United Overseas Bank Ord

Good morning everyone and welcome to UOB's third quarter 2024 results media briefing. Today we have with us our Deputy Chairman and CEO Mr Wee Yee Cheong and our CFO Mr Lee Wai Fong. After both presentations we'll be taking questions from the media. For media who are joining us online please use the raise hand function if you have a question. I'll now like to invite our CEO to get us started. Mr Wee please.

Okay thank you. Now good morning, thank you for joining us today. As all of you know, globally, there are renewed uncertainties, and we are watching development closely. As an ASEAN-focused player, we see the region being resilient. Supply chain shifts, new FDIs, this could accelerate. Regional economies are growing strongly. Easing global interest rate allowed central banks to further boost domestic economy. China's recent stimulus should have a positive spillover effect across our markets. I'm pleased to report that UOP has achieved a record high quarter. Net profit was up 15% year-on-year, $1.6 billion. driven by broad-based growth across all business segments and in our key markets in ASEAN. And I can feel, I can see the momentum is quite strong, the whole ASEAN market. You can see cut across healthy demand across sectors and geographies boosted our loan books, driven by ASEAN role as a trade hub and related financing opportunities. Rise of the digital economy with companies upgrading their systems and growth of the green economy with rising demand in sectors such as electric vehicles and renewable energy. Following the US factory cut in September, we see positive consumer sentiment in ASEAN markets. Our cuts and wealth fees continue to grow double-digit. year-on-year for the first nine months. Synergies from our city acquisition have kicked in. Our customer base in the region continues to grow. Cross-sell synergies are bearing fruit, notably in CASA penetration across all four markets. And we will focus on this. On the balance sheet front, Our asset quality is resilient with strong provisioning. Specific provisions were higher, mainly due to one-off factor during integration of the Thai city portfolio. Delinquencies of the Thailand unsecured book have peaked and we are normalizing. Business is intact and revenues are picking up. Our full-year credit costs remain within our guidance of 35 to 30 basis points. We will continue to maintain healthy level of capital and funding. Now, in short, we are confident of where we are today and how we can capture opportunities ahead. ASEAN is a bright spot amid global uncertainties. Our clients are expanding, investments are flowing, and digital innovation driving demand for services. As an ASEAN-focused bank, ASEAN's growth story is our growth story. We are uniquely positioned to capitalise on the tailwinds of strong megatrends with our extensive regional network and capabilities. Our multi-year investment in standardising regional IT platforms are now dealing benefits. Our FDI advisory unit set up in 2011 has supported more than 4,500 companies to expand into ASEAN. And we are the only bank to have signed MOU with government investment agencies across key ASEAN markets. We expect sustained revenue growth across our businesses and will continue to invest in building capabilities in our key ASEAN markets. So for guidance, we expect high single loan digit, double digit fee increase led by cards, wealth trade debited fees, higher total income, Cost to income ratio between 41 to 42% and total credit costs at 25 to 30 basis point. Our strong capital position also allow us to consider capital management initiatives. So thank you for your support. Now I will pass over to Wi-Fi to elaborate on our financials and performance of our retail and wholesale business. Thank you.

