TF Bank AB (publ)

Good morning everyone.

Vi stänger nu det första kvartalet 2025. Det är ett kvartal som volymässigt har kännetecknats av en kontrollerad tillväxtnivå. Vi har lyckats säkerställa goda marginaler. Överlag ser banken en stabil kreditkvalitet. Kraftiga valutarörelser i det här kvartalet gör att vår tillväxt bäst analyseras i lokal valuta. Sammanlagt har det varit 4%. Summerar man kvartalets aktiviteter får vi med god kostnadskontroll ett skrupligt operativt resultat på 188 miljoner kronor. Det är 27 procent bättre än motsvarande period föregående år. Framförallt är det segmentet kreditkort som driver EPS-tillväxten på koncernnivå. Vårt som glädjer mig särskilt är att intäkterna växer snabbare än kostnaderna. Det innebär att kv-talet fortsätter att förbättras, affärsmodellen skalar iväg. Under kvartalet har vi sett en fortsatt stabilisering av kreditkvaliteten. Det man måste ha i åtanke när man analyserar kreditförutstaden är att TF Bank är under stark förändring. Både i form av affärsmix och geografisk mix. Sen har vi ett makro i Tyskland och i andra marknader som jobbar emot vår underliggande förbättring av kreditkvaliteten när vi blir allt mer mogna i de marknaderna. Vi har under kvartalet fått vår pelade tvåvägledning från Finansinspektionen Det är meddelande om en PRD 2-vägledning om 0 % av totalt riskdagt exponeringsbelopp. Deras slutsats är alltså att vi inte behöver hålla något extra kapital utöver de regulatoriska kraven. Mot den bakgrunden och att tidigare finansiella mål uppnåddes i god tid under hösten 2024 kan vi nu presentera nya finansiella mål som sätter tonen för hur vi ser på verksamhetsåren 2025-2027. Kan vi bläddra. Vårt nya finansiella mål innebär att vi ska uppnå en lånekortfölj om 35 miljarder svenska kronor senast under andra halvåret 2027. Tidigare mål som passerades förra året var 20 miljarder. Samtidigt ska vi behålla en avkastning på eget kapital som väl överstiger 20%. Det skiljer sig inte från tidigare mål. På samma sätt som tidigare har vi också ett starkt fokus på bankens kapitalstruktur och såväl kapitalmålet som utdelningspolisen lämnas oförändrade. Från detta kan man dra slutsatsen att organisk tillväxt i kombination med stark lönsamhet fortsatt är grundstenen i vår ambition. Vi ser att vi skalar verksamheten väl och vi planerar för fortsatt lönsam tillväxt. Kan bläddra. Här tittar vi på tillväxten i lånebokens segment för segment i lokalvaluta. Om vi först börjar med helheten så var kvartalets organiska tillväxt 4%, ger och ger varor 19%. Kreditkort, TFBanks tillväxtmotor, växte med 10% under kvartalet och 47% year on year. E-commerce solutions backade med 7% under kvartalet, vilket är ett normalt mönster under det första kvartalet på året, och minskade year on year med 6%. Minskningen ska ses i ljuset av att verksamheterna i Polen och Baltikum är i run-off. Consumer lending växer med 3% under kvartalet i lokalvaluta och 6% year on year. Vi kan bläddra. And in this picture we go through market to market. We can start with Germany, which is the geographical core of the growing part of our credit card business. We have around the quarter set a strong demand for our credit cards and we expect strong volume growth in the coming quarter. Germany is now more than a third of the bank's treasury. In the German market, at the end of last year, we launched Avarda's credit offer, initially to Nordic traders. In addition to giving access to the German market, we also see that it is a strength for sales in the Nordic market, since Germany is an attractive market for Nordic traders. The credit card business and trading solutions continue to grow in Norway. IA Varida in Norway has signed an