Hexatronic Group AB (publ)

Welcome to this presentation of our Q1 2024 report. You will be listening to Pernilla Lindén, our CFO, and also Martin Auerberg, our Deputy CEO, and myself, Henrik Larsson-Lyon, that is the CEO of the group. So, the agenda. We will first look at Hexatronic at a glance. We will look at some Q1 highlights, a financial overview, business overview and then in the end the summary and market outlook followed by a q a so at the glance so when we look at the markets we are operating in it's it's a strong need for fiber optic networks we see that a low number of homes are connected with fiber optic networks and that's across all the strategic growth markets we operate in We see also that 5G deployment drives the need for fiber optic networks, like the backbone, but also connecting small cells. We see that the increasing use of data-intensive technologies creates a growing need for fiber connectivity for enterprises and data centers, and that's a strong driver. Now we will come back on that. We also see a shift from copper to fiber in harsh environments, such as oil and gas, sensing, defense, oceanographic and subsea applications. And on top of this, there are quite some significant government initiatives to support fiber deployment in especially rural areas and especially in the US, UK and Germany, but most countries have this. This picture shows the fiber penetration in a number of markets and we have highlighted the strategic growth markets we have. These figures are updated. We got new figures in March and for Europe it's figures that are from the study performed in September last year and for the US study that was made in the end of 2023. And we see some movements. So for instance, Germany has moved up to 10%. I believe it was around 7% a year ago. UK has increased to 17%. US, 24%. But as you can see and compare to, for instance, a very mature market like the Swedish market when it comes to fiber to them, which is around 70% penetration, there is a long way to go in many markets. And as I mentioned on the first slide, there are some big government initiatives in order to provide fiber to rural areas. And the biggest ones here are in the US, where we have the BEAD program. And there are actually several other programs that also support fiber rollout. But the BEAD program is around 42 billion US dollars. We can say that we haven't had a lot of movement of that lately. When we reported in Q4, we had Louisiana that was fully approved and had got their funding. As of yesterday, there are three more states that have got the full approval and their funding to start to put out areas for bid. But we see a slight delay in these projects. In the UK, Project Gigabit, that's ongoing and constantly new areas that are put out for bid. And we also see that in Germany in their gigabit strategy that they have started to come out for bid in the market. So these government initiatives are on the move. If we then look at Hexatronic as a total, a summary. We have revenues of 7.8 billion SEK and that's a rolling 12 basis. We have an EBITDA also on rolling 12 month basis of 1 billion SEK. If we look at the average growth over the last five years, it's 36% per year when it comes to the revenues and 55% when it comes to EBITDA. On rolling 12 months, we have an EBITDA margin of 13.3% and we are roughly 2000 employees. This starts to be more important when we look at our business. We have three focus areas. So the biggest one is fiber solutions, and that's where it all started for us. In the quarter, it represented 71% of our total revenue. And that's where you have fiber to the home, transport networks, submarine cables and so on. So it's quite a wide area and representing 71% of our revenues. Growing in terms of importance is harsh environment and data center. So if I start with harsh environment, it represented 15% in the last quarter, our total revenues and data centers, 14% of our total revenue. And I will come back with some more information about that later in the presentation. If we then move into Q1 highlights, So we continue to see a strong operating cash flow and also a good contribution from the new focus areas, data center and harsh environment. Net sales decreased 16% year on year and quarter over quarter 4%. We had a negative organic growth of 27%, and you might remember that in Q4, we had 23% negative organic growth, so roughly the same level. And this is due to the softer market conditions we see in fiber solutions. We should also say that Q1, but also Q2 last year, they were two record quarters for us. And in Q1 last year, we grew 52%, so really strong quarters that we provides a tough comparison. When we look at harsh environment and data center, they grew by 397% and 40%. And we can say in harsh environment, it's mainly by acquisition. And in data center, it's mainly organic growth, so strong growth there. EBITDA amounted to 168 million SEK, and that corresponds to a margin of 9.4%, which is pretty much in line with last quarter. We had an earnings per share of 0.31 SEC compared to 1.09 in the corresponding quarter last year. Cash flow from operating activities was 270 million SEC compared to 28 in the last corresponding quarter. And we had a cash conversion of 234%, so really strong. And it was primarily driven by continued optimization of our inventory levels. The interest bearing net debt excluding IFRS 16 is in line with the previous quarter and it amounted to 2.1 billion SEK. And we have a leverage ratio that increased from 1.4 to 1.7 this quarter compared to year end. And that was primarily due to lower profitability in Q1 this year compared to Q1 last year. If we look at the leverage, including IFRS 16, it increased from 1.7 to 2. And our order book corresponds to a little bit more than two months. It's unchanged more or less since year end. And I would say we are back to the levels that we have been talking about that we had before the pandemic, the war in Ukraine. Significant events then. So what we have announced is that we merge two of our Swedish subsidiaries. So it's Hexatronic Cable and Interconnect Systems and Hexatronic Fiber Optic. So that will be Hexatronic Sweden. And that's for more efficiency. The nomination committee have proposed Magnus Nikola as an election for chairman of the board. And that will be at the AGM 7th of May in Gothenburg. And you're all very welcome. The board of directors proposed to the AGM that no payment of dividend will be made for the financial year 2023. And we also announced yesterday that we will extend the executive management. So Jakob Skog, who is head of our focus area, Harsh Environment, will join the executive management as of April this year. And in June, we will welcome Pernilla Grenfell as head of investor relations, and she will also join the executive management team. Looking at the last five years, and I mentioned this in the beginning, we have had a strong growth of revenues, 36% in average per year. And we have had a strong EBITDA development in the average 55% over the last three years. And earnings per share even stronger with 64% on average. And just to remind, we have two financial targets that we communicate. One is we want to have a total growth of revenue of at least 20% per year, and an EBITDA margin between 15% to 17%. And both these targets, we say, are over a business cycle. And I would say currently, we are for fiber solutions down in the business cycle. Moving into financial highlights, I will hand over to our CFO, Pernilla Lindén.

