Norion Bank AB

Welcome to Norden Bank's Q1-Rapport 2025. My name is Martin Åsman, I'm the CEO and I'm here with Peter Olsson. Before we start here on page 2 and sum up the quarter, we sent out on April 10th that we have had some customers who have paid back their rents, a number of private customers. We have From Q2 last year, we have had customers who are in need of their rent payments. We have had approximately 100 million per quarter from Q2. Therefore, it is very happy that we were able to communicate that we have received 140 million in rent from FACETs. So it's very cool that the customers are coming up. It's good and very exciting. Regarding numbers, we can also talk about what we can call a media rush. It has been established that we have a number of consultants in our Plastic Cement. And it's true, it's not a secret. It was already communicated by Banken Börsnotans 2015 as part of the official outsourcing. Unlike Storbank, we don't have an office network. We have to see new businesses all the time. We work with different consulting applications. It's our way to get new businesses in. We have a relatively short running time for our businesses, 18-24 months, so for us it's all about getting as much flow as possible and seeing as many potential loans as possible, and therefore working in different ways, both with some consultants and with our own employees. Of course, this is part of an origination. When we do a business, it is the bank's employees and of course the credit committee that makes all the decisions on which business we do and don't do. This is a pure way of saying business, potential business, an origination part. We also have news under the number that is not just in numbers, but then Baldor has then made a principle decision to share Norium Bank's shares with their shareholders. We don't know when in time, but we think it's a very good way for us to increase the fleet. I think it's good for Norium Bank and their shareholders. And as I said, we don't know when in time, but we think this is very, very positive. If we then jump into some figures and start to look at the top left on page 2, there you see that our loan amount now goes up to 47.5 billion. This is an increase of 5%, but a decrease of 2.8 billion compared to Q4. There is some explanation for that, Peter will come in on more detail, but I'll just start by explaining a little about the decrease of 2.8 billion. FX, about 1 billion. Then we have a number of return on investment effects that go up to 500 million. So the decrease is not so bloody, but there are some explanations about it. But as I said, we will talk about it a little further in the presentation. The revenues for this quarter go up to 1.22 billion. The KJV is at a good level of 27.5, even without a clean-up. Under these 40 million, we have increased by 30, still at a decent level. The GDP is at 525 million and the casting paid capital is 17.8. The capital reduction continues to be strengthened and improved. We have a very good level. Both the core primary and total capital reduction increases by 30 points. We go in and look a little at page 3, which is the corporate segment, and it is corporate credit and factoring in the north. We also see here a decrease with 350 million, also here the currency affects with 330, so it is a fairly unchanged development on the corporate stock. Then we should not forget that factoring is almost always weak during the first quarter and factoring decreases With about 500 million. So if we exclude that, we make a very good quarter on the business part. We increase the stock by one year with almost 30%. This is a segment that we have been talking about for a long time. We have found a very good position to deliver financial solutions to medium-sized companies in the north. There is a lot of potential and I think we will establish that position also this quarter and continue to be a profitable business. So here we see a good growth. We have analyzed our stock here within the company and have seen if there are any effects on these loans that are affected by the so-called trunk-tooling. Very few customers are affected by this outcome that is here today. There is a lot of Kundialog och stor aktivitet. Vi har inte sett egentligen någon påverkade alls av den här makroekonominnen. Framförallt USA-presidenten med tonlar och så vidare. Ingen effekt alls än så länge. Verket på företagarna fastigheter. Men som sagt, det gäller vårdmjuka. Så vi får se lite vad som händer framåt. Men vi tror fortfarande att Q2 är ett och brukar vara ett par kvartal. Men som sagt, det är lite osäker omvärld. Men so far so good. We go to page 4 and look at the assets. Here we also have a decline. This also affects the currency. We are decreasing with 2 billion. The currency affects with 650 and the already shown effects that we talked about earlier affects with 500. This means that we have a decrease of about 800. Millions, and then we can also see that the decrease is due to the fact that we have reduced the volume by 500 million, which is good and positive. So no dramatic decrease, but also here, as I said in the business part, good activity, very much interesting in that law. There is, as I said, a completely different risk value and interest in doing business, and of course it has to do with the interest rate. So still positive for our property segment. If we look at the geographical split and the different industries we are active in, there are no major changes to talk about at all. But a decent quarter for properties. We can go into a little more detail on property and page 5. Senior and junior, no major changes. There are no major changes between the quarter either. No major changes on the LTV level either. Junior, if you look at the price development in the book, it's pretty flat. Maybe a little positive, but somewhere between plus and minus zero. No, but as I said, we have an improvement in step 3. We still have high volumes in step 3, but now we have come down a little here. That was also what we said earlier, that we saw that we had in front of us that the step 3 volumes would be improved or reduced during the first half of the year. Now we have reduced it by 500 million and I think we have good plans and good activity to continue to reduce the volumes here during the second quarter. Let's go to page 6 and look at the private sector. Here you might see a slightly different trend. As we said, the macroeconomy with Trump in the USA did not affect companies and properties, so we might see a little more on the private sector. In February and March, we have seen a slightly lower demand. I think February and March have something to do with the consumer's view of the future, which looks a little more negative. Therefore, it has been a slightly lower demand. But as I said, this is a small segment. We are not chasing the market share, we are focusing on profitability ahead of growth. So we have chosen not to lower prices, but we continue where we have been before. We work a lot in one channel. Almost 50%. I think owning the channel is key for us. First, it's better quality for our customers, which means that the credit losses will go down over time. Number two, there is a much lower purchase cost in that channel, so it's to continue to make a private loan channel. We are now also trying to go into Finland, which we did during the first quarter now. You look at payment patterns with our customers. We have said earlier that There are fewer and fewer who get the first reminder. It continues this quarter, but what is very pleasing and positive for us and our customers, of course, is that there are clearly fewer, compared to a year ago, who have challenges with paying. That is to say that when you have received your last reminder, there are clearly fewer people who go to the cash register. And that, I would say, is a crime we have seen. This quarter. And that is very, very exciting. Then we go to page 7, and then we talk a little short. We have communicated earlier that we are going to buy, and now we have bought, DNB's, now I still say DNB's private portfolio. It's actually ours now. But we made this deal ready in early April. We have communicated it since earlier. But now it is clear that the deal is completed. What does this give us? Apart from the fact that we have from 24,000 to 25,000 cards to 95,000, and that's good, we have another platform to build our card business on. We've been looking at that for a while, to be able to grow our card business, to expand our privacy. So this is very good for us. It's not just that we have 70,000 new cards. We get a stock of 650 million, and we get platforms and systems to grow our card business. Incredibly good. And this business is profitable from day one. So the business is done, and we look forward to having a bigger card business. Wall-E. Fantastic to talk about Wall-E. We have a really good position in our payment solution Wall-E. A lot of customer dialogues in the future. More and more traders. We have an incredibly good momentum. If we look at the general e-commerce market for Q1, it decreases with a few percentages. Our market share increases by almost 28% under Q1, so we take the market. We have a very good position. This will grow forward. If we look at the volume of transactions, we can't really compare it to Q4, because you know that the season effects are up and down and back and forth. But if we compare it to Q1, Q24 and Q25, the volume of transactions goes up from 3.5 to almost 4.5. The number of active customers In Q1 2020, we had about 4.5 million active customers. The loan book is quite unfriendly, as you can see down below, about 2.7 billion. But it is also the case that new traders take 15-18 months before we see the stock grow from the fact that we have onboarded new traders. But a very good quarter again. And again, this is a product that contributes to the bank's total profitability. So we are very pleased with the development and we think this will continue forward. Let's go to page 9, where Peter will talk a bit more about the value effects that were quite big this quarter. And with that, I'll hand it over to Peter. So Peter, please.