Thank you, John. Thanks for joining us so early. And I hope you enjoyed the tour that the group called for you. Okay, back to our results itself. Our third quarter core net profit grew 10% quarter on quarter. And 11% year on year to a record 1.6 billion with core ROE at 14.3%. Net interest margin was stable at 2.05% as loans margin widened on proactive deposit cost management. Loans grew 2% or $5 billion from last quarter, contributed by broad-based wholesale and mortgage growth. Fees income was at a new high of $630 million, supported by healthy trade and wealth demand, as well as picked up in-card fees. Bidding and investment income was very strong at $709 million, boosted by all-time high customer flow, treasury income, coupled with exceptional performance from trading and liquidation. Asset quality remains stable, with NPL ratio unchanged at 1.5%. The highest specific allowance this quarter was mainly from Thailand operational merger issues, which we have addressed and will normalize in the next two quarters. Total credit costs on loans was at 34 basis points. Our capital and funding positions stayed resilient, with CET1 at 15.5%, and NSFR at 116%. A little bit more detail on the numbers. Like I said, core profit for the quarter rose 10% from last quarter and 11% from a year ago to $1.6 billion. Total income grew 10% quarter to quarter. And we are very encouraged by the momentum. And this is happening across all revenue lines. The one-off cost relating to city integration has reduced significantly, by more than 50% from last quarter, with Vietnam as the last portfolio to be completed to complete operational day one sometime next year. On the business front, Group Retail registered total income of $4.1 billion for the nine months of 2024. In constant currency term, this was 1% higher than a year ago. Healthy growth in CASA, cut billings and wealth management fees helped to cushion the pressure on margin, especially in the mortgage area. Total income for group wholesale banking is 5% to 5.1 billion amid the competition for high quality assets. The competitive pricing impact was offset by strong investment banking activities along with steady growth in CASA and trade loans. Our margins. Net interest margin was stable at 2.05% this quarter, while net interest income picked up from a longer day count, but also because of loans volume growth. Loans margin improved five basis points to 2.56% as we proactively managed and brought down our deposits cost of funding. Interbank securities margin declined many due to the lower in the bank is. On our fees, net fees income of 630 million is a new quarterly record. Loans related fees remain strong backed by double digit trade growth. Card fees past 100 million level, along with the sustained wealth momentum led by strong Banka and Unitrust sales. On our treasury and trading, Customer treasury income rose to a new high at $270 million this quarter on increased hedging demands and higher business flows and market volatility. Other trade investment incomes surged above the $400 million as we captured trading opportunities and recorded exceptional gains from interest rate volatility. Core expenses for the nine months was up 5% from a year ago as we continued to build regional capabilities while maintaining tight cost discipline. Staff costs for the quarter rose in tandem with income. These are mainly in bonus provision that we set aside. While IT related expenses picked up from strategic tech investments. On a large income base, cost to income ratio improved to 41.5%. Overall, our asset quality remains stable with NPR ratio unchanged at 1.5% from last quarter. The higher MPA for individuals was largely due to a little bit of the friction that we observed in the Thai Retail Operation Day 1 in Thailand. I think we have since addressed the issues and moving forward, the MPA will be normalized. For the wholesale portfolio, new MPL formation declined. In fact, recoveries and write-off more than offset this increase. On the credit costs, net credit costs rose to 36 basis points this quarter, with total credit costs at 34 basis points. The increase in specific allowance was mainly due to delinquencies in the Thai retail unsecured portfolio following the OD1 issue that I mentioned, but these have since peaked and were normalized by the first quarter of 2025. the highest special allowance also contributed by prudent collateral markdowns on a few selected corporate NPLs in the US and Hong Kong, as we step up recovery efforts on this account. Total credit costs for the nine months was at 27 basis points, and we expect credit costs for the full year to remain within our guidance of 25 to 30. As at September, the group total allowance was 5 billion, of which 3 billion was from non-impact assets. We continue to set aside general allowance for the growth in our credit portfolio. Our over MPA coverage remains strong at 98% or 210% after taking collateral into account. Loans grew 5 billion or 2% from last quarter, given by broad-based wholesale trade loans alongside the higher retail mortgage. Year on year, we grew 5% that constant at constant currency. Customer deposits grew steadily by 3% quarter-on-quarter, with continued expansion in wholesale and retail CASA. Our overall CASA mix increased to 53.6%. Our liquidity position remains sound, with LCR at 141% and NSFR at 116%, both well above the minimum regulatory requirements. Our CT1 strengthened to 15.5% following the implementation of Basel III reforms in July of this year. On a fully loaded basis, our CT1 will be at 15.2%. With that, I conclude my presentation and pass it back, man.

Thank you, Mr. Lee. We'll now take questions from the media. For those dialing in on Teams, please use the raise hand function if you have any questions to ask. Let's start with those in the room first. Can we get the first question?

Congratulations on the numbers and also the share price increase.

It opened up 3% when I walked in.

Yes, so congratulations. Thank you. I would like to pick up on the end of your presentation. You mentioned capital management. Could you share, I mean, your competitor yesterday said a huge share buyback program. Is this something that you are considering?

I think this, even the new boss, you can see the capital is quite strong. So we can do a combination of things. Firstly, we can grow. So ASEAN is growing. So that is that we can take full advantage of the strong capital to grow. Secondly, we are, as what you said, we are also actively, hopefully by end of this year, we can actually look at how we can take full advantage. Maybe capital management will come in. I will discuss closely with my CFO, see how we can take full advantage of that.