Thank you, Henrik. So, we had a total net sales of close to 1.8 billion SEK in Q1, with an overall decline of 16% or a decline of 333 million SEK, compared to a very strong first quarter last year. Quarter over quarter, we had a decline of 4%. We had an organic decline of 27%, primarily attributed to fiber solutions in Germany, US and UK. Markets that are mainly negatively affected by higher financing cost and higher cost of inflation. The organic decline was partly offset by acquisition driven growth of 11% from Rochester Cable and Fibron Cable in the harsh environment area. us net in the data center area and atg that was acquired in 2023 and as as hendrik said our focus area harsh environment grew with 397 percent and data center with 40 percent overall we had a very limited exchange rate effect in the quarter Looking at a gross margin, we had a gross margin of 40.5%, which is in line with Q4 gross margin, but 4.2 percentage points lower than a record high quarter last year. That is mainly due to lower manufacturing utilization, some price pressure in some markets and mix effect. And the mix effect is related to Fibon cable and Rochester cable within harsh environment with lower than group gross margin, but with an EBITDA that contributes positively to a group margin. If we're looking at our operating expenses, we are in line with last quarter and 56 million SEK lower than last year, even if we have invested in new acquisitions during 2023. For Q1 2024, we had an operating expense of 27.5% of sales compared to 27.6% in previous quarter. We have previously communicated that we have initiated a cost saving program. And that program is mainly related to a reduction of production staff, but also white collar workers in fiber solutions in several of our geographical markets. The program generates an annual cost saving of approximately 90 million. The program has been gradually implemented and finalized by the end of 2024. Overall, we had an EBITDA of 168 million or 9.4%. A 54% decline compared to last year, but in line with Q4 EBITDA margin. We had a strong operating cash flow in the quarter. Cash flow from operating activities before changes of working capital of 160 million SEK. A positive effect of working capital of 155 million SEK. During the quarter, we have continued to work on optimizing our inventory, which resulted in a reduction of 88 million SEK. Due to holidays in connection with the quarter closing, accounts receivable and accounts payable have been slightly affected by deferred payments, which has been carried out the first week of April. But overall, a positive effect of 67 million in the quarter. Total cash flow from operating activities amounted to 270 million SEK corresponding to a cash conversion of 234% in the quarter compared to 8% cash conversion last year. CAPEX investment in the quarter of 68 million SEK or 3.8% of sales and 460 million SEK rolling 12 which corresponds to 5.9% of sales. The investments in the quarter is mainly driven by capacity investment in the US. After two investment heavy years in 2022 and 2023, and after completing the investment program in the duct factory in Ogden, Utah, that will be finalized in the third quarter in 2024, We believe that we will be able to grow for several years without extensive investments in the fiber solutions area. As communicated last quarter, our estimate is that investments in 2024 and onwards will amount to approximately 3 to 4% of sales, of which approximately 1 to 2% are expected to be maintenance investments. 92 million is related to acquisitions, 80 million payment of additional purchase price related to the acquisition of Fibon Cable and USNet. In addition, a minor add-on acquisition that was made during the quarter in form of M-Connect and also minor investment in a joint venture company. And during the quarter, we have amortized our RCF of an amount of 124 million SEK and amortized our lease liability of 31 million SEK. Interest bearing net debt, which corresponds to net debt excluding lease liabilities, amounted to 2.1 billion SEK at the end of the quarter, which is more or less in line with last quarter. Interest bearing net debt in relation to pro forma EBITDA on a rolling 12-month basis, a key ratio that reflects our existing bank covenant, has increased from 1.4 to 1.7 during the quarter. And the increase is mainly due to lower profitability in the first quarter compared to Q1 in 2023. Including IFRS 16, it corresponds to an increase from 1.7 to 2 in the quarter. At the end of Q4, we had 795 million of cash and an unutilized backup facility of 998 million SEK, which gives a liquidity of approximately 1.8.