Thank you very much. We are starting to break down the volume change today. The stock has totally decreased by about 2.8 billion compared to where we went out in the fourth quarter this year. And then we should have a negative FX effect of about 1.1 yards. It has been a volatile currency market and it is above all the Euro SEC movements that have affected us during this quarter and during the quarter as well. However, this is an impact on the stock market. We have a very limited impact on the result. We have managed to secure the currency movements in a good way during Q1 and we do so as usual. Then we have a change of a technology that affects with approximately 500 million. This is a one-off post and it has to do with how we actually handle these accumulated but unpaid interest rates that have been built up over time. Now this will be recorded as a negative post related to the public. But as I said, it is a one-time post and it has no result-based effect. So far, we have a underlying volume change of about 1.2 billion. There are a few different things that drive this. Above all, we had some expected mortgages in the investment segment. We flagged that in connection with the Q4 report, and these have come in according to expectations and also contributed to a better portfolio mix. In addition, we have also received lower Stage 3 volumes, which is positive. And then we have the seasonal effects, especially on factoring and payments, which Martin talked about earlier. So, in summary, we have a volume change that is minus 5.5%, but if we look at the underlying volume change, it was minus 2.3%. If we go to page 10 and look at the revenues, it goes to 1 billion 22 million kronor. Then we have, as previously mentioned, a positive effect of about 140 million kronor when we have revenues for the interest payments that we have received in relation to these step 3 credits. And these are then interest rates that have accumulated during 2023-2024. Even exclusive to this, we have a stable income level. And we have a NIM that goes up to 7.6% during this quarter. Page 11. We usually break down the NIM, and in previous quarters we have talked about how much that is missing from the NIM, given the way we handle these unpaid payments from the three creditors. This quarter, through the 140 million that we have received, we actually see the reverse effect, that the underlying number is a little lower than the reported number, and it is 30 points below the current quarter. If we look forward and at what pace, what run rate we hold on these credits, then of course they are affected by lower Steg 3 volumes. They are also affected by both FX-effects and how the housing rates have changed during this time. Should we give any form of guidance in the future, if we then take a theoretical scenario where there would not be any payments at all on these three credits during the second quarter, then the impact would be somewhere between 80 and 90 points, that is the round rate that we keep. We go to page 12 and look at the green line in Gilden. It goes up and is isolated under Q1. This is of course confirmed by the interest payments that we have received, the 140 million that we have received. If we had excluded them, we would still have the same trend, which is natural with gradually decreasing IBO rates. We have seen that both the yield and the funding costs have continued to drop even during this quarter. We can see that the same trend can continue even below Q2, but with an increasingly smaller effect if we look ahead. On page 13, regarding liquidity and trading costs, we can state that our regulatory liquidity has continued to strengthen and is strengthening rapidly during this quarter. We have an LCR that goes up to 330% and we have an NSFR that goes up to 121%. So now we have two quarters in a row where we continue to strengthen ourselves and we have actively worked to strengthen these levels after the legal decision that we made here during the fall. If we go to section 14, we can see this more from a purely non-technical perspective. During Q4, you saw how we actively worked to increase the structural liquidity position in the bank. We have continued to do this even during Q1, even if we have not really kept the same pace. But do we see how we have increased the level of total financing in relation to the loan in the last two quarters? As it was before, around 1.0 times and now we are up to 1.19 times. Translated into money, we have taken in about 9 billion in extra surplus liquidity here in just two quarters. And back to the summary of the NIM, of course, this must be taken into account. We have a weak negative carry on this extra surplus liquidity. And it is also given that if we had not needed to take in these extra 9 billion, then we could have acted a little differently regarding the pricing of our loan and also the structure regarding our loan. But we are, so to speak, clear with this now. We think we have succeeded very well, both on the structural liquidity side and above all the regulatory liquidity measures. So from these levels, we have no ambitions to increase further from where we are now. Since 2015, we have been talking about the segment, starting with the company segment. As I said, in terms of volume, we are down about 350 million. Almost the entire decline can be explained by FX-effects. In addition, we see a normal seasonal effect on the factoring side, which is part of this segment. This means that we see that the total development and both seasonal declines on factoring and Apex, we can see that the underlying loan business is doing well. There are stable margins