Vinci Sa Act

gentlemen, welcome to the Vansi Q1 Revenue 2025 Conference Call. I now hand over to Gregoire Thibault, Head of Investor Relations of Vansi. Sir, please go ahead.

Thank you, Heidi. Hello and thanks for attending this conference call. I'm today with the Investor Relations team and Marie-Amélia Faulk, the Group Controller. As usual, I will be brief to have more time for the Q&A and because I know there are other publications. And of course, for you this evening. What are the key takeaways of this Q1 publication? First, a solid performance overall to start the year, with total revenue up 4% to 16.3 billion euros, mainly driven by international, which is up 6%. And international represents more than 56% of our total revenue. Point number two, for Q1, please keep in mind that for concession, traffic is up year on year on motorways and on airports. For the energy solution business, made up of Vinci Energy and Cobra S, a dynamic international momentum and a good order intake in flow business. For construction, stabilization of revenue, as expected, at a high level while order intake of Vinci construction are up. I will give you more granularity later. Point number three, the group's order intake are down 2 billion euros versus Q124, but no worries, that's due to high comps at Cobra S. Indeed, recall that the order intake in Q124 included two offshore wind farm energy converter platforms worth 2.5 billion euros. Adjusted For this order, order intakes are up by almost 4% this quarter, with a buoyant flow business level. As a result, the order book of Vinci reached a new all-time high of 72 billion euros at the end of March, up 8% year-on-year and up 4% versus December 24. It represents more than 14 months of average activity, 14.5 months to be exact and to be fair, and that's a record visibility, giving the group serenity and enabling it to remain selective. Point number four, regarding the financial position, we are serene as well. The net financial debt of Vinci at the end of March amounted to 21.3 billion euros. This is a quite limited increase, of a bit more than 800 million euros since the end of December 2024, despite the traditional increase in working capital requirements at the beginning of the year, as you know, which is in line with the normal seasonality this year. Limited increase of the debt, despite the M&A spending this quarter, in particular for FM Conway in the UK, acquired by Vinci Construction late January 2025. Vinci's liquidity remains substantial, with a managed net cash of 11.8 billion euros and 6.5 billion euros of RCF. As a result, with such a sound financial position, Vinci is well prepared to go through the current economic uncertainties in the world and ready to continue to deploy its capital allocation strategy, whose pillars are investing in existing assets to extract more value, M&A and development under three capital disciplines. And of course, an appealing and recurring cash return to shareholders through dividends and shares buyback. Let's now have a closer look at the main businesses. For concession, revenues up 8% to 2.5 billion euros, of which Vinci Autoroutes, 1.4 billion euros, up 4%. Traffic in Q1 was up 2.1%, of which light vehicles plus 2.2% and trucks plus 1.6%. That growth reflects easy comps, traffic having been disrupted last year by the farmer's blockade, and on the other hand, negative calendar effects in Q1-25. For Vinci Airport, Revenue slightly below 1 billion euros, plus 12% and plus 9% like for life. You have already seen the traffic figures, which confirm the continuous rise in passenger numbers in almost all of the network's 14 countries. Many airports, for example those in Portugal, Mexico, Edinburgh or Budapest, achieved record passenger numbers. In Japan, passenger numbers continued to recover above their pre-COVID levels due to accelerating growth in travel with China. Overall, Vinci Airport's tax numbers were up 6% in 2025 versus 2024. Energy solution. Made up of Vinci Energy and Cobias, the revenue totaled 6.6 billion euros, plus 6% on an actual basis, and plus 3% like for like. That growth was driven by business outside France, which grew by 7.5% on an actual basis and by 4% like for like. This start to the year confirms that companies of Vinci Energy and Cobayes have strong positions in the dynamic market driven by the energy transition and digital transformation. On top of these beneficial trends, there is a positive effect of the recurring flow of acquisition made by Vinci Energy to strengthen its geographical coverage and bolster its expertise, and which can be seen as quasi-organic growth. Vinci Energy, in a nutshell, Q1 revenue, 4.8 billion euros, plus 5% actual, plus 2% like for like. All four business