Thank you, Pernilla. So we continue with the business overview and we start by looking at the performance in each focus area we have. And that's fiber solutions, harsh environment and data center. And just to say our ambition is to over the year provide more information, especially around harsh environment and data center. So if we start by fiber solutions and we put the head and continue to navigate through a softer market, you see that revenues went down from roughly 1.9 billion to 1.3 roughly versus last year. And when we look at the business development there, the decrease in sales, it's primarily driven by higher financing costs for our customers. cost inflation, and also to some extent, high inventory levels in some geographical markets. I've mentioned that before, that for us, we have seen that to a lesser extent, but several of our larger competitors have had a big effect of this. And I can say, we see that these inventory levels out in the market, they start to normalize, I would say. And also, as I mentioned initially, the comparison versus Q1 last year is a tough one because it was a record quarter for us. When we look at the market development, and it's very much due, in our opinion, due to higher cost of capital, inflation and high inventory levels, that has led to a softer market for fiber solution across most of the geographies we are operating in. We see that these governmental subsidies that I talked about, but it's not only those three markets, it's in most markets we operate, they will have an increased impact on the market going forward. And in combination with the normalized inventory level, we expect to see a gradual recovery of the market in the later part of 2024. I should mention also that If you look at these different markets, the governmental subsidies are good because it focuses on areas that most probably wouldn't have been built because the business case is not possible to get together for an operator. But it's still the small part. The biggest investment in fiber solutions is by the existing operators in the different markets. And I would say private equity financing, a lot of new entrants to the fiber network markets. If we look at harsh environments, we are capitalizing on trends within defense and energy. And you see the growth that we have been seeing a couple of times from 52 million in Q1 last year up to 259 million in Q1 this year. And it is driven primarily by the acquisition of Rochester Cable and Fibron Cable. And they are both active in dynamic subsea hybrid cables. And it's primarily applications in energy and defense. When we look at the markets and forward, there is a strong demand, both in defense and energy markets. And we expect that trend to continue over several years going forward. We see also an expansion of existing sea-based infrastructure, and it's a great interest in renewable offshore energy production. So that's good for our business in harsh environment. When we look at data center, it's an organic growth, primarily driven by hyperscale build out. And you see that revenues increased from 182 million to 256. And it's primarily an organic growth. A part of it is due to the acquisition of the US net in the US. We see a strong growth in the product and service business in both our main geographies, which are the US and Europe. The main market driver here I would say is the acceleration of the implementation of AI and that requires significant data center capacity and I would say it's a shortage today and we expect this also to remain over several years going forward. If we then move into geographies and here I comment on our total business in each geography and we start by Europe excluding Sweden where we saw a sales decline, but partly mitigated by the growth of harsh environment and data center. So it represents 46% of our total business. We saw the sales decline compared to last year, previous quarter last year, primarily due to software development within fiber solution. And the decline is primarily due to Germany and UK. And we had, as I said before, a very strong Q1 last year. We see a softer market in all markets, but as Germany and UK is the largest market for us, that's where it affects us the most. We continue to see a solid performance within harsh environment, and that's primarily then fiber on cable. When we look at the markets, we see that the higher cost of capital and inflation high inventory levels that has led to continued soft markets for fiber solution in germany and uk but i also mentioned in most markets and you will see this explanation for all geographical areas and both for harsh environment and data center the the market continues to show strong demand And as I mentioned before, it's primarily due to defense and energy market, but also AI development. If we then move to North America, we continue to position the company for long-term growth. North America represents 37% of our total revenue. And when we look at the business, we had a decline of 8%. And that's mainly due to decreased sales of ducts, and that's for blue diamond industries. And then we partly mitigated that by the acquisition growth of harsh environment and also US net, as I mentioned before. Our FTTH system sales in the US and Canada were slightly behind Q1 last year, and that was primarily due to some delays in a couple of projects. We continue the investment in the new factory for Blue Diamond Industries in Ogden, Utah. And that will expand addressable markets for ducts to include Western US, which we have not been able to deliver to before. And it's a big market. And as we have said before, we expect that market to be ready for production in Q3 this year. Market development. same as i talked about in europe the higher cost of capital inflation and high inventory levels that has led also to a softer u.s market primarily within duck but also fiber to the home we expect to see small effects of the bead program in the later part of the year only louisiana fully approved i mentioned earlier that we yesterday three more states have been approved fully approved and that means they get their funding and can put projects out to bid and we see that the rest of the states in the us they have lined up and are waiting for the final approval so we expect to see more states coming online here later If we move then to Sweden that's nine percent of our total revenue and there we had a sales decrease by eight percent and that's primarily driven by softer fiber to the home market and for the market development it's the same explanation as I said before with the cost of capital inflation that has led to a softer market. And the last geographical area is APEC, so Asia Pacific, and there we saw a decline of revenues of 25%, but it's primarily explained by a delivery of the submarine cable that we had in Q1 last year to South Korea, and to a lesser effect, a slower FTTH market in Australia and New Zealand. And I will repeat myself, but on the market development for the fiber to the home market, it's the same explanation with the higher cost of capital and inflation. Then if we move to the final part of the presentation, we have a summary and market outlook. So as a summary, we had a strong cash flow. primarily driven by a reduced working capital. We continued our diversification through harsh environment and data center, and that to some extent mitigated the current conditions in the fiber solutions area. And net sales primarily impacted by continued challenging conditions within fiber solutions, and also the comparison to a very strong Q1 last year. Profitability was in line with previous quarter with an EBITDA margin of 9.4%, 9.1% in last quarter. And we continue to maintain a strong financial position with a leverage ratio of 1.7. Then market outlook. We expect a strong market within harsh environment and data center for 2024 and for several years. And that's fueled by investments in defense, energy and AI primarily. And in fiber solutions, we expect the market to remain weak in the coming quarters and then a gradual increase in the demand in the later part of this year. And the main reasons why we see this is normalizing of inventory levels. We see the BEAD program to have some effect this year. And that's the main reasons why we see gradual recovery of the market. I can say there is still so much to do in the fiber to the home space in many markets. Good. Then we move into Q&A. We have a number of people who have already listed for questions. We would like that each person raising questions try to limit themselves to around three questions so we have time to go through the list. So I leave over to the Q&A session.

