Safran Sa Ord

Welcome to the SAFRAN full year 2024 results. At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to your hosts, Olivier Andries, SAFRAN's CEO, and Pascal Bontenis, Group CFO. Mr. Andries, please go ahead.

Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us to our full year 2024 earnings call. I'm here with Pascal. Starting with our key highlights. 2024 has been a landmark year for Safran, with revenues, profits and cash flows reaching record levels. These achievements were underpinned by strong aftermarket activity across the board, with notably civil aftermarket activity growing by 25% in dollar terms. supported among other things by the more than 10,000 aircraft in service powered by a second generation CFM56. Our focus on operational excellence continues to deliver results. We improved our operating margin by 150 basis points year over year. And we are pleased to see Safran Seats reaching operating break-even. marking another milestone in our turnaround efforts for aircraft interiors. In terms of OE deliveries, lift volumes were down 10%, reflecting supply chain constraints. Equipment and defense and aircraft interiors businesses saw an increase in OE volumes, benefiting from strong customer demand. On mergers and acquisition, we have just completed the acquisition of C RT, a U.S. MRO leader. At the end of December, we have divested our 50% share of Roxel to MBDA and signed an agreement with Woodward for the sale of our U.S. electromechanical actuation activities. The closing of Woodward deal is subject to the concomitant completion of Collins Actuation and Flight Control Activities Acquisition expected at the end of H1 2025. Looking ahead to 2025, we are confident to deliver another year of substantial revenue and profit growth. Turning to slide four, let me give you an overview of Safran's remarkable financial performance in 2024. Revenue grew by 18% at 27 Each of our divisions contributed to this strong growth, reflecting robust demand and our ability to execute in a volatile environment. Recurring operating profit is up 30% at €4.1 billion. Recurring operating margin expanded by 150 basis points, reaching 15.1%, reflecting strong business activity and illustrating our focus on operational excellence. Free cash flow was €3.2 billion, which is a standout performance considering pressure on working capital. Based on this good set of results, And as per our dividend practice to distribute 40% of our net result, we are proposing a 2.990 euro dividend per share for 2024, up 32% compared to last year, returning 1.2 billion euro to our shareholders and reflecting our confidence in the future. Turning to slide five, commercial momentum has continued in the recent weeks across Safran key businesses. In December, CFM achieved a significant milestone for the LEAP 1A engine with FAA and EASA certification of the new high pressure turbine durability kit. This enhancement extends time on wing. and durability, particularly in challenging hot and dusty environments. This is a trigger to start recognizing profit on Leap 1A RPFH contract. We celebrated the first commercial flight of the Leap 1A powered Airbus A321 Extra Long Range with Iberia. marking a milestone in long-range single-ail aviation. We are very proud of the full-fledged certification by EASA for our Engineus 100, a world premiere for an airworthy electric motor to power an aircraft. This is paving the way for extended application of electrical machines in general aviation and VTOL, for mission-critical functions with the highest standards of flight safety rules. Moving to our expanding defense business. In the US, we have launched Safran Defense and Space Inc. to expand our footprint, for instance, in Bedford for electro-optics, in Denver for small satellite propulsion, and in Rochester for the positioning, navigation, and timing systems. We secured new contracts with the Bundeswehr in Germany to supply advanced infrared binoculars and with the Egyptian Navy to provide optronics and navigation systems. Each of these achievements demonstrates Safran's ability to drive innovation, support our customers, and deliver value in an increasingly competitive global market. Now on slide six, sustainability. An update on our climate strategy roadmap achievements. In 2024, we devoted nearly 700 million euros in self-funded research and technology of which 88% was dedicated to environmental efficiency. In addition to the NGIN-EU certification, we have made several other key progress in our technological roadmap, reinforcing our leadership in sustainable aviation. We conducted ground tests of the first liquid hydrogen-fueled turbine engine. for light aviation with our partner Turbotech and Air Liquide. We completed the Ecopulse flight test campaign with Daher and Airbus, demonstrating the potential of distributed hybrid electric propulsion. We inaugurated Bicova in Belgium, which is a unique compressor test center designed to validate the next-gen aircraft engine innovations. We remain fully committed to reducing our carbon footprint and driving sustainable transformation across our operations. Our EcoVadis rating increased to 65 out of 100, reflecting ongoing improvement in ESG performance. We are on track to meet our 2025 and 2030 scope one and two CO2 reduction targets aligned with the Paris Agreement. We hosted our third supplier day, engaging our top 400 suppliers in our sustainability journey. To further drive our sustainability agenda, we continue to integrate sustainability into our governance and operations. I will now hand over to Pascal for more details on our 2024 results.