lines, that's infrastructure, industry, building solution and ICT, contributed to this growth. Outside France, that's 57% of the total for Vinci Energy, revenue was up 7%. The trend was particularly positive in Germany, which is Vinci Energy's largest market, aside from France, contributing revenue of more than 3.4 billion euros in 2024, and 0.8 billion in Q1-25. That's 11% more than Q1-24. In France, revenue of Vinci Energy was up 2%. Order intake for Vinci Energy consisting mainly of small and medium-sized contracts this quarter, order intake was up 2% in Q1-25, with an impressive new record high of over 22 billion euros on a rolling 12-month basis. Order book amounted to 18 billion euros plus 11% year-on-year and representing more than 10 months of average business activity. Finally, please note that Vinci Energy, our acquisition and integration machine, remained active on the M&A front, having completed 11 acquisitions this quarter, representing a total annual revenue of around 80 million euros on mainly outside friends. For Cobra S, strong revenue growth of 8.5% to 1.7 billion euros on plan with our guidance. In Flow Business, that's 57% of the total. Revenue rose by 4%, and it rose in Spain, in Latin America, and in the rest of the world. In EPC Project, revenue increased by 15%, 1.5%. This trend is due in particular to the ramp-up in Germany of the HVDC converter platform project and the ramp-up of the construction of the first LNG terminal of Germany. Remember that these projects are absolutely strategic for Germany's energy independence and sovereignty. In addition to this positive trend of EPC, it should be noted as well the contribution of the project of high-voltage transmission lines in Brazil. Order intake for Cobra S. As I already told you, they fell due to high comps. Meanwhile, it's worth mentioning that order intake on flow business kept on increasing. This order book amounted to a very high level. above 17 billion euros for Cobra IS, that's plus 2% year-on-year. It's a very high level that represents more than two years of average activity. And those of you with a good memory will notice that this order book is more than twice its level when we acquired Cobra IS three years ago. Vinci Construction, Q1 revenue, 7.1 billion euros, plus 1%. Outside France, that's 53% of the total, Revenue rose 2% thanks to recent acquisitions in the UK and in North America. On a like-for-like basis, revenue contracted by 3%. In more detail, business levels rose in continental Europe, Africa and Oceania, but fell in other regions. As already mentioned in our previous press releases, revenue from large projects fell slightly due to phasing issues, with some projects being completed while others were only in the start-up phase. In France, activity was slightly down, minus 1% life-or-life. In details, we note the firm business levels in roadworks, hydraulic and railworks, which partially offset lower levels in civil engineering arising particularly from the phasing of work on Grand Paris Express and in the building sector. Order intake rose by 7% at Vinci Construction, increasing in specialty networks and major projects as well as in Africa, and remaining this order intake at a high level in the Americas, Oceania, and in world works in France. Vinci Construction order book ended a quarter of 9% at almost 37 billion euros, representing 14 months of average activity. Vinci Immobilier, you know that the modest impact for Vinci Group, Q1 revenue of €245 million, minus 5%. And the value of reservation fell by 8%. That's partly due to some postponement of several bulk sales transactions to the Q2 2025. In conclusion, in today's particularly troubled environment, Vinci's multi-local business model gives it agility, resilience, and the ability to adapt. On one hand, its activities are essentially based on local supply chains and workforce. On the other hand, its management model is based on a highly decentralized organization and a strong entrepreneurial culture. In a nutshell, Vinci seems to be a safe haven in today's paradigm, as some of you write. Vinci is therefore able to maintain the 2025 guidance presented last February. To wrap up, Vinci expects its total revenue and earnings to rise again in 2025 before factoring in the increase in corporate tax rate in France. And last but not least, I see this opportunity to remind you that from the 1st of May 2025, Xavier Villard will become Chairman of the Board of Directors and Pierre Angeloas will become Chief Executive Officer of INCI, following the footsteps of his predecessor to keep on benefiting on the bright and long-lasting megatrend led. We would like to thank you for your attention and we are now ready to take your questions.

