Skanska AB (publ)

Good morning and welcome to the presentation of Skanska's Third Quarter Report 2022. I'm Antonia Givnelind, Senior Vice President, Investor Relations. And here on stage in our studio, I have our CEO Anders Danielsson and our CFO, Magnus Persson. Shortly, they will take you through the third quarter results and financials and they will guide you through some business and market highlights. And after their initial presentation, we will move over to questions. And you will be able to ask questions either by using the conference phone number or you can text us your question using the text field in the webcast page. Or you can ask your question in person if you are here in the room. And we will answer as many questions as we can. So with that short introduction, let's take a closer look at the third quarter results. I hand over to you Anders.

Thank you, Antonia. Before we jump into the figures, I want you to look at the picture here to the right. It's Heron Eyes Memorial Bridge that we're building in Virginia, USA. Well-run projects. First, an overview of the third quarter. We have a solid performance in the third quarter again. We have strong profitability in construction. We have a historically high order backlog. And we also have a attractive property development portfolio. We'll go into that later on. And we have a very robust and strong financial position. Operating margin in construction, 3.3% on a rolling 12-month basis. Return on capital employed in project development is at our target, 10%, on a rolling 12%. Return on equity is slightly below our target, 17%. Carbon reduction, we have managed to reduce the carbon reduction with 54% compared to our baseline year 2015. So if we go into each stream, starting with construction, revenue goes up in the third quarter with 21%. The underlying, if you look at the local currency, the increase is 9%. Order bookings increasing to close to 44 billion. We have a book to build of 102% on a rolling 12 months basis, which is really strong. And again, historically high 228 billion Swedish in order backlog. Operating income, 1.3 billion, and the operating margin in the construction of 3.4%. Just shy of our target, as you know, of 3.5%. So despite everything that's going on in the market in the world, we managed to keep up the profitability, which is a real strength. We grew the revenues, strong order intake, and a solid level of profitability. If I go into residential development, the revenue decreased to 1.5 billion. Also, the number of sold homes decreased, and we have started less homes in the quarter as well. But we do have a very strong position in the portfolio. We'll come into the details later, but we have a high sales rate in the ongoing project, and we have very few unsold completed. But the revenue is, of course, impacted by a lower activity in the market. But still, we have an operating margin of 9% and a return on capital employed here on a rolling 12, 9.5%. So I'm moving into commercial property development here. It hasn't happened too much in the quarter. No big and large divestments. So we have a gain on sale in the quarter for 152 million. Here you should look over time. In my view, if you look at the first nine months for the commercial development, we have divested commercial properties for close to 10 billion Swedish. And if you look at the rolling 12, it's 16 billion Swedish. So we are sure that our portfolio or products are really attractive for investors. which is good for the future because we do have 36 ongoing projects, which corresponds to close to 33 billion in investment upon completion of those projects. 32% occupancy rate, 48% completion rate. It's something we're watching very carefully. We don't want the gap to be too large. So it's something we look into. We have started one project in Q3, and what we can see now is that the leasing market is slowly recovering. We can see that, especially in Europe, in the Nordic Central Europe, that people are getting back to work, getting back to the offices in gradual incremental stages here, and we can see it also slowly in the US. And we can also see that the activity amongst potential tenants has increased. We have more potential tenants viewing our projects, and we can also see that we have signed a bit more tenant deals in the quarter. And we can also see that we have a good mix in the portfolio when it comes to offices, life science, multifamily, so that is also increasing demand for those other segments in the market. and we also see you can tell a polarization in the leasing market and i with that i mean that projects offices in very good location high quality high environmental standards they are more more attractive and then properties in not so good location and not so good environmental standards so and that is a benefit for for us of course investment properties that we new business stream as you know from 2022 and here we're targeting high quality high sustainable offices in sweden predominantly and the ambition is to grow that portfolio to 12 to 18 billion Swedish in the next few years and we have put our first transition here epic building in Malmö in the first quarter and we are preparing for more very high quality acquisitions going forward If I go back to construction and go into the order bookings, here you can see what I've just been talking about, about the order backlog development over the years. So you can see here in the blue bars that the order backlog is on a record high level. And we can also see that the order bookings per quarter is also quite stable. And the green line here in the picture is the revenue. We have been forecasting this increase for quite many quarters now due to strong order intake. And now we can see it this quarter as well, even though part of it is FX impact. And if I go into each geography, It's also a good position here. We can see that basically all geographies have a book-to-build ratio of over 100%, overall 102%. Slightly lower if you combine the Nordics, but I'm not concerned over that. We have 14 months of production in order backlog, and if we look at the total of 17, amount of production which is on a good level and you can see of course in very strong order intake in US and also in Europe and there's a majority of that increase is in UK so good position that with that I'll leave it to Magnus to go through the details Thank you.