Meaning that you will consider buyback by the fourth quarter?

I think we're looking at all options. All options. Because if we can't utilize the capital for growth, we have to find some way to return it back to shareholders. I see. So definitely share buyback will be an option.

By a dividend or whatever it is. So I think this is something that we are looking at.

Would your investors prefer higher dividend or share buyback? What would you prefer? Oh, of course, dividends.

Different investors have different view. Long-term investors, some of them prefer share buyback because some of them have capital gain tax or dividend outside of Singapore. But there are various considerations because we have a wide range of shareholders. So, we need to look at the interest of OINC and also our retail. The retail investors probably like higher dividend. That's very obvious.

So, we have to balance both.

So, this is something we are still premature to discuss now. We are looking at it. I think we are in a good position to talk about.

Yeah, but what is the size of your excess capital that can be employed to the full advantage?

So technically, we have always been comfortable with 13.5 to 14 CD1. Okay, so technically between 15 and 14, the 1%, if our RWA 250 do probably talk about a size of 2 to 2.5 billion of excess capital that we can actually look at. I can say we will utilize that to grow and partly also to be. We look at RWA 1% of 250 to 2.5 billion.

I see. Yeah, just another thing that Wi-Fi mentioned earlier about you say something about staff bonus because cost rise in line with provision for staff bonus. Can the colleagues here be optimistic about bumper bonus?

We are quite clear that we have a staff program that must be in line with performance. So if we do well, I think to be fair, shareholders expect higher dividend, staff also expect higher bonus. So I think we are being fair and something that we manage well. We will look at between the headcount growth and bonus, because that's how we manage to tutor staff, to also push productivity. So I think it's the balance that we look at, but we appreciate the hard work done by staff, especially with all the OD1 that we are seeing outside all over.

We appreciate that, but like I said, it's something that we will have to consider. You know, today, two-thirds of our staff is actually outside of Singapore. Look at Malaysia, look at Thailand, look at Vietnam. So we are focusing on the region as long as the region is doing well. I think no reason for us to shortchange.

Oh, wow. Chairs keep going up. The chair price keep going up. I'm sorry. Up 4%.

Any other questions?

John? Since you're considering what to do with excess capital, I wonder with the completion of the acquisition of Citibank and soon the Vietnam integration will be completed, would you consider another acquisition within your core asset markets? I believe there is an Indonesian bank for sale now. Yes. Which bank for sale? Indonesia.

This is something we're always on the lookout for. Ultimately, it has to be the right fit. The last thing we want is to make any acquisition that is real, organic. Because the growth is quite robust. You can see the tailwind is very strong. Any acquisition that you make, I think it's going to take a lot of management time to manage the integration of the system, the people, the culture and all this. So I think we are mindful. We are also Not because of that, we miss out the opportunity. I have a team of people actually actively looking at it to see opportunity. You look at the Citibank, it's the same thing. After so many years of not doing anything, and I believe the acquisition of Citibank actually boosted the overall branding of the bank as well as the customer base that we acquire.

Thank you.

I just want to ask a couple of questions, mainly on interest rates and capital. What is your NIM sensitivity likely to be based on higher inflation in the US and fewer interest rate cuts? Maybe we just end up at 4.5% in the Fed funds way. How would your portfolio book

We have published that we are now less sensitive. We know interest rate of a card, right?

This is how fast it is at the quarter.

So we always say that every 2.5 basis point will affect around 1.6% to margins, will affect us probably in the region of 70-80 million. So you think about it, if it's 100 basis point card, it's a 300-400 million profit expect. which is significantly less than what we were, mainly because we actually was now a little bit more sensitive. We moved into CASA, that is proven, and we have also repositioned our portfolio in view of this class. I think now there are markets saying that it might not be as deep. I think it's something that we will watch. Technically, if not as deep, it will be beneficial to margin. It's still early days in the US and a lot of times I do agree some of the actions that's being proposed is inflationary and inflation might not come down as fast as they can. So actually we'll watch that. The 10 years have reacted but you know market has always moved ahead on the ground and Overseas Bank Ord Overseas Bank Ord Overseas Bank Ord Overseas Bank Ord Overseas Bank Ord

And the other part is, okay, so for your set one, you said that a transition is 15.5 and your fully loaded is 15.2. How come the difference between your transitional and your fully loaded is a lot? Less than your peers. I can't comment on my peers.