Thank you. If you wish to ask a question, please press star 1 1 on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced. To withdraw your question, please press star 1, 1 again. Please stand by while we compile the Q&A roster. We will take our first question. And the question comes from the line of Elodie Rao. Please go ahead. Your line is open. Hi, good evening.

Thanks for taking my questions. First of all, I was wondering if you could give us a bit more color about the impact of negative calendar effects in Q1 on traffic in both toll roads and airports. Second, if you could give us a bit of traffic trends so far in April in toll roads and airports, but I suppose that's harder for toll roads. And third, if you could help us understand if there's any impact from these tariffs announcements on the diverse parts of Vinci's division. Thank you.

The last question? We missed it. The line was bad.

Oh, sorry. The Trump tariffs announcements, what would be the direct or mostly indirect impact on the different divisions of ANSI. Thanks very much.

So, yes, regarding the traffic, what we wrote is that the calendar effects were negative. First of all, 2024 was a leap year, so you have mechanically one day more, one day less than this year. Second point is Easter weekend. It started last year in 2024 in March. You remember? It started at the end of March and finished at the beginning of April, while this year, the Easter weekend was fully in April. So it means that particularly March, because of Easter, faced icons. And that's why in March, the traffic was down, in fact, 4%. This trend, at least on the calendar effect point of view, should then reverse in April. That said, if your question is, if we try to isolate the calendar effect and the farmer blockade impact last year, what would be, let's say, the traffic trend? We are not able to answer that. It would be slightly up, traffic For airports, we communicate every month, so you can see what can be the impact. For airports, we still expect growth, even if the growth should normalize month after month. And that's what we said in the guidance, by the way. We said that for the full year 2025, we expect total Pax to be up versus 2024. but growth to be less than in 2024. Growth in 2024 was plus 8.5%. So we still expect a growth in 2025, but more moderated than the 8.5%. For Trump, for the tariff impact, it's important to have in mind that we are a multi-local company. So in the U.S. in particular, we are American. We have local suppliers. Our employees are American. We don't sell imported goods such as luxury, spirits, or cars. So there is no direct impact on our business. And the U.S. is quite small for VinChip. In the US, we generated last year 3 billion euros, a bit more than 3 billion euros of revenue, compared to total revenue of 72 billion euros. So let's say the US impact is quite limited. And by the nature of our businesses and the nature of our organization, the direct impact should be limited. After, if the US economy were to slow down. And if the US dollar were to fall, there could be, let's say, indirect impact for us. But short term, I would say no impact.

Thanks very much. And do you have an idea of the traffic trends on Toll Road in April?

No, you will see the 20th of May when we publish the April figures.

All right. Thank you.

No problem.

Thank you. We will take our next question. And the next question comes from the line of Louis Pretto. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Good afternoon, everyone. Thanks, Greg, and the rest of the team for taking the time. I just had one question, and apologies because it's a bit unrelated to the actual numbers. You presented a request for qualification for the I-285E, but I understand that you have refrained from doing so for the I-24 Manus Lane in Tennessee. Could you provide us some light on why one project and not the other, as well as what to expect from Vinci in the remaining U.S. Manus Lanes project pipeline that we see in front of us? Thank you.

So first, we have a look, that's true, for the managed lane you mentioned, which was not the case for Georgia. We remain very cautious. You know our approach. We consider that the biggest risk for managed lane is on construction, is for the contractor. And so we didn't change on this front. That said, and probably that's why you can see there are more Competitors recently in the upcoming opportunities of managing the U.S., instead of having the two or three general suspects, you have maybe four or five, according to what I see in the press. It's maybe due to the fact that the risk matrix is rebalanced a bit in favor of the private sector. That said, I don't want to comment more than that. But it's true that we have a close look on this next opportunity while remaining very cautious and selective, you know us. So we'll see.

Excellent. That helps. Thank you very much.

Thank you. We will take our next question. Your next question comes from the line of Ruari from Colonnade. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Hi there, Rory Cullane, RBC. Firstly, why do you think heavy goods vehicle traffic declined in auto routes in March? Just comparing the February release with the Q1 figures, I just thought the time would be favourable there. And secondly, quite an open-ended question, how will increased investment in Germany impact your contracting business? What's your exposure there? Thank you.