Thank you, Olivier. Good morning, everyone. I'll be commenting on the adjusted accounts for which a bridge from the consolidated statements is presented on page 8. As usual, the adjustments relate to FX or PPA. The 4.7 billion euros change in mark-to-market of instruments edging future cash flows has been recorded in financial income in 2024. This is purely an accounting entry with no cash impact. FX trends are illustrated on slide nine. We continue to actively manage our currency exposure and secure favorable rates in a strong USD environment. In 2024, the Euro-USD rate fluctuated around 108 all year with a drop at 104 at year end which explains the mark-to-market from the previous statement. We achieved a hedge rate of 1.12, an improvement of one cent compared to 2023. For 2025 and the following years, our hedge rate is set at 1.12, same as in 2024. By convention, the annual estimated net exposure is capped at $14 billion, and this should not be interpreted as a medium-term business forecast. Our hedge book stands at $44.7 billion, ensuring long-term visibility and predictability for operations. On the income statements, one of items amounted to 6 million euros, including capital gain from the Roxhill divestment of 83 million euros. In financial incomes, the return on cash investments exceeded the cost of debt and generated 157 million euros in net financial interest. Additionally, FX revaluation of some positions on the balance sheet had a negative impact of 106 million euros. The apparent tax rate is 23.8%. Since the French draft finance bill was not adopted by year end 2024, there was no corporate surtax applicable that year. According to the latest news in France, 2025 should be the one and only year when the surtax applies. Net income attributable to the parent stands at 3.1 billion euros, representing 7.37 euros per share, up 52% from last year. On slide 11, as Olivier said, 2024 revenue reached 27.3 billion euros, up 17.8%. It's 17.1% organic growth with very consistent growth rate each quarter of the year. Original equipment sales were up 17.2%, driven by volume, customer mix, and price. Service revenues were up 17%, benefiting from strong demand from airlines for MRO and spare parts. Then we had a slight impact from the scope, a modest impact of 0.6%, reflecting the M&A activity in terms of divestments and acquisition of different businesses. Recurring operating income was €4,119,000,000, up by nearly a billion euros in one year. It is up 27% organically, reflecting robust execution across our businesses. Margins expanded by 150 basis points to 15.1% of sales. demonstrating the margin acceleration that we discussed during the capital market day back in December 21. Key drivers of this performance include price and volume effects in OE and MRO, positive mix for civil engines, and operational excellence with sustained cost discipline and efficiency gains of setting inflationary pressures. While R&D investments increased by 160 million euros, Their EBIT impact remains stable as a percentage of sales. It was 4.1% in 2024, which compares to 4.3% of sales in 2023. Let's now take a closer look at our businesses, starting with propulsion. Revenue hit 13.7 billion euros, up 15%. OE revenue grew by 13.5%, with 1,407 leap engine deliveries, down 10%, impacted by supply chain constraints. The lower volume was more than made up for by a better customer mix and pricing. Helicopter turbine engine deliveries increased by 94 units, totaling 682 deliveries. M88 fighter engine deliveries remained stable with 40 units, comparing to 42 in 2023, I would say as expected. and it did benefit from a favorable customer mix. Propulsion services revenue was up 16%, driven by a 24.9% growth in civil aftermarket in dollars, in line with our guidance. Our new spare parts indicator is up 17% in dollars, thanks to more show visits and higher prices for both CFM56 and IceRust engines. Our new services indicator is up 38% in dollars, led by LEAP RPFH contracts, as you know, with no margin recognition in 2024, and ice rust engines. Helicopter turbines and military engines also help boost the growth of propulsion services. Recurring operating income was 2.8 billion euros, up 18%, margin reach 20.6%, up alpha point compared to 2023, supported by the good dynamic in aftermarket for CFM56 and favorable customer mix and pricing. Equipment and defense sales reached €10.2 billion, up 17.7%. Original equipment revenue was up 18.3%, driven by higher volumes of Nacelles on the A320neos and the GE Gulfstream 700. more electrical system for the 787 and the A320neo, as well as increased defense sales on guidance systems, optronics, and land systems. Service revenue was up 16.8%, with a strong recovery across the board. Recurring operating income reached 1.3 billion euros, up 31%, with an operating margin at 12.2%, at 100 basis points compared to 2023, which was our commitment. This was expected thanks to the OE ramp-up, strong services, better pricing, and a relentless focus on operational excellence, which helped us offset the impact of inflation. Finally, on aircraft interiors, we can share some great news. That division is now back to the black. Sales were €3 billion, up 25.2%, showing very strong growth, but this is still 5% below the record levels of 2019. OE was up 24.5%, with strong growth in cabin activities, like custom cabins, A350 lavatories, A320 galleys. In the seat business, we delivered nearly 2,500 business class seats to major airlines worldwide, making significant progress in our industrial and engineering processes. Services were up 23.6%, benefiting from strong growth in both seats and cabin, mainly in spare parts. So we've made progress in turning around aircraft interiors. After breaking even in full year 2023 for cabin, cabin and IFE are now positively contributing to recurring operating income, and seats as rich operating breakeven for full year 2024. In the second half of the year, aircraft interiors was even at breakeven in terms of free cash flow generation. As a result, the division posted a positive recurring operating income of 27 million euros. On slide 16, free cash flow exceeded our expectations at 3.2 billion euros. This is an increase of nearly 250 million euros compared to 23, demonstrating the efficiency of our cash management. This performance comes from a 31% increase in EBITDA and stable working capital needs thanks to higher customer advance payments and deferred income, which have set the rise in inventory in euro terms. We also continue to invest in new production capabilities, especially in engine MRO, as well as in low-carbon projects. Safran was net cash positive at the end of 2024 with a positive balance of €1.7 billion, which represents minus 0.3 times EBITDA. Besides the free cash flow, we paid a dividend of €2.2 per share and repurchased shares for €1.3 billion. We also proceeded with the early redemption of the OCEAN 2027 convertible bond using shares purchased in 2022 and 2023. And we had a net cash out impact from our M&A activities of nearly 300 million euros. So we remain fully delivered and we enjoy a strong balance sheet. Switching to shareholder returns on slide 18. For the fiscal year 2024, Safran will propose a dividend of 2.9 euros per share, up 32%, representing a 40% payout ratio on the adjusted net income. On share repurchase programs, in 2024, we repurchased 6.5 million shares for a total of 1.3 billion euros, including the 750 million euros in share buybacks, resulting in the cancellation of 3.6 million shares, which add an accretive impact of 0.86% on the equity ownership. We also completed the edging of the potential deletion of the 2028 OCEAN convertible bonds. And early this year in 2025, we started the execution of our 5 billion program for share consolation with the first tranche of 350 million euros. All shares purchased under this program in 2025 will be conserved by December 31st. Olivier, back to you.

