then if you take a look at the port solution segment, Here the container throughput index, as we have discussed before, is of course the main indicator, and that continues to be on a very good level overall. Maybe there is some flattening in the growth rate, but it's still very positive. Our funnels continue to be good. There are big and small cases in the funnel. And of course, it's good to remember here that besides the obvious container throughput traffic indicator, There is the long-term prevailing trends in port solutions that are of course driving investments. That comes from the automation trend, the prevailing consolidation trend in that industry, changing the traffic routes driven by the repatriation and changing manufacturing locations. So of course we continue here to have a kind of positive general view on the market as we have had also last year. So iterating again a bit more about the quarter four, developed against the strong comparison period and how the past two years have gone, as you see here, because the order intake in quarter four was slightly down from previous year quarter four, but last year the order intake was actually very good and better than previous year in the first three quarters. There was a decrease in quarter four in all business areas, some increasing in Europe and some decreasing in America and APEC and actually the same profile is true for the sales side of things. Then next is time to look at the order book situation and we have had a solid above one book to be ratio throughout last year and we've been strengthening our order book throughout the whole last year since quarter four of 2024. So we have a particularly strong order book situation in port solutions. It is positive in industrial equipment with also positive mix, but it's also a bit down in industrial service. Now here you see the profitability development over the last few years. And again, comparing the quarters to each other, this is really a very strong progress and very strong execution to our strategy. There is an increase in industrial service and industrial equipment in quarter four. Some decrease in port solutions. Like I stated earlier, that's mainly driven by the volume. So port solutions continue to have good margins and good execution. And they also had a very good quarter four last year. Some less tariff tailwind, but still some visible in quarter four. Really good cost management and slightly weaker mixing in port solutions. But we're very happy with this 14.1% outcome due to quarter four last year. And that of course really helped us to reach this almost a percentage point year on year, full year improvement of profitability. Now then it's time to take a look at how we track in our profitability improvement progress or process. This is actually the third consecutive year in all three business areas where we consistently improve our profitability. All three business areas are well within their defined profitability, mid-term profitability ranges and we've done this on the rather challenging demand environment. But at the same time, of course, it is true to say that we have not really had a challenging downturn in terms of volumes yet. So as you will see here, there's been pressure on the volumes and we've shown continuous good profitability improvement. And of course, with additional volumes, then this is, we are confident that this continues to be a good story. And now I would like to hand over to Teo and then I'll come back in after a few slides to talk about the demand outlook and a couple of other things.