So I will first answer on Germany. It was your question, Ruri, on Germany? Yes, that was my question. Yeah, but in Germany, that's a big market for Vinci. We are very exposed to Germany. And by the way, this country is our second largest international market after the UK. Now, Vinci generated in Germany in 2024. Revenue of around 5.6 billion euros. That's 8% of our total revenue. And what's the split between this revenue? Vinci construction is 1.4 billion euros. That's mainly some road construction. And you know that road is one of the components of the stimulus plan announced by the future Chancellor So Vinci Construction, 1.4 billion euros. Vinci Energy is extremely big in Germany. As I said, it's more than 3.4 billion euros last year. That's the main international market of Vinci Energy. It represents almost 20% of the total revenue of Vinci Energy. Vinci Energy in Germany is very exposed to infrastructure. And when we say infrastructure, it's energy infrastructure. So to the country, the transmission and distribution lines network, which should be as well a very important part of the stimulus plan. And Vinci Energy is quite big as well in industry for industrial clients. And that said, I told you that the revenue of INSEE Energy increased quite strongly last year, year on year, and increased again in Q1-25 by 11% versus Q1-24. And Cobra 8 is very active in Germany, notably through Dragados Offshore, you know, to build and install the HVDC platform, and active as well on the LNG terminals that I mentioned in introduction. This is, you know, the first LNG regressification plan of the country. So it's a very strategic and important project. So if your question is, should we benefit from the stimulus plan in Germany, both for infrastructure and for defense, the answer is yes.

Great, thank you.

And how about... There was a traffic on EV trucks in March. You say decreased? No, it's flat. It's slightly, very slightly up. The trucks in March 25 versus March 24, slightly up. Year-to-date, trucks are up almost 2%. So I thought, you know, to try to analyze month after month, you can have many effects impacting the trend. So it's not always very easy for us to explain. And it's not always, in other words, don't try to extrapolate too much, this kind of monthly trend.

OK. Thank you.

Thank you. We will take our next question. Your next question comes from the line of Eric Lemary. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Yes, thanks for taking my question. I got three. If I may, the first one, could you maybe confirm that you lost the Nairobi Nakuru PPP in Kenya? I think you won this PPP with Meridian some years ago. I got a second question on the French property development sectors. Do you think we are close to the trough of the cycle today in the new residential market in France? And the last question. On toll roads in France, could you maybe tell us whether you have started to request the help of the administrative court in France to try to compensate this new infrastructure tax you started to pay last year? Thank you.

Yes, hello, Eric. So first question, Kenya, yes, that's the end for this project, we confirm. Second point, immobilier, the trough. It's difficult to say. In the current environment, you have some plus and some minus, positives and negatives. But all in, probably, regarding the order intake, regarding the reservation of housing units, I wouldn't say the trough has been reached. In Q1, this housing unit reservation was still down because, what I said, some bulk sales have been postponed to Q2, but all inlets remain a bit cautious. So in terms of revenue for immobilier, I'm not sure neither the trough has been reached last year. Maybe this year revenue will be, will post, let's say, a flattish or slightly negative trend. Regarding the operating earnings, probably yes, the earnings of Pouilly have been, the trough has been reached. Remember in 2024, the EBIT of Vinci Immobilier was negative and it was due to some write-off and due to some restructuring charges, which are now behind us. So we should not have again this impact. So we could be back in the positive territory regarding operating earnings. Maybe lower revenue, but a bit better on the resource front. Second question, no, third question, sorry, regarding the toll road. First, and regarding, let's say, our claim against this new tax on French motorways, which is in place since April 2024. And so currently the case is at the level of the Council of States. There are still a few technicalities to check. And so we should have an answer of Conseil d'Etat, Council of States, in the coming, I don't know, maybe in the coming weeks. And then very probably the litigation will continue through the administrative routes And we'll make a contractual appeal before the Administrative Court of Paris and before the European Court, the European Court of Human Rights. And they will have to rule on the grounds raised against this tax. So we will continue to challenge it. Be sure of that. And so the administrative route should start soon. But just be sure that Vinci's route remains committed to make it so that the state respects its contractual commitment. The procedure could last several years anyway. But however, we are determined to see this dispute through to the end and to win in order to preserve our rights and not to set a precedent for the contractual solidity of Vinci Autoroute concession contracts. It's a matter of the state's compliance with its commitment. And you know, without confidence in the state's compliance with the contractual framework, it's not ideal when we think about all the amounts of private money which will be needed in the coming years and decades, notably to decarbonize transport and to decarbonize the french economy so that's a very important challenge i would say it's not only for motorways it's more than that thank you thank you just on this ppp in in kenya do we know why it has been a concert is there an official reason It's partly due to some... It's not so easy to finance such a project.