So let's start with, as usual, income statement in construction. As you can see, the revenue with the top line grew quite a lot there. We're up quarter over quarter, around 20%. We have a lot of our activities in construction, other currencies, of course. And the Swedish krona has depreciated quite a lot. We have a fairly large impact of the foreign exchange rate in this. If you strip that out, we had an underlying growth of 9%. And I think on that, that also sounds like a lot to grow organically, if you will. But with the high inflation rates that we have had for quite some time now, a lot of our contracts are indexed to inflation. So, of course, then as costs go up, we have the right to be reimbursed by clients for the movements and index. And that is, of course, also driving part of the revenue increase here. So if we look at scope growth in the organization, you can say that's sub-9%. If we go down and look at the margins here, we had the gross margin of 7.2%, which is very respectable, not at least given the sort of surrounding environment. S&A, quite steady. S&A margin at 3.9%, I say that's a very good level that we have, down from 4.1% a year back then. Nominally speaking, you can see S&A goes up a bit. Part of that is, of course, also FX that comes into play here. Takes us down to an EBIT margin, 3.4%, and as I said, 3.3% on the rolling 12 months. Very respectable performance, and I think that measure is the right measure to look at when you're going to assess how well we are performing in the business rather than quarter by quarter performance. Not at least a good quarter since we have no particular one-offs really that is disturbing the comparison of these numbers. It's really the underlying business that you look at there. if we then look at the different geographies in the nordics we delivered three and a half percent margin somewhat down then from last year sweden isolated three and a half percent as you know we have said this before we expect a bit higher margin from the swedish business here than what we can deliver here in this quarter so In Europe, 3.2%, that's a solid level. The comparison number here that is considerably higher, 3.8, that's a very tough comparison to have. That quarter was a very well-performing quarter. US, 3.3%, continues on the trajectory to improve margins and improve profitability in this business. If you look at the profit levels here. They're essentially up 40%, but you have to acknowledge the fact that we have these currency impacts here, but not only are we improving performance, but we can do this steadily over time. So I think it's a testament to sort of a good development trajectory of this business now. If we go to residential development, there we go. The story is a bit different. As you know, the market has weakened in residential development. We see this, I'd say, across all different geographies we are operating in, even if the market has perhaps moved, weakened quickest and most perhaps on the Swedish residential market, where we have the most pronounced effects done. buyers are generally a bit hesitant today here and that's not so strange given where we are in the general economic climate we see interest rates goes up of course we have the inflation and just the general uncertainty and of course if you're going to make a very large capex buy as a private individual that is delivered to you six months ahead of time or maybe a year out in time you really don't like that uncertainty so transaction levels number of transactions on the market for new apartments here has come down then in the quarter. We delivered 9% margin in the quarter, 132 million in EBIT. And due to the volume, we had a very high S&A margin, as you can see, over and above 12%. Obviously, the volume is too low. We have an organization that is designed for higher volumes here. So that's not a level that we should be at there. I think it's also fair to point out that with our method of recognizing revenue in residential development, and we essentially do that at the point of contract. When we get a signed sales contract, we recognize the revenue. Looking at our third quarter results, it shows you a very sort of true picture of where the market has been trading in the third quarter. Had we employed other revenue recognition principles, I think the P&L would have looked a bit different perhaps. But our P&L shows the market very early on, so you can see any changes in the market, so to speak. if we look at the different geographies nordics 11 margin sweden 19.8 margin that's a fantastic result obviously in a tough market but but here we have to be transparent and say that part of this result the margin is heavily impacted i would argue by the release of past provisions from past projects that we now release in the third quarter. And the impact on the margin becomes especially large since the volume in the quarter is so low. So we're not trading here underlying at close to 20% EBIT. Then we have the European part of the business that unfortunately had in part a decimal quarter. The reason to the 3 million profit in the third quarter, that is essentially because in the establishment of the Boklok business in the UK, where we now have three projects, we have faced startup costs or learning costs, if you will, in the isolated quarter. If we take that part out, that cost associated with that out, the other part of the European residential development business, which is then Poland and Czech Republic, are performing really well. You can't see that in our numbers, which is why I thought it was fair to point it out then. If we then move on to homes started and sold, sales were obviously down, given what I just told you about the market. Sold close to 340 units then, and we do expect the market to remain slower, the number of transactions to remain fewer for some time here, until we can get out of the most immediate uncertainty that we now have in parts of the market with clients then. And when that happens, transactions will come back and that will probably take some time then. We also had a quarter with slower or fewer started units. It is a bit more challenging these days to find the right business cases. We have had cost inflation, obviously, and right now we have more difficult time with the revenue visibility, given that the level of transactions are fewer on the market. So business cases becomes a bit more difficult to sort of get together. But our ambition here is clearly to continue to drive this business and start new projects. And we have both the financial capacity and the risk tolerance to do so. If you look at homes in production, we have close to 7,900 units that are in ongoing production at the end of the quarter. We had sold already 71% of those units. So it's a very de-risked portfolio, if you will. And of course, as happens when the market goes down a bit, sometimes the sales rate decrease a bit. So we have a very good starting point coming into a bit slower market here with this high sales rate. Completed unsold homes, 92 of them, very few. I think we added 20 completed unsold since last quarter. It is still a very, very low figure here. You have to relate that to the 7,900 units we have in ongoing production. So we really don't have an issue with that at the moment. If sales becomes a bit slower, if we have a practice in the market where customers buy a bit slower, we saw in 2017-18 that this happened, unsold completed might come up a bit. That's nothing alarming for us, it would more be i would say expected and the important thing with that is that we keep our eye on the churn of those units so we don't get unsold completed units that are old we don't have that problem today and we will work so we don't have that problem in the future either Commercial property development, as Anders already said, was a very slow quarter in the CD. We made no material transaction. We handed over a major property in Poland and had good proceeds from that, but that's obviously not in the P&L, it comes in the cash