If you wish to ask a question, please dial pound key five on your telephone keypad. To enter the queue, if you wish to withdraw your question, please dial £6 on your telephone keypad. If you are listening to this presentation through the webcast, you can ask written questions using the form on the webcast page. The next question comes from Jacob Edler from Danske Bank. Please go ahead.

Hi Henrik, Pernille and Martin, and thanks for taking my questions. My first question is on your outlook commentary. It seems that you are tuning down your Q3 a bit relative to what you stated in the Q4 report. If you were to rank, what weighs the most in the commentary change? Is it interest rate expectations in the US and other markets holding back customer demand, BID program, state approval delays, or Also some flavor on how inventory corrections among customers are developing. That's my first question. Thank you.

So it's Henrik here. I would say probably interest rates levels. When we presented our Q4 report, If I take the US as an example, at that time, three months ago, it was more a discussion and debate how many times the Fed would manage to decrease inventories in interest rates in the US. If you look at the current climate, it's more discussion, will there be an interest rate reduction this year from the Fed? So I think interest rates because it affects more or less all markets. So it's a good sign if they go down, the risk appetite comes back. Then I would say also that even if we are not that much affected as I would say we see our competitors communicate, the inventory reduction is important because when there have been a lot of inventory out in the market, They continue to build the operators, but our competitors have less to do. And that leads to a tougher competition in the market for existing volumes. So that's also important. And then I would say, if you look at the BEAD program, I mean, it's so big and for the US and US is our largest market. So there you also have a bit of an effect.