Thank you, Marko. And let's take a look at some of the business area numbers in more detail. But before going there, as usually, so let's take a brief look at the comparable EBITDA bridge. between Q4-24 and Q4-25. So we had close to one percentage point improvement in the EBITDA margin in an year-on-year comparison, and this translates into roughly 5 million improvement in EBITDA in euros. And let's unpack this now next a little bit. So pricing impact year-on-year was roughly 3%. And then when we combine with that information, the fact that there was a sales decline in comparable currencies. So we are actually taking a look at the underlying volume decline of some 4% or so, which obviously is not good from the profit and profitability point of view. However, net of inflation pricing, mix, and then particularly good execution, so project execution, for instance, then we're all working in a positive manner, and as a result of that, the net of all of those impacts is positive by 13 million, as we can see as a combination of volume, pricing, mix, and variable cost on the slide. And then fixed costs continued to be very well under control, so only 2 million increase in fixed costs in an year-on-year comparison, whereas then the translation impact as a result of TFX differences was a clearly negative number, minus 7, and as a result of all of these then combined, so we end up with the improvement of roughly 5 million euros in an year-on-year comparison. Then moving on to the business areas, starting with industrial service. So we had order intake of 380 million euros. So this is actually a decline in reported currencies, but an improvement of more than 2% in comparable currencies. So like already mentioned in connection to the bridge, so actually the FH differences continue to play a big role now in the fourth quarter as well. Taking a look at the different parts of the businesses, so field service declined in the order intake in a year-on-year comparison, whereas past business got up. And then when we take a look at the regions, so EMEA did well, so there was an increase, whereas then Asia-Pacific and Americas both saw a decline in the order intake. Agreement base actually grew by 4.4%, like Marco already also mentioned. Order book decline of 7%. That's a big number, but in reality, that is almost all, let's say, of everything actually is in relation to the currency changes. Net sales 3.5%, higher year-on-year in comparable currencies. The story is very similar to what it is in the order intake. So PATH did better than the field service and of the regions, INEA did better than Asia Pacific and Americas. Comparable EBITDA margin, 21.9% on a very good level, 1.3 percentage point improvement year on year. The improvement did not obviously come from the volume, as the net sales increases roughly in line with the pricing change. It actually more came from pricing, from good execution, as well as then efficient cost management in general. Then moving on to the industrial equipment. So there we have an order intake increase in comparable currencies of roughly 1%. However, when we take a look at the external orders, so this is down slightly by almost one percentage point against fairly tough comparables, fourth quarter of 24 was very good from the industrial equipment order intake point of view. Of the business units, we had growth in components in a year-on-year comparison. We had a decline in process grains and standard grains as well, a slight decline. One would maybe also say that this was flattish in a year-on-year comparison. And of the regions, again, IMEA did fairly well, so increased there, whereas then we had a decline or decrease in the Americas and APAC. In a sequential comparison, and taking a look at the business units, so components orders actually rose also in a quarterly comparison, so the component orders in the fourth quarter were very good. We had a decline in port grains as also in a year-on-year comparison, and then standard grains were fairly flat in a sequential comparison, similar to what it was in a year-on-year comparison as well. Here our order book rose by 2% and of course with comparable currencies even more. Net sales up 3% roughly taking a look at the total volume or then the external volumes falls roughly 3% up. The sales mix was such that it was a little bit more favorable from the margin point of view now in the fourth quarter of 25 than a year ago. And then when taking a look at the comparable EV day margin, 11.7%, excellent improvement of more than two percentage point in a year-on-year comparison. Again, good execution, pricing, and of course also the already mentioned mix supported the profitability in the fourth quarter. And then BOT solutions, order intake, 406 million euros, This is a decline of roughly 11% in a year-on-year comparison, of course, against very tough comparables. So also here, the fourth quarter of 24 was very good from the order intake point of view. When we take a look at different businesses within Port Solutions, so Leaf Trucks actually had good activity as well as RTGs, Port Service quite slattish in a year-on-year comparison. And then when taking a look at sequentially, particularly the business units that are more short cyclical, like lift trucks and port service, so lift trucks had an increase also in a sequential comparison, so Q4 was higher than Q3, and port service was relatively on the same level in fourth quarter as in third quarter, so flat exactly like in a year-on-year comparison as well. Net sales declined by as much as 7% in a year-on-year comparison. This was, of course, as a result of the order book timing and as such, as expected already earlier. Order book, however, is clearly higher than what it was a year ago, thanks to good order intake that has been there basically throughout the whole of 2015. Comparable EVTA margin, 9.2%. So this is decline of half a percentage point. So this primarily obviously comes from the lower volume So sales was lower than a year ago. Mix did not help here. So in POTS, it was rather negative than positive in a year-on-year comparison. But this was partly offset by very good execution and project execution in the fourth quarter within the POTS business. Then a couple of comments on the balance sheet side. Let's start with the networking capital as usual. Networking capital has continued to be on a very low level, so there is no meaningful change. From the third quarter, obviously, with the structure is a little bit different. Inventories have turned into accounts receivable, but otherwise very much on the same level. The improvement in comparison to a situation a year ago comes from accounts receivable as well as advanced payments. And then on the right hand side, we can see the free cash flow, which continues to be on very good record levels, actually also for 25 and the cash conversion continues to be clearly above 100%. Then consequently, of course, as a result of the cash flow, our balance sheet from the net debt point of view looks very strong, or actually we have net cash in the amount of more than 160 million at the end of the year. And then finally from the balance sheet point of view, so the return on capital employed on comparable terms, 22.1 at the end of 25. And then I will invite Marko back to talk about the outlook for 26.