flow. So we can move on. unrealized and realized gains i think where the market is now it's good to point out that we update our property valuations every quarter with rent assumptions yield assumptions leasing space and so on and so forth we see very little changes in the expected future gains from our portfolio here between the last quarter to this one we are close to 10 billion in in that and And when we value properties, we normally employ quite cautious sort of yield assumptions on that because we value them out when they are completed, which can be two to three years ahead. So when we start a project, of course, a very cautious assumptions in that. So very difficult to anticipate where the transaction market will be two to three years out. So no major changes on that, and we still see a good interest from investors in the properties that we have. If we look at the completion profile, we had about 6.5 billion in properties that were completed in the portfolio. These were leased to around 72%. And then we moved one property in the quarter between ongoing to completed. It was a Swedish property that was moved from the southern parts of Sweden. We expect to complete another six properties during the fourth quarter. And going forward, you can actually see on the chart here how we expect to complete them. So then we will increase the amount of properties expected to be completed throughout each quarter over the coming year here then. Leasing, we had in the portfolio 30%, 32% of the space available was leased at the end of the quarter, and we had a 48% completion rate. And we usually track this on a rolling 12-month basis, and now we leased 175,000 square meters over the last 12 months. In the third quarter, isolated, we leased 44,000 square meters. That's actually quite respectable leasing, actually. And as Anders has already alluded to, what we have been saying for some time is that we have a good underlying dialogue with a lot of potential tenants. say at the end of the third quarter we actually started to see a little bit higher pace in the signed lease agreements as well and i think that is a very good development so let's work for that this development continues but right now these are early but very positive signals there On the tenant market, we observe the same trends as we have talked about before. Flexibility is important for tenants these days. It can be both sort of physical flexibility, expansion and contraction options and more contractual flexibility in terms of rate resets and a little bit shorter lease terms and so on. And also that we do see a higher focus on these modern well-equipped properties with the right locations that are energy efficient and so on. So we feel that our portfolio is very well strategically positioned actually to take advantage of this development in the market. Investment properties, we had very little movements in this business stream in the isolated quarter. As you know, we have only one property there with 12,000 square meters. It's fully leased and it is performing very well. If we go to the group, if you add together the business streams, we had around 1.5 billion in EBIT, and then we have central costs, which this quarter actually is a central profit of 112 million. The reason for that is that we divested very successfully the final remaining PPP asset in the UK part of the infrastructure development structure that we have put as a legacy business and that we are dismantling. gave a very good profit on that and the profit essentially consists of two parts one is the gain on sale and the other reason is that we because this is the last remaining asset of this type we have in the UK we can essentially roll back all accumulated exchange range differences to the equity position so it's a fairly big impact in the profit in the isolated quarter from that the other part of the central line and the P&L that is our headquarter costs and also roughly the same We move down to net financials. You can see we made approximately 70 million net interest here, and the reason for that is our big net cash possession and the fact that our internal bank have been very successful in managing deposits and short-term investments to make use of the changes in the interest rate curve, at the same time as we have a very low amount of external debt in the company. So that's a good balance. Taxes, we... have 300 million in taxes, 19%, which is higher than last year at 16%. And the chief reason to that is that last year we were able to utilize past losses in three European countries for tax deductibility reasons. We will not have that opportunity this year. So we are moving more towards our nominal tax rate this year than we could last year. If we go into the cash flow, we had a good cash flow, not at least because we handed over these big properties I alluded to in Poland, 2.8 billion inflow. Apart from that, we had obviously no dividend or strategic divestment, so total cash flow here in the isolated quarter, 3.1 billion. So that's a good number. When I look at the working capital, the bar here represents the negative working capital of over 30 billion, and this is the highest position we've ever had in that. I think the reader, if you're an analyst or whatever investor, you should sort of understand that these are balance sheet items, and balance sheets move with currency. So part of the increase we have seen lately in the network and capital position, nominally speaking, that is due to currency changes. To neutralize that, you should look at the green line, which hovers around 19%. That is also a very high and very respectable figure, obviously. And we do not see any real structural reasons that this will change, but of course we're very respectful for this because it's a very strong position and we are cautious in extrapolating it too far out into the future. If you look on the investments and capital employed, we're still in net investment territory in the group, which is the green line below zero, and that's exactly where we would like to be. We have a lot of free financial assets that we would like to employ. so that's good we have a small uptick as you can see in the last quarter and that is chiefly due to this big transaction that we had in handover that we had in cd in the central european business then capital employed increases to 54 billion respectable sum it really shows that we are sticking to the strategy of long-term growing also property development here In the early part, the 16.5 billion, of that, there's of course underlying assets. This is capital employed. Of the assets, 15 billion of the assets are ongoing projects right now. Of that, we have sold units, our sales rate is 72%. that is roughly worth 9 billion. So it's a very de-risked, you can say, exposure we have in the capital employee there. Similarly, in commercial property development, we have ongoing properties in the balance sheet worth 15 billion, and then we have completed properties in the balance sheet of 6 billion. These are then leased to 30% and 72% respectively. So also that shows a high degree of sort of de-risking of the capital employed that we have put into proper development in the group. If we look at the funding situation, there's no change in this one. We have still the same maturities. We have a couple of maturities next year and a little bit larger one in 2024. 20 billion in available funds, of which 7 billion is thanks to committed credit facilities that are undrawn. And our financial position remains very strong. Equity, 52 billion. We have an adjusted net cash position of 14 billion. And given where we are in the market with somewhat higher market uncertainty, I think we have the staying power to continue to see through development projects in a good way and run this business. And also this gives us the firepower actually to act on opportunities that may come out in a weaker market. So we are very well served by having this solid financial position in this moment. With that, I hand back to you, Anders.