Thank you, Pascal. At our last capital market day in December, we provided a preliminary outlook for 2025. Based on 2024 results and market trends, we are now raising the 2025 outlook. We expect underlying market trends to remain strong with a further increase in OE volume deliveries and robust demand for spare parts. We now expect high single digit plus growth in spares up from previous expectation of mid to high single digit for 2025. Therefore, Safran expects to achieve for full year 2025, excluding call-ins and any potential impact of new tariff implementation, revenue up around 10%, recurring operating income between 4.8 and 4.9 billion euro, free cash flow between free and 3.2 billion euros. Our free cash flow guidance includes an estimated impact of the future French corporate surtax of 380 to 400 million euros. Without this surtax, our cash conversion rate is above 70%. In closing, I would like to focus on our few key priorities. We remain totally focused to meet customer demand by managing the ramp-up in OE deliveries despite supply chain constraints. And here, LEAP is our top priority with the introduction of the new HPT blade on the LEAP 1A. We will continue to keep our customers flying, providing MRO and spare parts and ensure a smooth CFR56 to leap after market transition. We expect to close the call-in saturation and flight control activity acquisition by mid-year 2025. We will continue our clear and ambitious research and technology roadmap to tackle the greatest challenge of our industry, decarbonization. And last but not least, We are focused on our growth trajectory, increasing operating profit, expanding margin and cash. Thank you for your attention. We are now ready to answer any question you may have.