and the revenues are also on a good level. If we look at this from a longer perspective, the business segment has had a clear comeback, where the volume is almost 30% and the revenues are almost 40%. Page 16, the property segment. I'm trying to do the same volume bridge here again, that the reported volumes are down by about 2 billion. Then we have minus about 650 million in FX effects from this. The educational and technical change that I mentioned initially is the absolute majority of that amount, about 500 million, relative to the property value, so it's minus 500 there. And of the volume reduction of about 850 million that is left, step 3 has decreased by 550 million. That is to say, it is a underlying volume decrease of about 300 million, as we can see here. So there seems to be big differences between reported decrease and underlying decrease. Then you see on the income level that it is here that the 140 million is added. This of course affects the total income, which is 416 million, and it is these incomes that actually explain the entire NING-strengthening, which is clear, as we see under Q1 this year. On page 17, the private sector, as I said, a slightly smaller volume decrease, about 130 million down. Partly driven by a little more cautious sentiment in the market, but we can also look at the index, which is 7.2%. It is strengthened somewhat during Q1, so it is also proof that we have prioritized profitability ahead of volume growth and kept up with some of the prices in the market. If we look at it from a longer perspective, the private segment is doing well. Year on year we have an increase in volume of 8% and the revenues are up by 10% and the corresponding price. We look at Wall-E, as I said, Martin talked about the transaction volumes. It has been going super well underground and they are up by 28% since April last year. However, you see in this picture that we do not have the same exchange rate on either the stock or the income. This has to do with the time lags that are built into the business model and when we have new traders in our portfolio, it takes time to reach the maturity of new traders. On the other hand, the stable and good revenues go up to 123 million and the margins are unchanged compared to the level we saw here during Q4. And again, payments are developing very well. It's a very profitable business for us, given the income we have in relation to a fairly limited capital bond relative to our other segments. If we go to page 19 and look at the costs, they go up to 281 million here in Q1. It is down a bit, so it should be, because the 303 million we reported under Q4 had about 15 million in one-time related posts and about 10 million in a seasonal effect. So if we had cleaned away the about 25 million from the 303 million, we would have landed just under 280 million and now we are landing at 281 million. So there are very small changes here with Q1 compared to where we were under Q4 and then despite the annual salary revision that is booked here now during the first quarter. Så jag tycker vi fortsätter uppvisa en bra kostnadskontroll och vi har ett KI-tal. Side 20, look at our credit loss reserves. They go up to 216 million or 1.8% here under Q1. You can see it on the graph on the side here that we are in a good trend. The credit loss percentage continues to go down. Then we talk about the company and property side here isolated under Q1. så ser det bra ut, egentligen inga ytterligare reserveringsbehov att tala om. Martin var inne på att vi ser en väldigt bra utveckling även på privatsidan och det gäller då vår Our front book, where we see better and better payment patterns. However, what drives the reservations for the most part during this quarter is the back book on the private side. And you can see that if you look at the level of reservations from stage 3 private. We usually talk about them. They are strongly marked during this quarter. An increase of 2.1 percentages. and they now go up to 57.9% at the end of the first quarter. Page 21, we sum it up then. We have a turnover of 525 million. It is just over the preliminary interval of 510-520 million that we publicly did here a few weeks ago. And this is of course much driven by the 140 million i extra ränteinbetalningar som är intäktsfört. Det flyter igenom hela vägen till resultatet. Men även utan de här inbetalningarna så upprätthåller vi en bra resultatnivå. We have a drop in our own capital during Q1 that increased by 17.8%. And we should remember that we have not yet made any withdrawals from our capital base or own capital for the repurchases that we hope to start here. Instead, we have rather accumulated our own capital. Our own capital is 1.35 billion higher here now in Q1 2025 compared to the corresponding period a year ago. Page 22 and the capital coverage, we continue as I said to strengthen the capital coverage with 30 points. A core capital relation that goes up to 16.1% and total capital coverage 17.2%. As I said, quite a lot is happening even on the capital side during this quarter. What affects in a positive direction is of course a very strong reported result. The volume changes we have seen, whether they are FX driven or underlying volume changes, volume decreases that we have seen here, continue of course to strengthen the capital. On the negative side, from January 1, 2025, we have fully implemented Basel IV, which has a negative impact on the capital. But net, we continue to strengthen ourselves with 30 points, and we show very strong buffer levels in relation to the regulatory requirements that we have. Then we go to page 23, I turn back to you Martin.