yes and i will go through the market outlook starting with the construction stream if you start with the civil market is stable in basically stable in all countries in europe and strong continue to be strong market outlook in in the u.s and that the reason is that we can see federal money coming out in the system together with the states They invest a lot of infrastructure, and we expect that to continue. And the need is very high for that in the US. It's also good that we can see a stable market outlook when it comes to non-residential construction in our important markets, Sweden, Norway, US market is stable. So we are, the predominant part of our business are in the right segments. Of course, the residential construction market is weak, continue to be weak, depending on the interest rates that goes up and the hesitance we can see amongst the buyer, people who are about to buy apartments. uh going into residential our outlook is continue to be slow and we expect that to continue for the next 12 months but the underlying need for apartment are really really strong we are in the right places here as well and i expect that to be i strongly believe in the market on in a more long term commercial development property development leasing markets continue to be slow even that we have seen both magnus i talked about it earlier we have seen higher activity and we also actually signed more tenants agreement this quarter compared to the same quarter last year and again polarization definitely that's has happened in every downturn in the market that high high quality the right location of the offices they are attractive in a more difficult market this time as well we expect that So to summarize this solid performance in the third quarter, we have a strong profitability in construction, historically high order backlog, very attractive property development portfolio, again, very robust financial position, strong net cash of 14 billion, and the strategic direction remains for the company. We are going to keep the discipline, continue to improve the profitability in construction and grow some part of the profitable business in a responsible way. leading residential developer that's absolutely our strategy and ambition and we on the long term want to grow the commercial property development in our market i can see the largest opportunity for growth in the commercial development is in the us and here again life science is strong demand in certain part of of the operation we have there And we of course going to continue to build up the investment portfolio and that is really strategically really good for the company. Now we can work in the whole value chain and we can get a lot of synergies with that strategy. With that, I'll leave it to Antonia to start the Q&A.