Thank you. If you would like to ask a question, you will need to press star 1 and 1 on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced. And to withdraw your question, please press star 1 and 1 again. Thank you. We'll now take the first question. First question is from the line of Benjamin Healan from Bank of America. Please go ahead.

Hey, morning, guys. I hope you are both well. First question I had was on the spares guidance. Now, high single-digit plus, I think that implies that you can actually go into the double-digit, so is that fair? And again, can you give us a bit more color as to what's changed versus the mid-single-digit low end a few months ago?

Hello, Ben. Olivier speaking. Yes, we have a slightly revised app, our guidance relating to spare parts. It's basically raising a up a bit the volume of of short visit and engine inductions basically we've not changed our assumption relating to work scope and pricing fine okay uh that's clear thank you and then second question is around the long-term free cash flow guide that you gave at the cmd you've obviously already raised cash

For 2025 and you did better than you were guiding for in 2024 So, you know when I when I do the math from here I actually think it's very very difficult for you to do the 15 billion At the low end and actually it's going to be quite hard for you to beat sorry to do to do worse than the 17 billion that you've guided for at the at the upper end because if we look at the 2025 cash guide that you've given is and you strip out the French tax, you're doing kind of 3.4 to 3.6 on an underlying basis anyway, which I assume will grow from here in 2026, 2027, and 2028. So can you just give us a little bit of color around that, and what are the other dynamics that we need to be thinking about in cash flow? Because it just seems at this point to be very, very conservative. Thank you.

Good morning, Ben. Pascal speaking. we were very pleased with the free cash flow generation in 2024 which came beyond our own expectation we were guiding for 3 billion euros and we ended up with let's say 200 million euros more than than expected it's coming from working cap meaning you know the assumption we had for inventories or or customer payments we did revise upwards or 2025 guidance and by, let's say, on average, 200 million euros. Again, based on the first better profit expected in 2025, which translates into cash, and also some changes we made in our outlook for working cap. So going forward, we provided at the capital market the guidance for cumulative cash of 15 to 17 million euros. We fully understood that this was seen as very conservative by the market. So we are pleased to do better in the first two years of that period of time. A bit early to say if we will beat and if we do by how much at the end of the day. So let's go step by step year after year and we'll see at some point in time if we can raise that or not. But clearly it's too early. There are a lot of moving parts in terms of the reason at which we will deliver LEAP engines and then the advance payments we do receive from from customers what about you know the rafale contra export contracts we could win in the meantime how we will manage inventory at a time where supply chain constraints are still persisting so a lot of moving start at the point sorry so a bit early to to be more precise on the cumulative cash over the period but it is a good start if not an excellent start i agree cool

All right, thank you. Final, very quick one from me. Your comments and proportion on OE positive mix and price. Can you talk about that pricing dynamic a little bit? Is that something we're going to see again in 2025? And can you just remind us where we are on the break-even point for the LEAP? Thank you.

Yeah, on the OE side, what we wanted to point out is that we've delivered much less LEAP installed engine and slightly higher spare engines so the ratio was clearly helping in terms of results in terms of of ebit in terms of pricing for oe engines we see a slight improvement over time but nothing material with respect to the ebit performance uh okay the the engine that we are going to deliver in 2025 is basically are based on

It's a commercial contract that we have signed years ago. So, I mean, it's progressing. It's progressing year after year, for sure. A key element is also the spare engine ratio, which basically I can confirm is on the low teens.

Okay. Very clear. Thank you, Ben.

Appreciate it.

Thank you.

Thank you. We'll now take the next question. This is from Robert Stallard from Vertical Research. Please go ahead.

Thanks so much. Good morning. Morning, Robert. couple of questions for me first of all on the new leap 1a HPT blade I was wondering if you could comment on how the performance has been so far and then when do you expect the leap 1b blade to be certified and then secondly I was wondering if you could comment on your expectations for high thrust engine OE and aftermarket revenue growth in 2025 thank you hello Robert it's too early to

to give an answer on the Leap 1A new blade durability. I mean, we are just starting to induct those new blades during the shop visit and also in the new OE engine deliveries. So it's too early to say what's going to be the impact. We are very confident because we made all the endurance tests and so we are very confident that the time on wing will double. So that's for sure. On the LEAP-1B, we expect the certification, the new blade to occur within the year, within 2025 for the LEAP-1B new blades. On high thrust engine, yes, the dynamic is strong. on that one and and that that also helps to raise a bit that has helped us to raise a bit the guidance on on the spare parts in this index for 2025 very strong dynamic on high thrust okay thanks very much thank you thank you we'll take our next question

This is from Ross Lowe from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Hi. Good morning, everyone. Thanks very much for taking my question. So just going back to the topic of the mix between OE and spare engines and propulsion, you mentioned low teens. Can you just run through what that was in Q4 24, and then also how you see this trending quarter by quarter through 2025? Thanks.