agreement with Brandstad Group in January. This is a strong basis for our Norwegian business to partner with such a platform. In the rest of the Nordic countries, the focus is on maintaining profitability and credit quality in the consumer loan business. We have continued to consciously control the volumes in consumer loans in the Nordic countries to ensure good margins. Samma lönsamhetsfokus som gäller i Norden gäller också för Estland, Lettland och Litauen. I alla tre baltiska länder är kreditkvaliteten stabil och vi arbetar med att optimera portföljen för att upprätthålla det starka resultatet. I Österrike ser vi att kreditkursverksamheten utvecklas på ett bra sätt. Det är såklart en mycket mindre marknad än Tyskland. Men förutsättning att bedriva en lönsam verksamhet i Österrike kan till och med vara ännu lite bättre än i Tyskland när den är fullt utbyggd. In Denmark, which is one of our newest markets, we feel safe with the credit quality and our ability to find the right customer at a reasonable cost. It has taken a couple of years, which is normal. We are now in the next phase and are scaling the business at an ever faster pace. We have already established credit cards in Spain and Italy. It is beginning to travel to teach us these markets. They are big markets, they are interesting from a longer perspective. We can improve. Let's look at segment by segment and start with credit cards. The loan portfolio in the segment is close to 9 billion. The underlying business in the segment is growing by 47% compared to the same period last year. This is mainly due to the quarter of the German and Austrian markets. We continue to grow in the form of a number of new cards. We now have 374,000 active cards in Germany, an increase of 46% compared to last year. Vi ser också ett förbättrat KI-tal i segmentet, vilket visar på att affären skalar väl. I det här fallet, när vi växer så mycket, så är det slutsatsen extra viktig för oss. Och det slår nu igenom i hela bankens KI-tal. Under förra året har vi som sagt också lanserat produkter i Spanien och Italien, och vi finns nu i fem marknader. Nu vänder vi sidan. Within the e-commerce segment, we see the effect of our strong pipeline in new sales, as I have described in the previous quarter. We ended last year and during this quarter signed a deal with several major traders. Now, at the beginning of the year, we signed a deal with Brandstad Group, which is Norway's leading e-trader within its segment. In addition, we have a deal on the spot with Bagan & Kocken. Through these nine fairs, which are two examples, a good growth is ensured in the coming year. We estimate an annual volume of 2.7 billion, which will be in relation to the quarter's volume of 3.0 billion. The negative growth in the segment is also an effect of the fact that we in Baltikum paused new businesses in the beginning of last year, and then previously the same business in Poland in run-off. This of course contributes to the negative growth in the segment and means that trade has had a tough period. And as I said, we have launched Avarda's offer in the German market, which completes our Nordic offer in a good way in the Nordic, where we are now a leading actor. Can we blabber? I segmentet consumer lending har vi haft en kontrollerad tillväxttakt med fokus på att försvara marginaler. Vi ser framför oss ökade tillväxtmöjligheter i den danska marknaden och verksamheten där går från klarhet till klarhet. Generellt förbättrat kreditkvalitet jämfört med föregående år. Det innebär att vi fortsatt har en stark lönsamhet i segmentet, vilket för oss är business as usual. Nu lämnar jag över till Mikael för den fortsatta presentationen.