Great, thank you Peter. To summarize this and look a little forward, if we summarize with the different segments. Privately, as I said, a little further after the question is in February-March. We will see a little how it goes with the general public. Framtidstro, så fortsätter vi att förbättra kreditgivning. Vi ser, som Peter pratade om från BUC, att det ser bättre ut. Vi har jobbat med att förbättra kreditgivning under längre tid. Bättre kvalitet kommer att leda till lägre kreditförlust över tid. Det behöver vi se nu. Vi tittar, som sagt, lite på... Vi har gått in i Finland lite försiktigt under första kvartalet. Vi är väldigt glada nu att vi har... gjort affären klar där vi ökar vår kortdel och som ger oss en möjlighet att bygga kort klart bättre och större framåt så att privatsementet fortsatt bra. Företagsdelen As I said, there are no effects yet on the expansion of Tunla and so on, but we have to be cautious and look forward to it. Otherwise, I think the company looks very good. We have said that we have a very unique position to deliver financial solutions to a medium-sized company in the north. Stockholm is 30% in a year, so we have found a very good position there, and we will continue to do so in the future. What usually is good, without being able to guide too much what Q2 looks like, is that Q2 It's usually strong seasonally, and we still have good and many customer dialogues. In the properties, it's still a very good activity. A lot of customer dialogues, a lot of interest in doing business. That's what we continue to work with. The most important thing for us is to reduce our Step 3 volumes. And we have succeeded partly this quarter. And we look forward to continuing to improve that forward, that is to say to reduce Step 3 volumes. Wall-E is a very good quarter again for Wall-E. We have an incredibly good momentum in our Wall-E business. So it will be exciting to follow So all in all, very good quarter. Glad to have said that we have customers who have come up with their rents and pay accumulated rents, especially from 2024. The capital is still good, we are strengthening with 30 points despite the implementation of Basel. We have a very good position and position. All four segments have delivered a very good quarter. So it's exciting and that's it. Last but not least, as I said, we intend to buy back shares for up to SEK 500 million during the coming quarter. Det var nog det jag och Peter hade så vi tackar för att du tog dig till att lyssna och vi öppnar på frågan. Tackar.