We don't give this level of detail. Sorry for that.

Is the current level?

The current yearly level. Now you know, you are well aware that we do every week an allocation of new engine deliveries between installed engine delivered to the airframers and spare engines delivered to the airlines. So it can vary from one quarter to a quarter, of course. So the key point, the meaningful one, is the yearly result. And I can confirm it's low teens.

The color we can provide is on 2025, so we expect LIB deliveries total to be up 15% to 20%. The ratio between stairs and installed engines will slightly decrease, but in number of engines in volumes, it should be more or less flattish from one year to the other.

Understood. Thanks very much for the additional comment.

Thank you. We'll now take the next question. This is from Ken Herbert from RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead.

Yes, hi, good morning.

Morning.

Yes, Olivier and Pascal, I wanted to see if you can comment on lingering pressure within the supply chain as it relates to either LEAP or CFM56 spare parts. Are you seeing things progress as expected and improve as hoped, or are there still some pockets of softness or concern there? And then specifically, can you provide any more detail on the cadence of LEAP deliveries we should expect this year across the calendar quarters to get to the up 15% to 20%? Thank you.

Hello, Ken. As you know, the supply chain issues are persisting but improving progressively. So we will progressively see, let's say, an easing in supply chain constraints all across the board. The number of critical, let's say, suppliers and critical sites are basically decreasing month after month. We still have across the board some, let's say, pain points globally. But I can say that the situation is indeed progressively improving. But still there, I mean, the demand is still stronger than what the supply chain can deliver. And this will still be the case globally in 2025. Now, as we said on the LEAP deliveries, we are confident we will be able to deliver 15% to 20% more LEAP in 2025 compared to 2024, which has been the year of transition, especially on the, let's say, new HPT blade.

But we won't provide a quarterly guidance for the LEAP ramp-up.

Okay. Thank you.

Thank you, Ken.

Thank you. We'll now take the next question. This is from Ian Douglas Pennant from UBS. Please go ahead.

Thanks very much. Yes, Ian Douglas Pennant at UBS. On spare parts, sales growth extremely strong in Q4 and services slower than your guidance would suggest. And then you've alluded to higher proportion of LEAP engines sold as spares as well. I'm surprised then that you're, if I'm not being too greedy, then that your profitability is not even higher in Q4. Is there some offset to profitability that we should think about there? Because with LEAP sales and spare parts growing, we should expect larger. And then my second question, please, on tariffs, if you have any general comments on how you might manage your exposure there or how you might size any particular exposure. That would be very helpful. Thank you.

Good morning, Yann. On your first question, on this side of the table, we were very pleased with the performance in EBIT for Q4 and for the full year. So I don't have in mind any negative events that occurred later in the year.

On tariff, as you know, we have a strong footprint in North America, especially in the US, in Canada, and in Mexico. And yes, indeed, we deliver equipment and parts to our US customers from Mexico and Canada. So it's too early to give a precise answer to your question. We are monitoring very closely what's happening here. We are looking at that. But as long as we don't have the scope of the potential tariffs and the details, we are not going to be in a position to provide a precise answer. But we are monitoring the situation carefully.

Thank you. We'll take our next question. Next question is from the line of George Zou from Bernstein. Please go ahead.

Hi, good morning, everyone. First question on CSN 56 shop visits. So in 2023, it was over 2,000. By 2025, you're targeting 2,300. So if we straight line that, it would be high single-digit growth in 2024 and 2025. I guess, what was the growth in 24? And given your earlier answer that the change in the guide is all on volume, would it be fair to say that for 25, you're not expecting about mid-single-digit volume growth? And then second question, back to Ian's question on profitability, I mean, profit, I mean, sorry, proposal margin, it was down year-over-year in H2. We know H2-23 was strong, but you had fewer relief OEs, fewer lease deliveries, pricing benefit on OE, strong growth in fares. I mean, all of those would have seemed ingredients for margins to improve. So why did it decline year over year?