Thank you.

Thank you. We will take our next question. Your next question comes from the line of Dario Magloin. Please go ahead, your line is open.

Hi. Thanks for taking my questions. Two quick ones. On construction, can you tell us a bit about the trends I'm just seeing in France as well as outside France? I see the like-for-like growth is negative, but not so negative in France. So, yes, if you can comment a bit more. And also on energies, the Like-for-like growth in Q1 was 1.6%, whereas for 2024, in most quarters, it was more than 3%. So why do you think the growth is slowing down, and is this the new normal? Thanks.

But this trend of like-for-like in Q1 for Vinci Energy is probably a bit early to draw a conclusion. It's true it was plus 1.5% like-for-like outside France. But outside France, please keep in mind that this trend follows a very high false quarter, where the revenue international revenue was up 8%. So Q1 is less good than Q4 24, that's true, but it's a bit too early to try to extrapolate. Let's see in the coming months the situation. And for France, it's quite, I would say, resilient, predictable. It's a life-or-life growth of 1.7%. So all in, the total growth of Vinci Energy is in line with what we announced during the CMD last November, which is that By 2030, the revenue should increase high to meet single digits, like for like an M&A, because keep in mind, Dario, that we consider that M&A, the bolt-on, is quasi-organic growth. So that's bang in line with what we said during the CMD. That's bang in line as well with our full-year 25 guidance, where we say that in 2025, we expect the revenue of Vinci Energy to increase significantly. at the same pace, more or less, than in 2024. So it means an increase of plus 5% over the full year. Point number two, for the construction, the line was very, very bad. Dario, I'm sorry. What was the question on construction exactly?

Yes, so on the revenue side, construction was a bit better than expected. So on a like-for-like, I see a slowdown. Maybe can you comment on this slowdown, like-for-like, both in France as well as internationally? What to expect for the rest of the year?

Thanks. In fact, for Vinci Construction, The revenue we printed in Q1 is exactly in line as well with our full year 25 guidance. For full year 25, we said that we expect revenue of Vinci Construction flat, including the impact of the acquisition of FM Conway in the UK. So it means excluding this impact, we expected a like-for-like slightly negative trend. in Q1, like for like, was minus 1%. It's mainly due to some phasing effects on large projects. You know, on Grand Paris, some large projects on Grand Paris finished or were ramping down, notably the Line 14, the Line 15 in the south of Paris, while other projects large projects related to Grand Paris will ramp up, and notably the Line 15 West. So that's why we see a slight decrease in revenue, but honestly, it was expected and nothing to worry about. The order book remains very solid. especially for construction. That's true in large projects. That's true in flow business. And you know, flow business is very important for us. It's, let's say, our bread and butter contract. So no, let's say, no drama signal. And for international, a bit the same effect. A part of the decrease, like for like, was due to some fading effects. with some large projects being at the end, some projects in Australia, for example, some projects in North America, while other large projects are about to start and are about to produce a lot. And these future large projects are, for example, the Red Line extension in Chicago. are the Ontario Line subway in Toronto. So that's normal. You know, in EPC, in large projects, you can have a bit of volatility, but it's on plan, I would say. Okay.

Thanks, Craig. Thank you. We will take our next question. Your next question comes from the line of Graham Hunt. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Thanks very much. I've just got three quick questions, I think. Firstly, just on Cobra order intake, are we seeing in any sense a reflection of capacity constraints there that will keep order intake at this kind of lower level going forward in the near term because you just don't have the capacity to do more work there? Second question, on the airports, I wondered if you'd carved out, I know you mentioned in your airport release some weakness in the U.S. and Dominican Republic because of a slowdown to the U.S. market, but I just wondered if you'd carved out travel to the U.S. for the whole portfolio and whether you'd seen what the trends were for the broader portfolio and if you've seen any change through April. And then third question, just going back to the I-285 east Was there any reason or what's the thinking behind going alone there as the equity partner? Would you consider bringing in a partner on the equity side for other projects?