Den nästa frågan kommer från Jakob Hässlevik från SEB. Varsågod.

God morgon. Om vi börjar med kreditförlusterna i konsumentportföljen så uppgick ju de till 600 punkter i kvartalet uppifrån 400 punkter i Q4. Vad är det som hände? För det är ju en väldigt hög nivå. Speciellt när jag tänker på att svenskas disponibel inkomst har ökat och förbättrats under början av året.

Ja, god morgon Jakob. Det stämmer ju. Det vi sa tidigare att det finns en frontbook och en backbook. And we also said on the call that the front book, the critical environment, looks very good regarding crisis losses. Then we have a back book. We choose to be conservative. We feel that there is room to reserve and we choose to do this for the time being. So you have the crisis losses where they are. But we are conservative and choose to increase the risk of reservation.

Yes, but I think that if the back book is from the last few years when the interest rates were higher and you mentioned that you have increased the credit rate and tried to increase the requirements and the like, how will it be that the back book now starts to have such clear problems? Is it a specific fund segment that is from brokers versus your own or have you made a mistake in some model somewhere? Is this happening?

Vi har inget problem med backbooken men vi har ett utrymme att reservera upp och då väljer vi oss konservativa. Det är inte så att vi har sett något trendbrott. Det gör man ju inte på en backbook som är väldigt lång, men från ett kvartal till ett annat. Det hoppar inte utan vi väljer att vara konservativa. För vi tycker vi har ett utrymme att reservera upp.

Du kan argumentera att den konservatismen också kommer från coming changes in regulation, especially with tax-related rights and other things, and possibly eventual changes in the debt settlement law and other things that come forward. So it's not a matter of time, but as Martin says, absolutely nothing has happened in the quarter.

Okay, great. Om vi sedan kollar på tillväxten på låneboken, är detta den nya run-raten om vi antar att det inte blir några steg 3-förflyttningar i Q2? Eller har ni nu möjlighet att öka tillväxttakten framöver?

Du menar på privat eller generellt?

Väldigt generellt, det var ju ner lite grann i nästan alla segment Q över Q.

Yes, it depends on how you see it. Companies are rising, for example, assets are flat. If you say that 300 million is quite flat if you clean and private is down 100 million. So it's relatively flat if you take away the currency effect and revenue effect, then all segments are relatively flat. And then you add that step 3 is down 500. Then you have a flat development. Privately, when you start with that, you have to go from segment to segment. You can't just take everyone at once. Privately, it's a matter of demand. And we have to see a little bit of what happens with consumers' future beliefs if you want to take a private loan. We have no growth heat there, but we choose to do De affärerna som är bra utifrån ett kreditperspektiv, det är på privat, det är svårt för oss att styra efterfrågan. Tittar på efterfrågan med företag och fastigheter, som vi sa tidigare, Q2 brukar vara säsongsmässigt starkt. Det har inte gått så långt in på Q2, men vi ser att det är fortfarande bra dialog och mycket aktivitet. Obligationsmarknaden har inte varit så öppen som den var i januari, så det finns goda förhoppningar att det är en bra tillväxt under. Under andra kvartalet. Wall-e, det växer inte någon stock egentligen. Så privat är vi lite mer avvaktande och återigen vi väljer att inte ha någon tillväxthet. Men företag har fastat sig fortfarande ganska bra aktivitet och mycket kunddelar.

Ja men toppen. Och en sista fråga bara och det gäller hur tankarna går när det kommer till funding med Avanza. I was going to ask, when is your contract expiring and are you going to try to fight on deposits or will you rather do it as a resource and say no to everything?

Because you have a very strong NSFR now. But it's a bit like I said, we have increased both the regulatory liquidity measures and the structural the liquidity position in the bank to also have a better strength position to be able to handle this whole situation. So we are not clear in these dialogues exactly how this will play out in the end. We don't know that yet, but it is There are good discussions going on, but as I said, we have put ourselves in a much better position to be able to handle it now. But you can also note on that market that we have gradually also started to adjust the price picture on that channel. Then it has been a bit special here now during Under Q1, when it generally shakes in the market, the loan flows tend to increase, especially on such a platform where it becomes a bit of flight to safety from customers.