Thank you very much, Teo. There's the outlook for 26, but before that, some other additional things, of course, our solid progress, very nice development, strong cash flow and balance sheet, that's two outcomes. Our board of directors is proposing to the AGM a share split with one to three ratio. That is of course due to the high price and due to enhance the liquidity of the shares. And we also have the board proposing to the AGM that we increase our dividend from the previous year 165 level to 2.25 euros per share for 2021, which is very much in line with our stable to increasing dividend policy. And now to the demand outlook. Although there is a volatility of course in the marketplace, we expect several sectors to keep the demand up. And in the industrial customer segment, we expect the demand environment to remain on a healthy level. And for the port customers, the container throughput continues to be on high level as we saw before. And there is, of course, these long-term prospects in that business in general, the long-term drivers, and then this, of course, supporting a strong container handling demand in the future, so the outlook continues to be good. But at the same time, of course, it is good to keep in mind that this uncertainty related to geopolitical decisions and the trade policy decisions and the tensions, they do remain high, and, of course, they may have – positive and negative impact due to our demand picture that may come also come quite quickly then. But generally speaking, we have a positive outlook on the market. And then finally, let's look at our financial guidance. So we have a starting order book that is better as already was elaborated also by Theo and myself earlier. the demand outlook is stable, so we have a confident but realistic picture on the demand environment, and we are conscious about the market uncertainty also, so we expect our net sales to remain approximately on the same level, or to increase in 2026 compared to 2025. And as you saw, our margins have been developing very well in 2025, and we expect these margins to remain approximately on the same level also in 2026 compared to 2025. And with that, I thank you all very much, and we can move to the questions and answers. Thank you.

Thank you, Merko and Teo, for the presentations. And now we will start the Q&A session. Operator, we are ready to take questions.

If you wish to ask a question, please dial pound key 5 on your telephone keypad to enter the queue. If you wish to withdraw your question, please dial pound key 6 on your telephone keypad.

The next question comes from Daniela Costa from Goldman Sachs.

Please go ahead.

Hi, good morning. I have three questions, if possible. First, I wanted to ask you, give some color on how you see the mix-in port solutions going forward? I know you mentioned here it was slightly disadvantageous. I don't know if it's just one-off this quarter or given, you know, the nature of equipment, maybe more larger equipment. Is that something that will continue? And then I'll ask my other questions right after.

The port mix going to next year, of course, it is approximately flat, the mix or neutral, the impact as I see it. And I guess that is still... of your conclusion also.

That is actually my conclusion also, and I think that what you are referring to with the larger equipment, so of course we have been talking about that the potential mix might be weaker going forward in case the product, let's say the demand moves more towards the, let's say, heavier equipment. However, that has not happened to the extent that we would be expecting a deterioration in the mix for this year. Right.

Got it. And then I guess we have seen in some regions quite a steep move on things like still prices. Can you talk us through a little bit how we should think about that, given the length between orders and sales, the pricing that you're putting out at the moment? Do you expect that to be a headwind in the shorter term or not really? You can test it all too.

So your question was particularly about deal prices, right?

Yes.

So the steel prices throughout 2025, they have been approximately flat, and there's actually a slight positive, or from our point of view, positive, so in that way that there's actually a somewhat lower quarter one steel price rates than there was in quarter four of 2025. The outlook is, or the forecast is that there would be a minor increase in steel prices. in in in 2026 but of course only time will show that how will that materialize our approach has been and it is continues to be so as still is for for many of our products a reasonably significant cost component that we will pass on the steel cost in our prices and that's how all our pricing systems and our configurators have been built Finally, there is some regulatory developments in the market, and this CBAM is one of them that, of course, eventually that CBAM regulation, although it has no direct impact to our products and so forth, that may drive steel costs up in the longer term, but that's not in the immediate visibility at the moment.

Got it. Thank you. And then a final one just in terms of like you have obviously very strong free cash flow, looks like a decent size comes from the payables within working capital. Can you talk a little bit about sort of exactly what that is and how should we think about payables going forward?

I'm not quite sure that what your question was. I mean, are you talking about capital allocation of our balances in general?

No, free cash flow.

Yeah, of course. I mean, if you're referring to the dividend policy only or the question of other means of distributing the cash?

No, no. I'm just actually asking about free cash flow. Within your cash flow statement, there is a big positive or table in the working capital. Okay, fair enough. Yeah.

Yeah, maybe commenting the networking capital as a whole. So now at the end of 25, we are on a very beneficial level. And we are clearly, let's say, we are several percentage points better than our, let's say, midterm target is, which is that we should be below 10% of rolling 12-month sales in networking capital. Now we are clearly below that. So the situation is very beneficial from the network capital point of view. And if the question is that, is that something exceptional or will it stay here or will it even improve? So one could maybe say so that this is in, let's say, maybe in the midterm perspective, this is on the better side of the average. So maybe the overall, in a way, level on a long-term basis could be even a little bit higher for networking capital, but definitely so that we aim to be below the 10% threshold of the rolling 12-month sales. And then, of course, we will need to allow volatility in both directions, as we are now seeing a very good situation, so it may be that in some quarters we are seeing a little bit worse situations. So the payables, accruals, and advanced payments, all of the combination of all of that is very important, but I would still stress the importance of the advanced payments. So this is a lot customer project timing related, how the networking capital develops from one quarter to another one.