Thank you Joakim. Yes, if we first look at our moving revenues, we can see that these have risen to 668 million during the first quarter, which is 19% higher than the corresponding quarter of 2024. And this is the main driving force behind the increase in the previous quarter, the growth of the loan portfolio in the credit cards segment. I would also like to mention that our revenues during Q1 have been negatively affected by the strengthening of the krona, since over 90% of our loan portfolio exists outside of Sweden. If we look further at our credit losses, they increased to 232 million SEK during Q1, which is 23% higher than in Q1 2024. Kreditförlustnivån upp till 4,6 procentenheter och påverkas av en mixeffekt eftersom vårt växande segment Credit Cash har en högre intäktsmarginal och en högre kreditförlustnivå än övriga segment. Jag vill också påpeka att eftersom vi avyttrade ungefär 1,5 miljarder i förfannad lån den 20 december förra året så har både intäktsmarginalen och kreditförlustnivån ökat på grund av att balansen i beräkningens nämnare är lägre än tidigare kvartal. Dessutom har ju kronans förstärkning mot slutet av Q1 samma effekt på nyckeltalen. Men påverkan av den effekten är mindre i utsträckning medan riskjusterade marginalen som vi ser är fortsatt stabil jämfört med föregående kvartal och till och med har förbättrats något om man jämför med Q1 2024. Vi kan bläddra sida. If we look further at the bank's moving costs, we can see that they have increased by 11% to 249 million under the first quarter. The company's KIT in Q1 is 3% lower than the first quarter of 2024, which shows the scale of our business model as Joakim mentioned earlier. Och som vi kan se i diagrammet är k-uttalet för segmentet credit cards 33% det senaste kvartalet, trots att vi faktiskt hade något högre direkta marknadsföringskors under detta kvartal. Och den positiva trenden beror framförallt på skalfördelar i affärsmodellen och en också ökad automatisering av våra processer. If we look at our second segment, e-commerce solution, we had a KU rate that went up to 61% in Q1. And here it is as I said earlier that the business model for e-commerce solution means that the KU rate is higher than the rest of the segment, but it is also compensated by a higher risk-adjusted margin. If we look further at our third segment, consumer lending, we see a KU rate that rose to 31% in the quarter, which is roughly in line with what we have seen earlier this quarter. We look further at the bank's revenue, and as Joakim mentioned, it increased by 27% to 188 million the first quarter. The driving force behind the income growth year on year is above all the strong development within the credit cards segment. If we look at the quarterly adjusted profit per share, it increases to SEK 6.56 compared to SEK 5 per share in the first quarter of 2024. This corresponds to a profit margin of 30%. I would also like to mention that the profitability is strong during Q1 and the discount on loan portfolios has improved by 40 points to 2.8% compared to what we had in Q1 2024. Efter kronans förstärkning i Q1 och vår avvittning om 1,5 miljarder i förfallna lån förra året så har vi samtidigt betydligt mer kapital i banken vilket gör att avkastning på eget kapital ligger i paritet med Q1 2024 men som sagt var den underliggande lönsamheten förbättras faktiskt. Om vi bläddrar till nästa sida. And if we look at our segment, we can see that the segment of credit cards, the movement result increased to 80 million in Q1, which is 76% higher than the corresponding quarter last year. Högre intäkter från den växande låneportföljen, en stark riskjusterad marginal och skalfördelar som ger ett lägre KU-tal bidrar till segmentets avkastning på låneportföljen och ökar till 2,9 % i kvartalet. Tittar vi på motsvarande siffra under föregående år så var avkastningen 2,2. Vi kan bläddra vidare. If we look at our second segment, e-commerce solution, the turnover was up to 24 million in the first quarter, which is 3% higher than the corresponding period of 2024. The income margin has improved in recent years, while the credit loss level has fluctuated a bit, and we have under Q1 also had negative LGD adjustments in our receivables for the segment. If we look at the segment's loss on the loan portfolio, it was up to 2.8% in Q1, which can be compared to 2.4% in Q1 2024. We can move on and look at our last segment, consumer lending. Here we see a turnover of 84 million in Q1, which is 6% higher than the corresponding quarter last year. The risk-adjusting margin and KU-tolerance have been relatively stable in recent years, and the segment's discount on the loan portfolio has increased to 2.9% in Q1. The credit loss level has been stable at 2.8%, but I would also like you to note that this segment has been positively affected by LGD-adjusting in our reserve models during this quarter. And we can move on and look at the bank's financing and liquidity. And here we see quite small changes compared to Q4. The income balance in Germany has increased to 16.6 billion at the beginning of Q1. That's 79% of the company's total income. And our income in the Netherlands continues to grow. And there we now have an income balance of 3.1 billion. Vår tillgängliga likviditetsreserv uppgick till 19% av inlåningsbalansen vid utgången av Q1, vilket är ungefär samma nivå som vi hade i Q4. Merparten av vår likviditetsreserv är placerade i statspapper med en återstående löptyp på upp till 12 månader samt på overnight-konton hos några större nordiska banker. If we look at the LCR and the NSFR, we have increased it to 347, respectively 110% in Q1. The NSFR is affected by the high proportion of the fixed interest account, which is mainly generated through loan funds, and thus is burdened by a lower weight when calculating stable financing. The NSFR is a more slow-moving measure, and our ambition is to ensure a slightly higher level. We can now scroll. Perfect. If we look at our capital relations, the bank's key primary capital relation went up to 14.3%, the primary capital relation to 15.8% and the total capital relation went up to 17.7% based on the quarter. All capital relations have increased by about 1% in Q1, which is mainly related to the fact that the loan portfolio is unchanged in our reporting currency. This is due to the strengthening of the krona. During the quarter, as Joakim mentioned, we have received a decision from the Financial Inspectorate regarding the PLR-2 guidance. For the capital requirement, the guidance lands on 0% of the risk of the exposure rate. This is the same level that some of our competitors have received. Based on Q1, our capital regulation has a significant distance to the regulatory capital requirements on all three levels. I'll leave that back to you, Joakim.