Thanks. So from the managed lane, I'm sorry, Graham, we'll not comment more than that. It's not our tradition to comment on the ongoing opportunities. And it's still a bit early. It's still a long-term process. It's only a pre-qualification stage, so a lot of things can happen. And we have a way to monitor cautiously a specific opportunity and the macroeconomic environment around such an opportunity. And so it's a good segue to the U.S. Specifically, have we seen an impact of the U.S. situation in our traffic? No. Even if the current geopolitical uncertainty calls for caution. But at this stage, we have not yet observed a significant slowdown in U.S. airlines at our airports. since the beginning of the year. Something important in mind is that the proportion of US passengers in our total traffic was around 5% in 2024. So let's say it's quite limited. You remember that our portfolio is mostly The portfolio, even if it's very diversified worldwide, but the biggest proportion comes from the European airports. European airports, all European airports, represent more than 70% of the total area of Vinci Airport. And the traffic within this, all European airports, is mostly domestic or European or short-haul traffic. That's true for Gatwick. That's true for Anna. So we are not very exposed to long haul, and we are not very exposed to the US passenger. Dominican Republic, because you mentioned aerodrome, we have to be careful because it's true that it's an airport which is quite exposed to the US passenger. So we have to be cautious, but at this stage, We don't see an impact. You saw a decrease of traffic here today on the Dominican airport, but it's due to the reduction in the number of aircraft by ARAJET. ARAJET is one of the airlines operating in the aerodrome, and they decided to reduce their offer last May 2024. So, in fact, since one year, we face high costs, I would say. But that's not linked to the current U.S., I would say, uncertainty and fog. That's due to the fact that we have an airline running at lower capacity.

And just on Cobra.

And for Cobra, it's true that for Cobra Air, for Vinci Construction, for Vinci Energy, The key is the human resources, is the availability of manpower. But no, for Cobra S, don't say, okay, there was a slowdown because of this theme. No, no, it's not that. Cobra S, the decrease was only due to this exceptional order intake we booked in Q124 for these two HVDC in the North Sea in Germany for TENET. Adjusted from that, the order intake of COBRA-IS are up. And in particular, the flow business order intake for COBRA-IS are up.

Thanks very much.

Thank you. We will take our next question. Your next question comes from the line of José Manuel Arroyaz. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Hello, Gregoire. Thank you for the time. Just one question. I wanted to ask you on the power transmission line contract in Australia that Cobra won together with Acciona. I understand this is an availability concession running for many, many years, but could you tell us how much CAPEX is involved in this project for Vinci and for how many years will this CAPEX need to be deployed? Thank you.

Hello, José. No, in fact, we don't communicate a lot on this detail. That's quite a lot of capex. What has been officially communicated so far is the total capex for this renewable energy zone. But we did not... I think we have some confidentiality agreements with the clients not to communicate exactly on the amount of... of CAPEX. It's quite a lot, and we'll do the CAPEX cobrials with ACCIONA. But we can't say more than that. What is good is that, I'm sorry, it's only a qualitative answer. You will be frustrated. But it's good because it's a very positive signal for the development of this kind of a mega deal, jumbo deal, linked to T&D transmission lines. through PPP, what we think is that it's only the beginning. You know, Brazil used this kind of scheme since 20 years. They do their transport of electricity with the private sector. And so Coba IS has been very, very active since 20 years in Brazil. And now there is this new market. Australia, and probably the need to deploy thousands of kilometers of TND lines will be huge in Australia. And so there will be many opportunities for the private sector. And one day, it will not be only Australia, but we think there will be these kind of opportunities even in France, for example, So that's the message, that it's a very promising market, and thanks to Cobra IS, we have an expertise, and we are a first mover in a market with a bright outlook. But more figures, sorry, I cannot give you. Thank you, Edouard.