Right. Colin, thank you very much.

Thank you.

The next question comes from Antti Kantonen from SEB. Please go ahead.

Thanks, guys. It's Antti from SEB. A few questions for me as well.

I'll start with the guidance of flat-to-growing sales and especially on the forage solutions side. How much of the backlog that you currently have do you expect to convert to revenues during 2026? or if you don't want to give the number, how does that compare to the situation a year ago?

We maybe not give the direct number for the first question, but if we take a look at the overall order book now that we have at the end of 25 for 26 and compare that to how much order book we had one year ago for 25, so the difference is now more than 100 million. For all three BAs. For all three BAs. And then, of course, it is fair to say that the POS business is a clear majority of that, particularly now that the FX differences are impacting so much through the order book of the service business. So that basically it is the same number or maybe even slightly more for POS than what it is on the group level. But this is, of course, with reported currencies. So if you take a look at comparable currencies, markets with both numbers, so then, of course, that number is higher. So it's about twice as high, not for quotes, but for the group.

Yeah, sure, sure. And I was also thinking on the guidance, if we talk about, let's say, on the lower end of it, that your sales will be on the same level as in 25%. would that imply actually that volumes would be down? I don't know, clearly, but anyways, one would assume that, and still you talked about the net price impact on Q4, one would assume that the positive pricing continues to 26. So how should we think about that volume pricing, pricing trend in the backlog?

Of course, like we were saying earlier, The starting point is positive with the stronger order book. And of course we have a stable funnel that we look with positive mind. So there is all the reason to be positive about the demand environment and the volumes also. But at the same time, there are some question marks. Theo mentioned one of them is of course is the currency Currency rate, of course, and the other one is related, of course, to the general development of the market environment overall. But we're trying to say with our guidance that, of course, we have a good starting point for the year and we look at the volume development positively. But being, you know, appropriately, let's say, cautious about it also in this environment.

But logically, of course, you are right. So, I mean, if the sales were flat in a year-on-year comparison and the order book for this year is $100 million more than what it was for last year, so, of course, then it would mean that the in-and-out volume would be lower, which could be, let's say, depending on various things. But, of course, now we need to remember that what we are saying regarding the overall market outlook is that the sales funnels in the various businesses, so they continue to be good. They continue to be stable and on a good level.

Yeah, that's clear. Then the second question was on profitability and maybe a reminder on the tariff-related pricing tailwinds that were quite notable on previous quarter and still there on QQ4. How should we think about kind of impacts of those going forward, maybe fading away? Any guidance on that?

Well, they repeated also in quarter four after being visible in quarter three and quarter two, but not to the same extent. So as we have also said before, the expectation is that they will go away or deteriorate over time. And of course, it actually continued throughout the whole year, and there was also a positive sign to us. We expect that you will not see a similar kind of positive tailwind going forward. But also, it should not have a significant negative impact to the margins either.

Okay, that makes sense. And then the last question, and I guess, Marko, you almost started to answer on the capital allocation side, and I mean, obviously, there's a clear increase on the ordinary dividend, but again, I mean, balance sheet is getting stronger and stronger, and capital allocation has been a bit of a discussion point, so any updates on further distribution, buybacks, anything like that?

Yeah, I was so eager to start answering that question already, so I just re-emptied that. No, I mean, of course, that our approach has not changed there. Of course, we have several potential means for the use of that gas, and we are working on all of them. The obvious one is the potential acquisitions, and as we said before, we are, you know, That has been a big part of ConnectGrain's history and it continues to be so in our future also, the inorganic part of the growth. And so we have a funnel of different size of opportunities that we actively exploring. And it's more a timing question that when we can realize those. And for that, for sure, we want to have maneuvering room and the increase in the dividend that was announced Today, of course, that is in our way jeopardizing that maneuvering room that we have going forward, given the available cash and then, of course, our ability to leverage the companies. Would you like to add something to that? No, thank you. Okay, good.

All right. Thanks so much.

The next question comes from Mikael Doppel from Nordia. Please go ahead.

Thank you. Good afternoon, everybody.

Thanks for taking my questions. So a couple of them, I'll take them one by one. So if we can start to talk a bit about the net of inflation pricing. I think you mentioned it, but was it still in Q4 of last year? How do you think about 2026? I mean, if we put tariffs aside, how do you think about pricing net of inflation?