Yes. As we move forward, we will continue to drive the bank with discipline with a focus on our new financial goals. The focus is Germany and pan-European, as our largest market. During the coming three periods, we will be influenced by continuing to grow our short-term business around Europe with Germany and Austria as two markets. which will contribute a lot to our financial goals. We have a lot left to do in both Germany and Austria, and also Norway, which is where we are established. We have now set an ambitious plan when it comes to new card customers. We have almost 400,000 active cards in the segment, and it's an increase of almost 50% since last year, so it says something about the pace we have in the business. I think we are doing well in sales here and now. The business is scaling well. When it comes to our new markets, Spain and Italy, it will take time to get to know them. It is not that market that will contribute primarily to this generation of financial goals, but it is a preparation for the future. Under 2025, we are also now prepared to produce a number of new partnerships with major traders, which will further drive the growth of the bank in the e-commerce segment. Vi har också anpassat organisationen och förbereder för vår konsumtionslåneverksamhet i ett eget bolag, TF Nordic. Det är allt för att hålla fokus på den affären när nu en allt större del av bankens verksamhet är utanför Norden och inom kreditkort och betalningar. Under slutet av förra året ingick vi ett avtal om försäljning om drygt 80% av aktien i ReadyM Capital. which means that we have a very low share of so-called non-performing loans in our balance sheet. And it also means that it will take at least three years before a significant backstop will occur from our capital base, which otherwise could risk slowing down our growth. Without any weight on the capital and with a two-way lead to zero, we are now ready to take aim at delivering on our new financial goals. Of course, we have to be aware that we are in a changing environment, with geopolitical tensions, possible trade hindrances, and in the current situation, it is difficult to judge to what extent this will affect our customers. And it is the German market that is especially important to us. But there we see that the available income of households is increasing, as inflation is expected to drop. There is also a strong investment pressure in the German economy. Konsumentförtroende är fortfarande lite svagt. Det bromsar vår tillväxt precis här och nu. Men vi fortsätter här att bevaka makroläget noga och vi är ju redo att ta tillvara på de möjligheter som kommer att uppstå framöver och också hantera eventuella risker. Och med våra nya finansiella mål och den plattform vi nu har bytt så är jag övertygad om att vi fortsatt kan leverera en uthållig tillväxt och hög lönsamhet trots att vi har den här osäkerheten i vår omvärld. Med det så går vi till Q&A.