Thank you. Yes, so now it's time for your question. And as I mentioned before, you can ask your question on the conference call, then just please follow the instructions by the operator. Or you can send in the question in writing, use then the text field on the webcast page. Or if you are here in the room and want to ask a question, then just please raise your hand and we will bring a microphone. And may I also please ask you to start by stating your name and organization. But we will start with the questions from the conference call. So operator, do we have someone calling it?

We will now begin the question and answer session. For questions over the phone, please press star and one at this time. Our first question from the telephone comes from the line of Pam Liu with Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Thank you very much. This is Pam Liu from Morgan Stanley. I have questions on the property development business, please. The first one is regarding residential development. I'd like to know how you think about the potential cancellation risk. So should we expect that the contract signed so far may be cancelled when it comes to full payment at completion because of higher interest rate, difficulty in getting a good mortgage, and what sort of historical cancellation you have seen in previous housing market downturn, please. The next questions are related to commercial property development. I'd like to understand how you see rental yield developing in the commercial segment in Sweden and how do you reflect that in the valuation of your own commercial property portfolio? The second question there is, you obviously have a very strong balance sheet with little external debt. This is actually quite different from many of the other property developers in Sweden. that may have a more leveraged position. So are you seeing any for sale by competitors in the market yet? And how does that impact your evaluation of your properties? And how do you see the opportunities there? And the last question, so on page 20 of the Q3 report, I can see quite a big difference between segment reporting and IFRS for commercial development revenue recognition. Could you please just remind us what is the difference and why this is this big this quarter? Thank you.

Thank you, Pamela. I will start with the first question, and Magnus will address the other one. On the RD side, just about the cancellation, we have not seen a large number of cancellations. And it's a fair question, but in the past, our sales agreement, they are binding, which means that the people cannot sign up for the binding agreement if they don't have the financing in place. So that makes it secure for us and the client, the buyer, to be able to fulfill the agreement. So the short answer is we have not seen a lot of cancellation. I don't expect that to happen in a large scale going forward.

Hi, Pam. This is Magnus. I will continue with your other three questions. And this is a bit of a memory test, so if I fail miserably, you can remind me, perhaps. But I think your second question related to commercial development and our yield sort of outlook, if I'm not mistaken. on the Swedish market, and first of all, there's not a very large amount of transactions that are happening, so as everyone else, you sort of look at the market, that's the transaction that happens, and then you see what people are buying and selling to. say the underlying facts to that is very difficult. So it leaves everyone in a bit more, maybe a bit more darkness than in a strong market. What we have noticed in Sweden is that the transactions that have been made have been made at very attractive yields. Maybe surprisingly so, given what is going on around and also given where the interest rate is going and so on. And we can also see a slightly more, if you will, aggressive take from equity buyers than from leverage buyers, which doesn't surprise me, actually. So on that, then you had a question regarding the balance sheet, and have we seen any fire sales from competitions, etc.? ? Not really. We haven't done that. When the market goes, sort of weakens, it's not unusual that that happens. For instance, land pieces, et cetera, you need to, if you don't have our balance sheet, you might need to free up capital and to use that in other places. Maybe you're stuck with loan covenants and so on. Maybe this happens this time around. If it does, we will certainly be prepared to look at such opportunities. And your final question regarding the segment versus IFRS accounting, and the answer is very simple. In the segment accounting, we recognize revenue at the point of contract, meaning when we have a binding sales contract. In the IFRS accounting, we recognize revenue when we hand over the property to a buyer. So the reason that you see a big difference in the third quarter in commercial development is that the property that we handed over for 2.8 billion in the third quarter to a buyer, That contract was written in another quarter, but we handed over it now. So we had segment recognition of that revenue earlier and IFRS recognition of that revenue in this quarter.