No problem. Thank you. We will take our next question. And your next question comes from the line of Amy Geller. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Thank you. Just two questions for me. The first one was in the M&A pipeline. Given the sort of global market uncertainty that we sit with, has there been any shift in sentiment of the sellers in the market? Do you see any change in how they think about the potential value for their businesses? And the second one was in the order book levels that you sit with. you know, if we still sit with a wider economic uncertainty over the next year, you know, are there any risks of delays to the order book that we've already taken in terms of the execution profile?

I mean, if I understood correctly, your second question is that, is there a risk of cancellation of contract in the order book? Yes.

Cancellation of delays, potentially.

Yes, but cancellation of delays... Yes, you can always have this risk, but you know, we went through many crises like that. It's not the first one. And even, for example, during the COVID in 2020, there were very, very limited amounts of cancellation in the order book. It's not significant. So today, we are not stressed. First, we are not stressed, generally speaking. And secondly, we are not stressed by cancellation or delays of contracts. And keep something very important in mind. A lot of this order book has been seeded by Vinci Energy, Kobayashi, and Vinci Construction as well, by the megatrend of energy transition, of digital transformation, of defense. and sovereignty challenges. So these kind of trends, in our view, will not be put into question. Second thing is that, in our order book, the project, when it's contractually located, a part is already prepaid. The client has a financing letter. So let's say it's not easy to cancel a project. And again, fundamentally, we think this project, there is no reason, let's say, to cancel or postpone this project. And on top of that, we have what we call a pre-backlog. So we don't communicate on the pre-order book. But it's not zero. We are cautious people. So we have other projects, other contracts, which have not been yet included in the order book for different reasons. But we have a pre-backlog. So don't worry about that. For the M&A pipeline, We consistently analyze some opportunities, like Luis and Graham asked about this opportunity of managed lanes in the US. So we have other opportunities in airports, in highways, outside France. Energy, it's daily, many, many opportunities, et cetera. So we don't change. And the sellers don't change their mind. sometimes quite a long-term process. So when there is an opportunity up for sale, you know, the seller is not going to withdraw suddenly because there are some uncertainties coming from the US. Of course, that's something which has to be taken into account. But let's say we have to remain, sometimes we have to keep calm and carry on. you know, let's see the things, and we are long-term people. So it doesn't change dramatically the M&A market. There are opportunities, but for opportunities, of course, we will analyze even more carefully regarding the evolution of this tariff situation and of this trade war, which changes every day. you know better than us, every day there is an erratic decision, I would say, a different news. So we are not going, a seller is not going to say, okay, no, I don't sell. And the day after, okay, now finally I'm ready again to sell, et cetera. So that's why we have to keep calm and to stick to our long-term minded philosophies.

Thank you. We will take our next question. Your next question comes from the line of Harry Shankar Ramamurthy. Please go ahead. Your line is open.

Hi, everyone. It's Harry from Deutsche Bank. Thanks for taking my question, Greg. Just one for me. On the Energy's division, order intake, you've been maintaining that this growth in this segment should not be coupled to GDP growth and should benefit from structural tailwinds. Now, I do get that you could see fluctuations in execution or in revenues, but are you concerned about the slowdown in the rate of growth in order intake? So maybe put differently, would you expect inflows to come through much stronger for the rest of the year? Thanks.

it's a slowdown, year-to-date slowdown, yes, if you want, its order intake are up 2% at Vinci Energy. So it's, let's say, in addition to this order intake, we will do some Bolton acquisition. So all in, we are confident to print a high to meet single-digit growth on average per year by 2030. And, you know, we said during the CMD that the top of the range, the upper range, will not be probably for 2024 and 2025. So I circled back with the full year guidance 2025, which is VINCH Energy to be up, More or less, like in 2024. So it means around plus 5%. Sure. Again, there is... To give you an example, Larry. In Germany, you know, since two years, Germany is, let's say, in recession. Vinci Energy in Germany posted... a double-digit growth year on year in 2024. And in Q1 2025, still a double-digit growth, despite the country is in recession. So in fact, quarter after quarter, or even year after year, you can try to, let's say, to fine-tune to see if there is a positive inflection, negative inflection. Okay, that's fair. But, fundamentally speaking, we think Vinci Energy is not cyclical, is not volatile, and Vinci Energy is a unique company in the world. The diversification, geographical diversification is unique. Diversification of expertise is unique. So, of course, you have some markets which will decrease, which will be under pressure, but it will be compensated by other markets. So I would say that Vinci Energy, if we are right in the guidance, if revenue is up 5% in 2025, in a situation where Europe, European economy will be up maybe plus 1 or plus 1.5%, U.S. economy, maybe in 2025, will be up plus 2%, etc., but we'll do better than that.