Tack så mycket för frågorna här och precis som du nämnde så går vi över nu till Q&A och den första frågeställaren som har ringt in är Patrik Bratselius från ABG. Varsågod, du har ordet.

Perfekt, hör ni mig?

Ja.

Ja, vad bra. Det var lite problem med hjulet. Kanon. Yes, min första fråga kopplar lite till de finansiella målen här då. And if you count backwards, it implies an increase of almost 20% per year until the end of 2027. And in the current situation, consumer lending and credit cards are about 40% of the book and e-commerce about 10%. If we look forward to 2027, how do you expect the split of the loan book to look like at that time?

We follow the numbers quite slavishly. We invest our capital all the time where we expect the best return on our own capital. Så det är svårt att säga exakt vad vi tror i det perspektivet. Men om man blickar bakåt så ser vi ungefär hur trenden har varit under den senaste perioden. Då kan man konstatera att konsumtionslån i... The consumer market is growing by under 10%, while the credit card business is growing by about 40-50% per year. And of course, when the credit card business increases in size, the growth rate will decrease in percentage. So I think if you want to do such an analysis, you have to follow the nominal figures instead over the years. Of course, we expect to get an ever-growing platform over time, but... Så det är genom fingervisning, ungefär hur vi ser på det. Sen som sagt, vi är alltid redo att navigera om. Men det är såklart att Tyskland som marknad, relativt våra andra marknader, så är den väldigt stor. Så lejonparten av den här tillväxten kommer att komma i Tyskland. Det är omöjligt att säga något annat.

Tack. Jag fortsätter lite på den inslagna vägen här då. Om totala boken förväntas växa med cirka 20 procent, Can you still count on e-commerce and consumer loans to be around two-digit growth per year? Or is it lower and that the majority should come from credit cards? I understand that it is not, given what you said earlier, nothing that is written in stone, but I still understand that you have some kind of thought and idea behind tillväxten i och med att ni har lagt ut nya finansiella mål.

Absolut, så är det. Men som en fingervisning så lanserar vi ett antal nya handlare här nu inom e-commerce. And then we see that the volume of transactions that comes in in that business, only through the sales we have done here in the last half year, corresponds to, not really, but about a quarter of the volume of transactions. So that gives a foreshadowing of how we see growth in that segment, that it should be only two-digit. When it comes to consumption loans, it depends on the development in that market. Now we see that there has been quite tough competition and marginal pressure in recent years. I think that there might be a reason for that trend to change a little bit. And for that reason, I actually count on a little stronger growth in the consumption loans in the next three years than we have seen in the last three years. And we've had a lot of good competitors who have wanted to grow the business, especially in the Nordic countries in recent years. But I believe that we will see a marginal increase in the Nordic market in the future. And then it will also be relatively more interesting for us to be active in. Vi har ju våra finansiella mål med att vi tror att vi kommer att kunna växa affären med restrikoden att upprätthålla rentabiliteten väl över 20%. Det gäller också för vår konsumtionslånaffär, att det är där man måste ligga.

Jag förstår. Om man tänker på en sån här tillväxtprofil, hur ser ni framför er att era räntenettomarginaler utvecklas i en sån här miljö?

Ja, och jag tycker man kan kolla på vår utveckling generellt. Det här kartalet är ju väldigt tydligt när man ser hur själva rentabiliteten på utlånade tillgångar, hur den ökar. Och vi stärks hela tiden för banken som helhet i takt med att vår tillgångsmix ändras. Och då vet vi ju att marginalerna är högre i kreditkortsverksamheten i förhållande till, och också i vin- och betalningar i förhållande till konsumtionsbanor. I takt med att If the bank becomes more important in that direction, the margin will also increase in total. With the cost of course that the credit loss level is a little higher in those segments. But in summary, we are trending towards an increase in the whole when we talk about bottom line.

Yes, and given that Germany will become such an important market on the credit card, You will be quite a big player on this market. Can you just talk a little bit about how you have experienced the competition develop in recent years and how you see that it will develop in the future?

Joakim is going to answer this question, Patrik, but then you actually assume that Germany is the only market and I mean, you know about TF Bank as well and it is also the case that we will look at new markets as well, of course. Then you can answer the other question, Johan.