Okay, perfect. And then my second question out of three. It's related to the cost-saving program. It was implemented at the end of last year, but hits full effect at the end of Q1, so into Q2, but you've seen a gradual effect during Q1 as well. Would it be feasible to assume that this coupled with seasonality, which typically is supportive of Q2, could support a bit higher margins already in Q2? I realize that the market is tough, But just some flavor there. And also, did you see any negative impact from the earlier Easter? Yeah, thank you.

I would start by saying that the cost reduction program we had, as you say, will see the full effect from Q2. So it has been gradually implemented. I would say on your topic around seasonality, For the last three years in a strong market, we haven't seen a lot of seasonality effects that we saw, I would say, in previous years. There might be a slight effect here of seasonality, but I wouldn't guess that it's too big. And the market continues for fiber solutions to be soft. We expect to have a market which is roughly in line with what we had in Q1. So that's the way I would like to answer the question.

Okay, perfect. Just last question then. On the Ogden plant in Utah, are you able to add some flavor how the project customer pipeline is looking for that plant and also some flavor on how you are ramping up fixed costs related to that plant? Thank you.

First, I would say we maintain that it will be ready for production in Q3 this year. Under these softer market conditions, we will be very careful in taking up too much cost. And I would say it depends very much on how the market is in Q3, Q4, how we ramp that plant up. And on the last part, I would say we see more and more interest from our existing customers in the US for the plant in Western US.

Okay, perfect. Thank you so much. Those were my three questions. I'll open to the line. Thank you.

Thank you.

The next question comes from Max Baco from SEB. Please go ahead.

Thank you. Good morning. Three questions from me as well. Starting with on the topic of the cost saving program, I noted here in the quarter that the number of FDs was actually up by 30 since the end of last year, which is in contrast to what was communicated in the cost saving program. So perhaps if you have any comments on that, starting with that question.

So overall, you know, we have implemented the cost saving program overall with 160, but also it's about that we constantly are looking at the capacity of what we have. So you also have that effect in the end of Q4 where you don't have so much production in the end. And of course, you have more in March. We have also invested in our new focus areas with more headcount. That's the reason. But the cost saving program is implemented.

Okay, perfect. And the next one on the cash flow, which was really strong here in the quarter, you mentioned in the report that the Easter and the timing of the Easter had an impact on the cash flow with the timing. Would you say that it was a net positive or net negative effect, the timing of the Easter?

I actually would say there will be a wash between the accounts receivable and accounts payable.

Okay, so net neutral.

So net neutral of the delay, so the positive 67 is there overall.

And finally, the last question, I mean, of course, the BID program a bit delayed now, but have you made any progress on local production of fiber optic cables in the US? Do you have anything to add there?

It's still an ongoing project that we are evaluating different options, how to do it.

OK, but if it's still going to be in place,

during this year ahead of the the bead program taking effect would you say you know depending on which alternative we do it will be a different timeline but if i say like this when we talk about our fiber fiber to the home business the system says in the us The big, big majority of our customers, they will not go off the BEAD programs, of the BEAD funded programs. They are primarily building in more densely populated areas. So the big effect for us when it comes to BEAD, that will be for Blue Diamond Industries. Then what we have said before is that, of course, we would like to be able to participate in BEAD funded projects also on the FTTH side. And that's why we are evaluating these things.

Okay, perfect.

Thank you.

I'll get back in the line.

The next question comes from Adrian Jelani from ABG Sundal Collier. Please go ahead.

Yes, hello. I'd like to start off with a question regarding the subsidy package for fiber in Germany. I recall last quarter there were some bureaucratic issues with the money actually reaching the market. Can you just give us an update on what the status is on that at the moment and how big of an effect that is for you in Germany?

We see that those projects have started to come out, so it will have a gradual increased effect on the market. which is good. Then, as I said before, the majority of the investments in the German market and all markets will be from the existing operators and these new entrants, often private equity backed. So I think the more important effect is that they start to invest more.

Okay. And then for my second one, on the different focus areas, First of all, I appreciate the added nuance for each area. But can you also, I guess, talk a bit about how the margins differ between fiber, harsh environments and data centers in a more normalized market environment, not perhaps at the moment?

I would say we don't disclose that, but I think we have mentioned before when we did the acquisitions, because it has been an acquisition driven growth to a large extent, that the profitability of those companies have been in the range of our financial targets.

Okay and just to be clear not at risk of using my third question on a follow-up not your financial targets at the time but your current one of 15 to 17 percent.

Exactly.