Morning, Georges.

Hello, Georges. I will answer on the first one, the shop visits. So in 2024, when we look at shop visit volume, it has grown mid-single digits. In 2024, versus 2023. Looking ahead, we see again a mid-single-digit growth for short visits. And this is why we have risen a bit our forecast for 2025. So mid-single-digit growth again in 2025.

On your second question, George, I will highlight that the line called holding and eliminations came lower than you all are expecting. I just would like to recall what is accounted into that category. It is first the cost of the holding, and then the second is cost for services that we provide to all the companies within Safran. Typically, the M&A team is centrally and then recharged to the different companies of SAFRA. The fiscal team is central, so on and so on. In 2023, we had quite a high negative number in this category due to the fact that we have set up an employee shareholder plan that all the costs was accounted for into the holding and elimination. And in 2024, in the second half, we did recharge to all SAFR companies their own respective costs. So this is why holding and elimination is coming lower than in 2023 at, I guess, a negative 30 or so million euros. And when you look at the profitability branch by branch in H2, there is this kind of negative weighting on the margins. So that explains the... the propulsion margin you see in H2.

So this is why you need to take into account this correction when you compare H1 and H2.

And I would say the run rate in the holding and elimination going forward should be more in the 30 to, let's say, 50 million euros negative going forward.

And just to confirm, Olivier, when you say mid-single-digit volume growth in 24 and 25, starting from the base of above 2,000 for 23, is that still going to be around 2,300?

Around, yes. Yes. Okay, thanks.

Thank you, Georges, and good luck for your next position.

Thank you. We'll now take our next question. This is from Chloe Le Marie from Jefferies. Please go ahead.

Yes, good morning, Olivia and Pascal. I have two questions, if I may. The first one is actually on the de-correlation, if I may call it like this, between your civil aftermarket growth in Q3 and Q4 and GE's performance in commercial services. Maybe if you could explain what are the end-market exposures that drive that difference. And also on the CFM56 internal shop visits, if you could explain how these are allocated or competed for between yourself and NGE, that would be great. And the second one is a technical one. On the French surtax treatments on 2025 EPS, how should we think about this in relation to the payout, please?

Hello, Chloe. On civil aftermarket, just as a reminder, our indicator on spare parts takes into account mostly CFM56 for sure. LEAP is going to start, and our first engine as per our share of this program, which is, as you know, on the G90, it's 25%. So just as a reminder, when our partner is basically communicating on their spare parts, it's all across the board, combining, let's say, narrow-body engines and wide-body engines. So that can explain.

What we could say as well is typically on the LEAP shop visit today for third parties, not inside the RPSH contracts, Most of the work which is done relates to the HPT blades, meaning that GE is providing those parts to the MRO shops, so it's revenue for GE, not revenue for Safran. We do not yet recognize a lot of revenues on LEAP third-party MROs.

On top of that, we don't have the same accounting rules, so this has to be taken into account as well. And specifically on the CFM56, we don't have the same exposure to the services. Our partner basically has much more MRO activities themselves, I mean internal shop visits that we do have. So that can explain the differences.

Just if I can follow up on just on the internal shop visit, because obviously they indicated theirs were down in Q3 and in Q4. So yours were up, right, in Q3 and Q4?

You mean sequentially?

Year on year.

Year on year, I would guess so.

Are you talking internal shelf visit, our internal shelf visit?

Yes, your internal CFR56.

Okay, we don't disclose that on the CFR56. Now, what I can say year over year, on the LEAP globally, when we look at the shelf visit on LEAP, which you know that LEAP, we are only mainly talking about services today. On Leap, our internal shop visits have increased by around 30% year over year between 2024 and 2023. And it's going to grow 30% between 2025 and 2024.

Am I clear?

Yes, yes. So a 30% growth on LEAP internal shop visits, on LEAP shop visits globally, so on LEAP shop visits of 30% between 2025 and 2024. And I can also give another element. The third-party shop visits on LEAP will continue to grow. and will be, let's say, between 10 and 15% in 2025. This is an important point because when we talk about third-party shop visits, this is the driver for, let's say, spare part revenues for us on LEAP. So 10 to 15% third-party shop visits on LEAP in 2025.