Understood, Greg. So thanks for this.

Thank you. We will take our next question.

Just a follow-up for Henri. Last year, we won in Q1 2024. several large projects. Okay? Large projects for Vinci Energy, it's a project above 5 million euros. But still, they won several large projects, and notably in substations in the UK, in the Netherlands, and other projects like that. So in Q1 2024, you had, let's say, a big impact, a big boost for the intake of Vinci Energy, of... of large projects, which is not the case in Q125. And that's why we wrote in the press release that in Q125, the order intake is only made up of small and medium-sized contracts. So if we adjust from this large project impact for Vinci Energy, order intake is up by more than this 2%.

got it got it so hopefully uh we should see uh better growth rates uh for the rest of the year thanks for thanks for this click hopefully stay with us and you will see absolutely thank you we will take our next question your next question comes from the line of Marcin Vojta please go ahead your line is open

Yes, good evening. Thank you for taking my questions. I've got two. Firstly, on airports, could you remind us what is the level of tariff increases that you are implementing for 2025 for London Gatwick and also for your airports in Portugal? And my second question, just coming back to the German infrastructure stimulus, which appears to be quite substantial, but How much visibility have you got on the timing and do you expect any incremental benefit to the business perhaps towards the end of this year or in 2026? Thank you.

Hello Martin, that's a good question. For Germany, so clearly you understood we are a winner. thanks to full exposure to this country, with such announcements and such massive investments in roads, bridges, and rail, and electrical walls, etc. But that said, at this stage, I don't have a concrete vision of how this plan will be implemented. And the ramp-up of this plan could take a bit of time. Even if the money is here, you know, the... There is a bit of organization in Germany to put in place between the various levels of clients, of public clients. You know, which clients will launch which projects, etc. So that's why I lack a bit of visibility today to answer you exactly, okay, will we see a big impact in 2026 or 2027? Probably not. But again, we are long-term people on this announcement of Germany for infrastructure, for defense, are very positive for the European economy and for, let's say, European domestic stocks like Vinci. And probably, you know, these kind of projects of Jumbo stimulus plans are probably not the last one in Europe. And in particular, in defense, some other countries could decide to open a bit the wallet. So we'll benefit from that. But to give you an exact timing with when will there be an impact in our figures, unfortunately, I can't. But it will not be in the short or very near term. For airport, the aeronautical fees, for now, the aeronautical fees were put in place since March 2025. In general, it's at the beginning of the year, but this year there were a bit of a complex technicality. So the application of aeronautical fees took place in March 2025. And so for Lisbon, the passenger charge for the Lisbon group, so Lisbon and Madeira, Azores, etc., will increase by 1%. It means, in fact, CPI minus 2%, with the reference CPI, with the European CPI at 3%. So Lisbon, the impact will be plus 1%. And Porto and Faro, the ironical fees will increase in line with the European CPI, so it will be plus 3%. For Gatwick, you know, it's the contract and commitment framework, so in average, the increase from April 2025 will be CPI minus 1%. Don't forget, since Many years, it was RPI, the Retail Price Index. Since April 2025, within, let's say, the extended CNC framework, it's now CPI minus 1% for this year and the year after. And the next two years, it will be CPI. That's for our main assets. After for Aerodome, it will increase again next November. It will be US CPI plus 3%. After already a big increase in 2024, you remember. In Belgrade, it will be European CPI. So I covered, I think, already a big part. We'll give you more granularity in the famous toolbox airport

Thank you very much.

There seems to be no further questions. I would like to hand back for closing remarks.

No, thanks, everybody. Good luck with this publication and upcoming publications. And, of course, the investor relations team remain at your entire disposal to follow up whenever you want.

so have a nice evening bye-bye this concludes today's conference call thank you for participating you may now disconnect