That's very clear. Thank you so much.

Thank you.

The next question comes from the line of Marcus Henriksson with ABG. Please go ahead.

Thank you very much. Do you hear me, everyone? We do. Perfect. First off, you highlighted positive one-offs in residential development Sweden and a negative one-off in Europe with the EBIT margins of around 20% and around 1%. Could you highlight how large these one-offs were?

We don't do that, we sort of don't speak about these things because it's very difficult to assess how much is a normal level of provisions that you let out. With our way of recognising revenue, which is done then as I just described at the point of contract, we are always cautious in recognising revenue in the early stages of a contract. If things change, if we're not able to handle the risks, we would like to have that caution to protect the financial position of that project. And that means that in a successfully delivered project, we will be able to release these reserves at the end of the project, which in turn means that every quarter you look at in Skanska, you will have a positive impact, hopefully then by the release of some provisions. And that can be larger in some quarters and smaller in other quarters, depending on what projects we happen to complete. So it's very difficult, not really meaningful, to sort of go into that differential. But I think in this case, given the low volume we had in Sweden, the impact of the release of these provisions and the, to our favor, settled claim, were very big on the margin. And we don't want to sort of send you off in the wrong direction of our trading results. So it's a big impact on the margin there.

Very clear answer. Thank you for that. Dan, also you... intent to continue to keep production starts high in RD? I guess preferably sales ratios would be 40 to 50%, maybe 20 to 30% in the current market. But at what time is the sales ratio in new projects become too low? If it's 0 to 10%, for example, would you wait with construction starts and focus on SG&A?

I understand that. We decide that sales rate requirement for each and every project. And as we said, we have a very good position now in the portfolio since we have a high sales rate, very few unsold completed, and we have the financial strength to start new projects. So we can take that decision on our own. and also i can say we we have very good pipeline so if we believe that the project is in the right location and we we strongly believe in in the future of the rd business we can start it with a very low sales rate because we have the financial strength to do that And I can also see that the trend here in the market, which is similar to other downturns in the RD market, is similar, that people tend to want to buy and sell in the same market, which means that they want to buy closer to completion. And that actually is a benefit for us because we have a competitive advantage. We can start projects with a lower sales rate. But it's, again, decided project by project.

Thank you for that last question. Could you highlight where you've seen the most increase in land prices in your different regions and where you think you'll be able to find opportunities to add to your land bank?

We have a very strong land bank. It's something we go through on a regular basis, the strategic land. You have to work with the land bank for five, seven, even ten years ahead, and that's exactly what we're doing. So we are well fit for the future when it comes to land bank. Having said that, of course, we're looking into opportunities that will probably show up in the market. So that's the way we address this, our approach.

I can add to that Marcus that on the land bank we of course review the valuations regularly to make sure that we are in line with the market or below the market value in our books and on that normally speaking when the market sort of drops off it takes quite a long time for it to hit the land values so which is you know why the earlier answer to that we would be prepared to look at things but we don't obviously see any sort of land fire sales at the moment

Thank you for taking my questions. Thank you.

The next question comes from the line of Gregor Kugelitsch with UBS. Please go ahead.

Hi, good morning. Thanks for taking my questions. The first question is on, you flagged it, but the mix of commercial development, you used to talk about life sciences, can you just remind us what that mix actually is in your portfolio, either in capital employed or whichever way, or ongoing projects, whichever way you want to quantify that would be helpful to give us a sense. The second question is just on commercial property sales. Obviously, it was a low quarter in Q3. That's not unusual. I guess, can you give us a sense whether there's ongoing discussions? I mean, there's obviously $6 billion, $7 billion or so that's, I think, ready to go. So what are the conversations like with potential buyers? Maybe a similar question, maybe it applies to both development segments, but roughly speaking, what kind of pricing trends have you seen? I mean, I'm guessing in residential in Sweden, you're kind of tracking the market, which I think is down high single digit, but correct me if I'm wrong. And similarly in commercial, I guess more difficult because you haven't actually transacted. But if you could just give us a sense of what you think pricing is doing. Thank you.