But you know how... How does it work? Okay. So that's the question, right? So basically, what Bezos does is today, everybody have their own models. So I give you the benefit of the models. Because of the difference in standard. What Bezos wanted to standardize is that you don't have big variation. You don't have one bank having better capital treatment than another, or they rank that the RWA is less. So what the BASR does is it actually set a flaw. Okay, which means that, you know, flaw is based on standardized. Standardized means they based on prescriptive parameters. So they don't care what your model says. They say that, okay, for this, this is the parameter, this is the range. So BASR after that in the transition. So meanwhile, if you're very aggressive, you can have the benefit because your RWA will be low. But comes to the final, it will be flawed at 70%. So if you are below that, you have to move your RWA up. And that's where a lot of the countries are. Singapore is actually quite unique compared to Europe. In Europe itself, it's actually the reverse, because a lot of them, the RWAs and all, same thing has been a little bit aggressive. So this is what Basel wants to do, to standardize risk treatment by all institutions. So those that are very aggressive has benefited a lot with aggressive model will be normalized upwards. So we are probably a little bit more conservative in the models. And we also have been positioning the models on this new buzzer. It's not new. It's something that is anticipated. So things like benefiting SMEs and all was something that we're working on. So, as a result, we are less affected.

The floor is nearer the Basel.

Yes, yes, yes. So, we are more conservative.

Okay, I get it. So you're at 15.2% which is would be higher than the transition than the but higher than your peers.

We are all roughly around is the transition that's reported around 15.6. It's no longer the difference in 1789 versus the 15. So the transition we have fully loaded.

Okay, got it.

Hi, good morning. I want to know, based on where you think rates are going, how would fixed deposit rates and mortgage rates change for you?

We have to go according to the market. If the interest rate drops, our mortgage will drop. But at this, I think it's holding, what is the housing loan rate now? 2.6, right?

Some foreign banks have gone at 2.4. No, but you see, Interest rate drop Interest rate drop Interest rate drop Interest rate drop Interest rate drop Interest rate drop Interest rate drop Hopefully making them later. So this is how the market calibrate. The second part is really asset opportunities growth. So I think mortgage, especially in Singapore, is a very good bright spot. So at the best, it's not only competitive, but it's actually very good risk. Very low risk. Hardly default. So there's a lot of competition in that space. In terms of your

Securities book, because the treasuries and all that deals have all gone up. What do you plan to do? Do you plan to extend it long, short? I don't know. Now you can go long.

Yeah, you're right. I mean, you can catch and you trust. But I always tell people that it's very frightening that the volatility of the 10 years are. When we were here just after the last talk, the tenure was probably 3.5, 3.6. And after we leave the room one month later, it's 4.2. So they are trading more than junk bonds. So that is the sensitivity we must be aware of. But it's right that 4.5 is attractive, that we have actually started to extend some of our books. especially in the liquid asset portfolio that we hold to carry. So we are selectively doing that. The other part was really the interest differential between the treasury and 10 years copies. That's most of our books liquid asset is in common securities Singapore. So that's the other one that we're actually looking at. But yes, we are looking to extend. We prefer to But we prefer to use liquid than to do other synthetics. So we didn't do as much synthetics. Most of it is natural extension of my liquid assets from it.

And then of course, I'm sorry, I have to point at her. And then what was the problem, the issue with the Thai book, the city?

Thai book, not Thai reporter.