You see, Jacob, we have taken in 9 billion in liquidity, so we don't have any stress in that way. The more time goes, the less Thank you very much. The next question comes from Emil Jonsson from DNB.

Welcome. Thank you very much.

Good morning. Other NII is very much related to both Q&Q and year-on-year. Vad var det som drev det?

Du menar i övrigt segmentet? Ja, det är ju en dynamik som styrs väldigt mycket av vår Our internal banking pricing and so on. But a big part of that is, as I mentioned, that on the structural surplus liquidity that we have taken in, we have not allocated it fully to the segment, but it remains as overhead. And on that we have a certain negative carry. So that's probably a big part of the effect you see from that.

Yes, it is Basel IV. As I said, on the capital side,

So what draws us in a positive direction is of course that strong results and that we have lower volumes underlying. It does not matter if they are underlying volume decreases or FX driven, so to speak. But from January 1, we have implemented Basel IV and it is the credit risk side within the regulation that simply raises the issue. That is correct.

Could you elaborate a bit on what exactly is changing in the REA calculations from BOSF 4?

There must be something with the risk weights. There are mainly two areas that drive it from our side. The first is the property segment, where we generally get higher risk weights when you look at the structure of our portfolio and how it has moved. And then there is also the factoring side, where untouched factoring limits are punished harder now than they have done before for our part. So it's mainly those two areas. Then this regulation is still new. Some pieces of the puzzle are still not finished, which is a bit funny that we are forced to implement a regulation where some issues are still on the agenda at EBA and the like. We hope that we can get some easing for this. when the regulation becomes clearer in the future. But as we have done now, we have had the ambition to make very conservative interpretations on Basel IV in order not to have to pay the price for it afterwards.

Thank you. And a follow-up question on the platform loan. As the agreement looks like, Om en sparkund väljer att inte göra något alls på eget initiativ, blir deras pengar kvar hos Avanza eller blir de kvar hos er? Det är våra pengar. Det är kunderna vår. De behöver göra ett aktivt val för att de pengarna skulle hamna någon annanstans på Avanza i så fall.

Om Avanza skulle ställa ner sin plattform i eftermiddag så försvinner inte pengarna bort från vår balansräkning. Sedan är det klart ur ett relationsperspektiv så ser det lite annorlunda ut så det är en mer komplex fråga än så men rent legalt så är det våra pengar.

If we play with the idea that you get it approved by FI and that they are approved by the vote, when do you expect them to start? Is it already the day after the vote that you can start or how does it look?

In theory, yes. In theory, yes, as soon as the two approvers are approved and as long as we are not in a quiet period, I will add to that as well.

Okay. Thank you. One last question on capital. What opportunities do you see for lifting up lost consumer food so that you don't have to backstop the project?

Yes, it's something that we have talked about for a long time and have worked and are actively working on for a long time. We want to. have a lower volume of NPLs in our balance sheet. Now we had big expectations for this new regulatory SDR status that has come, but this also has FI with some positions har inneburit vissa förseningar vad gäller de tillstånden så att vi bevakar ju den här marknaden löpande men har gjort bedömningen eller gör bedömningen. Det är fakta att prissättningen är inte riktigt där för att det ska vara ekonomiskt rationellt för oss att göra affärer på de här nivåerna som vi ser i marknaden just nu.

En sista fråga. Based on this, what do you think is most likely that there will be some kind of NTL transaction during this year or next year?

I would say that in that case from next year, because then you have a different SDR status, hopefully. That's my answer, then Peter can follow up.

No, but that's correct. I think it's... And hopefully, we believe, an important key to solve the knots in this market. So I agree with that.

We don't have any stress with that. It's better to wait until the pricing looks better and the SDR status can only be a key to that. So we don't have any stress with that. We don't want to do any stupid business to stress it.

All right. That was everything from my side. Thank you. Thank you.

The next question comes from Marcus Sandgren from Kepler Tjövre. Welcome.

Good morning. I was just going to ask about the currency. It seems that you have about 40% of the loan in foreign currency, right? Is basically everything out of the cost base in kronor, or is there a lot of currency there as well?

That was pretty accurate. I think it's 43. So you're pretty good at this, I have to say, Marcus. I think it's 43, but close.

Yes, that's right. About 40%. Yes, but on the stock market. But I'm thinking out of the cost base.