Maybe since you were going through the bridge, you may want to continue on this also.

Yeah, the basic commentary here is the same as it has been. So we believe that we will be able to push cost inflation into the customer prices. And then, of course, the tariffs may change, the currency rates may change, but if we take a look at the overall underlying inflation, so the idea is that we will be pushing that into the customer prices. And in the past years, we have been able to do that in some cases, maybe a little bit even more than the cost inflation. So we believe that we can balance the situation from that point of view, but maybe it is not a good idea to expect inflation. a continuous net of inflation price benefit in 26 or further.

That makes sense. And talking about cost, just a follow-up. Do you have any meaningful cost efficiency measures ongoing now that could support margins into this year? Anything tangible you could mention on that side?

Maybe two things I will mention. First of all, this topic that we have discussed also in the past is the ongoing industrial equipment cost efficiency program that we earlier announced that will continue until end of 2025. And on that note, we can say that we are still continuing that and we expect that to continue to bring us some benefits also, additional benefits also during this year. The second topic is, or the second answer to that is that when it comes to adjusting our cost structure to the prevailing market conditions, that is what we did early last year also, that in all accounts, whether it's the SDNA or the cost that we have on the group level, or for example, in service, costs that are directly related to customer process and that is business as usual for us and that we've done in 2025 and we continue to do the same in 2026 if the market environment that demand so requires. But beyond those two things, we don't have anything specific to discuss about right now.

Okay. That's clear. And finally, I think you mentioned in your opening remarks, you talked about the industrial service business and saying it was a bit of a tough environment within that business. Can you talk a bit about, you know, what you see there specifically happening across the regions, across the customer segments, and how you expect 2026 to develop?

When we look at industrial service in general, if I start from just the market activity and how it looks, one thing that we've discussed earlier and we also can measure is how our remote connections, also what we call the True Connect product, how much activity the customer is having with our grains, which then of course means that how much manufacturing and production activity there is, and that those productivity rates are down last year, the whole year, and they also ended with a negative sign that's somewhere 6% to 7% compared to the previous year in terms of the general use of the grains. That's a fairly good proxy or explanation also due to how much our productivity in service develops for those particular customers, and that has a correlation to how our service business is actually – So that tells more that there is in this sort of environment where the customers have uncertainty of which direction the world is going, that they have the tendency to hold back on not urgent or not critical measures. They will do the things that have to be done to make sure that the equipment is productive and safe. That was a phenomena last year that had certain impact to the service business. But it's obvious that you cannot do that for very long time. So those equipment has to be taken care of. So that is something that usually returns. The other positive aspect is that we kept on increasing or improving our agreement base, which is essentially the growth engine for service and very important. So that grew more than 4%, 4.5% last year. And that is what we consider and I consider very important as a service core. And then finally would say to that, and sorry for the long answer, easy to get excited on the topic. On service side, there is a lot of positive demand drivers like there is in the ports demand side, in the long term, and whether it is the demographic trend of having less people doing this sort of thing, or the automation trend that's also prevailing in some of the segments there, the outsourcing, that similarly to ports actually is prevalent in many of the industrial and many others that also in the long term are drivers for demanding in industrial service as well as in efficiency drivers too. If I may add to a little bit additional color. I thought that I answered the whole thing already.

That was very good, but I would maybe add one more thing. And I think when we have previously been saying that actually the differences between regions tend to be bigger than between customer segments in our demand. So now it may be that there start to be relatively big differences in demand pictures between different customer segments. And there are maybe a couple of indications of that one, and one of them is that the thing that we have been discussing also earlier, that, for example, in North America or in the U.S., there has been a little bit of slowness on the service and equipment business, on the other hand, has been maybe even surprisingly strong, so which would, in a way, maybe indicate that some of the segments are doing well and they are buying equipment, and some others have maybe a little bit more issues with their utilization and they are maybe saving on non-essential services. And also then this fact that our service spare parts are doing better than the field service may be an indication of the same thing. I mean, of course, the tariff thing, et cetera, can impact the spare part pricing and inflate that a little bit, but that doesn't explain the whole thing. So these kind of changes may be there happening a little bit because of defense and because of power and those kind of specifically, let's say, buoyant segments currently.

Okay.

That's super helpful. Thank you very much.

As a reminder, if you wish to ask a question, please dial pound key 5 on your telephone keypad.

There are no more questions at this time, so I hand the conference back to the speakers for any closing comments.

Thank you, everyone, for following our webcast event today, and thank you for asking such great questions.