Okay perfect and if I can get away with the third one then. Has there been some accelerating price pressure in Q1 and what is your outlook on prices during the year if the market does remain weak?

No, I think we have seen, as we wrote, an increased price pressure in most markets and we expect in the softer market that the price pressure will remain.

Okay, perfect. In that case, thank you and thanks for allowing me to ask three and a half questions.

The next question comes from Fredrik Nilsson from Redeye. Please go ahead.

Hi, thank you. Most of my questions have been answered, so I will stick to one actually. I mean, could you elaborate a bit on the development in your FFTH within North America? It seems like you do almost in line with the strong quarter last year. Could you tell us a bit about the market share and your presence in the market? Are you seeing that interest for your solution is growing even in those tougher times?

Yes, I would say from a market share perspective, I think I've said this before, that we have a very small market share. But I think we are growing from small figures. I would say we see more and more interest. from our solution so that's a good sign and we expect to have a continued good development of the fiber to down business in the US going forward okay that's that's all for me thank you very much thank you

The next question comes from Stefan Ward from Pareto Securities. Please go ahead.

Hello. I'd like to ask some questions about the sales development in Europe and in North America. It's a tiny sequential decline, but if we start with Europe, it looks like it's around 800 million, which also could be argued to have been close to the run rate in most of the quarters in 2022. The guidance that you are giving now with the potential recovery late in the quarter, is this a good level to assume for the quarters going forward, that it will be around 800 million, or do you see potential for an increase there?

You know, we don't provide guidance on that. I just want to refer that, you know,

the softness in the market we saw in q4 and we saw in q1 we expect that kind of soft market to remain in the coming quarters and then you have to draw your own conclusions from that yeah but there's a difference between softness and decline or deterioration and what i'm after here is some color on if if the market is deteriorating if you see that it is falling or if it is stable, I would hope to get some clarity on that because it would be helpful for investors, I believe.

I would say what we saw in Q1 in terms of market, we expect to see that same of market level demand in the coming quarters. Then I think what you saw, if you read the Q4 report versus the Q1 report now, We talked quite a lot about the German market in Q4. And here we also added the UK market that we saw was softer.

That's true. And I tried to involve the US in this question as well. I mean, there's a tiny sequential decline. It's on par basically with the Q3. uh revenue level that is in there when i look at sort of industry metrics it looks like which which actually correlated or followed the the the overall market decline very well last year they indicate that we saw sort of a recovery on a month by month basis in the first quarter there's nothing you can comment on if markets have i mean they're soft but Is it downwards or slightly upwards? Is there any change or can you say that or anything on the inventory correction? My perception would be that it looks like the inventory correction is mostly over in the U.S. Could you give some color on any of that, please?

The same there. Our view on the U.S. market is that it will be on... the same kind of demand level as we saw in Q1. I think I mentioned the inventory correction that primarily affects our competitors that are much bigger also. I think we start to hear that it's starting to normalize. I mean, a lot of the information we get, we also get from our competitors quarterly reports. We have not seen any of them yet. So they are following in next week. So it will be interesting to see what they say about the inventory correction. But I would say the market continued to be soft coming quarters. That's our expectation. But if you look at it last year, when competitors declined their revenues in fiber solutions quite a lot, we kept quite stable or even grew a bit last year. And this is due to more and more interest in our solution, which is very flexible and cost efficient. So that work will continue.

Okay, thanks. Then I'd like to, given this outlook, do you have any, what can we expect in terms of mix a couple of years from now? uh if it comes to to you have this 70 30 or 70 15 15 percent mix between the fiber harsh and data could you could what do you see a couple two to three years ahead how will this mix evolve would you say and i commented on that previously that you know our ambition is that harsh environment and data center

should represent a clearly bigger percentage of our total business. So that's what we are working for. This time we didn't talk about M&A because there was not much to talk about, but we feel that we have done the strategic acquisitions in fiber solutions that we wanted to do. So the focus now and has been for some time is to do M&A activities within data centers and harsh environments to grow that percentage of our total business.

Okay, thank you. The final question is on the potential for additional working capital relief. Given that you're not expected to grow anything this year, do you think that you can trim the balance sheet further, or is that work mostly done?

We are continuing to work on our inventory overall. So that will not stop that work overall.

There are no more questions at this time so I hand the conference back to the speakers for any written questions and closing comments.

I think we had a couple of written questions but they have been answered in our opinion in the oral questions we had so I would like to thank you for your interest listening in and hope to hear you or you hear us in q2 and that's the 16th of july thank you very much