Yes, I mean, for TF Bank, Germany is a big market, but for Germany, TF Bank is not a large financial institution, so to speak. Vi har otrolig potential att fortsätta att göra exakt det vi har gjort föregående år i Tyskland ett antal år till. Det är såklart, vid en viss tidpunkt så når vi en storlek. Det börjar mättas, vi får jobba också med en mogen kreditkortsbok på ett annat sätt. Men vi är långt ifrån där ännu. But of course, in the light of what you can see, for example, Spain and Italy as new markets, the idea is not that they will deliver volumes during this coming three-year period, but at the end of that period. But it is Germany that we have continued to keep in touch with quite well over a couple of years.

Yes, but I thought a little about if you look at how How do you rate your cards compared to competitors? There are other competitors out there that have very attractive profitability. You want to think that this should attract other banks within the space and that some may be more aggressive in price and roughly if you stick out on som en prissättare i marknaden eller om ni ligger i linje eller hur eventuellt sånt har utvecklats?

Nej, vi ligger i pris med i linje med de andra i det här segmentet. Then if we are a little higher or lower, it is not the price as such that our card is deductible. The interest rates are less important in this market. And when it comes to competitors, I can only state that it is no problem to borrow money. Anyone can do that. The problem is to get them back. And that is what we prove that we can do. From that perspective, we have a well-tested model. We know our customers, we know this very well. We are looking forward to it in a good way. We have done it for many quarters. There are always some new ones that are trying in the market, but you have to get the whole thing together in the business and also get the money back. So that perspective, even if it would be a collection of new competitors in Germany, it will take a few years for them to learn that market, just as it will do for us to learn from Spain and Italy. You can expect that it will take two or three years before you are ready, at least before you can scale the business.

Very good. Thank you. Then there were no further questions from my side.

Thank you very much for the questions. Then we move on and give the floor to Jens Hallén from Carnegie.

Thank you very much. Joakim, as you said, it's easy to borrow money. It's harder to make it profitable and so on. I'm going to take that thought and talk a little more about financial goals. With the details that you have given, we can count back on how it will come to 35 billion. But investments will be required. It was a long time ago that we talked about the K-number. Hur ser ni nu 25, 26, 27 på investeringsfasen, takten? Kommer det krävas någonting för att ni ska kunna nå till 35? Eller är det här bara helt enkelt att ni drar fram tillväxtsystemen som ni har idag och så kommer vi till 35?

Det man kan säga är att vi investerar i verksamheten redan idag och har gjort det de senaste åren. Vi anpassar vår investeringstakt efter vilka förutsättningar We invest today in our technology to ensure that it is top notch. We also invest in when we grow as much as we do, we invest in the first day's margins, in our customers, in marketing and so on. If you look at the growth rate that we see ahead of us in kronor and ören, it is not dramatically different from what we already do. So from that perspective, I see ahead of me that we will have a path where we will develop in almost the same way as we have done before, if nothing unexpected happens. And that also means that we will get share shares in the business more and more over time.

And in addition to that, Jens, if you just be careful, you can look at the credit card, the KU number is 32 and the company number is 37.

Yes, but exactly. I tried to understand, because you have also talked about new countries, and I know that a few years ago when we looked at this, of course it had a bigger impact because you had a smaller scale. But if I heard you right, if we look at what you have done, the investments you make today, do you believe that we can have so-called positive jobs when the revenues continue to grow faster than the costs, despite this Yeah, absolutely.

There are essential scale advantages to get home in this business. Then you have to be careful because from time to time you have to step in and make investments in technology and other things. But we take it over time. I think we have done it historically and we will do it in the future in a good way. We are trying to drive the business so that it does not disturb the development of delivering every quarter in the way we have done historically. It is our ambition to continue to be disciplined over the coming three years in the same way as we have been historically.

I have one last question. Let's see how much you can answer it. Well over 20%. Is it 22? Is it 25? Is it 30? How do you see it? I can say that the consensus is around 25-26% for 2027. We are well over.