Hi, Greg. This is Magnus. Thank you for your question. On your first one, you were asking about the business mix in commercial development, and that question is a bit tricky to answer because it depends completely on what you look at. You look at lease space, capital employed, ongoing projects, et cetera, et cetera. But in terms of life science and what we allude to in the report, that's obviously not a major part of our portfolio at the moment, but we see strength in the market segment, which is why we look at these market segments more closely now. So to give you an indication, it would be definitely sub 10%, not even close to that. I don't actually have a number for you, but it gives an idea at least. Your second question eluded me a bit. Maybe you can clarify what you were after.

Well, I'm trying to figure out whether, you know, you're at a point where you're coming close to some disposals kind of at your, you know, to validate your 10 billion unrealized gains or whether, you know, obviously we don't know what you're doing in the background in terms of talking to people or whether there's just nothing going on.

That's a really good question, not at least given where we have the transaction market. We don't pre-communicate our transactions for obvious reasons, but with that said, the completion profile that you look at, or that we show you rather in this quarterly earning earning calls that is a fairly good over time representation of when we put a project on the market essentially we do that in conjunction with the quarter two before a quarter two after the completion of that Now these days leasing have been a bit slower and we don't want to sell properties too early before they are leased enough because the downside of that is that you often have to give away some of the value to another buyer then that leases up the remaining part of the property. Since we have the financial capacity, the risk appetite and the long-term strategy to remain in product development, we decide to see our properties through to the end, so to speak, to lease them up to what we believe is the right level of value creation for the shareholders before we divest them. These days it has been a bit slower divestments then. But of the ones we have done, we have definitely been able to protect the market values that you see in our report. And just to be very clear, we do not market value the ongoing development projects in our books. This is just extra information for any reader of our quarterly report on how we view these market values.

Okay. and pricing trends in general in the two development segments?

It's very difficult to answer at the moment. As I already alluded to when Pam Liu asked the question, we have few transactions to look at at the moment. Those we see are at very attractive yield levels, almost sometimes a bit surprisingly attractive. uh which is very positive we have a good interest from investors in the dialogues we have on our upcoming transactions so that makes us feel sort of comfortable that these assets are very attractive and on the rest of residential development there it is obviously a bit difficult given that the transaction volumes at least on the swedish market has been a lot lower lately and buyers are so uncertain so the sort of pricing visibility into the future is lower in residential development

Okay, thank you very much.

The next question from the telephone comes from the line of Graham Hunt with Jefferies. Please go ahead.

Good morning. This is Graham Hunt from Jefferies. Just maybe three quick questions from me. First on your terms on capital employed, you're close to your target there and just in the context of investment continuing to be up and potentially activity slowing. Are you expecting to see that fall below target within the near to medium term? And a second question on US construction. Just wondered what you're seeing there in terms of the labor market and whether availability is having an impact on your business or you expect it to. And then third question, if you could provide any more color on your startup slash learning costs for look look in the UK, that would be helpful. And when you might expect these to roll off. Thank you.

I can start, this is Magnus. I think your first question related to capital employed and what target we have for that. I can say we don't have a target for capital employed build-up. We have a general ambition to grow product development. over time in RD&C, which are our two development business streams and then investment properties where we quite clearly have communicated a reasonable size within a few years that that portfolio should have in order to validate the values based on which we decided to make the strategic shift. In capital employed in residential and commercial development, we have a return on capital and target of 10% that we think remains very valid.

And on the second question, the US construction market, which is strong right now on the infrastructure, as I said, we don't have any problem to get the right people in place in the project we have ongoing or we bid for. we are very careful before we bid the project that we have the right team in place that we have the resources the subcontractors in place before before we even sign up for it so that has been and also we we are strong the strongest market now in west coast new york area metropolitan area there and also in on the west coast and there we have a good availability of resources so that that's not not an issue and just a comment on the book look as magnus pointed out earlier in the presentation that we have three ongoing projects in book look in the uk where we have startup issues startup costs that we take in the third quarter and if you take that out europe is or the profitability in rd europe is on a normal level thank you very much thank you

Okay.

No more questions. Okay. Thank you very much. This means that we have now answered all your questions and it's time for us to conclude this press conference. So first of all, thank you Anders and Magnus for your presentation here today. And thank you for joining us here at our studio in Stockholm. And lastly, thank you for watching. A recorded version of this broadcast will be available on our website shortly. And then we will be back in this setting to present our year-end results in February. Thank you.