So the city. Okay, so I think we just want to be very transparent. She probably knows about it. But you see in the city portfolio number one, there's a very big portfolio in the city that we took over. So we knew that things cannot be perfect. But we took the opportunity to normalize a few things. There are a few things that we changed in there. Like some of it, we changed billing cycle. Some of it, we have multiple billing cycles. Every time you got city pay on certain time, now our cutoff is certain time. So sometimes, then the other part was, we call it multiple cuts. So some people have two, three cards, right? Then when you make a payment, you specify which cards you want to pay. And then our system use operation. So there are some of these changes that actually As a result, these difficulties, because of this unfamiliarity, some of them default. Because when you're not, I think just be open, the other part was really Thailand itself also increased the regulatory minimum payment from 5% to 8%. So this is a rare combination that we have. As a result, we have actually shifted a lot of people to stable life. So within two months, we actually stabilized that portfolio. But we also deviated some resources to look at customer surveys rather than to chase payment. So as a result, we agree that some of this backlog started to build up. But the good news is, like I said, within two months, we actually addressed the customer issue. Then we looked at recovery. Okay, and we have fully recovered by now. So I think people now are paying on time. Now, I have to address this historical portfolio, which we have also got offered relief programs, give them a period of time to pay. So this definitely in our mind, we are very clear. It was a blip that we had. It was quite stressful to the Thai operation. In fact, we sent people to actually stabilize because our primary responsibility is to stabilize so that customer can play out. And that has actually taken out. All those talks about social media, they are already gone. So I think that's the good part of it. So I think it's behind us. Now we can look at synergies already because all these problems that you have then you can actually grow and it's actually a very big type of follow that we and the credit cards and all are pretty strong so I think that's where we are yes we had a little bit of hiccup but we have addressed it and I think we just have to face it okay but it's behind us and the good thing is We still can't absorb it. My credit costs and all, I still can't absorb it. It's not that it has gone such enormous amount, but yes, when you look at quarter on quarter, there's a blip in there and we will have to fully address it and take it back. I think the good news is behind us. Customer service is back to normal. When we look at the cross-sell that we go into, the amount that customers are actually now opening up, like I say, even some of the CASA accounts and all. We say Citi never really concentrated on deposits. Today, I think Thailand Penetration now has reached like 30%, 40%. And we continue to push that up. So from zero, from zero cross-sell, now we have one. So some of this, we are back to it. The spending per class has also increased. I think that, so we are quite confident that it's behind us. And like I said, we also measure customer feedback, customer, and we actually measure social media very closely. So the good news is a lot of those noises. So unfortunately, it was something that No, no acquisition. That's why it's so difficult. But there's something that we learn. OK, we learn, but good thing is our what we call the recovery programs was fully effective. So we saw all the indicators, past due, customer complaints, number of calls has been picked up. They're all back to normal now.

Will you guys revise any new guidance now that President Trump is in office now?

I think it's still too early to tell. So far, I mean, yes, I see the sentiment is more inflationary. But I think also depending on who are the people that you're sticking with. So on the face of it, yes, the interest rate may continue to stay higher longer, based on the strict policies, the inflation. But I don't want to make that assumption yet.

And then with ASEAN, do you think that investors will still continue to invest in ASEAN? I think so.

I think the flow is coming. You look at even JHO. On top of it, we have seven branches there. You can see the inquiries are very strong. They already committed to invest half a billion dollars Some of these customers that we referred So there are opportunities But it cannot translate to dollar and cent at this point But a lot of inquiries

So what do you plan for Johor? Are you going to open more branches?

We are looking at opportunity. We are looking at opportunity. We see how we can relocate some of the branches because with the acquisition of Citibank, we have added nine branches. Ten in Malaysia. Johor has seven branches. So this is something our people will look at it, see how we can capture it, how we can take advantage of the trade zone.

And then what about, you know, I think the Sultanate is trying to revive forest city and they're trying to encourage the banks to open branches. Have you looked at it? I mean, have you been there?

We are exploring, we are exploring. is still a bit too early. They have not formalized it. I think definitely there are more upside than downside.

Let me put it this way. More upside. Any other questions? Do we have questions from those online? Any other questions from those in the room?

Okay, so tomorrow, okay, let's ask about tomorrow. Have you, you didn't, I mean, in the first half, you always said that you get new customers for tomorrow. But what's the update on how many customers?

The latest, I think. So our organic acquisition is on track. I think we added, like I said, one over a million. So now we have probably... The last time we guided was 8 over, so now 8.3. So they are ending. They are a very important acquisition tool, especially outside of Singapore. So Malaysia was something that we saw that number coming into Malaysia. Thailand, we had it a bit earlier, and with the city, I think it's increasing, but I think the Exponential rate is happening in Indonesia. Because these are the ones that we have a branch network is not as strong. So it's happening. And the other thing that now that we have been focusing on was to put capabilities into a digital. I think that's what we want to do. And you'll see more of it coming up. Because if you want to look at cross-sell, you have to do all this. The digital capabilities have to be So that's where we are focused on. Both digital and the other part was really compliance related. We do have a lot of issues if you're not careful about the mass market. So customer onboarding and all was something that now we pay a lot of attention to. Scams and all. How do we enable people But yeah, too easy. People get worried and maybe add friction. So that's the balance now that we have to look at between security and innovation.