The largest part is SEG.

And is the largest part over 90%?

Absolutely, we have the largest cost post. We have our organization almost exclusively in In Sweden. Then we have small branches in both Norway and Finland as well, but it is relatively few employees. Then it is clear that underlying has a different currency mix when you look at contracts with IT suppliers and there are a lot of dollars and others that will play a role over time. But over 90% is definitely correct.

Very good. And the other thing I was thinking about was just what Emil asked about repurchase. When you mention that in theory we can start in practice, how do you think about that? Do you wait for what happens with the shares to be shared or how are the thoughts going?

No, we don't wait for that because we don't know when in time it will be. So in theory and practice it can actually be a bit of the same thing here as we sit the day after. Stelman och då ponerar att FI har gett ett godkänn, då skulle man kunna köra igång då. Vi kommer inte att sitta och vänta på någon utdelning av Valdos aktierna. Jättebra.

Tack så mycket Edvard. Tack så mycket, ha det bra.

Den nästa frågan kommer från Jens Hallen från Carnegie Investment Bank. Varsågod.

Hej hej, god morgon. Några snabba Venter Netto, question from my side. First, Peter, you talked about adjusting the run rate. I heard that from 6.73 in Q4, a run rate is quite stable compared to last quarter, so maybe 6.75, 6.80, something like that.

Is that the best guess for a run rate in Q2? If you take the reported number that we have now, and then you can turn to it from different directions. If you take the reported 7.6 and then you Can you play with the idea of taking away the 140 million? Where are we then, so to speak? Or turn it around if we have the underlying NIM at 7.3, now it is a little lower than what we saw in Q4. So we have seen a underlying, small, so-called technical NIM pressure due to how the market interest rates have moved where we are in the interest rate cycle. That's how it is. Then what we say about these 80-90 points is that If we take a scenario that is not what we think, but if we play with the idea that it would not get any money from the step 3 volumes at all, then we have been here for a few quarters between 90 and 100 points and what we say is that the run rate effect comes down. It comes down as the step 3 balances decrease. It is also partly FX driven, but it It also goes down when Stibor goes down, so to speak, because there are fewer revenues that are missing with lower interest rates on that side. But we have seen a little continued pressure without any drama at all.

When you get into that effect, are you starting to see the market interest rates stabilizing? And you are still making some new payments where I guess the margin is okay. Can you see that the underlying margin is also starting to stabilize?

You mean if there is a competitive situation or not? What do you mean, Jens?

Exactly, exactly, exactly. If we go with the idea that the market rates are stable now in Q2.

There is no pressure that we have to make loans at a low margin. No, we don't do that.

Two other questions. You also have a day count effect on the net income of almost 20 million. Approximately, yes. It will be 10 million positive delta for Q2. I was talking about the net income that is not allocated. It is down 60 million per quarter. from 1997 to 1938. It is a bit difficult for us to estimate. You mentioned that you have done a lot on the funding side, when the liquidity side is up to 121% now. Have you taken in from TORNA We expect Q2 to be somewhere between the 37 and the 90, or the 37 million in total. That's where we're going to be. 60 million in the first quarter will of course be a big post.

Like Peter said, we have no intention of continuing the development, that is to say to bring in as much liquidity as we have done in the last few decades. We will not make the same increase in the future, so to speak.

No, I don't know if we should call it that, but it has gone a little faster than we had expected. And then, as I said, we consider ourselves to be done. Then it will be difficult to give any exact guide as the rest of the rental net, as you mentioned.

When we are satisfied with these levels, then you can say yes. It will not be that it will stick up a lot. It will not have the same opening pace.

No, I would not think that we have any And then just one last thing.

We haven't talked much about the costs, but as you mentioned, it is a slightly flat quarter or quarter despite the revolutions in Q1. When you look at 2025 and think about your budget, are there any investments you have to make? Or is it idealistic to think that you can keep a low, one-digit growth rate for 2025?

You can say this, where we make investments, in addition to the fact that there is a lot of regularity driven, which we have done 24 and 25, we have been a whole lot of consultants, we do Q-shubs and we have a lot of regular perspectives. I don't see an increase in that, there will be an increase in tactics, but where we finally make investments is in Wall-E. We strengthen Wall-E organizations with customer responsibility and business development. We think we have a very good position in i Wall-E, så att där vi ökar, om man tittar på numerärer, det är egentligen i Wall-E. Det är där de stora kostnadsökningarna är. Sen vad det ger i slutändan, i kronaöron, det är svårt att säga, men egentligen där man kan säga gasar lite.