On your last question about the EPS guidance for the dividend calculation for this year, we usually and we always, I would say, apply a 40% payout ratio on the adjusted net income to compute the dividend proposal. It is true that when we have non-cash impairments affecting the net adjusted income, we would usually restate the net income from those. Typically last year, well in 2023, sorry, we adjusted the net income by the impairment we had on the goodwill on the cabin and seats because it's a non-cash item. And then once we have restated the net income, we apply the 40%. In 2025, the surtax in corporate tax is a cash item. So there is no reason to adjust the net income this year before we apply the 40% payout ratio because it is a cash item compared to a non-cash item when we talk about goodwill impairment, for example.

Very clear. Thank you very much. Thank you. Well, now I'll take the next question. This is from Christoph Menard from Deutsche Bank. Please go ahead.

Yes, good morning. Thank you for taking my question. I wanted to come back to the tariff question. You mentioned Mexico and Canada. Two questions around tariffs. The first one is, do you have an idea of how many times your parts are crossing the borders in terms of the exchanges with Canada and Mexico? And the other element around tariffs is, What about tariffs on EU manufactured product and the engine parts? Is it something you've looked into and anything from the 2020 situation when there were some tariffs that could be useful in terms of understanding the situation? And the second question was on your guidance, you actually lowered the EFX rate. So it's a question on the sales guidance. You lowered the FX rate, so it should contribute to higher sales. Is it something, I mean, you said around 10%, so is around 10%, 13% the same in your understanding of the guidance of sales? Thank you.

Good morning, Christophe. I will answer very quickly the second question. There is no change in our FX assumptions. Spot rate 110. And the edge rate, 1.12, exactly the same as we had at the capital market day when we provided the preliminary guidance for 2025. In terms of spot rates, you know, one cent change would impact our sales by about 100 million euros. So typically today we are at a spot of, let's say, 104. So it's six cents different from our own assumption. Meaning that it could translate into an additional 600 million euro sales, which is not in our guidance today.

Christophe, I will try to answer on the first question, but there are many parts, sub-assemblies, modules flowing all around the world. As you know, we have a worldwide footprint. And so as an example, You know, when we assemble the LEAP 1A engines in France to be delivered to Airbus, but we get the call from our partner GE, so the call are flowing from the U.S. to Europe, and then assemble within a complete engine in our facility south of Paris. On the other side, the LEAP-1B for Boeing are assembled mainly in GE facilities in the U.S., and we deliver to GE the turbine module, which is coming from France, and the fan module, which is coming mainly from Mexico. And of course, submodels can, when we have some activities, for example, in Mexico or in Canada, and we deliver equipment from there to the U.S., yes, indeed, we get some parts that could flow from the U.S. to Mexico to be assembled in Mexico or from the U.S. to Canada to be assembled in Canada and then go back to the U.S. as a complete equipment assembly. So, you know, it's quite a complex worldwide, let's say, vision. And of course, this is why we are very carefully monitoring what's going on to see the impact and to, let's say, anticipate a bit and see how we can mitigate as much as we can through the impacts. That's basically the plan.

Thank you very much.

Thank you.

Thank you. We'll now take our next question. This is from Samuel Burgess from Citi. Please go ahead.

Morning. Thanks for taking the question. Firstly, can you just remind us on your expectation for a timeline on profitability in seats? That would be really helpful. And second question, the revenue guide is for 25 has remained flat, but our profit guide has clearly increased, which might imply a stronger aftermarket mix. Can you just give us some color on the rationale for this change? What's changed between now and December? Thanks.

I'll take the first one on seeds. As you know, and as you've seen at the Capital Market Day, The plan is to move up the profitability of Fair Heart Interiors globally to double digit, especially on seats. Starting from a break-even point for seats in 2024. Basically, we are targeting to be on this journey. We are targeting to have, indeed, an increased EBIT margin in 2025 versus 2024. So be in the black and be consistent with this overall journey. And of course, we are going to be focused on cash as well in order to improve the cash performance of our aircraft interior business as well.

Morning. On your second question on revenue guidance, there was no reason to change our revenue guidance for 2025. The only assumptions we raised between December and today is on the spare parts revenue moving from mid to high single digit to high single digit plus, which has definitely a positive impact on revenue. but this is falling within the up around 10%. In Euro terms, I would say we should be close to 30 billion euros in 2025. Remember that the FX assumptions we have is the Euro dollar on average at 110 for the year. We understand today it's 104, so it's more favorable than our own assumption, but we'll see with time what is the average for the full year 2025.