But the top four markets we are operating in, I think we do engage the parties. So the MPS score is actually top three. So I think the acceptance seems to be quite good.

So it's top three in the markets you are in? Oh, yeah.

Could you also share colors on the wealth flows and your wealth management?

I think the flow is quite robust. I think this time round, I think the flow will be more ASEAN, not so much on North Asia. So ASEAN because it's growing well, so the flow is coming from ASEAN. That, in a way, is in line with our market.

And is it like the increase in AUM during the quarter? Was it primarily net new money or was it because of trading games?

No, net new money. New money. So a lot of it, like Yichong said, is from the consumer space. So it's not in the private banking space. But the consumer space is where our ASEAN franchise is very strong. So I think that's also... Give testament to the cross-sell that we're all trying to do in the region. So we are quite hopeful, like John said, the momentum that's coming out of ASEAN. And people are now committing. Once the confidence is back, we hope. Of course, people always say that the amount and the penetration rate is different from North Asia, really because of the risk. So the wealth that we are selling are really financial insurance, unit trust, simple products that we want to look at, interest rate protection, etc. We have some in the private banking space, but not as big, where they look at equity, account and all. So I think we are quite happy that now the growth is in the consumer space. 4 billion from the previous quarter or on this one?

No, no.

So two things, right? One side, the consumer space. Once there is stability and there is somebody, at one time, they will move towards equity, but now more people go towards fixed income. So the fixed income space is where it's very active, right? So if you don't do, if FD is too long, right? Too long, sorry. You look for alternative and that's that's where we think that we are able to offer solutions at all. And also the risk and insurance is still a very core product that they are doing very well in.

And that's and you're happy with just doing banker with no insurance, no interesting life insurance.

We went we went through that.

It's just it's just a different. Fund Management is very capital intensive.

You probably want to focus on banking.

And no problems in North Asia on the credit front.

I think one of your peers mentioned that there was a big... To say that North Asia has gone out of the woods is not true. but we have been monitoring it very closely. I think we recognize our NPLs ahead. So we have some of those. People are asking us how come, and we are asking ourselves as well, how come we recognize North Asia? How come it's not popping up? But based on our own, and we are now looking at activities to try to accelerate settlement. Because you look at North Asia, at least there are more transactions now. In recent months, there are more transactions. Previously, there were a lot of speculations, but more transactions. So with more transactions, and one of the reasons why we increased our collateral value, like I said, is because we actually wanted to just take the haircut and get off. So hopefully we want to clean the books out. But it's something that is well managed. We don't have new accounts that's coming in that we're not aware of. So I think that is something that we are managing and we think that we're at the tail end. We're definitely at the tail end.

Some of the credit costs is due to valuation. So it's okay. I think it's good to be conservative.

Any observations on the new Thai Prime Minister? Any observations on the new Thai Prime Minister and how the asset quality outlook can be?

We are the only Singapore bank. We are highly committed.

I believe. I'm confident. Let me put it this way.

No reason not to think. and the floor of ASEAN Thailand is still one of the biggest countries. You can see the Chinese, the EV cars, and all these things. And the tourism is coming in. No reason. As long as they do the right thing, and they are business people, they do the right thing. And we have been in Thailand for over 20 years. In fact, the third week of this month, we are celebrating our 25th year.

25th.

I will be there. It will be a major celebration. And we have three buildings in Thailand. And you see my headquarter. And that gives a lot of commitment. I think it's important. If you want to be in the market, you have to be committed. So that translates to customer confidence. A country like Vietnam too. We are the first Singapore bank to be locally incorporated. We are also in the process of acquiring a piece of land to build our head office in Thailand and in Vietnam.

In Ho Chi Minh City?

Ho Chi Minh. So this is all ongoing because end of the day, these are all my major ASEAN subsidiaries. We are locally incorporated. We want to make Asma feel that we are committed and we are willing to put fixed asset in our own headquarter.

Is this year your 90th year? Is there going to be like, are you looking at a special dividend to reward your Singaporean shareholder?

You don't... 90 is a... I hope so. Okay.

All right, if there are no other questions, thank you all for joining us this morning. Thank you.