Och vi kan väl upprepa det vi har sagt tidigare, att vi tror väl på vissa kostnadsökningar framåt, men vi tror inte att de kommer vara egentligen i av den magnituden som vi såg under 2024. Det tror vi inte, med vad vi ser nu i alla fall.

Okay, utmärkt. Tack så jättemycket för bronsvaran.

Tack själv igen, så fint.

Som en påminnelse, om du vill ställa en fråga, tryck fyrkant 5 på din telefon. The next question comes from David Lindskog from Private Investor. Please go ahead.

Hello. First of all, I would like to congratulate you on a good report.

Hello.

I think it is strong for the entire company. Yes, it is strong. I think it is strong with the survey, the credit losses, the income and perhaps even more the future prospects. I have two practical questions and a strategic question. I'll start with the strategic one. I think it would be interesting to hear you think more about how you see the credit card business. Do you expect to be able to grow strongly through the segment? This is a bit of a new launch, so to speak.

Yes, I would have hoped to say yes, but we have not yet laid such a strategy so that we will have X number of cards in two years. But I think it's like a war card business, it's a good business, it completes our private loan. Then how many cards we have in one or two years, but of course we have a plan to be able to gas it and it becomes one extra leg to stand on. Vi tar ju lite rivstarten då, vi nästan tredubblar antalet kort över natten. Vi har liksom en plattform att kunna fortsätta mer än från de 95 000 korten vi har. Men vi har ingen exakt plan att om två år ska vi ha 700 000 kort. Så långt har vi inte riktigt kommit, men jag tror det är en väldigt bra plattform att kunna få fart på kortaffären.

This can be a bit of a reinterpretation, but I will still formulate the question and see if I can come up with something new. I understand the logic of repurchase. You have a division due to the value of the stock. At the same time, a division would be much easier to actually implement. And considering the free float and limited trading of the stock, how would it actually be possible to repurchase a stock in a relevant range before Balder has divided the shares?

Yes, it's a bit of a free float. Then you can't say either. You can in this resale we will probably choose. We are not really able to do things that are posted outside the stock exchange. So I still think over time it is possible to do it. Then it may take a little time with the free float. I understand your question. If it is practically possible with the free float. But I think it is possible. Or we think it is possible. Then you don't do it overnight.

No, and you earn a lot of money. Two kronor per share. It's hard to compare that to the trade that happens.

Absolutely.

I agree completely. And then the last practical question, and it's a bit of a reinterpretation here as well. It doesn't come directly from the clear sky, but with Avanza. Apropos loans, from that it can at least disappear over time. Potentially, in a worst-case scenario. Are there any practical risks with this? Or is it all essentially handled, since you have taken in so much surplus liquidity and had a good time?

No, but it was clear that when NSFR, this came from FI and then when Avanza chooses as a direct consequence to choose this platform, then it becomes a bit of a cold shower for us. But since time has passed and we have still noticed that we have managed to get liquidity on our own in a short time. In our own channels and on other platforms, we have felt a less and less worry the longer the time goes. That's number one. Number two, we have worked for a longer time to get flow in our own channels. It becomes a little more sticky loan, it becomes a lower cost. So it was nothing new for us, actually, that we wanted to have more loan than a channel. So actually, you can say that in the short term it was a bit hard, but in the medium and long term, I think this is good.

I can just add that what makes us in a strong position is that we have built up this extra surplus liquidity and with regard to after FI positions, just the Avanza platform is less worth for us. So we are also in a position where we do not need to replace the volumes we have there, crown by crown.

And you agree with that David, why is the value lower? Efter FFIS-delningstagen. Du är med på det att över natten så blev ju inte Avanza's inlåning lika, vad ska man säga, viktig för oss. De räknas ju inte på samma sätt.

Nej, men för att det drog ner teckningen i en safari. Ja, exakt.

Så då blev per definition de pengarna mindre värda.

When I first saw it, I thought it was a big deal. But after a while, when you have time to deal with it, I thought it shouldn't be a big deal anymore.

That's my answer now. I don't think we understand how it's interpreted. It's not someone who moves the money overnight. It's up to each customer. I think the platform is good for that. For customers, because it will be another competition for us banks to always have to give the best price to customers. But that's another question.

Thank you very much for the answer. And we'll see you in the ring next time.

Thank you for calling in, David.

Have a nice day. Thank you.

There are no more questions right now, so I'll leave the floor to the speakers for any final comments.

Okej då tackar vi Peter och jag för att ni ringde in och önskar en bra dag. Tack, tack!