Great, thank you both.

Thank you. We'll now take our next question. This is from David Perry from JP Morgan. Please go ahead.

Good morning. Thank you for squeezing me in so late. Just one question. Any chance you could give some guidance on the propulsion margin in 2025, please? Thank you.

Good morning, David. We've reached a margin of 20.6% in 2024. We guided as a capital market that between 24 and let's say the end of the decade, we aim to maintain the margin above 20% at a time where we will transition from the CFM 56 aftermarket model to the LEAP service aftermarket model. In 2025, By the way, I could answer for all the three divisions. We aim to improve the margin rate in propulsion, still in the low 20s, but higher than what we had in 2024. Continue to raise the margin rate by at least alpha points in equipment. And as we aim to reach more or less 10% operating margin in aircraft interiors in 2028, It means that we need to improve the margin by 1.5 to 2 points a year. So this is what we are aiming for 2025. So within all of the three branches, we aim to improve the margin rate.

I'm just curious. You're willing to say up by half a point in equipment, but in proportion, you don't seem to want to guide. Can I be annoying and just try and push you?

It could be within, what, one and two points.

One to two point improvement in the proportion margin in 25.

Yeah, it could be a good target for us, yeah.

Okay, that's very helpful.

Thank you.

My pleasure, yeah. Maybe it's a good time to also highlight that, remember, at the Capital Market Day in 2021, we've said that for 21, 22, 23, were aiming to improve the margin by 100 basis points each and every year and this is what we did and we said at that time that in 24 and 25 we were aiming to achieve 150 basis points improvement and as you can see we did that in 24 and looking at our guidance this is uh more or less what we should achieve in in 25 so we are bang in line with what we've said in 2021 despite you know, a completely different environment in terms of inflation and supply chain.

Sorry, am I still on or have you closed me off? No, you're still on, David. Sorry, just to make sure I'm not being stupid. You mean 100 to 200 basis points or you mean 0.1 to 0.2 percent? Sorry for that question.

I'm seeing one of two points, improvement in the margin rate starting from 20.6%.

So it's 100 to 200 basis points.

Yeah.

So it's 100 to 200 basis points for the propulsion. Yeah. That's what he said.

Yeah. Very clear, very helpful. Thank you so much.

Thank you, David.

Maybe it's the last question.

Thank you. So the last question today is from the line of Amarik Poulan from Kepler Shofra. Please go ahead.

Yes, thank you for, excuse me, good morning. I've got three questions. So on this propulsion margin, I think you highlighted the first recognition of LEAP aftermarket profit in 2025 and the catalyst of the HPT blade approval. Does that change the margin contribution of the aftermarket? Is it a driver also of margin boost in 2025 or is it too small to really matter this year? And then on the guidance, you do not obviously consolidate the call-ins yet. And you mentioned the potential sale of the electrical business to Woodward. What this sale contributes today to the actuator business and what should be the net contribution to now assume for Woodward? for the equipment business. And last, I think there were some articles in the press mentioning an interest in ATOS activities. So could you give us a bit of a feel for the pipeline of M&A, both disposal and potential acquisition that the group is looking at right now? Thank you.

Hello, Aymeric. I will give you a quick answer on your third question. The answer is no. And by the way, we have communicated that we have no interest in looking at those assets. So we've denied.

Good. Thank you. On your first question, it is true that, as we say, that the capital market is a trigger event to recognize and start recognizing profits on LIP1A RPFH contracts with the introduction of the Maverick, so the new HPT blade. on the LEAP. Now that the blade is certified, I confirm that we will start to recognize some profits only on LEAP 1A today, RPFH contract. Frankly, this is non-material compared to the overall EBIT guidance we gave, so it will not make any change to the margin rate in the proportion division. On your second question, we will provide An updated guidance if we close that deal by mid-year on the Collins slash Woodward net effect on the account. Just to remind you purely on Collins activities, it's about $1.8 billion revenue. It was in 2023, I guess. So we'll provide an updated guidance on what will be the impact. As you know, the guidance we are providing today excludes any impact from the Collins acquisition.

Thank you.

Thank you all and happy Valentine's Day.

Thank you. Have a good day.

Thank you. This concludes today's conference call. Thank you for participating and you may now disconnect.