In your question, you put your finger on it. Everything depends on how much we invest in the future. The more we grow and invest in new markets, It's about how far you want to draw this line and how fast you want it to go. We expect to continue in about the same way as we have done over the next three years. Then we set our growth ambition and based on the conditions we have, to generate profitability in our mature markets. And as you have noted, we have had a positive bias in the German market now, and it is getting bigger and bigger and more important for us. And that also means that we can invest more in the future, which gives growth. So there is a balance there. So well above that is that we should keep ourselves in the span of over 20% in how we see how we will invest in future growth.

Okay. Det var alla mina frågor idag. Tack så mycket.

Tack så mycket för frågorna och då går vi vidare i ordet till Emil Jonsson från DNB. Varsågod.

God morgon. En uppföljningsfråga på tillväxtmålet. När det är uppnått, kan ni resonera kring huruvida ni tror att lönsamheten, avkastning på eget kapital, kommer att vara högre eller lägre än vad den är idag. Och vad som skulle vara en viktig drivare åt det ena eller andra hållet.

Ja, och det jag kan säga då, om vi når tillväxtmålet på 35 i slutet av den här perioden, och så säger vår styrelse och ägare, nu ska det här bli en kassako, och vi slår av på tillväxttakten, slutar investera i nya marknader, då kommer räntebiljetten att bli avslöjt mycket högre. But we intend to, during this three-year period, tell you what we will do in the coming three years. And in light of that, we will also have valuable investments in the future. So everything depends on what credibility we can convince our shareholders to reinvest in future growth to create this platform for payments and credit solutions around Europe. Det beror helt och hållet på hur vi investerar, vilket utfall det blir på rentabilitet. And the board now thinks that we have a very good outlook during the coming three-year period. They want us to grow a lot. My ambition is that the board will feel the same about three years. That now we should invest in the business. Which means that hopefully we will get a renewed mandate to build new businesses. That's my hope. And that's what I'm driven by.

Thank you. And these new e-commerce agreements that you signed during the quarter, is there any difference in underlying margin and profitability compared to the other e-commerce books?

What we have come to terms with is a profit sharing model, which means that it is quite kind to us from a P&L perspective. Otherwise, you need to invest first, you get the costs first, and then the income comes later. But this is kinder. But initially, it will be light in the income a little later than we see the costs. That's how it works, Emil. So I hope that was the answer to your question.

Yes, and in the context that we are building Gleam and we are building it up to full size, and it depends on the trader and the transaction speed in the business, then it takes between 6 and 18 months to build it up to full size.

Okay, but if you count that you have reached a full run rate, so to speak, Borde man nog vänta sig att de här avtalene precis kommer att komma som allt annat?

Ja, och då är det så att vi är väldigt enkla människor så vi ställer samma avkastningskrav på all verksamhet vi har i banken. Utan ska konkurrera och kunna leverera på de avkastningsmål som vi har. Annars så blir det självmål. Så i det perspektivet så håller vi inte på att teckna avtal av marknadsföringsskäl utan vi är rent pekuniära i allt det vi gör.

I understand that it takes time to build loan volume, because there must be transactions and so on. But when the numbers are in place and open running, one should expect that the volume of transactions from day one is and will be around these 2.7 billion, or is there some kind of ramp up there too?

No, it's short.

Micke, do you want to answer that? No, but I think Joakim mentioned it. It takes one year to upgrade these volumes.

But the transaction volumes come immediately. If it is for technical reasons that you light up and step on it, I don't know from fall to hand. But the transaction volumes come from the beginning, but then you build credit volumes over time.

That's right.

But then you have to know that if you sign an agreement with a trader under, for example, Q4-Q1, then maybe they will be launched Q1, Q2, Q3, depending on which agreement they will step out of and so on. So in that sense, you can't see directly in a month that the transaction volume will come, but it depends on which agreement they will step out of and also which implementation period there is. So it often takes from signing to implementation, all the way from a quarter, which is the fastest, up to maybe three quarters. Which is correct as well.

Okay, that helps a lot. Thank you. You talked about that you are waiting to sign new contracts later this year. Do you expect that what is remaining during the year is bigger or smaller than what you have already signed in Q1?

It's hard to say when you also talk about who has the expectations. I'm generally more positive than Mikael and so on. There are others in the company who are more positive than I am. It depends on what she has for DNA in her body.

We hope that we can return in Q2 with that, Emil. So we don't... Yes, there is a lot in the pipeline that looks very good, but we will pause it and return to it in Q2, hopefully at the end.

Alright, fair enough. One last question. The professional network in credit cards has been positive for the past few quarters. What is it that drives that? Borde man vänta sig att det liksom återgår till det normala, att det ändrar miljoner negativt per kvartal?

The answer to that, why it has driven positively now, because I think that you think that it goes from 14.7 to 15.5 now. It's maybe a little different seasons and coincidences, depending on the interest rates, you also have to think about. But in general, it's really about that we also see in front of us a downward trend in terms of market financing, i.e. our interest rates. Then it will take a while, since we have a fixed... We have 67% of our portfolio in fixed interest accounts, so it will take a while to go down. But in general, our interest rates should go down faster than we need to adjust to the customer. So we should reasonably get a positive interest rate over time. Then it can be different between quarters.

But in general, it should be like that. But the question was about the provision net. Att den har varit positiv under senaste kvartalen.

Förlåt, jag trodde du pratade om räntorna. Då svarar jag på den frågan också. Vi lanserade PPI här för något år sedan. Den får positiv effekt på den raden. Så den ska du se framför dig att den kommer att vara positiv framåt. Kanske inte så mycket uppåt, men den kommer åtminstone att vara positiv. Ursäkta att jag missförstod din fråga där.

Thank you very much. That was all the questions from my side.

Thank you very much. Thank you very much for the questions. Finally, we will take a few questions. The share of fixed term deposits decreased by 3% quarter over quarter to 67%. Have you reached the peak of the share of fixed deposits?

You can see it in the light of the fact that we replaced an NPL portfolio of 1.5 billion. And we both work with supply and run times. So why we have 67% left is because we have the share that we matched our NPL portfolio with. It is still there. So over time, it will probably go down somewhat. But I will not answer if we have reached the peak, because it can happen that there are other contexts in the future. But we are on our way down.

But it has to do with the MPL portfolio. Thank you. The last question. There has been a lot of talk in the media about interest rates. How has this affected Nordic investors?

Do you see that the market for consumer credit will disappear? No, we don't see that at all. What that means is that there will be a number of customers who will be without loans, who will be excluded from the financial market. Which means that they will seek to borrow money that is totally unregulated. Earlier it was possible to have consumer credit institutions, but they are now also banned in Sweden. Which means that it is expected that there will be a market with black borrowings. And that is what unfortunately happens with the combination of interest rates and that a certain type of institution is banned. Ur ett policyperspektiv så är det olika saker som händer i kombination. Man kanske måste fundera på om man ska verkligen ha både räntetak och förbjuda konsumentkreditinstitut ur det perspektivet. It is important that if there is a need for a loan, it is also good that there is access to it. From my perspective, I think that the more regulated the companies are and we have a strong consumer protection, it is much better than to end up in the black market. You have to think about that. Thank you. Absolutely.

Tack så mycket. Det var alla frågor vi hade. Så nu lämnar jag över till lite avslutande ord här till dig Joakim.

Ja, vi tackar så hemskt mycket. Vi avslutar ett kvartal, kliver in i ett nytt kvartal, fortsätter att leverera som vi alltid har gjort. Vi följer med i vår omvärld som alla andra nu med all dramatik som händer från en dag till en annan. Men underliggande, vår affär taktar och går precis som den ska. Vi tar en dag i taget. Tack.